Recruiting Christmas Wish list

[hoopsstar12]

1- 5 star running back. 2- 5 star Nose guards. 1- 5 star outside linebacker. Kelly and co. have to capitalize on other teams coaching changes or unexpected events that might make their recruits nervous. We need impact players at the above positions that can step in and play next year. We also need a red zone buster type of impact player that can score no matter how bad the play call is. The 30 for 30 show is going to revive interest in the program and the coaches have to go hard for the top talent who wants to compete at the highest level week in and week out. We have to recruit tirelessly 24-7 and land some difference makers who dont know how to lose.

 

[IrishInOntario]

My prediction is that ND lands, at best, 1 more impact recruit in this cycle and at this point, it looks like it will be a wide receiver such as Oliver Martin. The recruiting board doesn't look at all positive right now. No DE's left right now. Only Antjuan Simmons I I think is "meh" at linebacker, and the only quality DB left on the board is Thomas Graham and he looks less likely each day to come to ND. The offensive class is, as always, really good. Two great tight ends in Wright and Kmet. Quality (even if underrated) wide receivers in Pouncey and Martin (likely) and 4 offensive lineman who I like, even if they did miss out on the very best ones in Smith and Sarrell. CJ Holmes looks like CJ Prosise 2.0. Avery Davis is a baller at QB too. Short. But a baller.... Defensive recruiting on the other hand.... Ewwww. All you need to know is that the 3 best players in the defensive class including TWO MORE friggen pass rushers, decommittted.

 

[BGI User 1596]

My prediction is that ND lands, at best, 1 more impact recruit in this cycle and at this point, it looks like it will be a wide receiver such as Oliver Martin. The recruiting board doesn't look at all positive right now. No DE's left right now. Only Antjuan Simmons I I think is "meh" at linebacker, and the only quality DB left on the board is Thomas Graham and he looks less likely each day to come to ND. The offensive class is, as always, really good. Two great tight ends in Wright and Kmet. Quality (even if underrated) wide receivers in Pouncey and Martin (likely) and 4 offensive lineman who I like, even if they did miss out on the very best ones in Smith and Sarrell. CJ Holmes looks like CJ Prosise 2.0. Avery Davis is a baller at QB too. Short. But a baller.... Defensive recruiting on the other hand.... Ewwww. All you need to know is that the 3 best players in the defensive class including TWO MORE friggen pass rushers, decommittted.

Reap what you sow at 4 & 8 !

 

[DieHard_Irish]

Screw the star ratings, seems many schools win many games without the so-called 4 and 5 star recruits. Wisconsin and Boise come to mind

 

[Kelso86]

Screw the star ratings, seems many schools win many games without the so-called 4 and 5 star recruits. Wisconsin and Boise come to mind

Michigan State as well (well, except for 2016) -- but, overall, they seem to do more with less.

 

[IrishInOntario]

You're missing the point though. In 3 of the past 4 cpasses, ND has missed on players at the same positions. Pass rushing outside linebackers and defensive ends, as well as safeties.

You can't miss year-after-year and expect things to correct themselves. After two years of bringing in ZERO WDE's, ND finally landed two last year in Hayes and Okwara... Then this year they failed miserably. Beal, Echols, Kaindoh, Jeter and Paschal all said "no thanks" despite visits to ND and serious interest at multiple points, including two of thme actually committing. It's mid December and ND doesn't have a single pass rusher on it''s board... They couldn't land ONE guy. They need to show Gilmore the door and allow the new DC to bring a DL coach that can recruit and develop. They then need to say "screw it" to regional recruiting along the DL and allow the new DL coach to do what Hiestand does. Chose the 10'ish kids he wants to play for him on the DL and recruit them personally, regardless of where they are from geographically. They need a coach (preferably their future position coach) to communicate with them daily and they need to hear from both the DC and HC once every week to ten days.

 

[Kelso86]

You're missing the point though. In 3 of the past 4 cpasses, ND has missed on players at the same positions. Pass rushing outside linebackers and defensive ends, as well as safeties.

