I say Elite 8 or we fire Mike Brey
- Thread starter hawkit3113
- Start date
Really? So you are basically down playing our academics and athletics. You sir, are a crappy fan.
5 to 15 range in recruiting is top level. In fact it's just about elite. When you only have a few schools recruiting better than you, if you have a great coach, you should be able to compete for a title every year. You will have the talent edge in 10 or 11 of the games every year, just have to outcoach the 1 or 2 opponents that have more talent.
Anyway, back to basketball. Go Irish.
Its a valid question at least with Basketball. ND basketball is not a powerhouse and there a catholic schools that have a much better basketball pedigree then ND does in the last 20-25 years.
I am calling BS. We have an advantage that we need to use. Watching the tourney this weekend and see all these players that went to Catholic High Schools tells me their is room for improvement.
ND can offer the total package. Can we not?
Also, I dont know how old some of you are, but ND has always been a player in college basketball. Always. You guys are acting like we are a mid major or something. BS.
ND can offer the total package. Can we not?
Also, I dont know how old some of you are, but ND has always been a player in college basketball. Always. You guys are acting like we are a mid major or something. BS.
Sigh, the pedigree of ND basketball since 1990 isn't great. It is full of a lot of good teams that have gotten to the tournament but its not like there a bunch of deep runs in there. ND has not really marketed the basketball brand on a national scale and the visibility of the program is no where near that of the football team.
Catholic kids that are good at basketball can look at other catholic basketball schools and may feel like for them growing up those schools are better basketball schools, Georgetown, Gonzaga, Nova, Marquette, and Xaiver have all had comparable success to ND in basketball in the time frame of high school kids' lives.
Not saying ND doesn't have facilities or that the school itself isn't a draw but to believe ND should automatically have its pick of the top players at catholic schools around the nation is a bit delusional for basketball. It doesn't even work that way for Football anymore and ND is still a national brand there.
Catholic kids that are good at basketball can look at other catholic basketball schools and may feel like for them growing up those schools are better basketball schools, Georgetown, Gonzaga, Nova, Marquette, and Xaiver have all had comparable success to ND in basketball in the time frame of high school kids' lives.
Not saying ND doesn't have facilities or that the school itself isn't a draw but to believe ND should automatically have its pick of the top players at catholic schools around the nation is a bit delusional for basketball. It doesn't even work that way for Football anymore and ND is still a national brand there.
Alot of you have a loser mentality.
ND is a ten times better school than Gonzaga, Xavier, Nova, G Town, Boston College, etc, etc, etc,.......and also a much more recoginzed brand. I dont care what you say.
ND is ND. We are recognized in everything we do. Everything.
ND is a ten times better school than Gonzaga, Xavier, Nova, G Town, Boston College, etc, etc, etc,.......and also a much more recoginzed brand. I dont care what you say.
ND is ND. We are recognized in everything we do. Everything.
OK, put your pom poms down and get a grip on reality. Even if you believe that ND is "ten times better" than the schools you listed, not everyone shares your belief. It has nothing to do with having a "loser mentality." It's reality. I would also remind you that Marquette, Georgetown and Villanova have all won national championships in basketball, something ND has yet to accomplish.
Just looking at the last 25 years, Nova, Georgetown, Marquette and Zaga all have as good if not better basketball results. Recognizing that isn't a loser mentality. There argument isn't that ND isn't recognized for a lot of things, it is that ND basketball doesn't have the national pull to be in a position to pick and choose who it wants out of the top high school kids at catholic schools. It doesn't work that way and empirical evidence supports that. Not sure why this is even being disputed.
I am not sure how you saying ND should have its pick of the group makes it true. What is something that ND has that gives it a clear heads up on the national basketball powerhouses?
Then we make it the draw. It cant be that hard. We have more advantages than all other Catholic schools. Hell, we played in the Big East and now the ACC. The time is now.
That's a shifting argument but sure, the ideal goal would be to make ND an elite brand in college basketball.
Villanova, Georgetown, Providence, BC, Seton Hall, Marquette, DePaul and St. John's all played in the Big East too. I'm not sure what point it is that you are trying to make. You may find this to be a revelation, but there are a lot of people out there who think that Philadelphia, Boston, Washington, Milwaukee, Chicago, and New York City have more to offer than South Bend, Indiana, does.
I assume this has been the goal at least since Brey came in after MD left but maybe I am wrong. I am not sure of any program in a major D-1 conference like the ACC that sets their ideal goal at "lets be kinda good, but not great, and maybe once every 5-7 years we will have a shot to make a deep run."
So now its about the location of the school? Not how good the school is?
You kill me. We need less fans like you.
"I choose Villanova over ND because going to a school in Philly is more important to me than a world class education and the opportunity to play for one of the most well respected ADs in the country." - lol, ok, I buy that.
You litterally know nothing about basketball. Zero. Basketball always will and always has been about recruiting connections. And Brey needs better ones. Or to develop better ones.
Are you really that dense? You have never known anyone to choose where they attend school based upon where the school is located? Or maybe you just don't know anyone who ever attended college.Originally posted by hawkit3113:
So now its about the location of the school? Not how good the school is?
You kill me. We need less fans like you.
"I choose Villanova over ND because going to a school in Philly is more important to me than a world class education and the opportunity to play for one of the most well respected ADs in the country." - lol, ok, I buy that.
You litterally know nothing about basketball. Zero. Basketball always will and always has been about recruiting connections. And Brey needs better ones. Or to develop better ones.
