Why Notre Dame should join the ACC in Football.

[domer1976]

What are you guys hearing about Notre Dame ever joining the ACC for Football too? I think Notre Dame should. Why?

1) If the first two years of the College Football have not shown you, Notre Dame not being in a Conference is going to hurt them in trying to make the College Football Playoff. Why? Because the Irish only play 12 games.
Say Ohio State has 1 loss and Notre Dame has 1 loss. Then Ohio State goes and plays the Big 10 Championship and wins it. Who has the advantage? Ohio State does by going 12-1 instead of 11-1.
I'm not saying Notre Dame can't make it as an Independent, I'm just saying they are at a disadvantage.
2) The committee uses Conference Championships as one of their criteria. Since Notre Dame isn't in a conference, they can't earn that distinction.

What are you guys' thoughts on this? We'd love to have Notre Dame join full time to even out the divisions.

Unfortunately, you've already received a plethora of dismissive replies from some of our more arrogant fans by now. Haven't even read any of the replies to your op, but I don't need to to be certain of that. Courtesy is not the long suit of many posters here; they believe the more that they post the more weight their opinions carry,

But ignoring the opinions of ND board lurkers for a moment - as the ND administration routinely does, with good cause - ND recognizes the disadvantages it has by not playing a 13th game, and accepts them as the price it must pay to maintain its traditional football independence (or at least semi-independence, now that it is allied with the ACC). I personally support the administration's current policy, and though some of the more obnoxious fans who only value the university for its football fortunes may disagree, I don't see it changing any time soon.

 

[Duo]

Unfortunately, you've already received a plethora of dismissive replies from some of our more arrogant fans by now. Haven't even read any of the replies to your op, but I don't need to to be certain of that. Courtesy is not the long suit of many posters here; they believe the more that they post the more weight their opinions carry,

But ignoring the opinions of ND board lurkers for a moment - as the ND administration routinely does, with good cause - ND recognizes the disadvantages it has by not playing a 13th game, and accepts them as the price it must pay to maintain its traditional football independence (or at least semi-independence, now that it is allied with the ACC). I personally support the administration's current policy, and though some of the more obnoxious fans who only value the university for its football fortunes may disagree, I don't see it changing any time soon.

Domer 76.............

Wow........what a breath of fresh air for a change! Excellent post! And yet there is still room for negotiations and compromise.

 

[SeanPol355]

FSU sycophants are just trying to drag us down to their low level. Trash em back and force them to do voluminous research to defend their points.

 

[Duo]

FSU sycophants are just trying to drag us down to their low level. Trash em back and force them to do voluminous research to defend their points.

Hey Schmidty Nole,

Nice of you to bring up a reasonable and respectful post. Can you feel the love, the tolerance, the CFB comradery, the "Hale fellow well met" fellow college football fan welcome aboard feeling here! Bwahahahahhh!

 

[scotchirishblood]

Why are people so fascinated with conference speak. This shit seemed to be spear headed by ESPN ever since other conference title games became the norm.

Stop ..just stop. We are Notre Dame. We love our independence. I'm willing to bet more schools in the near future leave some conferences and become Indy status. Mark my words.

With all due respect I will take that bet. ND aside I believe college FB is slowly moving in the direction of Super Conferences. There will eventually be either three or four POWER conferences and if you aren't in one of them you are out of luck where a NC is concerned. Those not included can of course have their own lesser NC but it would be be akin to the Basketball NCAA National Championship and the NIT.

Just my opinion but I have heard rumblings from gurus on sports radio much more informed than myself who agree with that opinion. Some current Power5 schools would be left out of the mix. Makes sense. Of course ND would be included if they chose to be.

 

[Irishjohn68]

What are you guys hearing about Notre Dame ever joining the ACC for Football too? I think Notre Dame should. Why?

1) If the first two years of the College Football have not shown you, Notre Dame not being in a Conference is going to hurt them in trying to make the College Football Playoff. Why? Because the Irish only play 12 games.
Say Ohio State has 1 loss and Notre Dame has 1 loss. Then Ohio State goes and plays the Big 10 Championship and wins it. Who has the advantage? Ohio State does by going 12-1 instead of 11-1.
I'm not saying Notre Dame can't make it as an Independent, I'm just saying they are at a disadvantage.
2) The committee uses Conference Championships as one of their criteria. Since Notre Dame isn't in a conference, they can't earn that distinction.

