I dont know if anybody else notices but iin college football you can literally buy national titles right now lol

[chaseball]

The biggest NIL spender (or at least one of them) just won a national title. Several of the top teams that finished in the top 5 in F+ are some of the biggest NIL spenders in the nation. College football coaching salaries are exploding all the way down the coaching food chain including scouts and other front office personnel.

This kind of reminds me of how the recruiting ranking national champion would always end up being the FBS national champion. Now its the football operations budget national champion ---> NIL budget national champion ---> Recruiting & transfer portal ranking national champion ---> 85 man roster national champion -----> F+ (or production) national champion ------> until ultimately the NCAA FBS national champion.

What is the common denominator amongst all of those components ? MONEY. BIG F**** MONEY

One question for ND: Are they going to start swinging around their big D money bag and showing some appreciation for what football has meant to the modern success of the university of Notre Dame? Essentially is ND going to s*** or get off the pot?

 

[Irish_inPSU]

You're not wrong. I suspect ND will continue to try to do things "the right way" and only dip into the NIL to retain a guy or acquire a missing piece needed. I would be shocked if they went "osu or oregon all in" to buy a roster. But I also won't be suprised if they ultimately cave to some degree in order to remain relevant and competitive.

I think we will eventually see the NCAA step in and try to reign in NIL a bit. Its out of control and its eroding CFB in particular badly. Pay players? Thats fine, but right now its the wild west with zero checks and balances. They have to make this a contractually obligated situation where a kid might transfer, but they sign a contract with that school to stay there either until they graduate or they go to the nfl. Anything...

 

[BGI User 756]

The biggest NIL spender (or at least one of them) just won a national title. College football coaching salaries are exploding all the way down the coaching food chain including scouts and other front office personnel.

This kind of reminds me of how the recruiting ranking national champion would always end up being the FBS national champion. Now its the football operations budget national champion ---> NIL budget national champion ---> Recruiting & transfer portal ranking national champion ---> 85 man roster national champion -----> F+ (or production) national champion ------> until ultimately the NCAA FBS national champion.

What is the common denominator amongst all of those components ? MONEY. BIG F**** MONEY

One question for ND: Are they going to start swinging around their big D money bag and showing some appreciation for what football has meant to the modern success of the university of Notre Dame? Essentially is ND going to s*** or get off the pot?

Lol, not a good post after the season ND just had. You recall last season? You were predicting the Irish weren’t making the playoffs, then they weren’t beating UGA.. etc

But but but ….how about OSU not retaining 4 of their coaches because they were outbid!!! I guess that $40M deficit had consequences

And hey, how about hiring that RB coach? Missed your post on that one

 

[savvyandsassier]

tOSU did not buy a roster. They brought in a relatively small number of players. They did pay top dollar, presumably, to bring in a select few elite guys. But they didn't spend 20 million on portal guys, it was mainly on retaining their own roster, including dissuading NFL guys from leaving early. And they mainly just paid their already existing roster.

Who knows how much ND pays their own players, but they did pay competitive money to get RL, and I would imagine all the various transfers got the market rate, and that that is also true for players already on the roster. We have a lot of guys who could make a lot of money on the open market and yet they don't leave. So I would assume it's because ND is taking care of them.

 

[4-4-3]

tOSU did not buy a roster. They brought in a relatively small number of players. They did pay top dollar, presumably, to bring in a select few elite guys. But they didn't spend 20 million on portal guys, it was mainly on retaining their own roster, including dissuading NFL guys from leaving early. And they mainly just paid their already existing roster.

Who knows how much ND pays their own players, but they did pay competitive money to get RL, and I would imagine all the various transfers got the market rate, and that that is also true for players already on the roster. We have a lot of guys who could make a lot of money on the open market and yet they don't leave. So I would assume it's because ND is taking care of them.

For what they're worth, three links:

How Much Are Players Getting Paid

The Plan to Pay College Athletes

Keeping Players Out of the Transfer Portal

Everywhere you look -- RECRUITING, ACQUISITION AND RETENTION -- money is INCREASINGLY involved.

This all either gets capped or otherwise regulated at some point, or ONLY THE RICHEST -- WHO ARE ALSO WILLING TO SHELL OUT LIKE SOTHEBY'S ART COLLECTORS -- will be left to DUKE IT OUT.

