why put a D in that is so complicated it keeps 5 star kid off the field.

[basketlax41]

How is it a good idea to put in a Defensive system so complicated that you need a kid who but for ND, would have gone to an ivy league school, on the field to make it work? A system that keeps 5 stars off the field.

Recruiting is hard enough, lets not make it harder. Put in a simple system, and let your athletes execute. Thats what bama does. Keep it simple.

Reminds me of when Weis was at ND. We were mistake prone, cause the offense had to many moving parts, reads etc, several times a game kids would be on the wrong page.

 

[SALittleGiant513]

Which 5 star isn't playing because of the system? Max and Jaylon are starters.

 

[Pennick4]

Stop blaming the system. It is about execution.

 

[FightingIrish44]

I don't think the complexity of the defense is what's keeping Morgan off the field. The coaches just think Schmidt gives the the best chance to win.

Why do you feel Alabama's defense is so simple? Seems like am assumption.

 

[hvillebill]

How is it a good idea to put in a Defensive system so complicated that you need a kid who but for ND, would have gone to an ivy league school, on the field to make it work? A system that keeps 5 stars off the field.

Recruiting is hard enough, lets not make it harder. Put in a simple system, and let your athletes execute. Thats what bama does. Keep it simple.

Reminds me of when Weis was at ND. We were mistake prone, cause the offense had to many moving parts, reads etc, several times a game kids would be on the wrong page.

If you're going by star ratings only, then there's no reason to have them earn their spot in practice. Just let the ratings agencies determine who plays even before they ever hit campus?

BVG - "Let's see; you were a five-star and you over there were a three-star. Well, that settles that!"

 

[basketlax41]

Which 5 star isn't playing because of the system? Max and Jaylon are starters.

Thought Morgan was. If he wasnt point is still the same.

 

[IRISHJD98]

If you're going by star ratings only, then there's no reason to have them earn their spot in practice. Just let the ratings agencies determine who plays even before they ever hit campus?

BVG - "Let's see; you were a five-star and you over there were a three-star. Well, that settles that!"

For that matter, why even play the games?

 

[basketlax41]

If you're going by star ratings only, then there's no reason to have them earn their spot in practice. Just let the ratings agencies determine who plays even before they ever hit campus?

BVG - "Let's see; you were a five-star and you over there were a three-star. Well, that settles that!"

Thats not my point. Kelley has even said that Morgan is a better athelete, but he has not picked up the system yet. It just shouldnt be that complicated.

 

[basketlax41]

I don't think the complexity of the defense is what's keeping Morgan off the field. The coaches just think Schmidt gives the the best chance to win.

Why do you feel Alabama's defense is so simple? Seems like am assumption.

Its not watch them play. They let their best athletes attack the ball. LBs coming off the edge. They are not for example dropping Sheldon Day into coverage.

 

[basketlax41]

Let me put the question a different way.

Why have a D so complicated that when one guy, who understand that D, goes down the wheels fall off.

 

[hvillebill]

Let me put the question a different way.

Why have a D so complicated that when one guy, who understand that D, goes down the wheels fall off.

At the D-1 level they don't play a high school system, no matter what team you're talking about. They all have nuances that some kids thrive upon and others can find difficult. Sometimes players think they can do things just because of their athleticism that they could get away with in high school. At this level, if they make a mistake, they're out of position.

Morgan will get his chance; it's just not right now.

 

[Telx1]

Well, aside from the mistakes and valid or invalid assumptions in the OP, I think all of us have questioned whether the system is simply too complicated for the college level. Personally, I think we have seen far fewer blown assignments this year compared to last, and poor fundamentals seem to be more of a problem this year than the system, per se. Poor tackling and poor secondary play of not turning their heads to find the ball have plagued us all year. As for Joe's play, I appreciate he gives 100% every down and achieves close to his ceiling most games, and the fact this is not nearly good enough is frustrating for everyone, but he apparently offers our best chance to win. Contrary to many posts, I think the delta between him and Morgan is more than calling plays and getting everyone aligned properly, as Jaylon could be tasked with this. Joe must grade out better than Morgan in knowing what he is supposed to do by a wide margin during the weekly practices. Kelly is clearly in the hard ass camp that players have to earn playing time, and none of us knows what Morgan may or may not be doing to keep him from earning even nominal playing time. I keep hoping this changes before the season is over, and time is getting short.

