Does the NCAA

[Patrish]

Well, there's precedent for CAPS and, of course, precedent for BOOSTERS.

I'm curious to see how long a TOTAL DEREGULATION REGIME can work.

But one thing is certain. Supporters won't stop attending games even if it's a NEW CAST OF CHARACTERS every year.

If, as Saban says, when teams with 20 million in NIL play teams with 3 million in NIL, the imbalance is going to result in the teams with a 3 million NIL having a poor record, which generally results in poorer attendance, so I’m not so sure that attendance won’t suffer as a result of the imbalance and NIL

Time will tell

 

[chaseball]

I’ll title my threads as I see fit

In case you haven’t figured it out yet, my titles are generally lead ins.

It's a garbage/inconsiderate way to post. This is a ND community site for fellow ND fans to aggregate ideas and information about their team (it's a symbiotic relationship among its users who are both readers and publishers) -- topic titles aren't supposed to be a banner ad that baits people into clicking/viewing topics they aren't interested in

a lot of users are at work browsing this forum and will quickly refresh the main page to scan titles quickly and see what the community is discussing at the moment .. you are forcing those community members to have to use additional clicks with the non-descriptive-clickbaity-title and essentially making the board less usable/less user friendly for the users of this forum

 

[Patrish]

It's a garbage/inconsiderate way to post. This is a ND community site for fellow ND fans to aggregate ideas and information about their team (it's a symbiotic relationship among its users who are both readers and publishers) -- topic titles aren't supposed to be a banner ad that baits people into clicking/viewing topics they aren't interested in

a lot of users are at work browsing this forum and will quickly refresh the main page to scan titles quickly and see what the community is discussing at the moment .. you are forcing those community members to have to use additional clicks with the non-descriptive-clickbaity-title and essentially making the board less usable/less user friendly for the users of this forum

Stop whining

You post your way and I’ll post the way I want

 

[Patrish]

It's a garbage/inconsiderate way to post. This is a ND community site for fellow ND fans to aggregate ideas and information about their team (it's a symbiotic relationship among its users who are both readers and publishers) -- topic titles aren't supposed to be a banner ad that baits people into clicking/viewing topics they aren't interested in

a lot of users are at work browsing this forum and will quickly refresh the main page to scan titles quickly and see what the community is discussing at the moment .. you are forcing those community members to have to use additional clicks with the non-descriptive-clickbaity-title and essentially making the board less usable/less user friendly for the users of this forum

What’s absurdly funny is you telling me that this is a ND community site for fellow ND fans

You’re no fan of ND

You make backhanded critical remarks all the time

If you don’t like how I post, stop whining and go somewhere else

 

[chaseball]

What’s absurdly funny is you telling me that this is a ND community site for fellow ND fans

You’re no fan of ND

You make backhanded critical remarks all the time

If you don’t like how I post, stop whining and go somewhere else

I generally enjoy reading your on topic posts (when you are talking ND football) and you are one of the more frequent posters on this site.

Im asking you to be considerate of the users of the forum. The more accessible/usable we keep this forum (as a community) the more readers and ultimately contributors it will have which will increase the quality and quantity of the content & discussion taking place on this forum.

 

[Telx1]

I think that most would agree that the chaos thatexists today isn’t good for college football

And Nick Saban said it best, a college that has 3 million in NIL money can’t compete with a college that has 20 million in NIL money.

So what’s the answer ?

CONTRACTS

You come to a school and you sign a contract, a four year contract with an extension

That’s how you return stability to college sports

Pat,
I agree! They’re essentially signing a contract today, but absent any binding obligation on the players part. A four year contract obligating the university to pay x amount, and a punitive buy out clause for either party to break the contract. I would prefer the one year sitting out upon transfer, but agree with Echo that ship has sailed.

 

[savvyandsassier]

Pat,
I agree! They’re essentially signing a contract today, but absent any binding obligation on the players part. A four year contract obligating the university to pay x amount, and a punitive buy out clause for either party to break the contract. I would prefer the one year sitting out upon transfer, but agree with Echo that ship has sailed.

They can do that now, dude, they just can't force them to do it. And for lack of a better word, as it were, the market will decide the form and the terms these contracts typically take and consist of. And apparently no one wants contracts like that. You guys just can't seem to get out of the mindset of decree-ing how things are gong to be. Like you're all trying to be reasonable, but you ultimately will decide how it's going to be unilaterally. Which is precisely what the NCAA is not allowed to do. That's just like willful obstinance. Like a fantasy GM or something.

They should have have fantasy camps for disgruntled CFB fans, and you guys can pretend to come up with rules regimes that will be strictly enforced, after you flatter yourself, and congratulate yourself that you're being responsible and the adult in the room and returning proper order and stability to CFB. I think that would be gratifying for a lot lof you guys.

 

[Irishjohn68]

I generally enjoy reading your on topic posts (when you are talking ND football) and you are one of the more frequent posters on this site.

Im asking you to be considerate of the users of the forum. The more accessible/usable we keep this forum (as a community) the more readers and ultimately contributors it will have which will increase the quality and quantity of the content & discussion taking place on this forum.

Who died and make you queen of this forum? Chaseball you are an absolute clown show.

