FightingIrish44 said:

He called him and offered to help him? That’s incredible. Tremendous class. Maybe this happens more than we realize but that’s really cool. I’m not sure how that goes over as Freeman is the head coach of Notre Dame. Like…did Freeman actually accept help? It was probably more gameplanning stuff or just a general, polite offer. Maybe a bit of networking.

I liked how he went nuts on the player that bumped Greathouse on the punt return though that should have been called. The man was crying after the win and it was genuine. I respect that. Yet people will say Notre Dame is irrelevant.

What an all-time doozy of a loss. I still think Marshall was worse but this one hurts more. I think NIU is a good team that should probably finish better than their 7-6 2023 season. Maybe 10-4 or 11-3 or better?

A bit of hope: NIU beat 7-6 Boston College last year and then turned around and lost to Southern Illinois the next week. Then BC almost beat FSU but for 20 penalties. Crap happens and you lose sometimes.

Click to expand...

Yeah. He offered genuine help as in looking at film together and understanding schemes, etc. It was offered with best intentions not as a rub. The guy is all class. Said he is so grateful to ND for scheduling the game and that freeman treated him as an equal n was a great guy n wishes freeman a natty

wi_hoosier said:

The thing is... turn around from what? His own missteps and underachieving? ND may not have been able to take the last step under the previous staff, but the last 5 years the won all the games they were supposed to.

Click to expand...

Uh - ND do I’d not win all the games they were supposed to the last 2 years. That’s the point

We lost games we should not have. And freeman’s blunders vd Ohio state lost that game also

He called him and offered to help him? That’s incredible. Tremendous class. Maybe this happens more than we realize but that’s really cool. I’m not sure how that goes over as Freeman is the head coach of Notre Dame. Like…did Freeman actually accept help? It was probably more gameplanning stuff or just a general, polite offer. Maybe a bit of networking.

I liked how he went nuts on the player that bumped Greathouse on the punt return though that should have been called. The man was crying after the win and it was genuine. I respect that. Yet people will say Notre Dame is irrelevant.

What an all-time doozy of a loss. I still think Marshall was worse but this one hurts more. I think NIU is a good team that should probably finish better than their 7-6 2023 season. Maybe 10-4 or 11-3 or better?

A bit of hope: NIU beat 7-6 Boston College last year and then turned around and lost to Southern Illinois the next week. Then BC almost beat FSU but for 20 penalties. Crap happens and you lose sometimes.

Golson5 said:

He does have talent/potential. It's 2 games into the season. 1 solid game. 1 terrible game.

Is the season over? Are we forfeiting the rest of the season?

I didn't hear that yet

Click to expand...

He sucked in College Station. Just didn't lose the game.

He sucked against NIU

He sucked at Durham

Riley is a lousy QB.

Period!

P.s.

He's the perfect QB for a school like NIU.

speaking of NIU...

I'd take their QB over Riley all day long and twice on Saturday

The thing is... turn around from what? His own missteps and underachieving? ND may not have been able to take the last step under the previous staff, but the last 5 years the won all the games they were supposed to.

This is premium content. Please subscribe to view.

IrishExpert2288 said:

ND in my lifetime has hired 4 first time Head Coaches and all of them have done basically the same thing. They have the ability to win some big games but 2-3 times a year they will throw in complete stink jobs.

Ara had 2 unbeaten regular seasons (66,73)
Lou went 12-0 in 1988 and then was 11-0 in 1989 for a 23 game winning streak, then won 18 in a row from 1992 to 1993
Devine won 10 in a row in 1977, which lead to a National Championship in 1977
Kelly had 3 undefeated regular seasons 12-0, 12-0, and 10-0 (Don't talk to me about a soft schedule, because this years schedule is a joke and we are 1-1)

Add up the 5 years of Faust, 5 years of Davie, 5 years of Weis and 2 years and 3 games of Freeman (17 seasons and 3 games)
What is the longest winning streak?
Find me ONE SEASON where ND did not end up with at least 3 LOSSES?

The longest winning streak was
Davie 1998 ( 8 games and that season ended with 2 humiliating losses and 3 overall losses)
Weis 2006 ( 8 games and that season endied with 2 humiliating losses and 3 overall losses)

What is Freemans longest winning streak? 5 games? If Freeman does not win the next 10 in a row, vs this trash schedule then it is pretty apparent that those of us who wanted Fickell were 1000% correct.