You can't miss year-after-year and expect things to correct themselves. After two years of bringing in ZERO WDE's, ND finally landed two last year in Hayes and Okwara... Then this year they failed miserably. Beal, Echols, Kaindoh, Jeter and Paschal all said "no thanks" despite visits to ND and serious interest at multiple points, including two of thme actually committing. It's mid December and ND doesn't have a single pass rusher on it''s board... They couldn't land ONE guy. They need to show Gilmore the door and allow the new DC to bring a DL coach that can recruit and develop. They then need to say "screw it" to regional recruiting along the DL and allow the new DL coach to do what Hiestand does. Chose the 10'ish kids he wants to play for him on the DL and recruit them personally, regardless of where they are from geographically. They need a coach (preferably their future position coach) to communicate with them daily and they need to hear from both the DC and HC once every week to ten days.

"Then this year they failed miserably. Beal, Echols, Kaindoh, Jeter and Paschal all said "no thanks" despite visits to ND and serious interest at multiple points, including two of them actually committing. It's mid December and ND doesn't have a single pass rusher on it''s board... They couldn't land ONE guy"

That is so true -- but, outside of the standard "I just liked this school better" schtick, I would really like to know the real reasons behind a change of heart from these kids (and others who change their mind).

I thought I read that Kelly would give his DC much more latitude in hiring his staff and going after recruits, which should help going forward.

 

[Telx1]

"Then this year they failed miserably. Beal, Echols, Kaindoh, Jeter and Paschal all said "no thanks" despite visits to ND and serious interest at multiple points, including two of them actually committing. It's mid December and ND doesn't have a single pass rusher on it''s board... They couldn't land ONE guy"

That is so true -- but, outside of the standard "I just liked this school better" schtick, I would really like to know the real reasons behind a change of heart from these kids (and others who change their mind).

I thought I read that Kelly would give his DC much more latitude in hiring his staff and going after recruits, which should help going forward.

I don't find this level of rejection surprising. ND had one of the worst DC in college football, and a mid season replacement who was a placeholder. Unless you're in love with ND and not concerned about coaching, why would a high value defensive player commit to ND in this environment? I don't like it, but I get it. That's why I want Elko to be hired and announced quickly, in hopes he can create some positive momentum for defensive recruits. Who knows, perhaps the four star rush DE who is committed to WF will take a look at ND if Elko is the hire!

 

[stu4don]

Time to find three diamonds in the rough. I know the chances aren't great, but BK needs to get creative after this year's bust and find some last minute guys who can be slotted in in a year or two? IIO -- any big Canadians wanna wear blue and gold? Eh?

(*This is the position that would benefit most from Juncos.)

 

[AdvanSix]

Screw the star ratings, seems many schools win many games without the so-called 4 and 5 star recruits. Wisconsin and Boise come to mind

the reason other schools (like Wisco and MSU) win without 4 and 5* star players is because they have a proven system with coaches who know how to win. ND does not. Brian Kelly has no system that is proven to work in D1.

 

[BGI User 1596]

the reason other schools (like Wisco and MSU) win without 4 and 5* star players is because they have a proven system with coaches who know how to win. ND does not. Brian Kelly has no system that is proven to work in D1.

Power trumps namby pamby every time!

 

[hoopsstar12]

There will be turmoil in other programs i.e. coaches leaving, scandals like at Louisville etc. and Kelly should also be judged on his effort and results for recruiitng top players other than wide receiver, offensive line and tight end.

 

[TXNDFan88]

Beal - Georgia gave his sister a track scholarship when ND would not

Pashcal - Kentucky gave his brother a job

It aint easy being ND - you expect kids to work hard their senior year and get good grades. But they need to do better and get numbers on the DL.

 

[DieHard_Irish]

the reason other schools (like Wisco and MSU) win without 4 and 5* star players is because they have a proven system with coaches who know how to win. ND does not. Brian Kelly has no system that is proven to work in D1.

Yeah, I agree

 

[TXNDFan88]

Ultimately we will have a lot more talent than Wake Forrest did. If Elko can do the same he did at WF and our offense is as good or better - we are way ahead, way ahead! If we had a serviceable D two years ago we are playing for a NC (not winning it, but back in the show). Last year with a serviceable D, we win Texas, MSU, Stanford, VT, and Duke - not in a playoff, but certainly not a dumpster fire.