 

[savvyandsassier]

There's a huge problem with your analogy.

The NFL and college football are not at all similat. In the NFL, the players are employees. They receive paychecks from the teams. They signed contracts. The teams have to pay payroll taxes on their employees.

None of that's going on in college football. As of now, college football players are not considered to be employees. That's what you're not getting. It's not that somebody's going to come physically break up the college football players if they decide to start a union. The problem is they don't yet have the legal standing to be able to do what you think they're going to do.

The issue is going to be that they're going to have to be considered employees for any of this other stuff to happen. The way that they're going to be considered employees is to go through the courts.

Alright, man. Can you get off of your fixation with officially court decreed employee status, you're like an autistic kid or something. What you are describing is the epitome of a minor technicality and legal hoop to be jumped through, on the way to implementing this totally bad-faith, desperation move on the NCAA's part to cling to power by any means at their disposal, including effin' getting sued and losing again, and having a three billion dollar judgement made against them, and them trying to somehow work it to their advantage so as to hold on to their at this point nominal, largely ceremonious authority over college sports. This is not some final disposition for the sport of men's CFB. This is an individual lawsuit, the results and outcome of which does not speak for the players' interests. This is the NCAA running very scared and still trying to be opportunistic scumbags at the same time.

Labor law ultimately is insignificant. If the players form their union, irrespective of whatever govt. recognition they procure, the precious 'legal standing', then they can walk, and bring the sport to a halt. They are indeed irreplaceable. These aren't no air traffic controllers. The cockroaches at the NCAA, and all their supporters and fellow travelers in the media and the collective CFB fanbase, are gambling that a bunch of 18 year olds on instagram will never have the balls to do something like that, and thus can continue to be exploited. And the NCAA can stay in business. And they're probably wrong. Because the lawsuits will keep coming. And there's just too much money to be made.

 

[tbonesays]

There's a huge problem with your analogy.

The NFL and college football are not at all similat. In the NFL, the players are employees. They receive paychecks from the teams. They signed contracts. The teams have to pay payroll taxes on their employees.

None of that's going on in college football. As of now, college football players are not considered to be employees. That's what you're not getting. It's not that somebody's going to come physically break up the college football players if they decide to start a union. The problem is they don't yet have the legal standing to be able to do what you think they're going to do.

The issue is going to be that they're going to have to be considered employees for any of this other stuff to happen. The way that they're going to be considered employees is to go through the courts.

Not sure which is more distasteful, a college football player fired for poor performance or the University being on the hook for a lifetime of disability costs. Spoiler alert, in the case of the latter the school will just drop football.

 

[topdecktiger]

Alright, man. Can you get off of your fixation with officially court decreed employee status, you're like an autistic kid or something. What you are describing is the epitome of a minor technicality and legal hoop to be jumped through, on the way to implementing this totally bad-faith, desperation move on the NCAA's part to cling to power by any means at their disposal, including effin' getting sued and losing again, and having a three billion dollar judgement made against them, and them trying to somehow work it to their advantage so as to hold on to their at this point nominal, largely ceremonious authority over college sports. This is not some final disposition for the sport of men's CFB. This is an individual lawsuit, the results and outcome of which does not speak for the players' interests. This is the NCAA running very scared and still trying to be opportunistic scumbags at the same time.

Labor law ultimately is insignificant. If the players form their union, irrespective of whatever govt. recognition they procure, the precious 'legal standing', then they can walk, and bring the sport to a halt. They are indeed irreplaceable. These aren't no air traffic controllers. The cockroaches at the NCAA, and all their supporters and fellow travelers in the media and the collective CFB fanbase, are gambling that a bunch of 18 year olds on instagram will never have the balls to do something like that, and thus can continue to be exploited. And the NCAA can stay in business. And they're probably wrong. Because the lawsuits will keep coming. And there's just too much money to be made.

Alright, man. Can you get off of your fixation with officially court decreed employee status, you're like an autistic kid or something. What you are describing is the epitome of a minor technicality and legal hoop to be jumped through, on the way to implementing this totally bad-faith, desperation move on the NCAA's part to cling to power by any means at their disposal, including effin' getting sued and losing again, and having a three billion dollar judgement made against them, and them trying to somehow work it to their advantage so as to hold on to their at this point nominal, largely ceremonious authority over college sports. This is not some final disposition for the sport of men's CFB. This is an individual lawsuit, the results and outcome of which does not speak for the players' interests. This is the NCAA running very scared and still trying to be opportunistic scumbags at the same time.

Labor law ultimately is insignificant. If the players form their union, irrespective of whatever govt. recognition they procure, the precious 'legal standing', then they can walk, and bring the sport to a halt. They are indeed irreplaceable. These aren't no air traffic controllers. The cockroaches at the NCAA, and all their supporters and fellow travelers in the media and the collective CFB fanbase, are gambling that a bunch of 18 year olds on instagram will never have the balls to do something like that, and thus can continue to be exploited. And the NCAA can stay in business. And they're probably wrong. Because the lawsuits will keep coming. And there's just too much money to be made.

There's no fixation. Is not a technicality. For the things to happen that you want to happen, there's going to have to be a court ruling. There's simply no other way around it.

