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Some Tough Love A Day Later

Agreed but I think it paints an inaccurate picture when people say ND 0doesn't have 5-star talent. I call BS. Similar to those names I just mentioned, it's like saying McGlinchey, Stanley, Fuller, Procise, Martin, Kizer, Harrison, Eifert werent 5-star studs because rivals told us they were 3-4 stars.

Nobody said a 4 star can't develop into an excellent player, but you just listed guys that played for ND over a stretch of what? 6 years... You can't name all the best players ND has landed in a decade and talk about them as if they play for one team... For the record, by time the players Clemson fielded yesterday graduate, there will be as much or more talent than you listed in that whole paragraph, on that Clemson team in one year. Don't believe me?

Trevor Lawrence (1st round pick)
Travis Etienne (2nd-3rd round pick)
Tee Higgins (1st round pick)
Justyn Ross (1st round pick)
Mitch Hyatt (1st round pick)
Dexter Lawrence (1st-2nd round pick)
Christian Wilkins (1st-round pick)
Isaiah Simmonds (1st-2nd round pick)
KJ Henry (1st-3rd round pick)
Xavier Thomas (1st round pick)
Cellin Ferrell (1st round pick)
Austin Bryant (2nd-3rd round pick)

Those are just the guys that played key roles yesterday. And I probably missed 2-3.
 
Those guys all developed exceptionally but all of the names you listed are over 5+ year period. It isn't enough concentrated talent to be the best team in the country any given year.

You recruit more elite players and combine them with all of the studs who developed into star players and now you can compete for a national title.
No question but most of us realize that ND will never sacrifice itself to recruit with the Alabamas, OSU's of the world and many of us applaud that. We understand there is a talent gap but every 3-4 years like 2018 with the mix of talent and senior leadership to make a run.

Again, I don't think the talent gap/narrative was 27 points worth, it was disappointing ND couldn't compete like they did against UGA last year or Clemson in 2015. But. Never should ND sell out in order to compete with the 3-5 schools at the top.
 
No question but most of us realize that ND will never sacrifice itself to recruit with the Alabamas, OSU's of the world and many of us applaud that. We understand there is a talent gap but every 3-4 years like 2018 with the mix of talent and senior leadership to make a run.

Again, I don't think the talent gap/narrative was 27 points worth, it was disappointing ND couldn't compete like they did against UGA last year or Clemson in 2015. But. Never should ND sell out in order to compete with the 3-5 schools at the top.

Did you watch the 2nd half when Clemson pulled their starters in the 3rd quarter on defense and we t into ultra conservative mode on offense? Do you honestly believe for a second that Clemson couldn't have scored 40+ if Dabo had put his foot down? ND was completely outclassed.
 
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Nobody said a 4 star can't develop into an excellent player, but you just listed guys that played for ND over a stretch of what? 6 years... You can't name all the best players ND has landed in a decade and talk about them as if they play for one team... For the record, by time the players Clemson fielded yesterday graduate, there will be as much or more talent than you listed in that whole paragraph, on that Clemson team in one year. Don't believe me?

Trevor Lawrence (1st round pick)
Travis Etienne (2nd-3rd round pick)
Tee Higgins (1st round pick)
Justyn Ross (1st round pick)
Mitch Hyatt (1st round pick)
Dexter Lawrence (1st-2nd round pick)
Christian Wilkins (1st-round pick)
Isaiah Simmonds (1st-2nd round pick)
KJ Henry (1st-3rd round pick)
Xavier Thomas (1st round pick)
Cellin Ferrell (1st round pick)
Austin Bryant (2nd-3rd round pick)

Those are just the guys that played key roles yesterday. And I probably missed 2-3.
My point wasn't that all those guys played on the same team but rather ND doesn't get credit for 5 star players on their team because they weren't deemed 5 star guys by rivals. You won't even acknowledge Love/Tillery as a 5 star player but rather a 4 star who developed into an exceptional player. Here's where I have guys on NDs roster going in the draft.
Rounds 1-3
Love
Coney
Bars
Tillery
Dexter
Okwara
Kraemer