The only other POSSIBLE SOLUTION -- AND I'M BY NO MEANS STUMPING FOR IT EVEN THOUGH I OWN SHORTS ON THE ENTIRE FINANCIAL SYSTEM -- would be a sustained DEFLATIONARY DEPRESSION with a 2008 level market crash of around 75%.

But then, AS WE KNOW, short of A CAP AND/OR OTHER FORMS OF REGULATION, it would simply ALL START UP AGAIN.

MONEY CAN CRAZE THE MIND.

 

[chaseball]

For what they're worth, three links:

How Much Are Players Getting Paid

The Plan to Pay College Athletes

Keeping Players Out of the Transfer Portal

Everywhere you look -- RECRUITING, ACQUISITION AND RETENTION -- money is INCREASINGLY involved.

This all either gets capped or otherwise regulated at some point, or ONLY THE RICHEST -- WHO ARE ALSO WILLING TO SHELL OUT LIKE SOTHEBY'S ART COLLECTORS -- will be left to DUKE IT OUT.

The only other POSSIBLE SOLUTION -- AND I'M BY NO MEANS STUMPING FOR IT EVEN THOUGH I OWN SHORTS ON THE ENTIRE FINANCIAL SYSTEM -- would be a sustained DEFLATIONARY DEPRESSION with a 2008 level market crash of around 75%.

But then, AS WE KNOW, short of A CAP AND/OR OTHER FORMS OF REGULATION, it would simply ALL START UP AGAIN.

MONEY CAN CRAZE THE MIND.

Money has always played a huge role in college football, now as more money is coming in that role is only increasing. We never regulated wealthy programs for dominating all of the best talent, and thus national titles in the past, I dont see why we have to start now with NIL.

If some 18 year old consensus #1 prospect makes $20M out of HS guaranteed in signing bonuses/NIL deals....then that's progress. If some wealthy billionaire wants to set the market for a 5 star at $30M out of HS guaranteed then so be it. Ultimately its the athletes benefiting.

 

[ticat]

Money has always played a huge role in college football, now as more money is coming in that role is only increasing. We never regulated wealthy programs for dominating all of the best talent, and thus national titles in the past, I dont see why we have to start now with NIL.

If some 18 year old consensus #1 prospect makes $20M out of HS guaranteed in signing bonuses/NIL deals....then that's progress. If some wealthy billionaire wants to set the market for a 5 star at $30M out of HS guaranteed then so be it. Ultimately its the athletes benefiting....

....and the sport (COLLEGE football) being the poorer for it...but you will never understand that

 

[chaseball]

The market for a 5-star right now is about $1-$12M per, will be interesting to see how much that number goes up through the next 5 years and how many great 5-star prospects ND could have bought at a much cheaper price just 5 years ago when the topic comes up in 2030. There's a massive urgency to act now because revenues are still way outpacing the cost for talent, which means market forces are only going to drive the cost for talent UP and with it any competitive advantage that could be had from investing early

 

[chaseball]

....and the sport (COLLEGE football) being the poorer for it...but you will never understand that

Why is the sport only good when institutions are hoarding all the wealth from it? Why isn't it good when both institutions and players are sharing in the wealth?

 

[ohio1980]

tOSU did not buy a roster. They brought in a relatively small number of players. They did pay top dollar, presumably, to bring in a select few elite guys. But they didn't spend 20 million on portal guys, it was mainly on retaining their own roster, including dissuading NFL guys from leaving early. And they mainly just paid their already existing roster.

Who knows how much ND pays their own players, but they did pay competitive money to get RL, and I would imagine all the various transfers got the market rate, and that that is also true for players already on the roster. We have a lot of guys who could make a lot of money on the open market and yet they don't leave. So I would assume it's because ND is taking care of them.

Finally someone who knows what they are talking about. OSU releases this kind of information to the public, why does ND not do this?
Why do they not release information so ND fans can get educated and not keep claiming "they do things the right way".

 

[savvyandsassier]

Finally someone who knows what they are talking about. OSU releases this kind of information to the public, why does ND not do this?
Why do they not release information so ND fans can get educated and not keep claiming "they do things the right way".

You still could say tOSU bought their roster, even though they recruited most of them out of HS. I have no problem with it at all, so it doesn't bother me. If anything tOSU did it right, and it was very effective. Quality not quantity. They got old boy from Ole Miss, who's a kick ass RB. They got Downs from Bama. Will Howard was good, but seems like not really any better than Kyle McCord. But whatever, it worked. And they wasted money on Julian Sayin.

