OT: How did we get here

[deadirishpoet]

rgc, I understand and respect your position. The US had mostly open immigration in the late 18th century and early 19th century. John Adams and the Federalists imposed certain laws extending the time period for citizenship from 5 to 14 years but this was mostly a ploy
to control the electorate. In the late 1800s, the Chinese Exclusion Act and the Alien Contractor Labor laws were enacted that restricted certain workers from immigrating. The Immigration Act of 1882 levied a head tax on immigrants and blocked the entry of "idiots, lunatics, convicts, and persons likely to become a public charge." My ancestors came over from Ireland in the 1850s so apparently avoided the Immigration Act. Lucky for me! It also banned virtually all asians, including people from India as they were deemed by Court ruling not to be white.

The Immigration Act of 1924 set quotas on the number of immigrants from certain countries. This law was apparently aimed at primarily Catholics, Muslims and Jews.

The US has a long history of limiting or even prohibiting non-white, non-protestant people from immigrating and most of those laws are clearly discriminatory. So when people assume that current bans on Muslim countries are racist, you can at least understand why they might think that.

There should be a serious discussion about immigration but I suspect that our politicians (as well as many of our fellow Board posters) are not up for that. It is much easier to demonize illegal immigrants and refer to them as animals infesting our country.

I am liberal and feel that we have a duty to help our fellow man. I try to do that in my personal life and support spending my tax dollars on that as opposed to using my tax dollars to send our troops throughout the world to kill people. I think that immigrants can be a boon for the economy. I also think that it will change the racial makeup of our country. We have always been a white-majority nation and many people feel uncomfortable with the thought of being in the minority. I don't feel uncomfortable with that concept.

So why not make our immigration laws simpler. Allow anyone to come to the US provided they (1) have no criminal background; and (2) can communicate in English. Provided they obey the law and become contributing members of our society, I would propose that they can earn citizenship within a certain number of years, i.e., 5, 7, etc. If they are convicted of a violent crime or one involving moral turpitude (i.e. identity theft, kiddie porn, etc.) within that time period, they forfeit any right to citizenship and will be deported instantly.

I don't expect everyone (or perhaps even anyone) to agree with this premise but it is at least a start.

Interesting.

It was a fair attempt.

Open boarders will never work. Every nation in the world has boarders and protects them. What other nation endorses a policy as you just laid out?

I also notice assimilate wasn't on your list. If people don't assimilate then there becomes here. So why would we want there to become here if they are fleeing their? I also don't remember you being this vocal about immigration when president Obama was in office. Where you surprised president Obama separated families who any fanfare?

There is nothing wrong with coming through the front door.
My family fled Nazi Germany in the late 30's just as the nazi's were rounding up the Jews. They had to come through yhe front door and there was no asylum gor Jews back then.

Most people want to help people, charities are a great thing, but it's a FACT illegal immigrants take more from this country than give back.

It's a shame those who do not want to wait their turn suffer

I like you brother. You are a fair soul, but being this far in debt to China, and taking on this burden makes no sense for our children

 

[rgc7]

Duck,
A good and thoughtful post, and filled in a lot of things that I had studied many years ago about
Out earlier immigration laws or lack there of.
As far as racial prejudice, ( perhaps I am color blind on this ) but I never considered Hispanics
As a separate race. To me they were always Basically Native Indians ,or descendants of Europeans ,
Or a mixture of both.
Of course, I realize that there are a good number of black people also living in those areas as well,
but I just do not believe that our immigration policy is influenced by race to any great degree.
I do ,however , feel that there is good immigration which controls immigration to reasonable numbers, and
that provides needed additions to the population as economic and intellectual and technical needs
Of our country dictate. Of course, we should also accept a certain number of “ Refugees” for
Humanitarian reasons.
However, all immigration must be legal and controlled. That is good immigration.
Bad immigration is what happened to Rome with the “Barbarians at the gates”, That is what is happening in
Europe today, and is certainly taking place here today.
I certainly agree that we have a duty to help our fellow man, but if we let too many of or fellow men
“ Sit at our table.” Eventually, we will all starve !

 

[HarlemIrish]

What if my next-door neighbor was an illegal immigrant?

We can play this game all day. As I said before, I'd prefer to evaluate issues based on an objective view.