Second Day
Gilman
Mack
Tranquil
Boykin
Kareem
Mustipher
Eichenberg
 
My point wasn't that all those guys played on the same team but rather ND doesn't get credit for 5 star players on their team because they weren't deemed 5 star guys by rivals. You won't even acknowledge Love/Tillery as a 5 star player but rather a 4 star who developed into an exceptional player. Here's where I have guys on NDs roster going in the draft.
Rounds 1-3
Love
Coney
Bars
Tillery
Dexter
Okwara
Kraemer

Second Day
Gilman
Mack
Tranquil
Boykin
Kareem
Mustipher
Eichenberg

Not bad predictions, but the majority of those round 1-3 guys you know are round 2 and round 3... There is a huge difference between those guys (especially in numbers) and the Clemson guys that will go in round 1, because they are the absolute best players in college football... A collection of those guys vs your guys gets you a 20+ point loss.
 
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Did you watch the 2nd half when Clemson pulled their starters in the 3rd quarter on defense and we t into ultra conservative mode on offense? Do you honestly believe for a second that Clemson couldn't have scored 40+ if Dabo had put his foot down? ND was completely outclassed.
Again, ND will not ever recruit in the same tier as these teams. The reasons behind that are the reasons many of us cheer and root for ND. They could sell out, sure, but I'd rather have a team who does it the right way, values their STUDENT-athletes and makes a run every 3-4 years.

I also think the game could have been competitive if ND takes advantage of great field position early (Book Fumble), the special teams fumble recovery, Mike Floyd 2.0 gaining some hands, Love not being injured. Every ND fans knows they don't recruit on the level of the elite so losing Love was brutal.
 
So everybody wants to bitch and moan, but you want some actual solutions to start shrinking the gap?... Here are two.

1. Jack Swarbrick, you have to ****ing pay people. You operate one of the riches programs in the country, but you have no problem allowing an elite coordinator / recruiter leave for a better situation. Unless Notre Dame is willing to pay highest rates to assistant coaches in the country and attract the best assistants in the business, guys that should be head coaches at lesser schools (Brett Venables) but who are coordinators at your school because you backed a Brinks truck up into their yard, you're NEVER going to overcome the talent gap through coaching and development... Because the schools that have more talent than you, have better, higher paid coaches than you as well. That's to simple truth. You need an elite coach / recruiter at every coaching position. You can't have 3-4 good assistants, and a bunch of middle of the road guys.

2. This is the most important thing that should be taken away from this post and the conversation that needs to be had with the following assistants.

- Autry Denson should be fired. I don't care how productive your running backs have been. I really don't. Look around America, there are 20+ running backs coaches who backs produce just like yours do. Anybody who has every spent a second coaching football knows that it's the easiest position on the field to coach. There are 20+ other guys in a America that coach the running back position every bit as well as Autry Denson and half of them do it without the offensive line talent that Notre Dame has (which I'll get to in a second). It comes down to this, if you're not an elite recruiter, you receive you pink slip tomorrow... Autry Denson is responsible for recruiting South Georgia and Florida, the most talent rich region in the country. Who the **** made that decision? He's horrendous recruiter. One of the worst at a major school, nationally. ND needs a savage in that region. A guy that not only lands top running backs, but a guy who recruits top talent at other positions as well.

I'm sorry Autry, you're a decent RB coach and a bad recruiter. I'm going to find a guy who is a dog recruiting Florida speed and can coach running backs. You're fired.

- Jeff Quinn should be fired. Your offensive line is terrible. It was mediocre all year. You gave up 6 sacks yesterday and it could have been 10 if Ian Book didn't scramble like crazy. Ian Book was running for his life against Pittsburgh for **** sakes. He was running for his life against USC. They could get push against Ball State. Let that sink in for a moment. You did a terrible job not only on the field, but in a stellar year along the offensive line, after ND has put 4 OL in the first round of the NFL Draft in the last 5 years, and won the Joe Moore award last year, you failed to land a single top 100 recruit on the offensive line, let alone 5 star. You allowed 5 star offensive linemen to go to schools where they will be wasted, instead of coming to Notre Dame to play for OL U.

I'm sorry Jeff, you're offensive line pales in comparison to Clemson's, Alabama's, Oklahoma's and Georgia's and you've proven that you can't recruit the monsters go to other schools. You can land 275lb undersized guys, but the truly elite guys don't want to play for you. You're fired.