Click to expand...

BRAVO.

That's the way to cut through first-time coach HOPIUM.

By using COLD-STEEL FACTS.

It separates STARRY-EYED DREAMERS from REALISTS.

FACTS MATTER.

And I'll go you one better -- Terry Brennan. Another fresh, Hallmark-card-type, first-time coaching HIRE.

These experiments have THUS FAR all ended in tears.

But your key point -- INCONSISTENCY -- is central to your argument.

Is it a BUG with Freeman or a FEATURE?

BY THE END OF THE YEAR, WE SHOULD KNOW.

tkirish said:

Regarding the fans. Personally I have watched several different ND shows/podcasts talking about how talented this team is. All this leading up to the start of the season. Everyone basically said this was a playoff team and some said a potential to play in the national championship. Heck even Kirbstreet said after the A&M game , ND looked different than years past. So when you lose at home as a 28 point favorite, it’s very shocking. Now with that said , had the talk before the season been tempered by saying ND has a lot of new faces playing and coaches, it might take time to gel. That would be truthful. Maybe a 10 point favorite over NIU was more realistic. This team may or may not be good by the end of the year. I don’t know. Right now , they are a bad team. I feel we the fans were grossly misled by many so called ND Experts. So my expectations were very high. After watching 2 games , I know this team will be lucky to win 7 games. I can live with that. But I will no longer believe anything said about ND.

Click to expand...

Spot on. That’s why I bailed on the old school Irish illustration paper & the premium boards. Not one trainer on the sidelines could tell Leonard Riley was hurt? Have you watched MLB games when all of a sudden the manager & trainer come running out. Professionals can tell the slightest hiccup in a throwing motion or maybe a grimace when the pitcher lands. TkIrish, this team & coach are done.

Telx1 said:

OK, now being reported that Leonard damaged his left shoulder labrum. I’m sure we all can remember the play in the first qtr where he was thrown down such that he landed on his left shoulder and got up wincing. It’s not his throwing shoulder and he reportedly had a shot into that joint during the game? This clearly explains why he was no longer part of the running game after his first TD drive success. Take away his running, and you have an average Passer, at best.

I’ve had multiple shoulder labrum tears, and they hurt like hell with certain movements, and the pain shuts down your involved muscle. If this was to Leonard’s throwing shoulder, we would then have an obvious answer for his poor and weak throws. But this is to his non throwing shoulder. I said in an earlier post that his weak throw that led to his second interception which gave them the game, was inexplicable because it was ten to fifteen yards under thrown. Perhaps the left should injury explains the inexplicable!

Take away Leonardo’s running ability and threat, and our entire offensive game plan changes, and defenses once again will stack the box to stop the run. This is a critical week for Freeman and Denbrock to decide which qb gives us the best chance to win, irrespective of post college career implications.

Click to expand...

TelX
We are in a bad way. Freeman was in an enviable position -
Despite losing 3-4 games to inferior opponents and prior to the latest loss to NIU, everyone was behind Freeman and wanted him to succeed
This was going to be the year

Now, That’s gone. The goodwill. The promise of a great year

And the same applies to Leonard. I don’t have any confidence in him. Teams will make him throw and he won’t be able to

We will win this week but imo lose 2 more games this year. This coach bet on another portal qb and it’s not going to work out

Angeli or Carr should get in after Leonard struggles

This is premium content. Please subscribe to view.

yorick17 said:

Also kind of begs the question as to whether, given the injury and seeming limitations, could a replacement have done a better job?

Click to expand...

That is the most common question in football. Coaches often stick with a troubled starting QB too long, did you see the 4th qtr of the national championship game for UW?

chaseball said:

I dont have a big crush on coach prime lol i simply didn't hate the hire and have been a fan of his behind the scenes coverage through his son's growing youtube channel. I've also commented that ND can learn a lot from the kind of ground up groundroots movement going on through social media regarding colorado football. They are really doing a good job marketing that program, and trust me, things like TV ratings and ticket sales at a place like colorado matter just as much as the wins do.

Click to expand...

Stop lying

NDinNJ said:

three letters NIL

Click to expand...

Don’t believe everything you read.