Ewing, I live in a State where Cuomo said he was undocumented. Not sure how he was born and raised in Jamaica Estates along with Trump and Geraldine Ferraro, now he's an illegal alien. I have no issue with legal immigration. Right now we have the left who sees votes. Then you have the Koch brothers who want cheap labor and are anti union. Big problem here in the city with the FDNY responding to illegals being hurt in construction jobs. Osha? What's that. The left doesn't understand that by flooding the job markets they are suppressing the wages of mostly African Americans and working class whites. Are we a nation or not? Shouldn't we take care of our own?

 

[HarlemIrish]

Too simplistic DIP. Most illegal immigrants work under a "borrowed" SSN in order to make money for their families. They have all of the standard deductions taken out of their paycheck, including social security, Medicare, Federal and State taxes, and will never get the benefit of those deductions. They also buy groceries, pay rent, buy clothes and otherwise add to the economy. They don't "take away funds," they add to those funds.

Certainly there are some that take advantage of the system and some that are criminals, much like so many American citizens do.

But, hey, I get it. We got ours and they should just stay home and fight the drug cartels, warlords, etc. and fix their home rather than seeking a better life for their families here. I mean, if the roles were reversed, none of us would try to come to America to better our lives.

How about the schools and housing in NYC? BTW I'm talking about greatly reduced housing in Chinatown in Manhattan prime real estate. How does an immigrant get here and land one of these apartments? The russians in Brighton Beach also? How about all the schools that have to be built and extra teacher for ESL? They do get medicaid in NYC. Any person can walk into a NYC hospital and say I'm sick. The hospital by Hippa laws has to treat them. Whats your address buddy? Undomiciled.

 

[deadirishpoet]

Duck,
A good and thoughtful post, and filled in a lot of things that I had studied many years ago about
Out earlier immigration laws or lack there of.
As far as racial prejudice, ( perhaps I am color blind on this ) but I never considered Hispanics
As a separate race. To me they were always Basically Native Indians ,or descendants of Europeans ,
Or a mixture of both.
Of course, I realize that there are a good number of black people also living in those areas as well,
but I just do not believe that our immigration policy is influenced by race to any great degree.
I do ,however , feel that their is good immigration which controls immigration to reasonable numbers
that provides needed additions to the population as economic and intellectual and technical needs
Of our country dictate. Of course, we should also accept a certain number of “ Refugees” for
Humanitarian reasons.
However, all immigration must be legal and controlled. That is good immigration.
Bad immigration is what happened to Rome with the “Barbarians at the gates”, That is what is happening in
Europe today, and is certainly taking place here today.
I certainly agree that we have a duty to help our fellow man, but if we let too many of or fellow men
“ Sit at our table.” Eventually, we will all starve !

Hey brother I hope you're doing well

We have a Miller grandfather clock that was just maintenance, and I'm sure you know its a German brand.
I was speaking to the gentleman and found out much like you his wife is German, and he was telling me of the unassimulating by the Muslim cultures were police are not even allowed to patrol and sharia law was enforced not too mention the first billion dollar acre.
You go to Germany you know.

 

[francade]

“C'mon francade, be honest here. You wouldn't prefer a hard working immigrant because more likely than not he or she wouldn't be white and probably wouldn't be Christian. I'm one of you, brother. I'm a white guy who grew up in a middle class, Catholic family.”

Typical, liberal response. Accuse the non-liberal that he’s a racist. Works every time.

We may both be white, catholic and grew up middle class, but we’re nothing at all alike. Like I said, I’d trade you for a hard working immigrant that loved and embraced the US in a minute. We’d be better off. And just ftr, I grew up in Miami in the 70s and 80s and went to school w/, became best friends w/ & worked w/ immigrants from Cuba, puerto rico, Jamaica, Dominican Republic, Haiti, Colombia, Brazil, Venezuela, Honduras, Egypt and more, and most of them were catholic so I’m not sure where you were going w/ the “they probably wouldn’t be Christian” line. Most pouring over the border are. Anyway, I could care less if they were Jewish, Muslim or Christian, or any other religion, if they worked hard and loved and embraced the USA, you’d be on the next flight out for a swap.

 

[deadirishpoet]

Americans benefit from lower food prices though too.

There is a middle ground between "open borders, let everyone in", and criminalizing ("they're MS-13!!!!") poor people who are here without a visa trying to make money for their families. We need a certain amount of immigration and we aren't going to be able to fill that amount with well educated upper middle class European families.

So are you saying well educated middle class African, Asian,Middle Eastern, Hispanics would fo that work
Some would argue that's a racist remark by singling out Europeans

 

[deadirishpoet]

I don't think there's a nexus between my statement and your reply.