 

[Patrish]

I generally enjoy reading your on topic posts (when you are talking ND football) and you are one of the more frequent posters on this site.

Im asking you to be considerate of the users of the forum. The more accessible/usable we keep this forum (as a community) the more readers and ultimately contributors it will have which will increase the quality and quantity of the content & discussion taking place on this forum.

I’ll certainly take your advice under consideration

 

[Patrish]

Alright, man. Can you get off of your fixation with officially court decreed employee status, you're like an autistic kid or something. What you are describing is the epitome of a minor technicality and legal hoop to be jumped through, on the way to implementing this totally bad-faith, desperation move on the NCAA's part to cling to power by any means at their disposal, including effin' getting sued and losing again, and having a three billion dollar judgement made against them, and them trying to somehow work it to their advantage so as to hold on to their at this point nominal, largely ceremonious authority over college sports. This is not some final disposition for the sport of men's CFB. This is an individual lawsuit, the results and outcome of which does not speak for the players' interests. This is the NCAA running very scared and still trying to be opportunistic scumbags at the same time.

Labor law ultimately is insignificant. If the players form their union, irrespective of whatever govt. recognition they procure, the precious 'legal standing', then they can walk, and bring the sport to a halt. They are indeed irreplaceable. These aren't no air traffic controllers. The cockroaches at the NCAA, and all their supporters and fellow travelers in the media and the collective CFB fanbase, are gambling that a bunch of 18 year olds on instagram will never have the balls to do something like that, and thus can continue to be exploited. And the NCAA can stay in business. And they're probably wrong. Because the lawsuits will keep coming. And there's just too much money to be made.

Do you believe or agree that college football needs structure in the form of a governing body ?

 

[Irishjohn68]

Do you believe or agree that college football needs structure in the form of a governing body ?

Yes!

 

[ivan brunetti]

Do you believe or agree that college football needs structure in the form of a governing body ?

The member schools are the ones who must vote for such governess. And as of today, the schools don't want that sort of oversight.

 

[Patrish]

The member schools are the ones who must vote for such governess. And as of today, the schools don't want that sort of oversight.

That’s not the question I asked
And on what basis do you speak for all of the schools?
So I’ll ask you
Do you believe or agree that college football needs structure in the form of a governing body ?

 

[Patrish]

Yeah, is that typically how employees officially get hired, by court ruling? I don't know that much about 'employee' law, but they're obviously professional athletes just like NFL players. So we could probably just copy that paradigm.

Do you believe or agree that college football needs structure in the form of a governing body ?

Yes or no ?

 

[4-4-3]

If, as Saban says, when teams with 20 million in NIL play teams with 3 million in NIL, the imbalance is going to result in the teams with a 3 million NIL having a poor record, which generally results in poorer attendance, so I’m not so sure that attendance won’t suffer as a result of the imbalance and NIL

Time will tell

Yes, IT WILL.

And I'll be interested in seeing if ND becomes a $20 MILLION TEAM or a $3 MILLION TEAM -- pending on how things PAN OUT.

OSU was reportedly last year's $20 million POSTER-TEAM and beat ND HANDILY ENOUGH. Does anyone know what ND SPENT in roster building in 2024?

If it's going to be more and more about money -- AND IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS -- and, POTENTIALLY, athletes as employees as well as students, I wonder how ND will approach both issues -- specifically at the point that its CORE VALUES are CONFRONTED.

 

[4-4-3]

Do you believe or agree that college football needs structure in the form of a governing body ?

Yes or no ?

Well, IT LOOKS LIKE SOMEBODY DOES.

From the PAY SITE:

WASHINGTON — A committee of power conference administrators took significant steps this week toward the creation of a new entity that will govern the evolving professionalized aspects of college sports, a milestone moment in the industry’s history.

During a two-day summit in the nation’s capital, a “transition team,” charged with operationalizing concepts of the House settlement, inched closer to establishing a new structure to oversee, manage and enforce the settlement-related athlete compensation system for all of NCAA Division I. The newly created LLC, overseen by a CEO or executive director, is centered around a new enforcement arm to police violators of the industry’s new salary cap and is expected to feature revenue-sharing policies and a corresponding penalty structure for violators.

Multiple sources with knowledge of the meetings and issues spoke to Yahoo Sports under condition of anonymity.

This new entity dovetails with a proposal introduced last month from the power conferences that grants them more autonomy powers and creates a new division or subdivision within the NCAA. It stands as another shift in the transformation of major college athletics as the NCAA deregulates itself and cedes more authority to the power leagues after court rulings topple its long-standing amateurism rules.

Full story here:

Monumental shift: Power conferences, not NCAA, to control policing athlete compensation​

A committee of power conference administrators took significant steps this week toward the creation of a new entity that will govern the evolving professionalized aspects of college sports.
sports.yahoo.com

 

[Patrish]

4-4-3,

That’s an interesting development

 

[savvyandsassier]

Well, IT LOOKS LIKE SOMEBODY DOES.

From the PAY SITE:

WASHINGTON — A committee of power conference administrators took significant steps this week toward the creation of a new entity that will govern the evolving professionalized aspects of college sports, a milestone moment in the industry’s history.

