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How satisfied are you with the job Brian Kelly is doing?

Grade Brian Kelly's performance 10 years in:

  • A

    Votes: 9 13.2%

  • B

    Votes: 44 64.7%

  • C

    Votes: 11 16.2%

  • D

    Votes: 2 2.9%

  • F

    Votes: 2 2.9%
  • Total voters
    68
I think the typical ND fan is so used to mediocrity these days that it's impacting their ability to evaluate objectively.

For instance, what other blue blood/wealthy program in NDs tier would accept the results ND has had this decade? USC has been through several coaches since BK came on board, and USC and ND have similar records over that same time period (as an example). USC keeps changing coaches/looking for something better despite having a very similar record to ND since 2010.

How would Alabama, OSU, Michigan, Texas, USC, Oklahoma, etc. fans grade a coach who in 9 seasons has only finished ONCE in the top 5? How would they grade their program's coach who hasn't secured a single five star recruit in 6-7 cycles?
 
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chaseball said:
I think the typical ND fan is so used to mediocrity these days that it's impacting their ability to evaluate objectively.

USC has been through several coaches since BK came on board, and USC and ND have similar records over that same time period (as an example). USC keeps changing coaches/looking for something better despite having a very similar record to ND since 2010.
Click to expand...

Very simple question. Which program is healthier at the moment and for the foreseeable future , ND or S.C.?

Thank you for making the point that ND absolutely should stay the course with BK
 
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NDIRISH53 said:
There’s 6 major bowl games. Winning any of these 6 is a huge accomplishment. You’re right on.
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Is it really though? Think about the last two seasons. ND beat a 9-3 LSU team last year in the Citrus Bowl. That same LSU team (again 9-3) won a NY6 game this season. So you’re saying just because we beat LSU in a bowl game called Citrus Bowl, that if we had beaten this year’s LSU team in the Fiesta Bowl, that it would mean soooo much more? I don’t get that.
 
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Kcndmis97 said:
Is it really though? Think about the last two seasons. ND beat a 9-3 LSU team last year in the Citrus Bowl. That same LSU team (again 9-3) won a NY6 game this season. So you’re saying just because we beat LSU in a bowl game called Citrus Bowl, that if we had beaten this year’s LSU team in the Fiesta Bowl, that it would mean soooo much more? I don’t get that.
Click to expand...
Simple.
Fiesta Bowl > Citrus Bowl
 
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NIN Irish said:
Simple.
Fiesta Bowl > Citrus Bowl
Click to expand...
My point is you’re playing the same LSU team, regardless of the bowl name. So you’re saying if we won the Fiesta Bowl versus UCF, that is a better win over a traditional top SEC team in LSU?
 
Kcndmis97 said:
My point is you’re playing the same LSU team, regardless of the bowl name. So you’re saying if we won the Fiesta Bowl versus UCF, that is a better win over a traditional top SEC team in LSU?
Click to expand...
When you haven't won one in 25 years, I'd say yes, get the gorilla off the back.
 
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Pennick4 said:
Nobody cares about any game outside the Playoffs. Dummy.
Click to expand...
RTG VWRS
(+ Stream) GAME BOWL DATE/TIME NET
13.8 (25.280M) CLEM-ALA CFPNC 1/7, 8:00p ESPN Megacast
9.9 (19.069M) ALA-OKLA Orange 12/29, 8:00p ESPN/ESPN2
9.4 (16.809M) CLEM-ND Cotton 12/29, 4:00p ESPN/ESPN2
8.9 (16.781M) OSU-WASH Rose 1/1, 5:00p ESPN/ESPN2
7.3 (13.298M) TEX-UGA Sugar 1/1, 8:30p ESPN/ESPN2
4.7 (8.471M) LSU-UCF Fiesta 1/1, 1:00p ESPN
5.0 (8.366M) UF-MICH Peach 12/29, Noon ESPN

https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/college-football-tv-ratings/#2018bowls
 
After looking at the graph some more, BK has lead a ~10th (or so) ranked team for much of his tenure minus three catastrophic seasons (13, 14, 16) and minus his first season back in 2010 where he finished 15th but that was a transition year. Those 13 & 14 squads were absolutely decimated by injury, suspension, and misc. roster attrition so i don't even blame him too much for those seasons either.