Bottom line, HS recruiting is still king, nor to the untrained eye would NIL seem like it made any difference in that respect because it's still the exact same powerhouse programs dominating recruiting. And if you get too trapped in a portal cycle, it could totally screw up your depth chart, in random, unexpected ways, and you end up like FSU.

 

[Patrish]

The biggest NIL spender (or at least one of them) just won a national title. College football coaching salaries are exploding all the way down the coaching food chain including scouts and other front office personnel.

This kind of reminds me of how the recruiting ranking national champion would always end up being the FBS national champion. Now its the football operations budget national champion ---> NIL budget national champion ---> Recruiting & transfer portal ranking national champion ---> 85 man roster national champion -----> F+ (or production) national champion ------> until ultimately the NCAA FBS national champion.

What is the common denominator amongst all of those components ? MONEY. BIG F**** MONEY

One question for ND: Are they going to start swinging around their big D money bag and showing some appreciation for what football has meant to the modern success of the university of Notre Dame? Essentially is ND going to s*** or get off the pot?

WHY would ND need to do anything more than they’re already doing.

They played for the national championship.

Throwing money at issues doesn’t always solve the issue.

 

[Patrish]

You're not wrong. I suspect ND will continue to try to do things "the right way" and only dip into the NIL to retain a guy or acquire a missing piece needed. I would be shocked if they went "osu or oregon all in" to buy a roster. But I also won't be suprised if they ultimately cave to some degree in order to remain relevant and competitive.

I think we will eventually see the NCAA step in and try to reign in NIL a bit. Its out of control and its eroding CFB in particular badly. Pay players? Thats fine, but right now its the wild west with zero checks and balances. They have to make this a contractually obligated situation where a kid might transfer, but they sign a contract with that school to stay there either until they graduate or they go to the nfl. Anything...

I don’t think that there’s anything that can be done about NIL since it was the Supreme Court that ruled on it, and you’re not going to override the Supreme Court

 

[sjb75]

Finally someone who knows what they are talking about. OSU releases this kind of information to the public, why does ND not do this?
Why do they not release information so ND fans can get educated and not keep claiming "they do things the right way".

“We ain’t come here to play school.”

 

[Patrish]

Money has always played a huge role in college football, now as more money is coming in that role is only increasing. We never regulated wealthy programs for dominating all of the best talent, and thus national titles in the past, I dont see why we have to start now with NIL.

If some 18 year old consensus #1 prospect makes $20M out of HS guaranteed in signing bonuses/NIL deals....then that's progress. If some wealthy billionaire wants to set the market for a 5 star at $30M out of HS guaranteed then so be it. Ultimately its the athletes benefiting.

And what happens when these billionaires poor money into these athletes and they don’t win the national championship.

Sooner or later, it gets old and the money dries up

 

[Patrish]

Finally someone who knows what they are talking about. OSU releases this kind of information to the public, why does ND not do this?
Why do they not release information so ND fans can get educated and not keep claiming "they do things the right way".

Because Ohio State is a public school and must release the information whereas Notre Dame is a private school and does not have to release the information for the same reason

However, contrary to your uninformed opinion, Notre Dame does file the information and it can be found on the IRS form 990 that Notre Dame is required to file

 

[4-4-3]

Money has always played a huge role in college football, now as more money is coming in that role is only increasing. We never regulated wealthy programs for dominating all of the best talent, and thus national titles in the past, I dont see why we have to start now with NIL.

If some 18 year old consensus #1 prospect makes $20M out of HS guaranteed in signing bonuses/NIL deals....then that's progress. If some wealthy billionaire wants to set the market for a 5 star at $30M out of HS guaranteed then so be it. Ultimately its the athletes benefiting.

YOU WROTE, "I dont see why we have to start now with NIL."

I'LL TELL YOU WHY.

Because BIG MONEY EATS SMALL MONEY. And what you're left with is a SMALLER FIELD.

Me, I don't GIVE A HOOT, just as I wouldn't wish to see 130 NFL teams trying to figure out WHO'S NUMBER ONE.

But those who love CFB THE WAY IT IS -- and even if only NOMINALLY -- still want the whole EXTRAVAGANZA. They want RIVALRIES, REGIONAL SHOWDOWNS, THE BETTER BOWL GAMES, FEWER TRANSFERS, LESS MONETIZATION -- whatever.

And that's FINE WITH ME AS WELL.