- Brian Polian, your special teams are average at best and terrible at worst. We saw zero improvement from your units throughout the season, but more importantly, since you took over as recruiting coordinator, ND has landed 1, 5 star prospect. The last player of that level that you personally recruited was Manti Te'o, in 2007, 11 years ago. You've landed absolutely nobody that matters relative to winning a championship since then. You're known to be some "guru" on the West Coast in recruiting. With USC and UCLA in the tank, and Stanford on the decline. the worst they've been in years, you can't pull a single top recruit out of California. Not a single difference maker... Seriously... Not one. How is that even possible with the amount of resources ND spends maintaining a yearly fingerprint in LA.

I'm sorry Brian, your special teams are average and you can't pull a single top 100 4 star, or 5 star out of California, while Oklahoma, Texas, Alabama and Clemson can. Their recruiter is out recruiting you and for that reason, have a happy new years, but please clean out your desk. You're fired.

- Del Alexander, your wide receivers are the definition of average. They drop way too many passes (2nd year in a row) and you refuse to play the young guys over the old guys when they **** up or give poor effort. The same bullshit every year. No accountability whatsoever, and since Mike Denbrock left, not a single wide receiver has flourished into an All American caliber players under your watch. Furthermore, the only top 100 receiver you've landed since you got here is Kevin Austin. Why? Explain yourself? Why can't you out recruit teams like Michigan at wide receiver? Why can't you recruit along the lines of Oklahoma? I'm not asking you to recruit like Alabama and Clemson do, because I'm not naïve. But even among your peers you're an average recruiter. You're a West Coast guy, played wide receiver at USC, have ties to LA, and they have 5-7 top 100 WRs each year in California. You can't land one?

I'm sorry Del, Notre Dame is not a place for average and that's what our receivers have been since you got here, as has your recruiting, save Kevin Austin. Why did we hire a USC guy? You're fired.

- Tommy Rees. Congratulations for winning the QB coach of the year award tutoring a kid who is capable, but is limited in his ability make throws downfield. Nice job with development, please continue to do a good job with him... Now let's get serious for a second. If Notre Dame is ever going to win a national championship, did you see the three other guys that were in the playoffs? Lawrence, Murray and Tua?... That's what the Notre Dame quarterback needs to look like in terms of arm talent. You already signed a kid this year that was an afterthought and can't throw like that, let's make sure that Jurkovec keeps developing and that we evaluate Drew Pyne. If he can't make throws like Murray or Lawrence, pull his scholarship and lets land a kid who can. In terms of 2021, you have one job. Land a top 5 quarterback that can make all the throws, or find a new job.

Tommy Rees, you're on notice, not because you did a bad job coaching, but because you're not getting it done on the recruiting trail. You have one more years to fix that.

- Chip Long. Continue to develop as an offensive coordinator and land somebody of substance on the recruiting trail, outside of a white tight end that ND can land yearly, or you're fired. Nothing more needs to be said.

Chip long, you're on notice, Just as Tommy Rees is. I want you to spend no fewer than 100 hours per week recruiting until spring practice. You have one more year.

- Clark Lea, I have no problem with your coaching. You did a damn fine job this year in your first go around. But you have some explaining to do. Last year Mike Elko landed 5 top 150 players on the defensive side of the ball, coming off a 4-8 season, when Notre Dame had no momentum. This year you only landed 3 top 150 players on defense (1 top 100) coming off of a 10-3 season in which ND built a lot more momentum and recruits were listening. Why?... Why did your former boss out recruit you coming off the worst season ND's faced since 2009, when you have a much, much better situation to recruit from the following year?

Clark Lea, keep up the good work coaching, but if you don't match or surpass Mike Elko as a recruiter in the next two cycles, you'll be finding a new job. Not a threat, just a stern warning. Have a great New Years, take a couple days off and get ready to come back to work in January and prepare to put in 100 hours per week recruiting with your friend, Chip Long.