 

[coolirish9]

i'm with IIO in saying that our irish probably aren't landing anymore elite guys unless they get Martin or Thomas. the 2018 class is so far a top ten rated class and could be Kelly's best incoming class ever if they keep the kids that are already committed and get some of the kids that they are favorites for like big time 4 star Chicago area DB Houston Griffith who is down in Florida playing football with a soon to be incoming irish 4 star OL Robert Hainsey who is from pennsylvania

 

[Kelso86]

Speaking of Elko -- any news on that front?

 

[BGI User 1596]

Speaking of Elko -- any news on that front?

Apparently he is checking his options with Florida and Wake still in play.

 

[Pennick44]

Speaking of Elko -- any news on that front?

It takes forever for ND to do background checks on prospective hires.
Not saying they have hired him but who knows?

 

[iwish]

You're missing the point though. In 3 of the past 4 cpasses, ND has missed on players at the same positions. Pass rushing outside linebackers and defensive ends, as well as safeties.

You can't miss year-after-year and expect things to correct themselves. After two years of bringing in ZERO WDE's, ND finally landed two last year in Hayes and Okwara... Then this year they failed miserably. Beal, Echols, Kaindoh, Jeter and Paschal all said "no thanks" despite visits to ND and serious interest at multiple points, including two of thme actually committing. It's mid December and ND doesn't have a single pass rusher on it''s board... They couldn't land ONE guy. They need to show Gilmore the door and allow the new DC to bring a DL coach that can recruit and develop. They then need to say "screw it" to regional recruiting along the DL and allow the new DL coach to do what Hiestand does. Chose the 10'ish kids he wants to play for him on the DL and recruit them personally, regardless of where they are from geographically. They need a coach (preferably their future position coach) to communicate with them daily and they need to hear from both the DC and HC once every week to ten days.

IIO, so what is the answer considering all of your bitching on this? It can't be the school or the coaching staff per se since we are still landing plenty of other great kids and players. So you obviously have an answer - what is it?

 

[twalsh]

It takes forever for ND to do background checks on prospective hires.
Not saying they have hired him but who knows?

You really don't know. He might be signed sealed and delivered already, but they aren't going to announce it until he's fully vetted. Or he could be interviewing someplace else.

 

[NDIRISH53]

Really like the aggressiveness in the o linemen they are bringing in. Hainsey started left tackle for the most loaded team in the county and dominated, all while being as nasty as possible. Lugg may be the meanest high school player I've ever seen, not the best, but the meanest

 

[Kelso86]

Really like the aggressiveness in the o linemen they are bringing in. Hainsey started left tackle for the most loaded team in the county and dominated, all while being as nasty as possible. Lugg may be the meanest high school player I've ever seen, not the best, but the meanest

"Really like the aggressiveness in the o linemen they are bringing in."

That is a common theme in all linemen that Kelly has brought in. But, in his 7 years, WHEN has ND ever used a power rushing attack to utilize those skills? Only time I can recall is in 2010, when Crist went down and Kelly turned to Rees.

 

[NDIRISH53]

"Really like the aggressiveness in the o linemen they are bringing in."

That is a common theme in all linemen that Kelly has brought in. But, in his 7 years, WHEN has ND ever used a power rushing attack to utilize those skills? Only time I can recall is in 2010, when Christ went down and Kelly turned to Rees.

True. Even Nelson seems to have taken a step back in physicality this year. You gotta just hope that Kelly/next coach brings a level of alpha male and assertiveness like we see from Urban Harbaugh and Saban

 

[Kelso86]

True. Even Nelson seems to have taken a step back in physicality this year. You gotta just hope that Kelly/next coach brings a level of alpha male and assertiveness like we see from Urban Harbaugh and Saban

SO TRUE -- Which makes the NC State game so bizarre -- there was an absolute chance to let these guys be very physical in that slop and use the stable of backs ND has -- instead, he decides to throw the ball 50 times.

But, last time I checked, Harry H is still on the staff. I think it goes to Kelly's offensive philosophy.

 

[twalsh]

SO TRUE -- Which makes the NC State game so bizarre -- there was an absolute chance to let these guys be very physical in that slop and use the stable of backs ND has -- instead, he decides to throw the ball 50 times.