But IT DOES SEEM TO ME that if you let things run as they're CURRENTLY RUNNING, you will eventually run into so much MOVEMENT and COMPLEXITY, the whole thing will SELF-CANNIBALIZE.

HEY, LET IT HAPPEN OR NOT. But there's no NON-RULES BASED, LIBERTARIAN, PURE-MARKET-CAPITALISM answer to this.

That's just PRINCIPLE OVER PRAXIS.

 

[4-4-3]

Finally someone who knows what they are talking about. OSU releases this kind of information to the public, why does ND not do this?
Why do they not release information so ND fans can get educated and not keep claiming "they do things the right way".

Several possible answers COME TO MIND, none of which I have any proof of -- NOR AM I STUMPING FOR.

1. ND thinks that keeping the public in the dark on this issue is somehow "doing it the right way."
2. It doesn't want the public to know HOW MUCH money it's paying players as it wouldn't look like "doing it the right way."
3. It doesn't want other teams knowing HOW LITTLE money it's paying players, lest those other teams consider ND's players extremely ripe for plucking.
4. As a private university, it has the right to tell people to MIND THEIR OWN BUSINESS, regardless of whether what it's doing represents "the right way" or not.

Anyone interested in picking a number? I'm not a BETTOR, just running the CONCESSION.

 

[BGI User 756]

Finally someone who knows what they are talking about. OSU releases this kind of information to the public, why does ND not do this?
Why do they not release information so ND fans can get educated and not keep claiming "they do things the right way".

The irony of you acting like you know. That info can be found

 

[4-4-3]

Because Ohio State is a public school and must release the information whereas Notre Dame is a private school and does not have to release the information for the same reason

However, contrary to your uninformed opinion, Notre Dame does file the information and it can be found on the IRS form 990 that Notre Dame is required to file

And is that information ACCESIBLE TO ANYONE?

That would be a HELLUVA NUMBER to know.

Perhaps a kind of Rosetta Stone.

 

[ticat]

Why is the sport only good when institutions are hoarding all the wealth from it? Why isn't it good when both institutions and players are sharing in the wealth?

Hoarding the wealth? At Notre Dame, much of the "wealth" goes back into the athletics department (those flights that the basketball and soccer teams have to take to play Stanford and Cal aren't free, you know)...there are bills to pay for the price of ACC membership.

And though you are reminded time and again, this is not a PROFESSIONAL sports franchise. Nor are the athletic teams subsidiaries of the head office...I agree that college athletes should get some additional $$$ from NIL, but to be paid for play makes this a professional sport...and the University of Notre Dame will never be a professional sports franchise...

 

[savvyandsassier]

Several possible answers COME TO MIND, none of which I have any proof of -- NOR AM I STUMPING FOR.

1. ND thinks that keeping the public in the dark on this issue is somehow "doing it the right way."
2. It doesn't want the public to know HOW MUCH money it's paying players as it wouldn't look like "doing it the right way."
3. It doesn't want other teams knowing HOW LITTLE money it's paying players, lest those other teams consider ND's players extremely ripe for plucking.
4. As a private university, it has the right to tell people to MIND THEIR OWN BUSINESS, regardless of whether what it's doing represents "the right way" or not.

Anyone interested in picking a number? I'm not a BETTOR, just running the CONCESSION.

That's what ND dreads. Ever having to open up the books.

 

[chaseball]

That's what ND dreads. Ever having to open up the books.

Yup. This is what institutions have dreaded ALL ALONG.

Now they can't get by with propaganda talking about how they are doing everything they can to win a national title. They are now going to have to open up the purse in a massive way in order to compete and keep the program competitive at the highest level. And they have no choice because the money is so big and the money is the lifeblood of the entire organization.

Basically the cost for wins on saturdays is skyrocketing now that the athlete are legally allowed to be compensated. And all of the universities whose cultures are steeped deep in the old way of doing things are going to be the most resistant to change, and ultimately the most resistant to winning national titles in the process (ahem, ND).

 

[stu4don]

And look we made it to the natty -- brilliant CMF 'recurited' Cross-Mills-Watts (all of whom could have been drafted last year) and don't think they didn't get paid. Now we just Stole Penn State's RB coach and now the Messiah is coming to the holy land for a visit. Looks like we may be getting two highly paid guys to do the GM job. ND did open our wallets (and damn was that a good decision) for the best young coach in all of football.'