 

[Irish437]

Let me put the question a different way.

Why have a D so complicated that when one guy, who understand that D, goes down the wheels fall off.

It does appear to be that way. And I find it amazing that at times with both linebacker and QB, they had to settle on MAC talent because they were the only on understood the offense/defense. Last year was ridiculous. The defense guarded the sidelines and left the middle of the field wide open all the time.

I think the staff needs to do some Wonderlick football IQ test in regards to their scheme because natural ability doesn't carry nearly the weight as understanding the playbook, even if the player doesn't have the skills to execute it. The need to find players with the ability to understand it and have the skills. Tough combo, but no sense just getting great athletes because they will sit.

 

[basketlax41]

When VanGorder came here people would describe hmm as a great d coordinator who puts in very complicated schemes and blitz packages.....to me the better d coordinators at the college level are those that excel with less complicated schemes. saying hes a great coach.....he puts in complicated....are almost oxy-morons.

 

[Bodizephax]

Which 5 star isn't playing because of the system? Max and Jaylon are starters.

Nyles Morgan was a 5 star on one service-- Scout. Max Redfield was also a 5 star on only one recruiting service. Jaylon was a 5 star on all recruiting services.

 

[SALittleGiant513]

Max was a composite 5 star, definitely a 5 star on more then one service.

 

[Bodizephax]

Max was a composite 5 star, definitely a 5 star on more then one service.

He was only a 5 star on one service just like Greg Bryant. There was only scout rivals and espn at the time.

 

[SALittleGiant513]

Max Redfield Composite 5* #30 overall 247
http://247sports.com/Season/2013-Football/CompositeRecruitRankings?InstitutionGroup=HighSchool

If you don't count the composite as a ranking then sure he only had rivals as a 5*. I general view the composite as the most balanced system as it takes into account all of the systems and their weaknesses and strengths.

 

[Bodizephax]

Max Redfield Composite 5* #30 overall 247
http://247sports.com/Season/2013-Football/CompositeRecruitRankings?InstitutionGroup=HighSchool

If you don't count the composite as a ranking then sure he only had rivals as a 5*. I general view the composite as the most balanced system as it takes into account all of the systems and their weaknesses and strengths.

You never admit when your wrong-- He was a 4 star on two recruiting services at the time---you said all. Also the 247 composite wasn't used back then or at least it wasn't popular back then.

Also you wanted unproven 4 star recruits picked ahead of a proven productive 4 year player in Amir Carlisle----- How is that any different then posters wanting a two year player Nyles Morgan over Joe S?

 

[SALittleGiant513]

I didn't say all, which post was that Bodi? I gave you the link to the composite which I consider a major ranking system more legit and consistent then both Scout and Scouts inc. (Espn). That link shows him as a 5 star, my bad that you don't like to use the composite.

Also, lets be clear my position wasn't that Amir shouldn't be invited back for a 5th year because of 4*s that had not committed. My position was that with the amount of players the staff was still recruiting and what they were looking to take last year, with the scholarship numbers at the time Amir was in the danger zone of not being invited back. I also said that because of the potential of others to be a return man and with the development of Hunter in the slot that the loss of Carlise wouldn't be significant. Carlise has lost the primary return man position to CJ and Hunter gets more run in the slot.

 

[IRISHJD98]

Well, aside from the mistakes and valid or invalid assumptions in the OP, I think all of us have questioned whether the system is simply too complicated for the college level. Personally, I think we have seen far fewer blown assignments this year compared to last, and poor fundamentals seem to be more of a problem this year than the system, per se. Poor tackling and poor secondary play of not turning their heads to find the ball have plagued us all year. As for Joe's play, I appreciate he gives 100% every down and achieves close to his ceiling most games, and the fact this is not nearly good enough is frustrating for everyone, but he apparently offers our best chance to win. Contrary to many posts, I think the delta between him and Morgan is more than calling plays and getting everyone aligned properly, as Jaylon could be tasked with this. Joe must grade out better than Morgan in knowing what he is supposed to do by a wide margin during the weekly practices. Kelly is clearly in the hard ass camp that players have to earn playing time, and none of us knows what Morgan may or may not be doing to keep him from earning even nominal playing time. I keep hoping this changes before the season is over, and time is getting short.