During a two-day summit in the nation’s capital, a “transition team,” charged with operationalizing concepts of the House settlement, inched closer to establishing a new structure to oversee, manage and enforce the settlement-related athlete compensation system for all of NCAA Division I. The newly created LLC, overseen by a CEO or executive director, is centered around a new enforcement arm to police violators of the industry’s new salary cap and is expected to feature revenue-sharing policies and a corresponding penalty structure for violators.

Multiple sources with knowledge of the meetings and issues spoke to Yahoo Sports under condition of anonymity.

This new entity dovetails with a proposal introduced last month from the power conferences that grants them more autonomy powers and creates a new division or subdivision within the NCAA. It stands as another shift in the transformation of major college athletics as the NCAA deregulates itself and cedes more authority to the power leagues after court rulings topple its long-standing amateurism rules.

Full story here:

Monumental shift: Power conferences, not NCAA, to control policing athlete compensation​

A committee of power conference administrators took significant steps this week toward the creation of a new entity that will govern the evolving professionalized aspects of college sports.
sports.yahoo.com

I truly despise the NCAA as you probably know, no need to rehash that. But they do really appear to be on their last legs. And are basically flailing wildly to survive, with this monstrosity of a forced rev share 'settlement', that they foisted upon the CFB world, on both the schools and the athletes. And seemingly of their own volition and as a product of their own agenda, and instinct for self-preservation, and nobody was asking for this bold new rev share arrangement, which when you look at the details is totally bonkers. But they got their ass beat in court again, this time to the tune of like, 2.7 billion dollars, and this is how they responded.

I have no idea just how cozy the relationship between the schools themselves, which have their own conferences, that add another self-interested bureaucratic layer to the proceedings, and the big bad NCAA, which largely exists to do the schools' dirty work, and be the enforcers of the 'amateurism' era. And if that's truly dead, and it looks like it is, maybe the schools will tire of it, and come up with something new. The NCAA is deeply corrupt, almost like a rogue institution, in a way the schools themselves have managed to avoid becoming, chiefly because the NCAA's role is or was to be the bad guys and the schools don't have to get their hands dirty. But now that amateurism is no more, and the NCAA is both scandalized and delegitimized, as far as the schools are concerned it will have outlived its usefulness.

 

[4-4-3]

4-4-3,

That’s an interesting development

Yes, it is and certainly A PROPOS of this THREAD.

 

[4-4-3]

I truly despise the NCAA as you probably know, no need to rehash that. But they do really appear to be on their last legs. And are basically flailing wildly to survive, with this monstrosity of a forced rev share 'settlement', that they foisted upon the CFB world, on both the schools and the athletes. And seemingly of their own volition and as a product of their own agenda, and instinct for self-preservation, and nobody was asking for this bold new rev share arrangement, which when you look at the details is totally bonkers. But they got their ass beat in court again, this time to the tune of like, 2.7 billion dollars, and this is how they responded.

I have no idea just how cozy the relationship between the schools themselves, which have their own conferences, that add another self-interested bureaucratic layer to the proceedings, and the big bad NCAA, which largely exists to do the schools' dirty work, and be the enforcers of the 'amateurism' era. And if that's truly dead, and it looks like it is, maybe the schools will tire of it, and come up with something new. The NCAA is deeply corrupt, almost like a rogue institution, in a way the schools themselves have managed to avoid becoming, chiefly because the NCAA's role is or was to be the bad guys and the schools don't have to get their hands dirty. But now that amateurism is no more, and the NCAA is both scandalized and delegitimized, as far as the schools are concerned it will have outlived its usefulness.

The way I read this is that the NCAA is gradually being maneuvered into letting the FOX inside the HEN HOUSE. OR, it's doing it VOLUNTARILY.

That new SUBCOMMITTEE the article refers to looks to me like it could wind up as AUTONOMOUS and even succeed in getting the NCAA to spin it off -- if that isn't already the PLAN. Not being inside the room, it's difficult to know what's ACTUALLY HAPPENING. But I sense that the flow of power in the direction of the POWER CONFERENCES is already a FAIT ACCOMPLI.

What I see as LIKELY here is the establishment of a TIER-1 type CFB conference -- or even a LEAGUE -- that will have ZERO CONNECTION to the NCAA. In such a case, the Power Conferences would give themselves a name and make and enforce their own rules. What would happen to the NCAA in relation to the REST OF CFB, I've no idea.

Whether this would be merely a governing body or a COMMERCIAL ENTITY in its own right is an interesting question. Once you have a more thoroughly commercial sport -- given that the players, too, are now PROFITING STAKEHOLDERS -- other potential stakeholders are likely to emerge and MULTIPLY.

The universities, too, could then become more JOINED AT THE HIP, winding up as either investors in a FULLY COMMERCIALIZED conference or league or even FRANCHISEES, should this EVER GREATER MOVE towards monetization culminate in FLIPPING THE SPORT ON ITS HEAD.

Frankly, I don't care how it turns out as I learned years ago that in societies based on FINANCIALIZED CAPITALISM, money WILL ALWAYS FIND A WAY -- as that's the ENTIRE POINT of those societies. As long as the product on the field remains what it is, I HAVE ZERO ISSUES with the way this is evolving.