Remember Chase, ND will always require their kids to attend classes -- and that counts out about 2/3rd of all 5* players who really want to be semi pro... Not sure if that is ever going to change. We'll have to find another way to compete.

We were one damn pass play from going all the way this year. Against the best roster in a long long time.

 

[4-4-3]

Yup. This is what institutions have dreaded ALL ALONG.

Now they can't get by with propaganda talking about how they are doing everything they can to win a national title. They are now going to have to open up the purse in a massive way in order to compete and keep the program competitive at the highest level. And they have no choice because the money is so big and the money is the lifeblood of the entire organization.

Basically the cost for wins on saturdays is skyrocketing now that the athlete are legally allowed to be compensated. And all of the universities whose cultures are steeped deep in the old way of doing things are going to be the most resistant to change, and ultimately the most resistant to winning national titles in the process (ahem, ND).

I'm not going to TAKE ND TO TASK over this as I don't have either the DESIRE or the STANDING to do that. There's also no REASON to do it. AT LEAST NOT IN MY VIEW.

But I do think much of what you say is CORRECT. And it leaves ND clearly in the CROSSHAIRS.

On the one hand, if teams fail to reach consensus on a REGULATORY REGIME, ND will have to compete in a NO-AMOUNTS-BARRED auction for PREMIUM PLAYERS. HOW WILL IT DO THAT, ASSUMING IT EVEN WANTS TO?

On the other hand, if REGULATION COMES and the terms as per the players are generous -- or, worse, excessive -- ND will have to lay out WHATEVER SUMS ARE REQUIRED to run with the KINGS OF THE SPORT. In which case, how will ND -- given its EDUCATIONAL MISSION -- feel about doing THAT?

Even so, ND, as I see it, could STILL HAVE AN ESCAPE ROUTE -- one that would OBVIOUSLY WORK BETTER -- in a regulated environment. And that would be to CONTINUE TO TAKE PLAYERS -- AND ONLY THOSE PLAYERS -- WHO CAN MAKE IT AS STUDENTS. Whether or not it goes PAY FOR PLAY, ND could STILL SEEK TO EDUCATE.

And yet, would that still be A BRIDGE TOO FAR? OR perhaps merely one TOO SHORT?

ONE THING IS CERTAIN (I think). THIS SHOULD ALL BE RESOLVED PRETTY QUICKLY.

And till then, IT'S JUST FOOTBALL.

 

[chaseball]

tOSU did not buy a roster. They brought in a relatively small number of players. They did pay top dollar, presumably, to bring in a select few elite guys. But they didn't spend 20 million on portal guys, it was mainly on retaining their own roster, including dissuading NFL guys from leaving early. And they mainly just paid their already existing roster.

Who knows how much ND pays their own players, but they did pay competitive money to get RL, and I would imagine all the various transfers got the market rate, and that that is also true for players already on the roster. We have a lot of guys who could make a lot of money on the open market and yet they don't leave. So I would assume it's because ND is taking care of them.

I'm positive you are overlooking how much money they (Ohio State) have invested in NIL on the recruiting trail (not just this season but over the last several). They have a collection of high 4 star and 5 star talent in quantities that rank among the best in the nation (and a top ranked composite team talent ranking overall). This team's recruiting/talent is firmly in the tier 1. I'd be shocked if their NIL HS signing bonus budget wasn't among the top in the nation as well.

I think it's hurting NDs recruiting in that Notre Dame has a reputation for not capitulating to top prospects, and thus top prospects just kind of tune ND out from the get go during the recruiting cycle.

Why would these top prospects bother with Notre Dame when they know they wont get anywhere NIL-wise, and all of NDs competitors are willing to discuss millions of dollars upon signing?

 

[chaseball]

YOU WROTE, "I dont see why we have to start now with NIL."

I'LL TELL YOU WHY.

Because BIG MONEY EATS SMALL MONEY. And what you're left with is a SMALLER FIELD.

Me, I don't GIVE A HOOT, just as I wouldn't wish to see 130 NFL teams trying to figure out WHO'S NUMBER ONE.

But those who love CFB THE WAY IT IS -- and even if only NOMINALLY -- still want the whole EXTRAVAGANZA. They want RIVALRIES, REGIONAL SHOWDOWNS, THE BETTER BOWL GAMES, FEWER TRANSFERS, LESS MONETIZATION -- whatever.

And that's FINE WITH ME AS WELL.