What are you guys' thoughts on this? We'd love to have Notre Dame join full time to even out the divisions.

No they don't.

 

[Irishjohn68]

The alignment with the ACC was a mistake. Football in the ACC? Hopefully never and ND should do everything they can to move other sports out of the ACC.

ND playing and expanded ACC football is great for the ACC, but bad for the ND fans and has hurt the SOS and the great rivalries.

Your a real dumbass!

 

[TimTerrific]

The ACC sucks!

 

[88ND]

With all due respect I will take that bet. ND aside I believe college FB is slowly moving in the direction of Super Conferences. There will eventually be either three or four POWER conferences and if you aren't in one of them you are out of luck where a NC is concerned. Those not included can of course have their own lesser NC but it would be be akin to the Basketball NCAA National Championship and the NIT.

Just my opinion but I have heard rumblings from gurus on sports radio much more informed than myself who agree with that opinion. Some current Power5 schools would be left out of the mix. Makes sense. Of course ND would be included if they chose to be.

Super conferences? You do realize they play other sports than just football? I'm speaking of every school. Moreover while one may be a strong football conference it may not be so good for basketball, etc. And vice versa.

Here is the gigantic thing that isn't being discussed. It costs these schools money to be participating in conferences. What is going to happen is these nice fat TV contracts that are being spread about will be dwindling. I'm not speaking of the major tv networks but speaking of which and using SEC as the guinea pig here...nobody on the CBS and ESPN stage is tuning in to see Missouri play Kentucky. Hence the reason those aren't nationally shown. That is a problem and is being visited as we speak ...but the other one who is losing massive $$$$ is the SEC network. This is the real problem because this was supposed to spread all this extra bread amongst all SEC trams for all sports. The problem is that outside of the decent football match-up nobody is watching.

 

[tommika]

In this one from 2014 I see FSU listed 6 times and I see Notre Dame listed 2 times and one of them was the FSU/Notre Dame game. But wait, I thought FSU was regional and eyeballs only watch Notre Dame .
http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2014/11/florida_state_alabama_recordin.html

http://m.campussports.net/clemsonflorida-state-draws-huge-tv-ratings/

http://fanbuzz.rare.us/story/florida-state-boston-college-espn-highest-overnight-three-years/

SchmidtyNole,

1. Don't argue with Argus,or Tim,or the other Troll names he uses., just ask other FSU posters about him.

2. N.D. needed a landing spot for their "Olympic" sports, Tennis, Baseball, Golf, Basketball etc after the demise of the Big East,where we had a similar relationship to the one we have with the ACC now.

3. Both sides got what they wanted, The Irish keep their National schedule and get some of the benefits of the ACC Football tie-ins. The ACC gets 5 sellouts every year ( and frequently up ticket prices to the N.D. game,or couple it up with tougher to sell tickets) plus national TV time every time an ACC team plays N.D. The TV time is not as exclusive going forward as it used to be, with games on more and more channels, but the financial benefit to individual teams is very important since most College teams actually lose money.

 

[Classic Irish]

SchmidtyNole,

1. Don't argue with Argus,or Tim,or the other Troll names he uses., just ask other FSU posters about him.

Tim is Argus? Another name to add to the ignore list.

 

[Duo]

Tommika........

Good post and excellent advice about the pusillanimous Argus and all the other names he posts under like tim and big fella!

 

[TheDecker]

Did he walk out with Crab Legs and not pay for them? Yes. Was it wrong? Yes. Was he punished for it? Yes. Did he quote a meme in the Student Union? Yes. Was it wrong? Yes but I heard worse all the time as a college student. Was he punished? Yes. Should he have been punished for that? That is debatable. Finally did he rape the girl? No. And the State Attorney and an independant Former Supreme Court judge agree with me. Is that all?

Well you could mention the Florida State cover-up, for which the school itself was sued, and paid out millions of dollars.

Seems sort of relevant, doesn't it...

 

[TheDecker]

The reality of the situation is as follows:

1.) Having a 13th game can be helpful in making a case for the college football playoff (in the current system) if you're on the borderline.

2.) Having the 13th game be against our quality opponent helps the resume even more.

3.) Winning a conference championship can also help the resume.

4.) Conference bowl tie-ins can be helpful, depending on the circumstances.