Lastly, a public service announcement to all ND assistant coaches. You get paid a bundle of cash. The new expectation of you is that you will slave for that cash. Each of you will work 100 hours per week in recruiting until spring. That leaves you 68 hours per week to sleep. Get 6 hours per night and you have 26 hours per week to spend awake with your families. I'm going to work the same schedule. We're going to fix this. It starts with recruiting and it starts next week. Rest up. Turn your phone off. I don't want to talk to you for the next few days. Right now I need to go hire a running back coach who is on board with the plan, a wide receiver coach that is on board with the plan, and a special teams coordinator that is on board with the plan... By the way, Terry Joseph, you're now the recruiting coordinator (because you're a damn good recruiter) and I'm getting you a raise to 1.5 million per year. You will land a top 8 class next year and you be responsible for no fewer than 2, 5 star, and 6 top 100 recruits, coming off our playoff run and undefeated regular season.

Happy New Years Boys!

I agree with 99% but they did lose 2 First round O Lineman. In the games of what if’s, imagine both of them played?
 
Again, ND will not ever recruit in the same tier as these teams. The reasons behind that are the reasons many of us cheer and root for ND. They could sell out, sure, but I'd rather have a team who does it the right way, values their STUDENT-athletes and makes a run every 3-4 years.

I also think the game could have been competitive if ND takes advantage of great field position early (Book Fumble), the special teams fumble recovery, Mike Floyd 2.0 gaining some hands, Love not being injured. Every ND fans knows they don't recruit on the level of the elite so losing Love was brutal.

But we absolutely used to recruit like that. Vinny cerrato, Holtz’s recruiting coordinator, regularly pulled in consensus top 3 recruiting classes
 
The original post is a bit harsh for a team that just went 12-0. The bottom line is that if ND is going to continue to be a playoff contender/ big 6 bowl team every year they have to win the battle for recruits they SHOULD get . Too many signing day losses ( Amon St. Brown ) and Without a Doubt the OC has to be criticized for that shit gameplan. . IMO ND has to improve the running game IF we do not have the gamebreakers at WR. RIGHT NOW WE DO NOT . What we have are a good crop of OL and TE. get physical and tweak the plan Chippie. and BK needs to close the deal on recruits at RB or get rid of Denson. Position changes if it were up to me. Move Bracy to WR in the Spring . The incoming Frosh Hamilton needs to play somewhere and both safties return . IF has game breaking speed put him on offense too for a YEAR. We need speed speed speed. LENZY ? why didn't he play this year ??? Big Q that has to be answered. Is is bad coaching or is he and these WR's not that good ?
 
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Again, ND will not ever recruit in the same tier as these teams. The reasons behind that are the reasons many of us cheer and root for ND. They could sell out, sure, but I'd rather have a team who does it the right way, values their STUDENT-athletes and makes a run every 3-4 years.

I also think the game could have been competitive if ND takes advantage of great field position early (Book Fumble), the special teams fumble recovery, Mike Floyd 2.0 gaining some hands, Love not being injured. Every ND fans knows they don't recruit on the level of the elite so losing Love was brutal.
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You are right they won’t, but it’s hard to follow why? Were Jaylon Smith, Stephon Tuitt, and Quentin Nelson so bad for this ivory tower image they are shooting for?

Football made the image of Notre Dame that exists in the paradigm of 99% of the people who think about it. The football players that made that image were not choir boy scholars like they want to fill that ivory tower with now.

I think the university has done a pretty good job of convincing the larger fan base that the Notre Dame identity that the world identifies with was built on these top end students who also happened to be amazing athletes which is not true. They have built a lie and expect us all to live in it.

The program on its current course will sooner become Princeton or Harvard than Clemson/ Alabama, which is a shame to a fan like myself.
 
After reading the initial post and all subsequent posts , we all pretty much conclude one thing. ND needs better players and better coaches. That pretty much covers it. It’s been that way since Holtz left. Every year we all have our opinions and voices heard on this forum. Still, nothing changes. We can watch or we can turn the channel. That’s about all we control. There inlies the real issue. Those who are in control do not want to make the necessary changes so the football program can compete at an elite level. My feeling is , you can get elite talent and still maintain high standards. Someone mentioned in another thread that along with Alabama and Clemson, there are maybe 4 other schools that have a legit shot at a NC every year. The rest are basically window dressing. I must say I have to agree. Also, keep you eyes to the future. The day is fast approaching that players will be paid or compensated in some fashion. When that day arrives, things will drastically change.
 
