Just a reminder of the absurd insanity....Riley

[NDblitz]

BTW I've spoken to many parents that didn't know about the Pell Grant and they were able to send their kids to college without loans when they didn't think they could. Even 44 may have kids, grandkids, or he himself might now be able to pass that on to others so they too can attend college. There may be folks reading this board that don't post that may also benefit from this information.

That said, what kind of garbage human being would come here and post your garbage out of plain ignorance just to try to make a worthless gotcha point on a message board?

You need to examine your priorities.

From the Pell grant site.

Federal Pell Grants usually are awarded only to undergraduate students who display exceptional financial need and have not earned a bachelor's, graduate, or professional degree. 400k? Lol.

 

[88ND]

There's a lot of risk. There's physical problems, some surface years after playing. I agree the free education is great, but not enough as the schools make millions.

BTW, Pell grants make state college free for all comers. Requirements for awards are minimal. No risk of physical or CTE problems developing later on...

but nobody is forcing them to play...

 

[88ND]

In the university system, you don't necessarily get what you pay for.

oh...
but...
85 of them pay nothing...
so there's always that

 

[88ND]

What's the solution though brother? The old system was wrong, the schools were cleaning up on the backs of these players. Some of them go on to NFL and make money, but most don't.

Remember that QB at Nebraska that won the NC and maybe even the Heisman? He was an option guy that had no chance in pro football. Dudes probably driving Uber now. So, that ain't right.

What's the solution?

The real discussion is way too much to type but I will wallow in the text here for a bit...

Let's start at the beginning here.
First and foremost there is too much of an emphasis on having these kids grow up way too fast.
What I mean by that is this nonsense starts in junior high. Lifting year round...don't worry about those other sports (unless you're really good) then the other coaches which often times can be the same coach...
but they push these kids to make these sports year round. Lifting...the 'VOLUNTARY" workouts...aren't quite so voluntary. While they can't technically hold an official practice until date "X", it differs a bit here and there by state, but the coaches know damn well what the attendance is of these "voluntary" workouts.
Why do they do it? Well it comes from the superficial pipe dream. It's complete nonsense.
They need to let these kids grow up in good time. Let them enjoy their childhood because it will be two blinks of the eye and they will have to go to college or work or both.
Let them be kids and enjoy the youthful years.
Football functioned just fine when players weren't practicing year round. It worked just fine without early enrollments.

So the why do they do it? Johnny does it because Jimmy down the road is doing it. Jimmy does it because Billy in the next town over on another team might be doing it and so the daisy chain begins.
Add in the coaches preaching the very thing above and these superficial pipe dreams and this is what you get. Kids in a frenzy to get exactly what? For almost all of them they get nothing.

The NFL which of course is where these stupid superficial dreams are coming from will find a good player no matter where they play college. Let's just peek in on that for a moment.
We won't count anything below D2 schools just for the sake of sanity here...
there are..
425 D1, D1AA, D2 colleges playing football.
The average roster size is 118 players.
That's 50,150 players on average in the three divisions we're looking at here..
1,696 players on a game day roster in the NFL
32 teams with a roster size of 53

That means there is 3....yes three percent of players that will actually play on Sunday from the combined rosters of D1, D1AA, and D2

So indeed this nonsense is a stupid superficial pipe dream that will materialize for such a tiny amount of players.
Yet the focus is all on this.

It used to be get an education first and foremost and hope you have a great game on Saturday.
NOW...it's make football a year round sport and do everything you can to be the best player possible for what?
The NFL doesn't expand much. It was 28 teams for a LONG time and now 32 teams. Fact remains there are 1,696 roster spots and trying to tell every player they can get one of those among 50,150 players is the BS sales pitch.
Players and parents buy this sales pitch hook line and sinker starting all the way back in junior high.

Again at one time it was go to school and also get to play football.
Now it's play football and go to school...in some cases I'm not sure they're doing much schooling. Schooling has become a complete after thought. Ah, that NFL dream again getting in the way of reality and remember it starts in 8th grade.

I'm the black sheep of the bunch but I see it a little differently.
See you and many look at how much the schools make from this sport.
OK...
BUT...
You can swap out these players with lesser talented players and guess what...the schools are still going to make the same $$$
Don't kid yourself although they've done a good job kidding the athlete student that they specifically are the reason why that school is making xyz dollars.
BS.
People will still tune in to root against the rival team and so on and so on. People tune in, attend, etc no matter what.
This of course has to be relative across the board but if it were it makes no di$$erence in what these schools make.
If Bama with lesser talented players was playing Auburn also with lesser talented players there will be ZERO difference in the interest level of that versus today.
But they've sold the dream and it's been bought hook, line and sinker. Again starting in 8th grade. YOU are the reason the school makes all that money. WRONG.