Shocker

 

[justified1]

Do the Dems’s and the Libs realize what the future holds IF they succeed?
Their children WILL live in a totalitarian governed state and world.
Freedom is a right that is earned and maintained. There are those that are always looking to deny it.

 

[zonairish]

Duck,
A good and thoughtful post, and filled in a lot of things that I had studied many years ago about
Out earlier immigration laws or lack there of.
As far as racial prejudice, ( perhaps I am color blind on this ) but I never considered Hispanics
As a separate race. To me they were always Basically Native Indians ,or descendants of Europeans ,
Or a mixture of both.
Of course, I realize that there are a good number of black people also living in those areas as well,
but I just do not believe that our immigration policy is influenced by race to any great degree.
I do ,however , feel that there is good immigration which controls immigration to reasonable numbers, and
that provides needed additions to the population as economic and intellectual and technical needs
Of our country dictate. Of course, we should also accept a certain number of “ Refugees” for
Humanitarian reasons.
However, all immigration must be legal and controlled. That is good immigration.
Bad immigration is what happened to Rome with the “Barbarians at the gates”, That is what is happening in
Europe today, and is certainly taking place here today.
I certainly agree that we have a duty to help our fellow man, but if we let too many of or fellow men
“ Sit at our table.” Eventually, we will all starve !

Duck pulls the race card or nazi card as a matter fact. If you do not agree with him then by default you are a racist. I am so sick of his moronic opinions I blocked him

 

[spenna]

Anyone read about that MLB pitching coach who got fired for being, saying something, insensitive?
Then there is the Chris Hardwick story. Or, A teacher gets fired for FB comments. More and more stories like this. A mere accusation is enough to destroy careers.

Does anyone remember the days as a youth, the interactions in the playgrounds? The fights, brawls, arguments, competitions, jealousies? The things we said to each other, busting on each other? The mocking for fun and even to be a ‘putdown’ Today our verbal exchanges would consitute hate crimes or threats to homeland security.

How did we get here?

Further, a grade school kid cannot invite friends from school to a birthday party unless all the class gets invited? And then there is the sports or competitions where everyone ‘wins’ a trophy or awards so as to not hurt feelings or reveal levels of abilities and individual differences.

Then there is the Mayor of NYC saying that having academic achievement schools is unfair to less academically astute students and he wants to have open enrollment at schools that were setup to recognize and reward hard work and academic achievement.

And how about the NJ cheer sqaud? A parent complained that her kid got cut after tryouts. So the school board opens cheerleading to everone who wants to be a cheerleader can be one. The fact that some kids went to camps, trained and dedicated time and effort did not matter. There seems to be an ongoing attack-on individual differences.

Free speech, individual differences, and free expression are under attack.

How did we get here?

(I hope this doesn’t offend anyone)

The education system since the 1960,s .

 

[justified1]

The education system since the 1960,s .

Honestly: daytime TV owned by libs, woman and “.” have owned the media and it is like one shared mentality.
No other voice is tolerated. Time to “MAN UP”, men.

 

[rgc7]

Hey brother I hope you're doing well

We have a Miller grandfather clock that was just maintenance, and I'm sure you know its a German brand.
I was speaking to the gentleman and found out much like you his wife is German, and he was telling me of the unassimulating by the Muslim cultures were police are not even allowed to patrol and sharia law was enforced not too mention the first billion dollar acre.
You go to Germany you know.

 

[rgc7]

Hi Brother,
I was going to get back to you last night but my computer battery was on empty and had to be charged. That Miller clock sounds like a great clock and well worth repairing if there is really a good craftsman who can do the job properly?
My wife and I just got back from Germany a few weeks ago. We did not stay in any big cities,
But I understand that they are getting pretty bad since the German let in all the “Refugees “ , most of them
Being relatively young and healthy looking young men. They sure didn’t look like any refugees that
I have ever seen ? Too bad the Germans didn't Give them training and an M16, and send them back to fight for their freedom !
When we came out of North Korea, we had thousands of refugees from North Korea follow us out to
Freedom and they were ,for the. Most part, women and children and old men. They were refugees!
Back to my trip to Germany. When we left Germany we went to visit Prague. What a beautiful city !
I have never, in all my past travels, met such nice and thoughtful people. We could no sooner get on a street
Car without a number of people getting up to give us their seat ! The people there did all types of nice things
To help us ! I did not notice any type of bad behavior or crime, and I, not completely sure, do not believe
That the Chech Republic took any of the “Refugees?
Semper Fi