But, last time I checked, Harry H is still on the staff. I think it goes to Kelly's offensive philosophy.

You can't be a spread team between the 20s and morph into a power team in the red zone. It just doesn't work that way. An o-line that plays in the spread gets that mentality whether they want to or not.

 

[IrishInOntario]

IIO, so what is the answer considering all of your bitching on this? It can't be the school or the coaching staff per se since we are still landing plenty of other great kids and players. So you obviously have an answer - what is it?

ND absolutely frigging refuses to cast a wide net at DE and it irritates the hell out of me. Every year they target about 10 guys and when they strike out, they are left holding their dicks, looking like chumps. Pass rushing DE's are arguably the most coveted players in the nation with offenses becoming more and more pass happy. Each kid is a battle. ND has to quit this nonsense of slow playing every quality guy, hopi g the next Stephon Tuitt is going to sign... People talk about Stanford and Michigan State and how they get a pass rush. It's simple. They recruit and develop pass rushers. The odd one is a big time prospect, but most are high 3 stars and low 4 stars. But when you get 3 of them each cycle, some of them develop and work out. Some leave and some graduate having little impact on your program. That's recruiting.

If I'm Brian Kelly, I hold a 7:00 am meeting tomorrow with all my recruiting analysts, and Mike Elston. I tell them that all of them are fired if by next Friday morning they don't have a list of 25-30 offerable DE's for the 2018 cycle. I make it their only responsibility. If it takes them half of each of their days for the next week, so be it. Next step is to personallyrics evaluate each one and have their film lined up and waiting for my new DC hire and tell him you want all of them evaluated by lunch on his first day... Before the day is out, get their offers prepared, and have your new DC, new DL coach and whoever else it takes, on these kids immediately. Tell them you will not settle for less than 3 pass rushers in each class, from now on. Stars are irrelevant here. Lets kids that can rush the QB.
What can be done about 2017?

Start with this....

I have hourly contact with Josh Paschal, Hunter Echols and Josh Kaindoh, until they literally tell you to leave them alone. Promise them whatever you have to in terms of opportunity to play and do whatever it takes to try to get in their homes and prepare the best pitch of your life with your new defensive coordinator. Tell each that he is the most important player in the class and that he'd play from day 1... Don't quit until they'be signed their LOI's an faxed them in.

Here is what I would do next... I'd put a gun to head of my assistant coaches and the I'd put it in my own mouth as well if I'm BK. I'd tell them that "were going poaching" at all costs.... These would be my targets.

Kwity Paye- He might not even answer, or he may tell you to F-Off now that you successfully slow played the crap out of him when he wanted to come that ND and instead went to Michigan when they realized that he was underrated. Call anyway.

Drew Jordan- This 4 star Duke commit camped at Irish Invasion and did well, but left without and offer for some ridiculous reason. He's now committed to Duke. The Georgia prospect has grades. Get your ass down to Georgia and apologize to him and get his family up to ND.

Michael Allen- He's 6'6, 240lbs and committed to Wake Forest. If Elko comes to Notre Dame, I want him too. The kid is little raw, but he can play. Offer him now. Borderline 4 star player.

Jonathan Kingsley- Why the hell does Syracuse have a 6'4, 220lb, 4 star pass rusher in their class and ND doesn't. He's a North Carolina kid going to play football in New York. Check his grades and if they check out, get him a damn offer.

John Van Diest- 4 star kid from Colorado. ND does well with white kids. It's worth a call. "John, Boulder is beautiful, but hown do feel about the chance to play at Notre Dame?" Maybe he hangs up, maybe he and his family get on a plane.

I can name you 5 more guys I'd call, if you care to hear about it.

I was a recruiting coordinator (albeit not at Notre Dame). I can tell you that there are positions that you have to be hyper aggressive with and you have to cast a wide net. WDE / OLB (depending on if you play a 4-3 or 3-4) is one of them. You have to work tirelessly and diligently on about 30-40 guys, in order to find 3 of them that are good players and a good fit. ND dealing with about 10-12 guys per cycle is comical at best.