IMO given the fact that about 3 percent of players actually turn professional I feel the schooling needs to be paramount.
Taking a player from our beloved...
they can get 4 years of education, room, board, books, meals, all the under armor garb they want to wear including footwear, plus a monthly stipend for the pocket...plus an allocation for tickets and $$ earmarked for getting family to and from home and away games.

What does all that amount to? In the case of our beloved and how expensive it is to attend there..
the 4 years of free education and all needs for schooling, eating, clothing etc...easily hitting 400k.
Add in the other little perks and you're now nearing a half million over four years.

You get to leave college and start looking for employment 101 percent debt free. Being free of that stress is worth a great deal in itself, no? If you do your research right you might find out all that money the university gets they put back into facility for the scholastic side of things and athletic side as well. It's not like all that money is getting kicked up to Fat Tony Salerno while you just slave over the pigskin for the 'Man"

Sadly NIL is here now and it won't go away. So what is the best way out of this hornets nest?

I feel the ONLY way out of this debacle is for the NFL to step up to the plate and get a farm system.
The NFL has been on easy street using college as it's only feeder system since forever. The next CBA will be a nightmare for the owners to deal with because of the NIL deals. Riley making 1.1 million dollars and a real professional that works at this as a full time job is getting 785k. Yeah this will become a real problem in 5.5 years and if you think the NIL deals now are silly just wait and see what they look like in 5 years.
The players association is going to be full on loco over this.

If the NFL went this route it's a win for all. If a kid is really special he can be drafted out of high school. Start getting paid right away and it gets the kid in a team's system right off the bat. This is really beneficial to any possible QB's and the team having them in the system sooner than later.
Obviously there needs to be rules around the farm system with who can play and when can a player actually get into the BIG game...but that would be the easy part.
Kids can still opt to go to college and declare themselves for the draft after their schooling is done. Just like now the NFL will draft them then.
Hell there are kids that get drafted now after college and still not quite ready for the big show until a year or two.

A farm system would work great for all parties involved. Players getting paid right away that deserve it. Teams getting players into their system right away. Kids that choose to go to school are there because they understand the true importance of gift they've been given of a free education and truly appreciate that. NFL dreams are still on the table for the ones opting for college first.
Colleges no longer have to worry about WTF to do with this NIL mess. People will still tune in or attend the games at the very same rate as today.

Farm systems work quite well in baseball...(TALK ABOUT MONEY) but it works quite well $$$ for all involved in baseball, hockey has a farm system...basketball has started seeing the light with this although that is a bit different as the rosters are much smaller...
NFL team's have a practice squad in lieu of the 53 man roster and nothing benefits players like game action.

MOST importantly a farm system would stop the mockery of the education they COULD GET but are simply attending a school now based on the NIL amount and how quickly they can be eligible for the NFL draft....not giving one damn about the actual education.

P.S.
Kirk Herbstreit suddenly now wants to talk about the 40 year decision and that players can't have all the control. Amazing how his light bulb just illuminated on this subject.

 

[NDblitz]

The real discussion is way too much to type but I will wallow in the text here for a bit...

Let's start at the beginning here.
First and foremost there is too much of an emphasis on having these kids grow up way too fast.
What I mean by that is this nonsense starts in junior high. Lifting year round...don't worry about those other sports (unless you're really good) then the other coaches which often times can be the same coach...
but they push these kids to make these sports year round. Lifting...the 'VOLUNTARY" workouts...aren't quite so voluntary. While they can't technically hold an official practice until date "X", it differs a bit here and there by state, but the coaches know damn well what the attendance is of these "voluntary" workouts.
Why do they do it? Well it comes from the superficial pipe dream. It's complete nonsense.
They need to let these kids grow up in good time. Let them enjoy their childhood because it will be two blinks of the eye and they will have to go to college or work or both.
Let them be kids and enjoy the youthful years.
Football functioned just fine when players weren't practicing year round. It worked just fine without early enrollments.

So the why do they do it? Johnny does it because Jimmy down the road is doing it. Jimmy does it because Billy in the next town over on another team might be doing it and so the daisy chain begins.
Add in the coaches preaching the very thing above and these superficial pipe dreams and this is what you get. Kids in a frenzy to get exactly what? For almost all of them they get nothing.

The NFL which of course is where these stupid superficial dreams are coming from will find a good player no matter where they play college. Let's just peek in on that for a moment.
We won't count anything below D2 schools just for the sake of sanity here...
there are..
425 D1, D1AA, D2 colleges playing football.
The average roster size is 118 players.
That's 50,150 players on average in the three divisions we're looking at here..
1,696 players on a game day roster in the NFL
32 teams with a roster size of 53

That means there is 3....yes three percent of players that will actually play on Sunday from the combined rosters of D1, D1AA, and D2

So indeed this nonsense is a stupid superficial pipe dream that will materialize for such a tiny amount of players.
Yet the focus is all on this.