5.) When your team is already out of contention for a national championship, it can be nice to still have a conference championship as a option. Sort of a consolation prize.



All that being said, on the other side of the coin is:


1.) it is unwise to assume that the current "championship decision system" will remain in place for very long, with people already calling for change. Making any serious decisions based on the current structure is pure foolishness, nothing better than total stupidity.

2.) The ACC is improving as a football conference, and atheltic conference overall. But it's not on the level of the SEC or Big Ten, from either a competition or financial standpoint, yet.

3.) Making a greater commitment to the ACC for football what I have negative consequences for Notre Dame at financially, at this point.

4.) Such a commitment would also damage our ability to play traditional rivals and a truly national schedule.



It's possible that a relationship like you're talking about could make sense, at some point in the future.

At this point I also think that the ACC makes the most sense of any of the conferences, should that point come in the future that Notre Dame is looking to join a conference.

But in the short-term, it simply doesn't make sense for Notre Dame to join any conference at all. Not until a more stable environment arises, that promotes long-term decision making.

 

[NDSMC78]

Tim is Argus? Another name to add to the ignore list.

True. Put him on ignore a while ago.

 

[11NCs]

SchmidtyNole,
most College teams actually lose money.

Exactly 6 Power-5 schools lost money last year and only 1 (UVA) is from the ACC. More than 90% of Power-5 schools make money, lots of money - the average is nearly $15M. The fact that hundreds of D1AA, D2 and D3 teams make no money is completely irrelevant to this discussion.

 

[NDSMC78]

Exactly 6 Power-5 schools lost money last year and only 1 (UVA) is from the ACC. More than 90% of Power-5 schools make money, lots of money - the average is nearly $15M. The fact that hundreds of D1AA, D2 and D3 teams make no money is completely irrelevant to this discussion.

Not true.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/sports/wp/2015/11/23/running-up-the-bills/

 

[ForeverNole22]

Tim is Argus? Another name to add to the ignore list.

Yep and this time he is 32 years old.

Hahahahahahahahahahah

 

[danoleman]

Wow what a thread. Pretty much all over the place. I'll say this about ND and the ACC, you might not want to be in the ACC in football but Noles really want you guys there. You're a name program and will boost the conference. We need this in the new ESPN playoff era. I have no issue with ND so I'm not understanding some of the hate. I'll say this to the guy that thinks Winston is a rapist. Read his accuser interviews, all of them and tell me this. Which one of her versions convinced you he did this??

 

[echowaker]

i do believe nd joins a conference for football within 20 years. i believe the landscape will change to a point that nd will have to join. i can easily see 4 super conferences of 50 schools or so and the rest in a lower division.

 

[IrishBlooded]

ND / ACC has been a pretty good win / win.... So far.

But the only real 'power houses' that the ACC has, ND will have played them all by the end of this year. FSU, Clemson, Miami, VTech. The only two that have really made any national noise in the last decade are FSU, and Clemson. And ND was somehow randomly selected to play both of them on the road, in the first two years of the agreement...................

So now the question will be can the rest of the ACC help keep ND wins look important enough with their normal schedule? When you are replacing teams like Michigan, MSU, etc, and playing teams like Wake Forest. It doesn't help much.

But as earlier posters put it, the biggest piece of this agreement is the bowl deal. ND participated in the Big East bowl selection (which they never really participated in over all during it's life with the exception of 2 picks). And with the dismantling of the Big East, ND needed a new landing spot. The ACC had terrible bowl picks, and with the help of ND and Jack Swarbrick, the ACC was able to secure a much sexier post season bid.

If there is going to be a change. And there is absolutely no promises there. But if there is to be one. I would look a couple of years in the future. The ND / ACC deal, the NCAA / Playoff deal, and the ND / NBC deal all come up for renegotiation within 1.5 years of one another.

 

[Irishjohn68]

The reality of the situation is as follows:

1.) Having a 13th game can be helpful in making a case for the college football playoff (in the current system) if you're on the borderline.

2.) Having the 13th game be against our quality opponent helps the resume even more.

3.) Winning a conference championship can also help the resume.

4.) Conference bowl tie-ins can be helpful, depending on the circumstances.

5.) When your team is already out of contention for a national championship, it can be nice to still have a conference championship as a option. Sort of a consolation prize.