 

[BGI User 1596]

ND absolutely frigging refuses to cast a wide net at DE and it irritates the hell out of me. Every year they target about 10 guys and when they strike out, they are left holding their dicks, looking like chumps. Pass rushing DE's are arguably the most coveted players in the nation with offenses becoming more and more pass happy. Each kid is a battle. ND has to quit this nonsense of slow playing every quality guy, hopi g the next Stephon Tuitt is going to sign... People talk about Stanford and Michigan State and how they get a pass rush. It's simple. They recruit and develop pass rushers. The odd one is a big time prospect, but most are high 3 stars and low 4 stars. But when you get 3 of them each cycle, some of them develop and work out. Some leave and some graduate having little impact on your program. That's recruiting.

If I'm Brian Kelly, I hold a 7:00 am meeting tomorrow with all my recruiting analysts, and Mike Elston. I tell them that all of them are fired if by next Friday morning they don't have a list of 25-30 offerable DE's for the 2018 cycle. I make it their only responsibility. If it takes them half of each of their days for the next week, so be it. Next step is to personallyrics evaluate each one and have their film lined up and waiting for my new DC hire and tell him you want all of them evaluated by lunch on his first day... Before the day is out, get their offers prepared, and have your new DC, new DL coach and whoever else it takes, on these kids immediately. Tell them you will not settle for less than 3 pass rushers in each class, from now on. Stars are irrelevant here. Lets kids that can rush the QB.
What can be done about 2017?

Start with this....

I have hourly contact with Josh Paschal, Hunter Echols and Josh Kaindoh, until they literally tell you to leave them alone. Promise them whatever you have to in terms of opportunity to play and do whatever it takes to try to get in their homes and prepare the best pitch of your life with your new defensive coordinator. Tell each that he is the most important player in the class and that he'd play from day 1... Don't quit until they'be signed their LOI's an faxed them in.

Here is what I would do next... I'd put a gun to head of my assistant coaches and the I'd put it in my own mouth as well if I'm BK. I'd tell them that "were going poaching" at all costs.... These would be my targets.

Kwity Paye- He might not even answer, or he may tell you to F-Off now that you successfully slow played the crap out of him when he wanted to come that ND and instead went to Michigan when they realized that he was underrated. Call anyway.

Drew Jordan- This 4 star Duke commit camped at Irish Invasion and did well, but left without and offer for some ridiculous reason. He's now committed to Duke. The Georgia prospect has grades. Get your ass down to Georgia and apologize to him and get his family up to ND.

Michael Allen- He's 6'6, 240lbs and committed to Wake Forest. If Elko comes to Notre Dame, I want him too. The kid is little raw, but he can play. Offer him now. Borderline 4 star player.

Jonathan Kingsley- Why the hell does Syracuse have a 6'4, 220lb, 4 star pass rusher in their class and ND doesn't. He's a North Carolina kid going to play football in New York. Check his grades and if they check out, get him a damn offer.

John Van Diest- 4 star kid from Colorado. ND does well with white kids. It's worth a call. "John, Boulder is beautiful, but hown do feel about the chance to play at Notre Dame?" Maybe he hangs up, maybe he and his family get on a plane.

I can name you 5 more guys I'd call, if you care to hear about it.

I was a recruiting coordinator (albeit not at Notre Dame). I can tell you that there are positions that you have to be hyper aggressive with and you have to cast a wide net. WDE / OLB (depending on if you play a 4-3 or 3-4) is one of them. You have to work tirelessly and diligently on about 30-40 guys, in order to find 3 of them that are good players and a good fit. ND dealing with about 10-12 guys per cycle is comical at best.

And people wonder how it's possible to go 4 - 8!

 

[REMND]

If we hire Elko, hopefully he has a relationship with a 4 star DE and CB because we need one of each.

I would like 4 star Simmons for OLB.

Graham seem unlikely. I am hoping more for Fields and/or Treshean Smith at safety. I read that they can play either strong or free safety. Plus they would be good ST players I bet.

I want Sarrel but distance has always seemed a killer to me. The only way we get him is if he is just an ND guy. He might be but it is a long shot.

I want Miller and/or Calvin. Since Calvin is a returner as well he might be more valuable but Miller reminds me of KS. He will produce.

Losing Paschal and Graham cooling on us hurt. We needed them. It used to be we'd get a January surprise. Hope that happens.

Bad ending to recruiting season as of right now.

