It does. That performance was disgusting... notre dame lost all credibility with that Miami loss. They were the better team, unlike Alabama in 2012. Miami ended up losing 2 more games that year. The look in BK's eyes coming out of the tunnel was 100% fear and unpreparedness.
$warbrick
- Thread starter NDIRISH53
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He did win 10+ games in 2 of the last 3 season, and 12 games in another season....so check there.
He has been in the playoff/championship hunt until the last week of the season, repeatedly.....so check there
I agree, he needs to continue doing more, but you haven't provided anything as a counter argument to Kelly already being a good coach that is on the verge of "Righting the Ship" for ND...something we've been failing to do for 25+ years
Basically, all you've done is continue to embarrass yourself with a little temper-tantrum
This is some NDNation level of pathetic and illogical BS
No in 2015 and 2017 we were not in the hunt going into the final week. 2 losses both times. And even if we were... what does that tell you about BK if he got out coached by Shaw both times? I have nothing against the guy personally, he just needs to go if he doesn't reach the standards I alluded to previously.
Not for anyone with a functioning brain...which I get that you don't have after this comment.
This is like Clemson "losing all credibility" because they lost to a terrible Syracuse team
Or Georgia "losing al credibility" because they got absolutely BLOWN OUT by a 3-loss Auburn team
Your little temper-tantrums don't change the facts, they just expose your ignorance and bias
Kelly is a good coach and 2017 was a good season...one where ND beat 4 Top25/Top15 teams and only lost to 3 other Top25/Top10 teams
You can't ignore the facts, just because they don't fit your agenda
We absolutely WERE in the playoff hunt until the final week of the season in 2015. We were a 1-loss team going into the last week of the season, ranked in the Top 5 Overall.
We were also in the championship hunt through the last week of the season in 2012.
Again, he has repeatedly achieve a standard that you yourself requested...you don't get to move the goalposts now that you realize that
My mistake, ND did have one loss going into Stanford 2015 I thought we had 2 for some reason.
We have discussed this about auburn. That team that killed Georgia would have beaten ANYBODY in college football easily at that time. The difference is Georgia then went on to return the favor! If ND would have beaten Stanford I could have forgiven the Miami loss.
And my point about ND losing credibility is the fact that every ND hater, which we both know there is more than a fair share, had the right to say ND was overrated once again. Clemson doesn't lose credibility when they just came off a title and win 10 games every year, UGA doesn't either because they won the SEC and damn near the title. ND has been getting called soft and overrated for 30 years by both college fans and media members. That loss destroyed the credibility ND gained slowly week after week
Again, your raw ignorance and bias is showing.
It's every bit as legitimate to claim "no one was going to beat Miami at their own stadium that week". You can't make that excuse for 1 team and not the other.
And ND is never going to get to play the same team 2x, since we don't have conference championship games.
So again, 2017 was a good season where ND won 10+ games while beating 4 Top25/Top15 opponents....no matter how badly you want to claim otherwise
So now the standard is ignorant people (like you) who want to criticize without facts? Who cares about idiots like them and/or you??
ND didn't lose credibility in that loss anymore or any less than those other teams...but your bias has caused you to try to create excuses for other teams while throwing a temper-tantrum about ND, simply because you don't personally like the coach.
The reality is the Kelly is a good coach, who has greatly helped ND and maybe on the verge of finally righting the ship for this program after 25+ years.
Sorry you can't accept reality...but that does nothing to change it
Did Miami beat the #1 team in the country twice? Alabama was #1 auburn beat them Georgia was #1 auburn beat them.
Miami, caught lightening in a bottle and played like world beaters for two straight games, against VA Tech and us. Then they went back to reality.
And Auburn also lost 4 games!
Look, I get it. You're flailing around in the dark, trying to grab hold of anything to keep your BS agenda alive, because I've ripped it up and sent it down in flames.