But IT DOES SEEM TO ME that if you let things run as they're CURRENTLY RUNNING, you will eventually run into so much MOVEMENT and COMPLEXITY, the whole thing will SELF-CANNIBALIZE.

HEY, LET IT HAPPEN OR NOT. But there's no NON-RULES BASED, LIBERTARIAN, PURE-MARKET-CAPITALISM answer to this.

That's just PRINCIPLE OVER PRAXIS.

I feel in yur posts your arguments are usually pretty sound, but then you'll make a claim that isn't being held to the same level of standard that your other points are being held to in terms of their evidence and logic.

The bolded for example.

I feel like when institutions were the ones getting nearly 100% of the pie, we didn't mind leaving it up to the free market to decide and letting the chips fall where they may. And now the game is bigger/better/and more successful than ever.

But now that huge sums of money is going to the talent/players/ prospects, there's a whole lot of pearl clutching going on and people worried about regulations needed in order to keep things fair and balanced. Salary caps and such so that the fair market value for talent is artificially capped

Where were the cries for regulation when the top 8 blue bloods were dominating college football for the last 100+ years by monopolizing most of the resources?

Why are people playing market/wealth police, fear mongering over the health of the sport, now that the athletes are getting wealthy as well?

 

[Patrish]

And is that information ACCESIBLE TO ANYONE?

That would be a HELLUVA NUMBER to know.

Perhaps a kind of Rosetta Stone.

Keep in mind that the universities don’t directly fund NIL

 

[Patrish]

That's what ND dreads. Ever having to open up the books.

Once again, you’re totally uninformed

The books are open …… every year when Notre Dame files IRS form 990

 

[savvyandsassier]

Once again, you’re totally uninformed

The books are open …… every year when Notre Dame files IRS form 990

Oh well there you go! ND is happy to share it with the world. All I ever hear from fans grumbling is that ND doesn't ever reveal any information unless they absolutely have to about anything. It's their roots in the Catholic Church, they want everything to be secretive. But in this case they have to because it's the law! Man's law, if not god's law, which is the one they typically would rather defer to. In fact I think I recall an article which included claims at least, about how ND spent based on publicly available information and it was a pittance compared to what tOSU spent, as far as NIL outlays. And I guess that's where they got it, from the taxes.

Doesn't mean they don't hate to do it, indeed they do dread it, but the arm of justice has forced their hand. Maybe they lied, maybe they committed tax fraud. Not because they want to cheat the govt., but they just don't want the world to know how much they spend. Because they believe in amateurism so much, and so deeply honor and validate the ideal of the 'student-athlete'. And so they underreport. It would be a futile gestures, but, old habits die hard.

 

[savvyandsassier]

I'm positive you are overlooking how much money they (Ohio State) have invested in NIL on the recruiting trail (not just this season but over the last several). They have a collection of high 4 star and 5 star talent in quantities that rank among the best in the nation (and a top ranked composite team talent ranking overall). This team's recruiting/talent is firmly in the tier 1. I'd be shocked if their NIL HS signing bonus budget wasn't among the top in the nation as well.

I think it's hurting NDs recruiting in that Notre Dame has a reputation for not capitulating to top prospects, and thus top prospects just kind of tune ND out from the get go during the recruiting cycle.

Why would these top prospects bother with Notre Dame when they know they wont get anywhere NIL-wise, and all of NDs competitors are willing to discuss millions of dollars upon signing?

I don't know, they spent 20 million dollars, that was the big, scandalous headline, most of it on player retention, meaning keeping players they had previously recruited out of HS. Am I missing something?

 

[Patrish]

Oh well there you go! ND is happy to share it with the world. All I ever hear from fans grumbling is that ND doesn't ever reveal any information unless they absolutely have to about anything. It's their roots in the Catholic Church, they want everything to be secretive. But in this case they have to because it's the law! Man's law, if not god's law, which is the one they typically would rather defer to. In fact I think I recall an article which included claims at least, about how ND spent based on publicly available information and it was a pittance compared to what tOSU spent, as far as NIL outlays. And I guess that's where they got it, from the taxes.

Doesn't mean they don't hate to do it, indeed they do dread it, but the arm of justice has forced their hand. Maybe they lied, maybe they committed tax fraud. Not because they want to cheat the govt., but they just don't want the world to know how much they spend. Because they believe in amateurism so much, and so deeply honor and validate the ideal of the 'student-athlete'. And so they underreport. It would be a futile gestures, but, old habits die hard.