 

[BGI User 1596]

If we hire Elko, hopefully he has a relationship with a 4 star DE and CB because we need one of each.

I would like 4 star Simmons for OLB.

Graham seem unlikely. I am hoping more for Fields and/or Treshean Smith at safety. I read that they can play either strong or free safety. Plus they would be good ST players I bet.

I want Sarrel but distance has always seemed a killer to me. The only way we get him is if he is just an ND guy. He might be but it is a long shot.

I want Miller and/or Calvin. Since Calvin is a returner as well he might be more valuable but Miller reminds me of KS. He will produce.

Losing Paschal and Graham cooling on us hurt. We needed them. It used to be we'd get a January surprise. Hope that happens.

Bad ending to recruiting season as of right now.

Wake has one 4 star 2017 commit who is a DE.

 

[dagimpper1]

Here is my recruiting wish list
That will never happen!!!
1. ND looks for 5th yr grads that can actually help the team

2. ND excepts Juco's

3. ND gets rid of the calculus and language pre-rec

4. ND offers degrees in basket weaving and TV and movie appreciation.

5. ND makes the decision to Honer KR ,FL AP, AND LH. and play d1 big boy elite fb once again.

 

[twalsh]

Here is my recruiting wish list
That will never happen!!!
1. ND looks for 5th yr grads that can actually help the team

2. ND excepts Juco's

3. ND gets rid of the calculus and language pre-rec

4. ND offers degrees in basket weaving and TV and movie appreciation.

5. ND makes the decision to Honer KR ,FL AP, AND LH. and play d1 big boy elite fb once again.

There is no prohibition against jucos at ND. It's just nearly impossible to find any that qualify academically. There's usually a reason they were jucos to begin with.

 

[Classic Irish]

Here is my recruiting wish list
That will never happen!!!
1. ND looks for 5th yr grads that can actually help the team

2. ND excepts Juco's

3. ND gets rid of the calculus and language pre-rec

4. ND offers degrees in basket weaving and TV and movie appreciation.

5. ND makes the decision to Honer KR ,FL AP, AND LH. and play d1 big boy elite fb once again.

If you graduated from ND, you wouldn't be wishing for #4---and likely not for #2 and #3 either.

 

[dagimpper1]

First off my post was half in jest half frustration. But, in an alternate world if ND did those things how would that diminish ND as a university. Last I checked Duke was still a prestigious university. Yet they seem to go after the same bb players as Kentucky. Known for recruiting anyone. I don't expect ND will ever go down to bama's level. But, remember ND beat bama the first four games they played and bama was then and still is in the gutter. So what's changed at ND. I just want ND to get to where they have a 50/50 chance to beat teams in the play off. If ND does not want that they should tell us fans.

 

[Classic Irish]

First off my post was half in jest half frustration. But, in an alternate world if ND did those things how would that diminish ND as a university. Last I checked Duke was still a prestigious university. Yet they seem to go after the same bb players as Kentucky. Known for recruiting anyone. I don't expect ND will ever go down to bama's level. But, remember ND beat bama the first four games they played and bama was then and still is in the gutter. So what's changed at ND. I just want ND to get to where they have a 50/50 chance to beat teams in the play off. If ND does not want that they should tell us fans.

I don't care what Duke basketball does. One of the things that makes ND special is not prostituting itself as an academic institution in the name of its football program---at least not in the same way as most schools do. I think ND can have a successful football program without having to sell its academic soul.

 

[twalsh]

First off my post was half in jest half frustration. But, in an alternate world if ND did those things how would that diminish ND as a university. Last I checked Duke was still a prestigious university. Yet they seem to go after the same bb players as Kentucky. Known for recruiting anyone. I don't expect ND will ever go down to bama's level. But, remember ND beat bama the first four games they played and bama was then and still is in the gutter. So what's changed at ND. I just want ND to get to where they have a 50/50 chance to beat teams in the play off. If ND does not want that they should tell us fans.

Every school makes their own decisions as to how they run their program, how they run their university. And I am sure every school thinks they do it the right way. The reality is that there is no right way, or wrong way. Whatever path you choose, just have the integrity to stick with it and be consistent, regardless of which way the wind is blowing.