I think Kelly is also particular in what he needs to see for that time to be earned. I think back to Robert Hughes and Cierre Wood. Hughes got playing time when he finally started running the way Kelly wanted him too, but it took some time. Seemed like Wood couldn't adjust to turning up field soon enough - always trying to get to the outside - and so never passed Riddick despite his athleticism. I'm sure there are other examples, but those stick out for me.

 

[NyyorkerND]

4 stars 5 stars who really cares. Talk about complex defense? Dude that is just a ridiculous argument. He doesn't get playing time for whatever reason the problem that we have here is we think he's better than the starter and he may be. He'll get his chance next year to start. A guy can be a half star just go out on the field and get the job done.

 

[perseverare]

^ but that is the crux of the matter, if one is being objective, Schmidt is not getting the job done at a level that is obviously 'good'.

 

[iwish]

Again, we're 8-1....ridiculous number of injuries resulting in 2nd and 3rd string players getting time and excelling. I think we can say the team is in good hands.

 

[IrishMike409]

Thats not my point. Kelley has even said that Morgan is a better athelete, but he has not picked up the system yet. It just shouldnt be that complicated.

8-1. About to be 10-1. Great great chance to be 11-1 and in the playoffs. I'm not going to 2nd guess our GREAT coaches.

 

[Telx1]

Peres....Actually, I think the crux of the matter is that despite not playing good enough, he is our best player at that position for this season, thus far. Choosing not to second guess the coaches decisions on who is playing is hardly an illogical decision. One can argue that second guessing these decisions without any knowledge of how Nyles is performing at practice, or whether he has an attitude, or any number of variables is in fact the more emotional illogical decision.

 

[DieHard_Irish]

Peres....Actually, I think the crux of the matter is that despite not playing good enough, he is our best player at that position for this season, thus far. Choosing not to second guess the coaches decisions on who is playing is hardly an illogical decision. One can argue that second guessing these decisions without any knowledge of how Nyles is performing at practice, or whether he has an attitude, or any number of variables is in fact the more emotional illogical decision.

EXACTLY!!! well said.

 

[BGI User 1596]

As Einstein said: Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler.

 

[Johnnie82]

I guess my question is...If he needs to have the defense "dumbed down" is he truly a "5*", or was that just hype?

Full disclosure, I don't know the answer but I don't think we can assume that Morgan would be better if we have not been in practice.

 

[BGI User 1596]

A designer of Ferrari cars once told me that a Ferrari has fewer parts than a common car, but the parts themselves are significantly better than anything else on this earth. This elegant tale of construction uses the simple philosophy that if good parts can make a great product, incredible parts can lead to a legendary one. BVG is trying to make a Ferrari but with GM parts - not going to happen.

 

[perseverare]

Again, we're 8-1....ridiculous number of injuries resulting in 2nd and 3rd string players getting time and excelling. I think we can say the team is in good hands.

the only issue with your statement is I read similar statements when Weis was coach! it is more akin to:
"what me worry"

 

[DieHard_Irish]

the only issue with your statement is I read similar statements when Weis was coach! it is more akin to:
"what me worry"

So what do you want to hear then? Most have already acknowledged that Joe is far from an AA, but per the coaches, he is the best we have at the position. How much more succinct can an answer be then that. Kelly flat out said that Joe is better than any alternative. So are you saying he is wrong? That you know better? That he is blind? Lying? What? I trust our coaches know what they are doing, you don't trust them , I get that. I have asked before, what knowledge/expertise do you possess to refute there opinion of that? How many practices have you attended? The longer this goes on, the more laughable and absurd it gets.

 

[South Bender]

As echo said the other day "What ever happened to a player earning his way on the field?"
Not saying it's so, but maybe, just maybe, Morgan hasn't earned a damn thing yet.

But again, some here know more than our coaches.