It used to be get an education first and foremost and hope you have a great game on Saturday.
NOW...it's make football a year round sport and do everything you can to be the best player possible for what?
The NFL doesn't expand much. It was 28 teams for a LONG time and now 32 teams. Fact remains there are 1,696 roster spots and trying to tell every player they can get one of those among 50,150 players is the BS sales pitch.
Players and parents buy this sales pitch hook line and sinker starting all the way back in junior high.

Again at one time it was go to school and also get to play football.
Now it's play football and go to school...in some cases I'm not sure they're doing much schooling. Schooling has become a complete after thought. Ah, that NFL dream again getting in the way of reality and remember it starts in 8th grade.

I'm the black sheep of the bunch but I see it a little differently.
See you and many look at how much the schools make from this sport.
OK...
BUT...
You can swap out these players with lesser talented players and guess what...the schools are still going to make the same $$$
Don't kid yourself although they've done a good job kidding the athlete student that they specifically are the reason why that school is making xyz dollars.
BS.
People will still tune in to root against the rival team and so on and so on. People tune in, attend, etc no matter what.
This of course has to be relative across the board but if it were it makes no di$$erence in what these schools make.
If Bama with lesser talented players was playing Auburn also with lesser talented players there will be ZERO difference in the interest level of that versus today.
But they've sold the dream and it's been bought hook, line and sinker. Again starting in 8th grade. YOU are the reason the school makes all that money. WRONG.

IMO given the fact that about 3 percent of players actually turn professional I feel the schooling needs to be paramount.
Taking a player from our beloved...
they can get 4 years of education, room, board, books, meals, all the under armor garb they want to wear including footwear, plus a monthly stipend for the pocket...plus an allocation for tickets and $$ earmarked for getting family to and from home and away games.

What does all that amount to? In the case of our beloved and how expensive it is to attend there..
the 4 years of free education and all needs for schooling, eating, clothing etc...easily hitting 400k.
Add in the other little perks and you're now nearing a half million over four years.

You get to leave college and start looking for employment 101 percent debt free. Being free of that stress is worth a great deal in itself, no? If you do your research right you might find out all that money the university gets they put back into facility for the scholastic side of things and athletic side as well. It's not like all that money is getting kicked up to Fat Tony Salerno while you just slave over the pigskin for the 'Man"

Sadly NIL is here now and it won't go away. So what is the best way out of this hornets nest?

I feel the ONLY way out of this debacle is for the NFL to step up to the plate and get a farm system.
The NFL has been on easy street using college as it's only feeder system since forever. The next CBA will be a nightmare for the owners to deal with because of the NIL deals. Riley making 1.1 million dollars and a real professional that works at this as a full time job is getting 785k. Yeah this will become a real problem in 5.5 years and if you think the NIL deals now are silly just wait and see what they look like in 5 years.
The players association is going to be full on loco over this.

If the NFL went this route it's a win for all. If a kid is really special he can be drafted out of high school. Start getting paid right away and it gets the kid in a team's system right off the bat. This is really beneficial to any possible QB's and the team having them in the system sooner than later.
Obviously there needs to be rules around the farm system with who can play and when can a player actually get into the BIG game...but that would be the easy part.
Kids can still opt to go to college and declare themselves for the draft after their schooling is done. Just like now the NFL will draft them then.
Hell there are kids that get drafted now after college and still not quite ready for the big show until a year or two.

A farm system would work great for all parties involved. Players getting paid right away that deserve it. Teams getting players into their system right away. Kids that choose to go to school are there because they understand the true importance of gift they've been given of a free education and truly appreciate that. NFL dreams are still on the table for the ones opting for college first.
Colleges no longer have to worry about WTF to do with this NIL mess. People will still tune in or attend the games at the very same rate as today.

Farm systems work quite well in baseball...(TALK ABOUT MONEY) but it works quite well $$$ for all involved in baseball, hockey has a farm system...basketball has started seeing the light with this although that is a bit different as the rosters are much smaller...
NFL team's have a practice squad in lieu of the 53 man roster and nothing benefits players like game action.

MOST importantly a farm system would stop the mockery of the education they COULD GET but are simply attending a school now based on the NIL amount and how quickly they can be eligible for the NFL draft....not giving one damn about the actual education.

P.S.
Kirk Herbstreit suddenly now wants to talk about the 40 year decision and that players can't have all the control. Amazing how his light bulb just illuminated on this subject.