But as I've repeatedly remarked, I will be EXTREMELY CURIOUS to see how ND plays this -- given of course its OWN UNIQUE PLAYBOOK.

 

[savvyandsassier]

So I read the article and of course its main meaty portion, the powers that be's new push to crack down on spending! No more buying players! The NCAA of course are complete scum, and have no ethical conviction about anything other than enforcing whatever rules lead to their own self-perpetuation. Indeed an entirely rogue institution and the players are just pawns. The prey to the NCAA's predator. And it's very naked and undisguised. After all they're not paying the players. It's the schools, and the boosters. The schools heretofore had kept all the money, and I'm sure they adored that state of affairs and hate to see it go. And the boosters are shelling out for all this NIL pay for play. So it seems like a money transfer, if this pitiful attempt at a salary cap goes through, and the NCAA unleashes this badass, merciless new enforcement division that would make the IRS look like the Girl Scouts. And now the schools are going to be on the hook, and the boosters don't have to pay shit, because now NIL rules are going to be totally enforced, and the collectives will begin to wither. And all Phil Knight's billions will just have to languish. It's nice to save all that money, but what if you're a rich booster and you want to buy your alma mater a player or two?

Two things, I have no idea why the NCAA thinks they can legally prevent and punish the practice of paying athletes to play for a certain team. Pay for play provided by boosters, under the phony guise of outsized NIL deals. What's illegal about that? How is the NCAA empowered to prohibit that? The players did not sign off on this new arrangement, that totally hurts them financially. There's no CBA. The fact that former players agreeing to the terms of this 'settlement', and that way they can collect their class-action pittance, apparently is meant to be regarded as some de facto capitulation to this bullshit rev share arrangement, and all its unwieldy, outrageous terms. Thus they think or hope they can avoid a dreaded CBA, and plow forward full bore with all this heavy duty enforcement. And the NCAA is back in the position of once again willfully imposing 'amateurism' upon the players, however diluted the new definition. Which is what they're not allowed to do. And these boosters might still want to pay them and the NCAA aims to prevent it, as if they haven't learned a thing. And the old sheriff is back in town.

And 2nd, who is behind all this? The schools? The federal govt.? Or is it just the NCAA in flight or fight mode? And what about boosters, who on the one hand might be glad to have the NCAA back on the block, because they don't have to shell out anymore, because the NCAA will nail them and this time they'll be able to make it stick. Whereas currently the NCAA just sits there helplessly, in mortal terror of their own impotence, and lets the inmates run the asylum. They could enforce the rules now, they just don't because they're unenforceable and they'd be sued if they tried, and would lose. So what has changed? What about this settlement will somehow render the NCAA now able to crack down on the same violations they are currently letting run rampant, but now they won't lose in court? Because I've heard lawyers say this new arrangement is every bit as unenforceable as things stand right now. So it seems like a desperate last stand on part of the NCAA to stay alive, and it won't work. Unless the fix is in. And they are granted some special above the law status. And boosters are just going to do what they do, and they'll probably want to keep buying players. And the market will continue to decide. And the big showdown will be over the NCAA's legitimacy once and for all, if they are unable to successfully impose their will with regard to NIL, post this bullshit 'settlement'. And if they can't, then they're kaput.

 

[savvyandsassier]

The way I read this is that the NCAA is gradually being maneuvered into letting the FOX inside the HEN HOUSE. OR, it's doing it VOLUNTARILY.

That new SUBCOMMITTEE the article refers to looks to me like it could wind up as AUTONOMOUS and even succeed in getting the NCAA to spin it off -- if that isn't already the PLAN. Not being inside the room, it's difficult to know what's ACTUALLY HAPPENING. But I sense that the flow of power in the direction of the POWER CONFERENCES is already a FAIT ACCOMPLI.

What I see as LIKELY here is the establishment of a TIER-1 type CFB conference -- or even a LEAGUE -- that will have ZERO CONNECTION to the NCAA. In such a case, the Power Conferences would give themselves a name and make and enforce their own rules. What would happen to the NCAA in relation to the REST OF CFB, I've no idea.

Whether this would be merely a governing body or a COMMERCIAL ENTITY in its own right is an interesting question. Once you have a more thoroughly commercial sport -- given that the players, too, are now PROFITING STAKEHOLDERS -- other potential stakeholders are likely to emerge and MULTIPLY.

The universities, too, could then become more JOINED AT THE HIP, winding up as either investors in a FULLY COMMERCIALIZED conference or league or even FRANCHISEES, should this EVER GREATER MOVE towards monetization culminate in FLIPPING THE SPORT ON ITS HEAD.

Frankly, I don't care how it turns out as I learned years ago that in societies based on FINANCIALIZED CAPITALISM, money WILL ALWAYS FIND A WAY -- as that's the ENTIRE POINT of those socieities. As long as the product on the field remains what it is, I HAVE ZERO ISSUES with the way this is evolving.

But as I've repeatedly remarked, I will be EXTREMELY CURIOUS to see how ND plays this -- given of course its OWN UNIQUE PLAYBOOK.