You’re full of shit with your accusations and you’re a total douche bag for making those accusations !

Neither university can directly fund NIL contracts

 

[Patrish]

I don't know, they spent 20 million dollars, that was the big, scandalous headline, most of it on player retention, meaning keeping players they had previously recruited out of HS. Am I missing something?

A brain !

 

[savvyandsassier]

You’re full of shit with your accusations and you’re a total douche bag for making those accusations !

Neither university can directly fund NIL contracts

Oh shit, I suppose I meant the collective, they had to file, and that's the information that was available and reported on. And so I am right, and you of course are just a fascinating troll, who just wants to keep the back and forth going, and you kind of tripped yourself up there. But maybe not, as long as I'm replying to you you're getting what you crave. But what I meant was you made another one of your gallant declarative sentences that ND is not afraid to reveal their innermost financial secrets, when you were referring to the collective, and now you're doubling back or something. I think so anyway, I'm kind of getting confused here.

In any case it would be the collective that committed tax fraud, and not ND itself, if there was any underreporting. But maybe ND asked them to, or compelled them to, threatened them with eternal damnation perhaps, so as to help preserve their pristine reputation. But I don't know if that works anymore.

 

[savvyandsassier]

For what they're worth, three links:

How Much Are Players Getting Paid

The Plan to Pay College Athletes

Keeping Players Out of the Transfer Portal

Everywhere you look -- RECRUITING, ACQUISITION AND RETENTION -- money is INCREASINGLY involved.

This all either gets capped or otherwise regulated at some point, or ONLY THE RICHEST -- WHO ARE ALSO WILLING TO SHELL OUT LIKE SOTHEBY'S ART COLLECTORS -- will be left to DUKE IT OUT.

The only other POSSIBLE SOLUTION -- AND I'M BY NO MEANS STUMPING FOR IT EVEN THOUGH I OWN SHORTS ON THE ENTIRE FINANCIAL SYSTEM -- would be a sustained DEFLATIONARY DEPRESSION with a 2008 level market crash of around 75%.

But then, AS WE KNOW, short of A CAP AND/OR OTHER FORMS OF REGULATION, it would simply ALL START UP AGAIN.

MONEY CAN CRAZE THE MIND.

And just want to add, thanks for those links, especially that last one with all the insider interviews and whatnot. That was great. Pretty much what would you expect, but very cool to hear it from the horses mouth. The one thing that maybe surprised me a bit was it seemed like, that players were willing to stay with their team for less money, even quite a bit less money. But I guess it's kind of scary to leave something safe and secure.

 

[rrdd2021]

I don't know, they spent 20 million dollars, that was the big, scandalous headline, most of it on player retention, meaning keeping players they had previously recruited out of HS. Am I missing something?

Yeah, I just don't see the big deal......95% of their players were kids they recruited out of HS and developed. Not a thing wrong - or shady - in what they did.

 

[savvyandsassier]

Yeah, I just don't see the big deal......95% of their players were kids they recruited out of HS and developed. Not a thing wrong - or shady - in what they did.

It is still fair to say they bought the team. But so did the Yankees, right? I don't know if you're a European soccer fan, but every single team pretty much in the history of the modern game, over the last thirty years, bought their championships. If you think NIL and the CFB transfer portal is bad, and tOSU buys their team, be a La Liga fan, and watch Real Madrid overhaul their roster every season buying up all the top players available, and dominate every season. That's the pro sport CFB should probably be emulating. As far as converting to full professionalization. Very stark resemblance to major CFB in terms of perennial haves and have nots.

 

[Patrish]

Oh shit, I suppose I meant the collective, they had to file, and that's the information that was available and reported on. And so I am right, and you of course are just a fascinating troll, who just wants to keep the back and forth going, and you kind of tripped yourself up there. But maybe not, as long as I'm replying to you you're getting what you crave. But what I meant was you made another one of your gallant declarative sentences that ND is not afraid to reveal their innermost financial secrets, when you were referring to the collective, and now you're doubling back or something. I think so anyway, I'm kind of getting confused here.

In any case it would be the collective that committed tax fraud, and not ND itself, if there was any underreporting. But maybe ND asked them to, or compelled them to, threatened them with eternal damnation perhaps, so as to help preserve their pristine reputation. But I don't know if that works anymore.

You’re not just replying to me, you’re trying to make excuses for your reckless ,irresponsible, ignorant and accusatory post.