But reality is reality:
- The 2017 was a good season for ND/Kelly, in which we won 10+ games and beat 4 Top25/Top15 opponents
- The 2015 was also a good season for ND/Kelly, in which we won 10+ games and were in playoff contention until the last week of the season
- 2012 was a GREAT season for ND/Kelly, in which we won 10+ games, went undefeated, won big games, and made the National Championship
Kelly's issues have revolved far more around inconsistency than around mediocrity, at least in the last 5-6 seasons.
That doesn't mean that you get to ignore the good seasons though
Furthermore, the recent decisions have resulted in 10+ Wins in 2/3 seasons and appear to have ND in a position to finally "Right the Ship"
His legacy at ND will depend largely on 2018...but it's clear he's a good coach
Sorry that reality is such a tough place for you
As do we all, obviously.
But 1-2 bad games does not erase the entire season, nor does it mean that the season itself was not good.
A 10-3 season without a NY6 Bowl Win is clearly not a great/elite season, but it is certainly a good season, considering it's almost certainly one of the Top 5 seasons in the last 25+ years
You setting the standards now ? Get over yourself. Kelly is not elite but he's very good and his resume proves it.
They were good seasons.
I don't give Kelly "extra credit" for doing it after failure, but I do credit him for making the changes necessary to get that turnaround accomplished.
He's made good choices and done good work, while also doing bad in both as well.
For some reason, so people only want to focus on 1 aspect of his work though, and pretend the rest didn't happen or doesn't count.
That's funny. His resume includes an average of 8 wins per season. A 4-8 season. Losing the past 5 regular season finales, and 2-8 and the last 10 one possession games. And no I don't set the standards you know who does? Notre Dame. They tell us that they are on a mission to win a national championship, they tell us everything the do is excellence. You can be happy with a 9 win regular season I am not.
We can agree to disagree. For ND that is not a good season, not bad... just tolerable. 8-5 is slop, football hell. 10-3 is tolerable and nobody should be fired. You win a NY6 that's a damn good season, we're talking about Notre Dame, not Pitt.
Try to comprehend this.... ready? Auburn at that time beat the #1 team in the country TWO WEEKS in a row... got that so far? Did auburn finish the season the best team in the country? No. Were they the best and hottest team in the country for a stretch? Yes, and it wasn't even close. You can excuse the Miami loss all you want by looking at other teams. But if you're going to do that don't leave out the fact that UGA went on to beat them and almost win a title. Notre Dame wound up losing to Stanford for the 4th year in a row. Do you get the difference now? Just because you say someone is "flailing around in the dark" does not mean your argument is right. You are a certified dope, and I'm starting to believe you're Pennick8-5's son.
So the only way to have a good season at Notre Dame is to have a better season than we have had at any point in the last 30 years?
That seems reasonable to you now?
I 10 and three season that includes several wins against top 25 teams is a good season at Notre Dame. There is no way to debate that, and anyone with any intelligence and sense of college football can see it.
The fact that you are attempting to claim that a 10+ win season and #11 Overall finish, which included several major Top25 wins and wins over rivals (USC, MSU, BC, etc)...that just shows that you’re either hopelessly biased or hopelessly uninformed, or both.
I get that you want to differentiate ND losing a blowout to a 3-loss Miami team from Georgia losing a blowout to a 4-loss Auburn team, because it destroys your argument about why the 2017 season wasn’t a good one. I do. I get it.
You have a prophetic argument, and you don’t want it to fall apart even further. That’s totally understandable.
The issue is...they’re not different. Miami was on a major hot streak when we played them as well, and their house was ROCKING. (Just like Auburn)
They didn’t turnout to be an elite team, but they were still a tough team. (Just like Auburn)
No one is claiming that the 2017 Notre Dame season was as good as George owes 2017 season… But it was still good. There’s just no way around that.
That’s just reality
I get that place was a mad house but nothing excuses that terrible coaching and play, they played scared.