I got an idea, let boosters take an ownership stake in the programs directly. The NCAA is dissolved, and their writ is no more, and you negotiate out a CBA, which would include some new governing body or serviceable equivalent. You start from scratch, work out all the details, which is a huge endeavor of course, but it's gotta be done sometime. And maybe the boosters don't profit from it, but they can be more directly involved in compensating players, even at a loss to them, and we can dispense with NIL, and players can sign genuine marketing deals with anyone they want, through their agent like any NFL player.

As far as ND, yeah, they said they would never participate in any sort of rev share or direct payment/employment of players. And they might just get out altogether if that's what it came to. Well, looks like they're gonna. I wonder if anyone would ever try to embarrass Fr. Jenkins, at some press conference, and dredge up an old quote or two.

 

[Patrish]

4-4-3,

Even if the landscape results in two or three or four super conferences, there has to be some unanimity, some common cohesive structure amongst them.

I can’t see conference “A” establishing internal guardrails that would put them at a competitive disadvantage with the other conferences.

Somewhere in the future there has to be a singular authority governing all of the schools.

 

[4-4-3]

So I read the article and of course its main meaty portion, the powers that be's new push to crack down on spending! No more buying players! The NCAA of course are complete scum, and have no ethical conviction about anything other than enforcing whatever rules lead to their own self-perpetuation. Indeed an entirely rogue institution and the players are just pawns. The prey to the NCAA's predator. And it's very naked and undisguised. After all they're not paying the players. It's the schools, and the boosters. The schools heretofore had kept all the money, and I'm sure they adored that state of affairs and hate to see it go. And the boosters are shelling out for all this NIL pay for play. So it seems like a money transfer, if this pitiful attempt at a salary cap goes through, and the NCAA unleashes this badass, merciless new enforcement division that would make the IRS look like the Girl Scouts. And now the schools are going to be on the hook, and the boosters don't have to pay shit, because now NIL rules are going to be totally enforced, and the collectives will begin to wither. And all Phil Knight's billions will just have to languish. It's nice to save all that money, but what if you're a rich booster and you want to buy your alma mater a player or two?

Two things, I have no idea why the NCAA thinks they can legally prevent and punish the practice of paying athletes to play for a certain team. Pay for play provided by boosters, under the phony guise of outsized NIL deals. What's illegal about that? How is the NCAA empowered to prohibit that? The players did not sign off on this new arrangement, that totally hurts them financially. There's no CBA. The fact that former players agreeing to the terms of this 'settlement', and that way they can collect their class-action pittance, apparently is meant to be regarded as some de facto capitulation to this bullshit rev share arrangement, and all its unwieldy, outrageous terms. Thus they think or hope they can avoid a dreaded CBA, and plow forward full bore with all this heavy duty enforcement. And the NCAA is back in the position of once again willfully imposing 'amateurism' upon the players, however diluted the new definition. Which is what they're not allowed to do. And these boosters might still want to pay them and the NCAA aims to prevent it, as if they haven't learned a thing. And the old sheriff is back in town.

And 2nd, who is behind all this? The schools? The federal govt.? Or is it just the NCAA in flight or fight mode? And what about boosters, who on the one hand might be glad to have the NCAA back on the block, because they don't have to shell out anymore, because the NCAA will nail them and this time they'll be able to make it stick. Whereas currently the NCAA just sits there helplessly, in mortal terror of their own impotence, and lets the inmates run the asylum. They could enforce the rules now, they just don't because they're unenforceable and they'd be sued if they tried, and would lose. So what has changed? What about this settlement will somehow render the NCAA now able to crack down on the same violations they are currently letting run rampant, but now they won't lose in court? Because I've heard lawyers say this new arrangement is every bit as unenforceable as things stand right now. So it seems like a desperate last stand on part of the NCAA to stay alive, and it won't work. Unless the fix is in. And they are granted some special above the law status. And boosters are just going to do what they do, and they'll probably want to keep buying players. And the market will continue to decide. And the big showdown will be over the NCAA's legitimacy once and for all, if they are unable to successfully impose their will with regard to NIL, post this bullshit 'settlement'. And if they can't, then they're kaput.

It's hard to get a clear picture of how this will actually SHAKE OUT.

My guess is that the power conferences have a decent shot of SIDELINING THE NCAA as I outlined in my previous post. But then, I don't know who authorized the NCAA in the first place and what would be required to RETIRE IT.

The major unknowns is WHAT WILL THIS REVENUE SHARING SCHEME LOOK LIKE and what will be its legal structure.

But I agree with PATIRISH that someone has to TAKE THE REINS of this thing just for GOOD ORDER'S SAKE. But then, of course, there will be the MONETARY MOTIVATION as well.

In the end, it's ALWAYS about HOW THE PIE GETS DIVIDED.

 

[4-4-3]

I got an idea, let boosters take an ownership stake in the programs directly. The NCAA is dissolved, and their writ is no more, and you negotiate out a CBA, which would include some new governing body or serviceable equivalent. You start from scratch, work out all the details, which is a huge endeavor of course, but it's gotta be done sometime. And maybe the boosters don't profit from it, but they can be more directly involved in compensating players, even at a loss to them, and we can dispense with NIL, and players can sign genuine marketing deals with anyone they want, through their agent like any NFL player.