After reading the initial post and all subsequent posts , we all pretty much conclude one thing. ND needs better players and better coaches. That pretty much covers it. It’s been that way since Holtz left. Every year we all have our opinions and voices heard on this forum. Still, nothing changes. We can watch or we can turn the channel. That’s about all we control. There inlies the real issue. Those who are in control do not want to make the necessary changes so the football program can compete at an elite level. My feeling is , you can get elite talent and still maintain high standards. Someone mentioned in another thread that along with Alabama and Clemson, there are maybe 4 other schools that have a legit shot at a NC every year. The rest are basically window dressing. I must say I have to agree. Also, keep you eyes to the future. The day is fast approaching that players will be paid or compensated in some fashion. When that day arrives, things will drastically change.

Great post!
 
biggest issue i see is BK doesn't know what it takes to get over the hump because he never was a coach under an elite coach to learn the process or know what it really takes.
 
After reading the initial post and all subsequent posts , we all pretty much conclude one thing. ND needs better players and better coaches. That pretty much covers it. It’s been that way since Holtz left. Every year we all have our opinions and voices heard on this forum. Still, nothing changes. We can watch or we can turn the channel. That’s about all we control. There inlies the real issue. Those who are in control do not want to make the necessary changes so the football program can compete at an elite level. My feeling is , you can get elite talent and still maintain high standards. Someone mentioned in another thread that along with Alabama and Clemson, there are maybe 4 other schools that have a legit shot at a NC every year. The rest are basically window dressing. I must say I have to agree. Also, keep you eyes to the future. The day is fast approaching that players will be paid or compensated in some fashion. When that day arrives, things will drastically change.

Agreed about pay for play being right around the corner . If you read this article from last week the school basically says when college football goes pay for play the gig is up and they are checking out. We will see? I have a hard time seeing them give up the cash cow. They want to sit on the fence and pile money up.

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/28/sports/notre-dame-college-football-playoff.html
 
YOU DONT GO 12-0 WITHOUT TALENTED PLAYERS !

No, but you don't go 14-0 without the MOST talented players. Nobody is trying to push an agenda that Notre Dame doesn't have a lot of talent relative to 90% of college football. Our discussion surrounds how far away they are from the upper echelon of teams that have the best players, not the teams that have talented players.
 
Very tired of non-alums trying to dictate how Notre Dame as an institution should behave. Just too many people here who have no understanding of the institution, but just care about the football team. Root for some other school's team. All you want is to damage the institution.
 
Very tired of non-alums trying to dictate how Notre Dame as an institution should behave. Just too many people here who have no understanding of the institution, but just care about the football team. Root for some other school's team. All you want is to damage the institution.
Damage the institution? How is duke doing since softening their admittance for basketball players? No one is asking ND to be Alabama.

A good kid should be eliminated because of a foreign language requirement?
You can't have some easier majors offered to all students? not golf, but there are much easier majors than what ND offers, duke offers them, and duke is still better academically than ND.
Transfers are extremely difficult at ND, we aren't talking JUCO transfers.
 
Very tired of non-alums trying to dictate how Notre Dame as an institution should behave. Just too many people here who have no understanding of the institution, but just care about the football team. Root for some other school's team. All you want is to damage the institution.
Get off your high horse. It's alums like you who give the institution a bad rep. This is a free message board where people are free to make any comments they want. P.s. Very few posters are suggesting ND turn into a football factory
 
Again, ND will not ever recruit in the same tier as these teams. The reasons behind that are the reasons many of us cheer and root for ND. They could sell out, sure, but I'd rather have a team who does it the right way, values their STUDENT-athletes and makes a run every 3-4 years.

I also think the game could have been competitive if ND takes advantage of great field position early (Book Fumble), the special teams fumble recovery, Mike Floyd 2.0 gaining some hands, Love not being injured. Every ND fans knows they don't recruit on the level of the elite so losing Love was brutal.
I would LOVE Notre Dame to recruit at that level again. Unfortunately at the end of the day, we're still stuck with a mediocre coaching staff that isn't even competitive big games.
 