Originally posted by NDSMC78:
Are you really that dense? You have never known anyone to choose where they attend school based upon where the school is located? Or maybe you just don't know anyone who ever attended college.Originally posted by hawkit3113:
So now its about the location of the school? Not how good the school is?
You kill me. We need less fans like you.
"I choose Villanova over ND because going to a school in Philly is more important to me than a world class education and the opportunity to play for one of the most well respected ADs in the country." - lol, ok, I buy that.
You litterally know nothing about basketball. Zero. Basketball always will and always has been about recruiting connections. And Brey needs better ones. Or to develop better ones.
Weak ass argument.
"I chose DePaul over Stanford, because I would rather be in Chicago. And making more money and going to a better school was not as important to me as being in a cool city."
Does this happen? Probably not. Could it happen, I guess.
But lets be real here, no one is choosing DePaul over Stanford, now are they.
Listen, I don't have a dog in this exchange, but Brey just pulled Rex Pfleuger from CA's winningest coach/program in CA state history. (Gary McKnight Mater Dei/John Huarte's HS Alma Mater)
(RP has been off a bit, but had 23 the other night to put them in the State finals which they've won 4 years in a row)
One guy to watch is their JR center MJ cage who is Michael Cage's of NBA fame son.
Now that we are in the ACC I expect better pull from the local Catholic/other powerhouse schools....
PS Your OP is not well thought out, but you are entitled to that opinion.
(RP has been off a bit, but had 23 the other night to put them in the State finals which they've won 4 years in a row)
One guy to watch is their JR center MJ cage who is Michael Cage's of NBA fame son.
Now that we are in the ACC I expect better pull from the local Catholic/other powerhouse schools....
PS Your OP is not well thought out, but you are entitled to that opinion.
You are a damned fool. You know zero about anything. You make up ridiculous claims about ND being 10 times better than every other school, but when poster after poster says that you are full of crap, you respond with inanity and emoticons. I am through dealing with you. You have no sense of logic or reality.
Its the best thought out argument in the history of this board. Its morphed into something else now.
1. I said Brey needs to make a run. He does.
2. I said ND has the most advantages of all Catholic Universities. It does.
3. Brey needs to step up the recruiting. He will or we need to move on.
Brey needs to step up his salesmanship. No school, outside of the really top ones, sell themselves. The coach needs to do that. Like he did with Rex.
Man I am not really following your argument other then you are denying a lot of realities that exist. Non-basketball players that are making college decisions focused on academics may not choose Depaul over Stanford but they may choose Columbia, University of Chicago, Harvard or Penn over Stanford. Further, this assumes basketball players are placing a paramount value on quality of education.
You are the one saying you had the most well thought out argument in the history of the board... Lolz too much.
You have split the Rivals ND atom while simultaneously winning its' space race!
Enrico Fermi, Albert Einstein, Robert Oppenheimer and others would be proud.
In fact, so would Wernher Von Braun.
Your effort could win a Nobel if you submit it.
Well done!
Enrico Fermi, Albert Einstein, Robert Oppenheimer and others would be proud.
In fact, so would Wernher Von Braun.
Your effort could win a Nobel if you submit it.
Well done!
Thank you. And all I was trying to do is point out that another second round out with this team would be unacceptable.
And then I tried to explain that we are ND, and that is an advantage.
And then explained its the coaches job to sell the program.
What I gathered from this thread, is that I am more optimistic than a bunch of you and that I think more of the program and our history, than most of you.
This post was edited on 3/23 4:22 PM by hawkit3113
Yes, said its an advantage and never really explained how so and then when multiple people said it wasn't as easy as you make it seem you just responded to people saying they were terrible fans.
The school, the brand, academics,.......basically everything about us.
When did this place turn into a bunch of Debbie Downers? I am starting to think I am being trolled.
In this situation I would not be so judgemental.
You are entitled to believe whatever you want, but be careful when mixing that with the truth.
We need a strong final push and hopefully when the dust settles we can build off the momentum.
It is amazing what an NBA caliber point can do...
Ps I remember when Butch Lee almost singlehandedly beat the US playing for PR in the Olympics.
You are entitled to believe whatever you want, but be careful when mixing that with the truth.
We need a strong final push and hopefully when the dust settles we can build off the momentum.
It is amazing what an NBA caliber point can do...
Ps I remember when Butch Lee almost singlehandedly beat the US playing for PR in the Olympics.
I dont know what opinion I tried to pass off as fact. These are just my opinions and the way I see and feel about things.
Everyone wants to act like rivals is some factual debate, I generally only post my opinions. If Brey gets us to the elite 8, you will not hear from me about this subject again. A FF would be even better though. : )
There is a difference between it should be an advantage and it is an advantage. The reality is that it isn't currently and hasn't been in the last quarter century. ND's brand is most visible in relation to football not basketball, Brey is going to struggle to get multiple top 50 players in a recruiting class year in and year out. Most schools do, and the elite ones that don't are college basketball power houses.
Do you think Duke should have a better football program with all the advantages that school has?
Do you think Duke should have a better football program with all the advantages that school has?
Its much, much easier to win in basketball than football.
Are you telling me that a program like WSU where Marshal has coached for only 8 years can do it, but ND cant? Are you kidding me? Its about the right coach. Same with the Catholic advantage. There is no advantage if the coach doesnt use it or doesnt know how to use it. A coach needs good connnections to get a good pipe line going. Its always been that way.
Are you telling me that a program like WSU where Marshal has coached for only 8 years can do it, but ND cant? Are you kidding me? Its about the right coach. Same with the Catholic advantage. There is no advantage if the coach doesnt use it or doesnt know how to use it. A coach needs good connnections to get a good pipe line going. Its always been that way.
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