 

[iwish]

ND absolutely frigging refuses to cast a wide net at DE and it irritates the hell out of me. Every year they target about 10 guys and when they strike out, they are left holding their dicks, looking like chumps. Pass rushing DE's are arguably the most coveted players in the nation with offenses becoming more and more pass happy. Each kid is a battle. ND has to quit this nonsense of slow playing every quality guy, hopi g the next Stephon Tuitt is going to sign... People talk about Stanford and Michigan State and how they get a pass rush. It's simple. They recruit and develop pass rushers. The odd one is a big time prospect, but most are high 3 stars and low 4 stars. But when you get 3 of them each cycle, some of them develop and work out. Some leave and some graduate having little impact on your program. That's recruiting.

If I'm Brian Kelly, I hold a 7:00 am meeting tomorrow with all my recruiting analysts, and Mike Elston. I tell them that all of them are fired if by next Friday morning they don't have a list of 25-30 offerable DE's for the 2018 cycle. I make it their only responsibility. If it takes them half of each of their days for the next week, so be it. Next step is to personallyrics evaluate each one and have their film lined up and waiting for my new DC hire and tell him you want all of them evaluated by lunch on his first day... Before the day is out, get their offers prepared, and have your new DC, new DL coach and whoever else it takes, on these kids immediately. Tell them you will not settle for less than 3 pass rushers in each class, from now on. Stars are irrelevant here. Lets kids that can rush the QB.
What can be done about 2017?

Start with this....

I have hourly contact with Josh Paschal, Hunter Echols and Josh Kaindoh, until they literally tell you to leave them alone. Promise them whatever you have to in terms of opportunity to play and do whatever it takes to try to get in their homes and prepare the best pitch of your life with your new defensive coordinator. Tell each that he is the most important player in the class and that he'd play from day 1... Don't quit until they'be signed their LOI's an faxed them in.

Here is what I would do next... I'd put a gun to head of my assistant coaches and the I'd put it in my own mouth as well if I'm BK. I'd tell them that "were going poaching" at all costs.... These would be my targets.

Kwity Paye- He might not even answer, or he may tell you to F-Off now that you successfully slow played the crap out of him when he wanted to come that ND and instead went to Michigan when they realized that he was underrated. Call anyway.

Drew Jordan- This 4 star Duke commit camped at Irish Invasion and did well, but left without and offer for some ridiculous reason. He's now committed to Duke. The Georgia prospect has grades. Get your ass down to Georgia and apologize to him and get his family up to ND.

Michael Allen- He's 6'6, 240lbs and committed to Wake Forest. If Elko comes to Notre Dame, I want him too. The kid is little raw, but he can play. Offer him now. Borderline 4 star player.

Jonathan Kingsley- Why the hell does Syracuse have a 6'4, 220lb, 4 star pass rusher in their class and ND doesn't. He's a North Carolina kid going to play football in New York. Check his grades and if they check out, get him a damn offer.

John Van Diest- 4 star kid from Colorado. ND does well with white kids. It's worth a call. "John, Boulder is beautiful, but hown do feel about the chance to play at Notre Dame?" Maybe he hangs up, maybe he and his family get on a plane.

I can name you 5 more guys I'd call, if you care to hear about it.

I was a recruiting coordinator (albeit not at Notre Dame). I can tell you that there are positions that you have to be hyper aggressive with and you have to cast a wide net. WDE / OLB (depending on if you play a 4-3 or 3-4) is one of them. You have to work tirelessly and diligently on about 30-40 guys, in order to find 3 of them that are good players and a good fit. ND dealing with about 10-12 guys per cycle is comical at best.

Thanks IIO - all very reasonable and logical. But I have to say, do you really believe this or a similar conversation hasn't taken place? it is difficult for me to believe that BK, with 25+ years of head coaching experience, plus all of the other coaches and program staff, have NEVER thought deeply about Recruiting and specifically recruiting defensive players that can pass rush? I'm not being a smart-ass towards your thoughts - they make total sense.

I am frustrated like every other fan when I see us with out DB's and Safeties that can't take care of business. Year over year we had this issue - even when we had players (i.e., Harrison) they didn't seem to blossom or "get it" until their senior years (showed flashes) or later in the NFL. We had players like Max who we all were excited about as a 5* safety and again, he never materialized. Coaching obviously had a lot to do with that. Now we have a stable of promising young defensive backfield players and I am once again "hopeful" they will become solid performers.