Anyone think Kelly will be considered for one of these 5 NFL openings? (Or has that day passed.) Harbaugh? (I heard rumors of the Jets.)
 
Very tired of non-alums trying to dictate how Notre Dame as an institution should behave. Just too many people here who have no understanding of the institution, but just care about the football team. Root for some other school's team. All you want is to damage the institution.

Damage the institution? What the fvck are you talking about? Who’s advocating that by asking for better recruits/coaching staff or an AD willing to pony up when we get great assistants to keep them from going to rivals. I don’t recall Satan being on anybody’s wish list.

Here’s some shit for you..... I’d be willing to bet that 75%+ of the Notre Dame fans that attended the Clemson game weren’t alums. More than 50% that attend every ND home game aren’t alumni either. They support that same football program that uses a ton of money for non-football related things (including scholarships) that you’re asking them to walk away from. You may have a degree, but you lack intelligence. Damage the Institution.... Alienating 90% of the fanbase would absolutely be the dumbest thing you could do.
 
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Notre Dame’s lopsided 30-3 loss had nothing to do with recruiting.

It had nothing to do with talent.

Those are weak excuses.

So now Furman, Georgia Southern, Georgia Tech, Syracuse, Florida State, Louisville, South Carolina, Pitt, Texas A & M and Boston College recruit better and have more talent than Notre Dame ?

Not one team on Clemson’s entire 2018 schedule scored fewer points than ND. not one team !

Furman scored 7

Georgia Southern scored 7

Georgia Tech scored 21

Syracuse scored 23

Florida State scored 10

Louisville scored 16

South Carolina scored 35

Pitt scored 10

Texas A & M scored 26

Boston College scored 7

NOTRE DAME SCORED 3

Notre Dame scored 3 after a month’s preparation!

30-3 wasn’t about recruiting and talent !

It was about preparation and coaching, including game plans and in game adjustments.

Not true you say ?

Then go back and look at the points that Clemson’s inferior opponents scored and compare them to Notre Dame’s 3 points.

Deja Vu, all over again !
 
Very tired of non-alums trying to dictate how Notre Dame as an institution should behave. Just too many people here who have no understanding of the institution, but just care about the football team. Root for some other school's team. All you want is to damage the institution.
Great post. ND is different and better.
 
Great post. ND is different and better.

The institution will be fine. It always is. Stop your paranoia. Nobody looks down at Duke as an institution for recruiting one and done players in basketball that would never get into that school if they weren't athletes.

And not every 5 star is an idiot. Christian Wilkins would be one of the two most highly decorated student athletes on Notre Dame's team. He's not a thug. He's not a bad kid at all. He's an academic, all American, who was also a 5 star at a private school. Andrew Thomas and Jamaree Salyer were great academic fits and private school kids too. They were perfect fits at Notre Dame, they just chose to go elsewhere.

ND is not landing enough difference makers that profile well for Notre Dame. Those are the players we want ND to land, not criminals... Although I wouldn't mind a couple more rough around the edges kids. When harnessed, and provided a stable, structured environment, they were often my favourite kids to coach.
 
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Damage the institution? What the fvck are you talking about? Who’s advocating that by asking for better recruits/coaching staff or an AD willing to pony up when we get great assistants to keep them from going to rivals. I don’t recall Satan being on anybody’s wish list.

Here’s some shit for you..... I’d be willing to bet that 75%+ of the Notre Dame fans that attended the Clemson game weren’t alums. More than 50% that attend every ND home game aren’t alumni either. They support that same football program that uses a ton of money for non-football related things (including scholarships) that you’re asking them to walk away from. You may have a degree, but you lack intelligence. Damage the Institution.... Alienating 90% of the fanbase would absolutely be the dumbest thing you could do.
The university of Notre Dame is a liberal arts school nobody has ever heard of in northern Indiana without this football program. This football program is Ball State without its subway alums. You got it right on brother.
 
The institution will be fine. It always is. Stop your paranoia. Nobody looks down at Duke as an institution for recruiting one and done players in basketball that would never get into that school if they weren't athletes.