All that being said, on the other side of the coin is:


1.) it is unwise to assume that the current "championship decision system" will remain in place for very long, with people already calling for change. Making any serious decisions based on the current structure is pure foolishness, nothing better than total stupidity.

2.) The ACC is improving as a football conference, and atheltic conference overall. But it's not on the level of the SEC or Big Ten, from either a competition or financial standpoint, yet.

3.) Making a greater commitment to the ACC for football what I have negative consequences for Notre Dame at financially, at this point.

4.) Such a commitment would also damage our ability to play traditional rivals and a truly national schedule.



It's possible that a relationship like you're talking about could make sense, at some point in the future.

At this point I also think that the ACC makes the most sense of any of the conferences, should that point come in the future that Notre Dame is looking to join a conference.

But in the short-term, it simply doesn't make sense for Notre Dame to join any conference at all. Not until a more stable environment arises, that promotes long-term decision making.

How exactly do we know not having a 13th game is going to hurt Notre Dame? Didn't Oklahoma last year.

 

[Irishjohn68]

IrishBlooded, you are spot on! ND helped The Big East with there bowl selections just like they have improved the ACC also. ND remains independent, keeps the NBC deal and has a spot for all it's other sports. Win Win.

 

[TimTerrific]

32? I wish ! That is just as much a lie as where I went to college or that I had a daughter go to FSU. Pretty fun to watch these guys melt down with obsession over me!

 

[TheDecker]

How exactly do we know not having a 13th game is going to hurt Notre Dame? Didn't Oklahoma last year.

Basic logic:

13 wins > 12 wins
Especially when the committee specifically talks about how performances in CCG's have affected their decisions

To your point, "hurt by not having 13 games" is not the same thing as "automatically excluded by not having 13 games".....as it's definitely possible to make the playoffs with only a 12 game schedule

 

[Duo]

"it's definitely possible to make the playoffs with only a 12 game schedule"

Possible, just not likely. Anything is possible.

 

[TheDecker]

"it's definitely possible to make the playoffs with only a 12 game schedule"

Possible, just not likely. Anything is possible.

That's an overstatement, considering that Oklahoma made it this year

Statistically, that would be like say "It's definitely possible for a Pac12 Team to make, just not likely...anything is possible"

Your agenda is clearly tainting your ability to fairly evaluate verifiable facts

 

[john0gaunt]

That guy is so full of sh*t. Most people here would like to beat his a** and all of his other usernames.

+1000

Good to see punch drunk and stupid are back to support the rapist/criminole trolls.

 

[11NCs]

Not true.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/sports/wp/2015/11/23/running-up-the-bills/

Leave it to a bozo to link to a 2014 article in response to a comment about 2015.

 

[NDSMC78]

Leave it to a bozo to link to a 2014 article in response to a comment about 2015.

The stats for 2015 aren't available yet. These things just don't come out instantaneously, you know.
But at least I cited recognized authority, unlike you who merely throw things out there to see what sticks to the wall. Our posters are reminded that you are the person who told us all, just a month ago, that the basketball season was in the dumper. Good call.

 

[Duo]

"13 wins > 12 wins
Especially when the committee specifically talks about how performances in CCG's have affected their decisions"

Ahh............yes.

 

[Duo]

Maryville Teachers College...

Argus is nothing more than a lonely and delusional retired geezer in Naples, Florida estranged by a daughter and family hoping to curry favor and perhaps even a friend from Notre Dame. How to try to get some love from ND alumni? He tries by saying nasty things about their rivals, even to the point of making up different names and talking with himself! Whaaaaaaaaaa.................. That's argus.

 

[12375CAT]

ND will join a conference on July 1, 2116!

 

[Irishjohn68]

Basic logic:

13 wins > 12 wins
Especially when the committee specifically talks about how performances in CCG's have affected their decisions

To your point, "hurt by not having 13 games" is not the same thing as "automatically excluded by not having 13 games".....as it's definitely possible to make the playoffs with only a 12 game schedule

Fact is it didn't hurt Oklahoma last year not playing a 13th game.

 

[Irishjohn68]

Good to see punch drunk and stupid are back to support the rapist/criminole trolls.

Oh look, here comes another username to the rescue.

 

[john0gaunt]

Oh look, here comes another username to the rescue.