They already have one. The UFL. That allows them to have their cake and eat it too. They have the NCAA for the youngers and the UFL for the discards. But you are right.

 

[NDblitz]

Rick Neuheisal had a really good idea about NIL this AM. I need to relisten but in a nutshell he said you give kids 4 levels of scholarship. Enhanced...Enhanced +1, Enhanced +2, Enhanced +3. If a kid is going to transfer the school he is going to has to make him a +3 or he can't leave. And you would only have a certain number of slots per enhancement. The basic one being the largest.

I also like the idea of no NIL discussion until after your first season on campus. Unless you are a Grad. So if you are a Frosh or new transfer, NIL cannot be in the discussion at all. Any coach who violates that can be suspended for the season.

 

[88ND]

Rick Neuheisal had a really good idea about NIL this AM. I need to relisten but in a nutshell he said you give kids 4 levels of scholarship. Enhanced...Enhanced +1, Enhanced +2, Enhanced +3. If a kid is going to transfer the school he is going to has to make him a +3 or he can't leave. And you would only have a certain number of slots per enhancement. The basic one being the largest.

I also like the idea of no NIL discussion until after your first season on campus. Unless you are a Grad. So if you are a Frosh or new transfer, NIL cannot be in the discussion at all. Any coach who violates that can be suspended for the season.

The problem is policing such a thing. NCAA can't seem to police simple broken rules and we're supposed to trust them to monitor tiered scholarships...
No way.

If these kids want paid immediately then we've got to create a real farm system. Other sports do it...MLB and Hockey wouldn't survive without it. The NBA is seeing the benefit of it.

Whatever the exact plan is...we need to get NIL out of NCAA or at least football. If kids are good enough they will be drafted right out of high school just like other pro sports. If they need more development and or realize how paramount a degree is they can get that free of charge. If the stars align for them and they declare for the draft perhaps they can continue playing on Sunday.

Before some of the naysayers blow a gasket and say on this subject that will never happen because they should make money.

I ask this...
A player like Trevor Lawrence back when he was the highly touted recruit...Some pro team would have paid him an absurdly gigantic salary being able to draft him right out of high school. Get him their system and groom him to make his pro debut in a couple years.
Cases like that pop up quite a bit. They cold fetch far more money getting a real NFL contract right out of high school versus NIL dough they get now.
Riley wouldn't but if he's good enough he would be drafted after college is done. If not he got an all paid for highly respected degree from Duke/ND
The NFL wins, the players win. They are getting paid by the NFL and don't have to worry about pesky things like classes, etc. They are now professional. Most are only going to bide their time until the NFL deems them old enough to be drafted. School is simply a pain in the ass to them and if you gave them a pro contract out of high school option versus NIL money and attending classes none of which they want to take, I think you know the answer there.
College wins. College coaches win.
The fans are the big winner. Back to watching an amateur sport knowing they're taking studies seriously and get to play football on Saturday.

 

[NDblitz]

The problem is policing such a thing. NCAA can't seem to police simple broken rules and we're supposed to trust them to monitor tiered scholarships...
No way.

If these kids want paid immediately then we've got to create a real farm system. Other sports do it...MLB and Hockey wouldn't survive without it. The NBA is seeing the benefit of it.

Whatever the exact plan is...we need to get NIL out of NCAA or at least football. If kids are good enough they will be drafted right out of high school just like other pro sports. If they need more development and or realize how paramount a degree is they can get that free of charge. If the stars align for them and they declare for the draft perhaps they can continue playing on Sunday.

Before some of the naysayers blow a gasket and say on this subject that will never happen because they should make money.

I ask this...
A player like Trevor Lawrence back when he was the highly touted recruit...Some pro team would have paid him an absurdly gigantic salary being able to draft him right out of high school. Get him their system and groom him to make his pro debut in a couple years.
Cases like that pop up quite a bit. They cold fetch far more money getting a real NFL contract right out of high school versus NIL dough they get now.
Riley wouldn't but if he's good enough he would be drafted after college is done. If not he got an all paid for highly respected degree from Duke/ND
The NFL wins, the players win. They are getting paid by the NFL and don't have to worry about pesky things like classes, etc. They are now professional. Most are only going to bide their time until the NFL deems them old enough to be drafted. School is simply a pain in the ass to them and if you gave them a pro contract out of high school option versus NIL money and attending classes none of which they want to take, I think you know the answer there.
College wins. College coaches win.
The fans are the big winner. Back to watching an amateur sport knowing they're taking studies seriously and get to play football on Saturday.

Tiered scholarships aren't NIL. It's revenue sharing. Easier to monitor as school's have a compliance department. Any NIL would be a seperate endeavor handled outside the school by a player's agent and a company. No booster or school involvement.