When looking at his tenure in this context it has actually been pretty satisfying. The one major component Brian Kelly is lacking is that elite upside season where he has a team/roster that is on the same level as the elite first tier in college football. And based on lack of big upside on the recruiting trail since, I don't expect that to change anytime soon.

I guess the question comes down to whether or not ND fans are ok with being a 10th ranked program with the occasional jump into the single digits -- is that good enough at Notre Dame? Apparently to the stakeholders at ND it is but i think the issue is more debatable among fans.

And after this most recent discussion regarding BKs "ND worthiness" i'm starting to warm up to the idea that ND might just be a handful of players away each cycle. BK is excellent at maximizing the potential on the roster but he desperately needs to find a way to recruit a handful more prospects in that .95+ range each class. I seriously have my doubts -- given his track record -- that he can get it done but i think his program is much closer than i've been giving it credit for in some of my recent posts.
 
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chaseball said:
After looking at the graph some more, BK has lead a ~10th (or so) ranked team for much of his tenure minus three catastrophic seasons (13, 14, 16) and minus his first season back in 2010 where he finished 15th but that was a transition year. Those 13 & 14 squads were absolutely decimated by injury, suspension, and misc. roster attrition so i don't even blame him too much for those seasons either.

When looking at his tenure in this context it has actually been pretty satisfying. The one major component Brian Kelly is lacking is that elite upside season where he has a team/roster that is on the same level as the elite first tier in college football. And based on lack of big upside on the recruiting trail since, I don't expect that to change anytime soon.

I guess the question comes down to whether or not ND fans are ok with being a 10th ranked program with the occasional jump into the single digits -- is that good enough at Notre Dame? Apparently to the stakeholders at ND it is but i think the issue is more debatable among fans.

And after this most recent discussion regarding BKs "ND worthiness" i'm starting to warm up to the idea that ND might just be a handful of players away each cycle. BK is excellent at maximizing the potential on the roster but he desperately needs to find a way to recruit a handful more prospects in that .95+ range each class.
Click to expand...
This is a very good post. To me, this post represents the current status of ND football exactly. BK is a top 10 coach and thus ND is a top 10 program but there is still a big gap between the top 5 and ND. As stated, most of that gap can be closed if we get 3-4 elite prospects a year in the important positions (QB/WR/DL/OL). Right now we are way behind at QB and WR, plus more depth.

Think about our matchup versus Clemson, it was a 9-3 game with 2 mins left in the first half (even with the horrible overturn call on the Clemson fumble) when the flood gates opened. If we had more depth to absorb Love’s injury and a couple of better offensive playmakers, that is probably a tied game at halftime. For those who watched the Clemson/Bama game, you should have seen that we caused more issues for Lawrence than Bama did.
 
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chaseball said:
After looking at the graph some more, BK has lead a ~10th (or so) ranked team for much of his tenure minus three catastrophic seasons (13, 14, 16) and minus his first season back in 2010 where he finished 15th but that was a transition year. Those 13 & 14 squads were absolutely decimated by injury, suspension, and misc. roster attrition so i don't even blame him too much for those seasons either.

When looking at his tenure in this context it has actually been pretty satisfying. The one major component Brian Kelly is lacking is that elite upside season where he has a team/roster that is on the same level as the elite first tier in college football. And based on lack of big upside on the recruiting trail since, I don't expect that to change anytime soon.

I guess the question comes down to whether or not ND fans are ok with being a 10th ranked program with the occasional jump into the single digits -- is that good enough at Notre Dame? Apparently to the stakeholders at ND it is but i think the issue is more debatable among fans.

And after this most recent discussion regarding BKs "ND worthiness" i'm starting to warm up to the idea that ND might just be a handful of players away each cycle. BK is excellent at maximizing the potential on the roster but he desperately needs to find a way to recruit a handful more prospects in that .95+ range each class. I seriously have my doubts -- given his track record -- that he can get it done but i think his program is much closer than i've been giving it credit for in some of my recent posts.
Click to expand...