You should stop drinking. You won't smell like urine all the time and your family will have some respect for you. You're going to end up just like your father, passed out drunk in the gutter every night. Man up fool. Stop supporting rapists and criminoles. Sober up and have some respect for yourself.

 

[topdecktiger]

Super conferences? You do realize they play other sports than just football? I'm speaking of every school. Moreover while one may be a strong football conference it may not be so good for basketball, etc. And vice versa.

Here is the gigantic thing that isn't being discussed. It costs these schools money to be participating in conferences. What is going to happen is these nice fat TV contracts that are being spread about will be dwindling. I'm not speaking of the major tv networks but speaking of which and using SEC as the guinea pig here...nobody on the CBS and ESPN stage is tuning in to see Missouri play Kentucky. Hence the reason those aren't nationally shown. That is a problem and is being visited as we speak ...but the other one who is losing massive $$$$ is the SEC network. This is the real problem because this was supposed to spread all this extra bread amongst all SEC trams for all sports. The problem is that outside of the decent football match-up nobody is watching.

This is not close to being accurate. The SECN is not losing money. Not even close. The SEC made more than $500 million in revenue last year. http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/writer/jon-solomon/25454840/sec-rakes-in-5274-million-in-first-year-of-cfp-and-sec-network

In fact, SECN made more money than NBCSN, MLB Network, FS2, NBA TV, ESPNU, or CBSSN. http://www.foxsports.com/college-fo...e/the-15-most-valuable-sports-networks-050715

These individual schools couldn’t get anywhere near the TV money that they get from conferences. Each P5 conference pays out at least $20 million per school from its TV deal. Nobody is going to get anywhere close to that as an independent. (For example, BYU only gets about $ 4 million from its TV contract.) Notre Dame gets about $15 million, but that’s Notre Dame. The other schools wouldn’t get anywhere near what they get from being in a conference.


These schools are making decisions for one reason only, money. Where does that money come from? Football. Football is responsible for about 85% of a conference’s TV contract. Men’s basketball makes up most of the remaining chunk. The rest of the sports don’t really contribute any value.


So yeah, I’ll take your bet. Nobody is going independent. The money simply isn’t there. It’s suicide.

 

[scotchirishblood]

This is not close to being accurate. The SECN is not losing money. Not even close. The SEC made more than $500 million in revenue last year. http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/writer/jon-solomon/25454840/sec-rakes-in-5274-million-in-first-year-of-cfp-and-sec-network

In fact, SECN made more money than NBCSN, MLB Network, FS2, NBA TV, ESPNU, or CBSSN. http://www.foxsports.com/college-fo...e/the-15-most-valuable-sports-networks-050715

These individual schools couldn’t get anywhere near the TV money that they get from conferences. Each P5 conference pays out at least $20 million per school from its TV deal. Nobody is going to get anywhere close to that as an independent. (For example, BYU only gets about $ 4 million from its TV contract.) Notre Dame gets about $15 million, but that’s Notre Dame. The other schools wouldn’t get anywhere near what they get from being in a conference.


These schools are making decisions for one reason only, money. Where does that money come from? Football. Football is responsible for about 85% of a conference’s TV contract. Men’s basketball makes up most of the remaining chunk. The rest of the sports don’t really contribute any value.


So yeah, I’ll take your bet. Nobody is going independent. The money simply isn’t there. It’s suicide.

Damn! Those pesky facts again. Always shoring up reality.

 

[echowaker]

The stats for 2015 aren't available yet. These things just don't come out instantaneously, you know.
But at least I cited recognized authority, unlike you who merely throw things out there to see what sticks to the wall. Our posters are reminded that you are the person who told us all, just a month ago, that the basketball season was in the dumper. Good call.

thats what happens when he makes stuff up.

 

[88ND]

The pesky facts? Let's see what you posted....

500 plus in revenue. ? OK...in my business world the important key is net profit. ... Revenue is a wonderful thing provided you have more of it coming in than what is going out....
SOMETHING clearly NOT noted in the article.

Moreover is this article speaking of the $$ impact by the first year of the CFP ? As I noted football is king however the other sports of all those schools are NOT making money.

I wasn't trying to suggest that schools are going independent in droves but I do believe you could see some of these conferences being down sized and it will be quietly mutual between conference and school.

P.s .
It won't happen tomorrow but the landscape will be different 5 years from now and it won't be with super conferences and adding more teams.