As far as ND, yeah, they said they would never participate in any sort of rev share or direct payment/employment of players. And they might just get out altogether if that's what it came to. Well, looks like they're gonna. I wonder if anyone would ever try to embarrass Fr. Jenkins, at some press conference, and dredge up an old quote or two.

I think that -- minus the boosters owning the programs -- much of what you say here is already IN THE WORKS. What's left of the AMATEUR ELEMENT of CFB looks like it's DEFINITELY DISAPPEARING.

And yes, that question remains as to HOW FINE A LINE WILL ND NEED TO WALK if it "plays ball" with WHATEVER COMES NEXT.

 

[4-4-3]

4-4-3,

Even if the landscape results in two or three or four super conferences, there has to be some unanimity, some common cohesive structure amongst them.

I can’t see conference “A” establishing internal guardrails that would put them at a competitive disadvantage with the other conferences.

Somewhere in the future there has to be a singular authority governing all of the schools.

I would agree . . . with the exception that the TOP 20 to 40 schools COULD BREAK AWAY AND FORM A LEAGUE composed of anywhere from 2 to 4 conferences and leave the rest of CFB to ITS OWN DEVICES.

It would be a kind of COLLEGIATE COUNTERPART to the NFL, with the NFL as a kind of PREMIER LEAGUE in the sport and this new CFB League as the next step down.

So, while I agree with you that there has to be a COHESIVE STRUCTURE, I'm not sure that it needs to be UNIVERSAL as respects all of CFB.

 

[sjb75]

So I read the article and of course its main meaty portion, the powers that be's new push to crack down on spending! No more buying players! The NCAA of course are complete scum, and have no ethical conviction about anything other than enforcing whatever rules lead to their own self-perpetuation. Indeed an entirely rogue institution and the players are just pawns. The prey to the NCAA's predator. And it's very naked and undisguised. After all they're not paying the players. It's the schools, and the boosters. The schools heretofore had kept all the money, and I'm sure they adored that state of affairs and hate to see it go. And the boosters are shelling out for all this NIL pay for play. So it seems like a money transfer, if this pitiful attempt at a salary cap goes through, and the NCAA unleashes this badass, merciless new enforcement division that would make the IRS look like the Girl Scouts. And now the schools are going to be on the hook, and the boosters don't have to pay shit, because now NIL rules are going to be totally enforced, and the collectives will begin to wither. And all Phil Knight's billions will just have to languish. It's nice to save all that money, but what if you're a rich booster and you want to buy your alma mater a player or two?

Two things, I have no idea why the NCAA thinks they can legally prevent and punish the practice of paying athletes to play for a certain team. Pay for play provided by boosters, under the phony guise of outsized NIL deals. What's illegal about that? How is the NCAA empowered to prohibit that? The players did not sign off on this new arrangement, that totally hurts them financially. There's no CBA. The fact that former players agreeing to the terms of this 'settlement', and that way they can collect their class-action pittance, apparently is meant to be regarded as some de facto capitulation to this bullshit rev share arrangement, and all its unwieldy, outrageous terms. Thus they think or hope they can avoid a dreaded CBA, and plow forward full bore with all this heavy duty enforcement. And the NCAA is back in the position of once again willfully imposing 'amateurism' upon the players, however diluted the new definition. Which is what they're not allowed to do. And these boosters might still want to pay them and the NCAA aims to prevent it, as if they haven't learned a thing. And the old sheriff is back in town.

And 2nd, who is behind all this? The schools? The federal govt.? Or is it just the NCAA in flight or fight mode? And what about boosters, who on the one hand might be glad to have the NCAA back on the block, because they don't have to shell out anymore, because the NCAA will nail them and this time they'll be able to make it stick. Whereas currently the NCAA just sits there helplessly, in mortal terror of their own impotence, and lets the inmates run the asylum. They could enforce the rules now, they just don't because they're unenforceable and they'd be sued if they tried, and would lose. So what has changed? What about this settlement will somehow render the NCAA now able to crack down on the same violations they are currently letting run rampant, but now they won't lose in court? Because I've heard lawyers say this new arrangement is every bit as unenforceable as things stand right now. So it seems like a desperate last stand on part of the NCAA to stay alive, and it won't work. Unless the fix is in. And they are granted some special above the law status. And boosters are just going to do what they do, and they'll probably want to keep buying players. And the market will continue to decide. And the big showdown will be over the NCAA's legitimacy once and for all, if they are unable to successfully impose their will with regard to NIL, post this bullshit 'settlement'. And if they can't, then they're kaput.

Who would read this???

 

[Patrish]

I would agree . . . with the exception that the TOP 20 to 40 schools COULD BREAK AWAY AND FORM A LEAGUE composed of anywhere from 2 to 4 conferences and leave the rest of CFB to ITS OWN DEVICES.

It would be a kind of COLLEGIATE COUNTERPART to the NFL, with the NFL as a kind of PREMIER LEAGUE in the sport and this new CFB League as the next step down.