Feels like his biggest miss as a coach was BVG. I felt that 2015 offense was Championship level. Put that offense with this year's defense and ND plays Clemson a lot closer. I do think he and his recruiters have figured out the definition of 'the right kind of guys' -- and I don't expect the kind of player-problems we experienced 13/14 -- I also think hiring Balis might have been his biggest 'get' (except Lea who I think is a rising star) and that has gone a long way to improving players' fitness and limiting big injuries. I'm hearing some promising things about the '20 class and the potential to get a 5*...

But Chase -- if not Kelly who?

Name me 5 coaches who would do a better job than Kelly at Notre Dame (oh, and they have to want to coach at ND!)
 
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Nobody knows who the next Urban Meyer, Bob Stoops, Kirby Smart, Pete Carroll, Nick Saban, Dabo Swinney, Jimbo Fisher, etc. is. Meyer wasn't Meyer until a P5 program took a chance on him when he was just a prospect. The same can be said with the handful of other names I listed.

The point is that there's a number of head coaches out there with impressive young resumes that are looking for a promotion to the big leagues. What is more important than "who" the next coach is, is the philosophy of the institution making the hiring decisions.

ND needs to operate from a place of "the next coach we hire has a small chance of winning a national title here, but lets take a shot at the best prospective head coach available at the time, and give him a handful of seasons to see how he does, he'll probably fail, and when he does, we're prepared to cut him loose and take a chance on the next best available prospective head coach".

ND doesn't need to make the perfect hire at head coach they just need a philosophy change, and a willingness to assume risk when making head coaching changes.

The idea is you kiss enough frogs until you find your prince. You'll never find your prince if you settle for a duke though.
 
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Reality, from my perspective: Under Kelly the dominant tight end play has all but disappeared; QB play has been inconsistent. In fact, every position has been inconsistent, in my view. This is demonstrated by the original graph posted. I get the changes in college football. Still, I don't get how ND is so up and down. Based on performance over the last ten years I would expect ND to fall off next year. Can't wait for Feist's football annual to hit the news stands.
 
Whenever you see a thread 4 pages long, you can pretty much count on it being echo boy defending BK ad nauseum

BK gets a B+ for recruiting and C- for coaching. The C- is gracious. Lea get an A for coaching. Long gets an inc. because you can never tell exactly how much BK interfering in a bad way, you just know that at times he is.
 
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twalsh said:
No meaningful difference.
Click to expand...

Nope. The Fiesta opponent is usually a higher ranked team. More exposure. Arguably better for recruiting.

Saying there is no difference between the Fiesta and the Citrus is like arguing there is no difference between ending the year at 11-2 vs 10-3; or ending ranked 6th vs ranked 11th.
 
I had a pretty damn good time last year. Didn't expect that at all after losing two top-ten picks and scheduling Michigan, Fla St, Stanford, USC, VaTech. This year looks tougher and we lost the heart of the defense. Big test for Kelly and his coaches. While I don't expect a repeat of last year, I do hope for ten wins.

Chase you didn't answer my question (although I do agree with your take on past hired Davie -- in house disaster, Weis, ND alum, no college pedigree, disaster... Ty couldn't recruit, disaster.)

Anyway, I'll make it easier on you.

If Scott Frost said he wanted the Notre Dame job last year would you have canned Kelly and hired him?

If Kliff Kingsbury wanted the ND job two years ago. Would you have canned Kelly and hired him?

If Brent Venables told the world he was ready to become a head coach -- would you can Kelly today and hire him?

Would you take a chance today on.... Blake Anderson or Neal Brown?
 
If i was AD Brian Kelly would have been fired a long time ago (after 2014 season) And i would have taken chances on whoever the best prospective head coach/hottest coaching candidate was at that moment in time. I would give him 3-4 years max and if there wasn't a big uptick in talent and results that was indicating national championship caliber program i would fire that coach and hire whoever the next best available/hot coaching candidate was at that moment in time.

Brian Kelly was that guy at one time before ND hired him (back in 2009). Kirby Smart, James Franklin, Tom Herman, Scott Frost are recent examples. Josh Heupel's stock is skyrocketing right now.

I would be going through the best available coaches like dirty underwear until i found the next Nick Saban, Urban Meyer, Dabo Swinney, etc. even if it meant some very lean years in between. It's national championship or bust at ND ... being 2nd tier wouldn't be an option.
 