I am hopefully biased to the administration not being satisfied with 10 wins. 10 wins has become something to celebrate at ND. Not good.
Yes. It was a bad game, a bad coaching job, and a bad playing job. No questions about that.
However, virtually every team has a bad game every season.
For example, Georgia had a bad game against Auburn and got BLOWNOUT...but they still had a GREAT/Elite season (not just good)
So yes, ND still had a good season despite the Miami game.
Your attempts to try to discredit the good season(s) that Kelly has had based on nothing but pure idiocy.
You need to learn to view Kelly's work as a whole, the good and the bad. There is nothing wrong with pointing out areas/times where he struggles, but you have to credit the times/areas where he succeeds.
Your 1-sidedness, bias, agenda, and relative ignorance are the issues here
Saying that 10+ wins are a "Good Season" and saying that the coaches/players are going to be satisfied with that or that they're only going to pursue that end.......those aren't the same thing.
Coaches/Players won't be "satisfied" with anything less than a championship, but that doesn't change the fact that there are things other than a national championship that can be good seasons.
Your attempts to obfuscate these issues are pathetic.
We shall see this season if they aren't satisfied with last year. I think they prove me wrong and you right.
He had 1 great season and 2 tolerable ones. The 10-3 record in 2015 hides a lot
Look Friedman I hope with everything in me BK proves me wrong, and I believe he can and might this year. If you want to say it was a good season you make greats points and we won a good bowl, just November leaves a terrible taste in my mouth.
He’s had 1 great season and 2 good seasons.
Your pathetic attempts to spin reality to match your agenda have obviously failed
That’s fine. It wasn’t a good November.
But that’s why it wasn’t a great/historic season, but rather just a good season. If November “good” then that is a playoff team, despite playing arguably the hardest schedule in CFB.
But three are more possible outcomes for a season than “great/historic” and tolerable.
2017 was a good season. That’s all there is to it. There is no counter argument, based in fact, which is why you have failed so miserably to provide one.
My agenda? How can you claim that a season where the best wins were Temple and navy as a good season? You do realize that line had 3 first round picks and 1 second rounder. That team underachieved held back by the worst hire in ND history made by Kelly!
And even if you want to claim 2015 and 2017 as good seasons, that makes 3 out of 8 season as good. Which is why I refer to Kelly as an 8-5 coach.
It was a good season because Notre Dame won 10 games, played well for most of the season, and made major bowl game. That is a good season.
Don’t make me do this to you again, once should’ve been humiliating enough.
Seasons aren’t divided into “great/historical” and “tolerable”.
That simply The BS you’re pushing because of your agenda, That you hate Kelly and therefore want to discredit the good things that he does… Instead of just assessing everything fairly and in context.
Correct. 1 great season, 2 good seasons, for mediocre seasons, and 1 terrible season.
Calling him and Aiden five coach when only three of his seasons ended with that record, and only one ended that way The last six years… Is just stupid.
Exact same evidence supports the claim “Kelly is a good ted great coach at the premiere college football level“. That claim would likely send you into a temper tantrum tirade and end in an aneurysm and your funeral… But you’re willing to except a different claim with exactly the same support.
Again, agenda.
The reality is that Kelly is a good college football coach, who has been “good to above average, but not consistent enough” at the premier levels of college football.
However, it’s also reality that things have been trending well, generally, And there is finally reason to believe that Kelly has finally righted the ship at Notre Dame… Something we’ve been trying to do for 30 years.
Everything else is just your agenda.
Well our opinions differ on good. I'm sorry, ND just didn't beat one good team and was supremely talented. That's a good season at South Carolina, not ND. I will take 10-3 every year as long as that is not the ceiling and you can sneak into the playoffs once ever 4 years.
His average record is 8.75- 4.25. Four mediocre seasons and 1 horrible season is garbage in 8 years. .375 is his average for having a "good" season. If you're playing baseball congratulation, if you are coaching at the most storied program in college football THAT DOESN'T CUT IT!