And not every 5 star is an idiot. Christian Wilkins would be one of the two most highly decorated student athletes on Notre Dame's team. He's not a thug. He's not a bad kid at all. He's an academic, all American, who was also a 5 star at a private school. Andrew Thomas and Jamaree Salyer were great academic fits and private school kids too. They were perfect fits at Notre Dame, they just chose to go elsewhere.

ND is not landing enough difference makers that profile well for Notre Dame. Those are the players we want ND to land, not criminals... Although I wouldn't mind a couple more rough around the edges kids. When harnessed, and provided a stable, structured environment, they were often my favourite kids to coach.
This. Duke basketball is my new go to for the “we’re different” argument. No. Freaking. Excuses.
 
The institution will be fine. It always is. Stop your paranoia. Nobody looks down at Duke as an institution for recruiting one and done players in basketball that would never get into that school if they weren't athletes.

And not every 5 star is an idiot. Christian Wilkins would be one of the two most highly decorated student athletes on Notre Dame's team. He's not a thug. He's not a bad kid at all. He's an academic, all American, who was also a 5 star at a private school. Andrew Thomas and Jamaree Salyer were great academic fits and private school kids too. They were perfect fits at Notre Dame, they just chose to go elsewhere.

ND is not landing enough difference makers that profile well for Notre Dame. Those are the players we want ND to land, not criminals... Although I wouldn't mind a couple more rough around the edges kids. When harnessed, and provided a stable, structured environment, they were often my favourite kids to coach.

IIO,

ND went 12-0

ND has been populating the NFL with talented players.

You don’t do both without talented players.

There are consigliere’s and then there are wartime consigliere’s and you have to be able to differentiate between the two.
 
The institution will be fine. It always is. Stop your paranoia. Nobody looks down at Duke as an institution for recruiting one and done players in basketball that would never get into that school if they weren't athletes.

And not every 5 star is an idiot. Christian Wilkins would be one of the two most highly decorated student athletes on Notre Dame's team. He's not a thug. He's not a bad kid at all. He's an academic, all American, who was also a 5 star at a private school. Andrew Thomas and Jamaree Salyer were great academic fits and private school kids too. They were perfect fits at Notre Dame, they just chose to go elsewhere.

ND is not landing enough difference makers that profile well for Notre Dame. Those are the players we want ND to land, not criminals... Although I wouldn't mind a couple more rough around the edges kids. When harnessed, and provided a stable, structured environment, they were often my favourite kids to coach.
ND isn't changing for you or anybody else
Get off your high horse with. It is an amazing place with great academics and great athletics. Root for an SEC school.
 
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Very tired of non-alums trying to dictate how Notre Dame as an institution should behave. Just too many people here who have no understanding of the institution, but just care about the football team. Root for some other school's team. All you want is to damage the institution.

But you want the cash from the unwashed? The football team is what put ND on the map
 
Bilal was the weak spot. Kelly tried to get a legit linebacker but couldn't land one. No Caleb Kelly. Shark or Werner among others. I feel that Nik Coleman was underutilized and he became a great instinctive tackler. How none of the younger guys was developed is a mystery. I would deny Bilal a fifth year. Bring in another recruit.
 
This is as much about coaching, scheme and personality as it is about talent.

NDs O-Line used to regularly push teams around. In 93 they beat FSUs NFL defense up and down the field.

Under Kelly a crop of NFL linemen haven’t pushed anyone up and down the field.

Kelly’s offenses have no personality - the story changes season to season and even game to game.
 
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This is as much about coaching, scheme and personality as it is about talent.

NDs O-Line used to regularly push teams around. In 93 they beat FSUs NFL defense up and down the field.

Under Kelly a crop of NFL linemen haven’t pushed anyone up and down the field.

Kelly’s offenses have no personality - the story changes season to season and even game to game.

I agree with your 3rd paragraph.

With the left side of last year’s OLine I never understood why they didn’t blow out every defense, except for one factor.

No defense feared Wimbush and they loaded the box with 8 defenders.

With Book at QB they would have dominated and matriculated the ball down the field at will.

Don’t forget that Kelly also kept an NFL quarterback on the bench until the starter got injured.

I’m not so sure that he’s adept at recognizing QB talent.

I think he likes runners more than passers, at least that’s what history seems to indicate.
 
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