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stu4don said:
Feels like his biggest miss as a coach was BVG. I felt that 2015 offense was Championship level. Put that offense with this year's defense and ND plays Clemson a lot closer. I do think he and his recruiters have figured out the definition of 'the right kind of guys' -- and I don't expect the kind of player-problems we experienced 13/14 -- I also think hiring Balis might have been his biggest 'get' (except Lea who I think is a rising star) and that has gone a long way to improving players' fitness and limiting big injuries. I'm hearing some promising things about the '20 class and the potential to get a 5*...

But Chase -- if not Kelly who?

Name me 5 coaches who would do a better job than Kelly at Notre Dame (oh, and they have to want to coach at ND!)
Click to expand...
WHAT? Penny44 told us how great BVG was going to be. Awesome DC according to the board nitwit
 
Buguit said:
Whenever you see a thread 4 pages long, you can pretty much count on it being echo boy defending BK ad nauseum

BK gets a B+ for recruiting and C- for coaching. The C- is gracious. Lea get an A for coaching. Long gets an inc. because you can never tell exactly how much BK interfering in a bad way, you just know that at times he is.
Click to expand...
echoboy is a bk apologist, however the biggest one of them all is penny44. He still supports the utter disaster of bvg hiring.
 
chaseball said:
If i was AD Brian Kelly would have been fired a long time ago (after 2014 season) And i would have taken chances on whoever the best prospective head coach/hottest coaching candidate was at that moment in time. I would give him 3-4 years max and if there wasn't a big uptick in talent and results that was indicating national championship caliber program i would fire that coach and hire whoever the next best available/hot coaching candidate was at that moment in time.

Brian Kelly was that guy at one time before ND hired him (back in 2009). Kirby Smart, James Franklin, Tom Herman, Scott Frost are recent examples. Josh Heupel's stock is skyrocketing right now.

I would be going through the best available coaches like dirty underwear until i found the next Nick Saban, Urban Meyer, Dabo Swinney, etc. even if it meant some very lean years in between. It's national championship or bust at ND ... being 2nd tier wouldn't be an option.
Click to expand...
EXACTLY, we know who bk is. A good coach but he can't get over the hump. He has reached his ceiling. Very good seasons mixed in with some shit ones. Has he improved? Absolutely, however he has proven that he can't win a NC. Time to move on.
 
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Also as AD i would be bending over backwards so that any coach i hired wouldn't have any obstacles in his way of success.

I would ensure that the players who gave their LOI were spoiled beyond belief and treated like the revenue generating gods they deserve to be treated like.

And when i finally found that big time statue-worthy coach, i would make sure he and his staff was locked in with trend-setting contracts -- i would match our fans enthusiasm and support for the product by investing in the best personnel in college football money could possibly buy.

NDs coaching staff, facilities, policies, etc. would be the envy of the league. And talent (both coaches and players alike) would be banging the doors down here to be apart of it all.

This holier than thou, self righteous, self handicapping, doing it like they did in the 1960s culture at ND would be burned to the ground before i even finished signing the contract.
 
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chaseball said:
I would ensure that the players who gave their LOI were spoiled beyond belief and treated like the revenue generating gods they deserve to be treated like.
Click to expand...

Do you even know anything about the school you supposedly are a fan of? Why do you waste time being a fan of school so diametrically opposed to what you want it to be? The student/athlete philosophy is NOT going to change.
 
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d1042 said:
Do they give prizes for teams finishing, 3rd? 4th, 5th, ... 10th?

Does anyone even know who #2 was in past years?
Click to expand...
Not the point. I’m the biggest standards and expectations guy you’ll ever meet, and even I’d be thrilled with winning a major bowl. Especially when it’s a 4 team playoff.
 
Also, i can't choose what college football program to root for anymore than i can choose who my brother is. Being a ND football fan is as much apart of who i am to my core as what my favorite color is.
 
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Pennick4 said:
Yep.
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Now if kelly won a rose, fiesta, cotton, and sugar bowl you and the rest of the kelly crusaders would be telling me the exact opposite and you know it.

The length of how far out you’re going to defend kelly is hilarious. NY6 bowls aren’t significant because kelly hasn’t won one. LOL
 
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