This is premium content. Please subscribe to view.

wi_hoosier said:

The problem is that there is still no excuse... if this injury compromised him so much that he couldn't run or throw with velocity, then he should not have been in the game. Period.

Click to expand...

I read an article, that he was hiding the injury from the staff. I also read that this non throwing shoulder injury doesn't really impact the player. Baker Mayfield played through a season with the same injury.

Telx1 said:

OK, now being reported that Leonard damaged his left shoulder labrum. I’m sure we all can remember the play in the first qtr where he was thrown down such that he landed on his left shoulder and got up wincing. It’s not his throwing shoulder and he reportedly had a shot into that joint during the game? This clearly explains why he was no longer part of the running game after his first TD drive success. Take away his running, and you have an average Passer, at best.

I’ve had multiple shoulder labrum tears, and they hurt like hell with certain movements, and the pain shuts down your involved muscle. If this was to Leonard’s throwing shoulder, we would then have an obvious answer for his poor and weak throws. But this is to his non throwing shoulder. I said in an earlier post that his weak throw that led to his second interception which gave them the game, was inexplicable because it was ten to fifteen yards under thrown. Perhaps the left should injury explains the inexplicable!

Take away Leonardo’s running ability and threat, and our entire offensive game plan changes, and defenses once again will stack the box to stop the run. This is a critical week for Freeman and Denbrock to decide which qb gives us the best chance to win, irrespective of post college career implications.

Click to expand...

The problem is that there is still no excuse... if this injury compromised him so much that he couldn't run or throw with velocity, then he should not have been in the game. Period.

This is premium content. Please subscribe to view.

tbonesays said:

Makes one wonder why he was still in the game of only half a QB.

Click to expand...

three letters NIL

This is premium content. Please subscribe to view.

chaseball said:

Good posts throughout and I always enjoy reading your thoughts and analysis on ND football.

I do however disagree with the Texas A&M win being a "confirmation that ND is a very good team"

Texas A&M is ranked 21st according to latest F+ ranking (through week 2).

Texas A&M recruited really well under Jimbo Fisher and there are still some really highly rated players on their roster, but that whole program has been in disarray for years now, and they are under an entirely new regime with tons of roster attrition, learning a new scheme, new culture, etc.

They are more of a program we should beat in year 3 under MF to confirm that ND isn't a bad team .. but that's probably as far i would go with it.

Click to expand...

Thanks and I HEAR YOU.

But I don't think that's my quote. If so, I haven't been able to locate it.

Here, though, is something I DID WRITE:

"Beating A&M didn't give ND the keys to the kingdom. All it did was confirm the likelihood of ND's having a very good team. How it plays each week will further reinforce that likelihood or not."

There was NO CATEGORICAL CLAIM that ND IS in fact a good football team. Instead, I was careful to HEDGE MY COMMENT so as not to be definitive. Because HOW COULD I KNOW?

So, where does that leave us at this moment?

It's TOO EARLY TO TELL.

We don't know if ND has a good team or not, nor do we know how good NIU or A&M is, and it will take AT LEAST several more weeks to find out as per all three.

ONE SWALLOW DOESN'T MAKE A SUMMER. And hardly a football season.

As for power ratings, I'm a fan of the data they provide, and I know they're a tool for oddsmakers, but in the final analysis -- as per the end of the season -- DO THEY EVEN COUNT? Especially in those instances when the team with the highest power rating turns out NOT to be the NC winner?

Heres' an analogy:

The French army had the Wehrmacht beaten in EVERY POWER METRIC during the Battle of France in 1940. More men, munitions, artillery -- EVEN TANKS. But they lacked one thing that the Wehrmacht had in spades which probably wasn't even listed in the FRENCH POWER RANKING MANUAL -- MOBILE COMMUNICATIONS. There were NO RADIOS not only in French tanks but also at their various command headquarters. They used guys on MOTORCYCLES.

The Wehrmacht won in a matter of weeks and took about 600,000 French prisoners.

There are ALWAYS variables that have YET to be quantified. AND/OR the other team just WANTS IT MORE. NIU lost the power ranking game to ND and is certainly STILL TRAILING today.

BUT IT WON THE GAME ON THE FIELD.

If he can’t run and take hits then he should not play over Angeli. That’s the only advantage he has at this point.