Now you’re telling us that you didn’t mean what you thought about and took the time to type

Unlike you, I know exactly what I was talking about.

I was talking about and defending Notre Dame from your uninformed, ignorant, reckless attack.

There is no mistaking your written words.

As to your comment on my motivation, again, that’s nothing more than uniformed reckless speculation on your part

 

[4-4-3]

I feel in yur posts your arguments are usually pretty sound, but then you'll make a claim that isn't being held to the same level of standard that your other points are being held to in terms of their evidence and logic.

The bolded for example.

I feel like when institutions were the ones getting nearly 100% of the pie, we didn't mind leaving it up to the free market to decide and letting the chips fall where they may. And now the game is bigger/better/and more successful than ever.

But now that huge sums of money is going to the talent/players/ prospects, there's a whole lot of pearl clutching going on and people worried about regulations needed in order to keep things fair and balanced. Salary caps and such so that the fair market value for talent is artificially capped

Where were the cries for regulation when the top 8 blue bloods were dominating college football for the last 100+ years by monopolizing most of the resources?

Why are people playing market/wealth police, fear mongering over the health of the sport, now that the athletes are getting wealthy as well?

I'm not OF THE OPINION that players over the years have been HOPELESSLY EXPLOITED. That was NEVER the narrative as, frankly, NO ONE CARED. The more talented players GRADUATED to the NFL; the others, to selling securities, etc.

But as the game became more MONETIZED and the amounts involved reached MULTIPLES, the DEMAND for talent became that much GREATER which, in turn, ARMED PLAYERS to start making THEIR OWN DEMANDS.

FINE.

Let the players GET WHAT THEY CAN. Let them WORK THE SYSTEM and see what it GETS THEM.

I'm not about DENYING THEM.

My focus is instead on RECOGNIZING HOW THINGS FUNCTION. Which sector of the economy are you aware of that shares the spoils on anything REMOTELY APPROACHING an equitable basis? Those who run things ALWAYS MAKE SURE that power flows in directions that ENRICH THEM. It's THEIR SHOW. THEY OWN IT.

Who's in charge in MAJOR LEAGUE SPORTS? The owners or the players? Who nets more? The organizations that own the teams or the players? IT'S THE OWNERS. And that's just REALITY.

But as an INTEGRAL PART of that reality, there's STRUCTURE. NFL owners do not descend upon OLD SCHOOL TRADING FLOORS or sit at BANKS OF COMPUTERS putting in WILD-ASS BIDS for the best college players. There's an ORDERLY PROCESS, and in the end it SERVES ALL PARTIES.

The odds are VERY HIGH that if some kind of REVENUE SHARING SYSTEM is established, it will comport pretty closely with other SIMILAR STRUCTURES in society, upon which, by the way, it MOST LIKELY WILL BE BASED. And it will also be -- AS IT MUST BE -- VIABLY WORKABLE for those in charge of DELIVERING THE PRODUCT.

THEY'LL WANT THEIR VIG.

But it won't be an OPEN-ENDED AUCTION.

Why did the NFL relent and merge with the AFL? Because of the threat the AFL posed in outbidding the NFL for talent. And it may have even come down to the pursuit of ONE GUY -- Joe Namath.

This is not about ETHICS OR MORALS. This is about MONEY and POWER. And as I posted earlier, BIG MONEY WILL EAT SMALL MONEY, and the players will get whatever this STAGE OF CAPITALISM considers an EQUITABLE CUT.

But it won't be UTOPIAN COMMUNISM FOR COLLEGE ATHLETES, and dog-eat-dog CAPITALISM for the rest of us. Remember, this society is run by HARD, GREEDY MEN and their ATTACK-DOG LAWYERS.

Not too much GETS BY THEM.

 

[savvyandsassier]

You’re not just replying to me, you’re trying to make excuses for your reckless ,irresponsible, ignorant and accusatory post.

Now you’re telling us that you didn’t mean what you thought about and took the time to type

Unlike you, I know exactly what I was talking about.

I was talking about and defending Notre Dame from your uninformed, ignorant, reckless attack.

There is no mistaking your written words.

As to your comment on my motivation, again, that’s nothing more than uniformed reckless speculation on your part

Whew! I got you all worked up, didn't I? I hope you're not a troll. And you're just a character. I can't take you seriously either way, unfortunately. But it's a nice thought. And if I'm not mistaken you just used the melodramatic adjective 'reckless', not once not twice but thrice! Well played.....