We have had some success with LB's (Manti, Jaylon) and recruits we were really pretty excited about. Nyles is "kind of" getting there. But once again, not seeing the development of Tevon and others (yet) that we are hoping for. As for the DL, the only FR DL I remember us seeing hype about is Tillery and his SO year wasn't a big leap over his FR year.

Back to the DL line and specifically pass rushers, I just don't get why they aren't going after these players as you suggest.

 

[IrishInOntario]

Thanks IIO - all very reasonable and logical. But I have to say, do you really believe this or a similar conversation hasn't taken place? it is difficult for me to believe that BK, with 25+ years of head coaching experience, plus all of the other coaches and program staff, have NEVER thought deeply about Recruiting and specifically recruiting defensive players that can pass rush? I'm not being a smart-ass towards your thoughts - they make total sense.

I am frustrated like every other fan when I see us with out DB's and Safeties that can't take care of business. Year over year we had this issue - even when we had players (i.e., Harrison) they didn't seem to blossom or "get it" until their senior years (showed flashes) or later in the NFL. We had players like Max who we all were excited about as a 5* safety and again, he never materialized. Coaching obviously had a lot to do with that. Now we have a stable of promising young defensive backfield players and I am once again "hopeful" they will become solid performers.

We have had some success with LB's (Manti, Jaylon) and recruits we were really pretty excited about. Nyles is "kind of" getting there. But once again, not seeing the development of Tevon and others (yet) that we are hoping for. As for the DL, the only FR DL I remember us seeing hype about is Tillery and his SO year wasn't a big leap over his FR year.

Back to the DL line and specifically pass rushers, I just don't get why they aren't going after these players as you suggest.

Oh I'm sure conversations have been had, but there is a big difference between conversing about it and actually implementing the strategy. Clearly, for whatever reason, the implementation part of things has not taken place... Or else Drew Jordan, Kwity Paye and Michael Allen would already have offers. None of them do, all of them are committed elsewhere now and not a single one even took an official visit to Notre Dame.

Yes ND was chasing "big fish" at a position where you often only take 2-3 players each year and they had Beal and Jeter in fold for a time, but their complete lack of desperation now that they don't have a single pass rushing DE in the class is mind-boggling. The's are good, quality players. We're talking Prince Shembo and Romeo Okwara types. Do we want Justin Tuck's and Aaron Lynch's? Of course we do. BUT you have to walk before you can run. Plenty of the ears play top 25 defense without the likes of Stephon Tuitt. Will you win a Natty with those guys? Probably not without a couple studs surrounding them. But you need to land the foundation of your team before even thinking but getting those 5 star guys... Far too often ND whiffs on the top guys AND the foundational guys... The same guys Stanford and Michigan State have built their susta in ed success with. The same guys (Kwity Paye for example) that are good enough for a top flight Michigan defense, but somehow not for a 4-8 ND team's defense.

I hope Elko walks in the door, is appalled by the number of viable recruits left on ND's board, tells Brian Kelly to get the hell out of his way and puts out 10-15 offers to kids that he feels could help this team. ND has between 4-6 spots left in this class. They need to be used. And damn well oversign, because you know there is no way in hell we're going to training camp with 85 players on the roster.

Less than 2 months until signing day, get to damn work. As soon as the dead period is over, we better see some offers.

We need 2 pass rushers, 1 linebacker (Simmons would be a good get) and 1 DB (preferably a pure safety) on defense and we need to close on Oliver Martin on offense as well as a 2nd running back in the class, IMO.

 

[Telx1]

IIO...what's confusing about this is ND had a completely different approach the prior year as I recall. We were all celebrating the fact they had tied up a number of solid recruits early in the process, and were then targeting a few big fish later in hopes of landing one or two; where in prior year's they spent all year trying to land the big fish only to find themselves scrambling to get plan C types late in the process, as plan B types were all committed elsewhere. Is this deja vu all over again?

 

[hoopsstar12]

Pray to the blessed mother for a miracle or two with 2017 recruiting class.