So, while I agree with you that there has to be a COHESIVE STRUCTURE, I'm not sure that it needs to be UNIVERSAL as respects all of CFB.

Even if 20-40 schools splintered away, would they allow the other 90 or !00 schools to establish guidelines that give them a competitive advantage ?

With inter-conference play, one conference isn’t going to allow another conference to enjoy a competitive advantage.

Hence conferences would begin to engage in a weapons race which can’t be good for the game.

 

[4-4-3]

Even if 20-40 schools splintered away, would they allow the other 90 or !00 schools to establish guidelines that give them a competitive advantage ?

With inter-conference play, one conference isn’t going to allow another conference to enjoy a competitive advantage.

Hence conferences would begin to engage in a weapons race which can’t be good for the game.

IF THE TOP TEAMS BROKE AWAY, I'm not sure what that would mean for the NCAA EXISTENTIALLY as respects CFB. In other words, they mightn't be in a poistion to give ANYONE ANYTHING.

If you're also saying that the other teams, whether under NCAA leadership or not, could try to OUTMANEUVER the premier teams by providing better deals for players, maybe that would be theoretically possible for some of the BETTER-HEELED ONES that didn't make the "PREMIER LEAGUE" cut, but in that case, I would expect the premier teams to simply match them TIT FOR TAT or GO THEM ONE BETTER as they would be the ones COMMANDING THE GREATER RESOURCES.

Or they could simply INCORPORATE any serious competitors just as the NFL absorbed first the AAFC and later the AFL.

Whatever RULES BASED REGIME EMERGES -- and LIKE YOU, I can't see any alternative -- I can't imagine how it won't be on a FOLLOW THE MONEY basis.

 

[ivan brunetti]

That’s not the question I asked
And on what basis do you speak for all of the schools?
So I’ll ask you
Do you believe or agree that college football needs structure in the form of a governing body ?

College football is the entity that gets to decide. Not me, and not you. The members of the NCAA do NOT want a top down structure like we see in the NFL. That is clear.

I think it needs a governing body; but that is like me expressing an opinion on what a foreign country needs. It isn't up to me.

 

[Patrish]

College football is the entity that gets to decide. Not me, and not you. The members of the NCAA do NOT want a top down structure like we see in the NFL. That is clear.

I think it needs a governing body; but that is like me expressing an opinion on what a foreign country needs. It isn't up to me.

I asked your opinion

Why are you afraid to express it?

 

[Patrish]

IF THE TOP TEAMS BROKE AWAY, I'm not sure what that would mean for the NCAA EXISTENTIALLY as respects CFB. In other words, they mightn't be in a poistion to give ANYONE ANYTHING.

If you're also saying that the other teams, whether under NCAA leadership or not, could try to OUTMANEUVER the premier teams by providing better deals for players, maybe that would be theoretically possible for some of the BETTER-HEELED ONES that didn't make the "PREMIER LEAGUE" cut, but in that case, I would expect the premier teams to simply match them TIT FOR TAT or GO THEM ONE BETTER as they would be the ones COMMANDING THE GREATER RESOURCES.

Or they could simply INCORPORATE any serious competitors just as the NFL absorbed first the AAFC and later the AFL.

Whatever RULES BASED REGIME EMERGES -- and LIKE YOU, I can't see any alternative -- I can't imagine how it won't be on a FOLLOW THE MONEY basis.

Sad but true !

Is money the root of all evil in college athletics and especially football ?

 

[ivan brunetti]

I asked your opinion

Why are you afraid to express it?

I am not afraid, dummy. I stated that I think they need some sort of oversight structure.

But such a structure will not be able to overturn the rulings of America's courts. Unless the courts reverse course, paying players and the freedom to transfer, is here to stay.

 

[savvyandsassier]

I am not afraid, dummy. I stated that I think they need some sort of oversight structure.

But such a structure will not be able to overturn the rulings of America's courts. Unless the courts reverse course, paying players and the freedom to transfer, is here to stay.

You're a coward.... You're a coward!

Why are you afraid to expression your opinion?

WHY ARE YOU AFRAID TO EXPRESS YOUR OPINION???

 

[Patrish]

Nick Saban said it’s like the NFL, with no contracts and total free agency, that it’s devolving into total chaos

So who takes the next step toward establishing a ruling authority?

 

[4-4-3]

Sad but true !

Is money the root of all evil in college athletics and especially football ?

To me, money seems, INCREASINGLY, to be the root of EVERYTHING.

And yet our ENTIRE MONETARY SYSTEM is based on PROMISES TO PAY that if CALLED ON DEMAND, couldn't be satisfied.

What I think we've lost sight of is VALUE.

Would I have CHOSEN this given a magic wand? NOT LIKELY.

But as for CFB, if the product on the field remains the same -- and it could and, POSSIBLY, even improve -- I'll continue to LOOK THE OTHER WAY as I do with MOST EVERYTHING ELSE.

What's driving my interest in this PARTICULAR SUBJECT is my CURIOSITY as to where it will end.

 

[ivan brunetti]

You're a coward.... You're a coward!

Why are you afraid to expression your opinion?

WHY ARE YOU AFRAID TO EXPRESS YOUR OPINION???

You are an idiot. You are an idiot.