Patty is a pompous curmudgeon who likes to argue about everything. Most times, he doesn't make sense.
Guy’s we will miss Tommy
- Thread starter Zorich 88
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So, basically Tommy had NOTHING to do with the success ND football had while he was the OC????
Is that what you are saying? Are you saying in spite of an average at best OC ND had a very good 3 year stretch.
Well the beginning of each season brings so much optimism
No one is denying TR success as an OC but I'm hoping the current OC as much as TR has achieved though looking at his resume it might be bumpy at first
Last season more than the first two imo because I believe Kelly was calling the plays
So, the OC does get part of the credit for a team having the success ND has had???
Kelly stopped calling plays before Chip took over and NEVER resumed that responsibility.
He gets some credit. But that's not something people typically point to when evaluating an OFFENSIVE COORDINATOR.
Talk about ppg, ypg, ypp. Scoring against top opponents.
It's a weird thing to bring up because you have the HC, OC, DC, STC, QB
Winning is a combination but he was the OC and QB coach.
I would say he did an above average job in totality. In big games he was subpar. Overall he was okay.
It’s not even the stats. It’s wins and loses before anything else.
It’s also the eye test.
Is the offense flowing?
Does it have an identity?
Is the run game or passing game average, good or great.
Tommy is a very good OC. Nothing Tommy did at ND should be considered average.
ND scored a lot of points under Tommy.
Then what’s your basis for criticizing Rees, when he produced enough points on the board to win 30 of 38 games ?
I already explained the reason that I type in bold with 18 font, you’re just to stupid to understand my explanation
Golson never liked Tommy and never liked Book. He was wrong about both guys and can’t admit it.
I already explained the setting of the “opening” line, you’re just too stupid to understand it.
Dead,
It makes perfect sense.
One only has to read these posts to see and understand the angst and ire directed toward Buchner and Rees, Notre Dame men.
And there is a distinctive separation of perspective between fans that are alum and non-alum.
Constructive criticism carries an inherent value with it, without constructive criticism progress is impossible !
But just bitching at every imperfection, contains little if any value.
Never forget that the enemy of good and great is ……… perfect !
I‘m not one to “follow the crowd”, so the sentiment of the fan base doesn’t influence me as I tend to make up my mind based on the hard data points that are presented to me.
My criticism of Weis was that he seemed to diminish the defensive aspect of the game by over emphasis on the offensive aspect of the game.
I hope that helps to explain my position and my defense of the attacks on Buchner and Rees.
He did lay a few eggs, though. Marshall, Stanford and the 2nd half vs Navy come to mind from last year.
Wins and losses is not a OC stat. Thats a head coaching stat. You can average 20ppg and your defense gives up 10ppg. Your offense sucks. You won because of defense
We scored decent under Rees. Not great by any measure. But not terrible.
Right, hes bordering on average to good(every once in a while he was very good), no where near great. Not a big loss in my opinion
Again, it’s more than stats. You can say the same thing if the offense is good but the defense is bad.
What’s the average field position? If the defense gives up a lot of points early does that force the offense to come out of the original game plan?
If a team has a bad OC/DC that will stick out for everyone to see.
Tommy did a good job at ND. He is a good OC.
What’s amazing is the majority of people outside of ND believe Tommy is a good OC. I only see NF fans saying Tommy is average.
So, you only have to be average to make 2ml a season at one of the top football programs in America???
Man, how much do good OC get???? 5ml a season????
I can see someone saying he is good. I'm not really arguing that. He was great at times, awful at times, solid at times. However you want to call it... average solid good. Whatever
But there's plenty of those guys out there. Your word, good. Plenty of that.
He's not anything special while he was here that's like oh my God, how are are we going to replace that guy. No he was not that.
So if he would have stayed, I would been okay with that fine. If he left, okay with that fine. He was one of those types of coaches
You don’t know what you have until it’s gone. Same thing when Book left.
When you say that he was awful at times, was he awful or was it the execution that was awful ?
He played quite a few half-games.
It's really just yards per play adjusted for the opposing team's defense. Most of the other stats are just a function of that one.
So it’s your stated opinion that when ND fails to score, that the sole party responsible for that failure is the OC.He played quite a few half-games.
It's really just yards per play adjusted for the opposing team's defense. Most of the other stats are just a function of that one.
NOT the players on the field and not the opposing defense, but the OC.
You know nothing about football !
I can appreciate your time and research. Great job!!!He played quite a few half-games.
It's really just yards per play adjusted for the opposing team's defense. Most of the other stats are just a function of that one.
However, I do feel you have to factor in the below average QB play. No excuse but you have to factor in the big hole that existed at QB.
Look, Tommy had flaws for sure. However, I really liked what he did with the ND offense.
I definitely believe he will be missed.
Could you cite examples where he was awful
Why would Saban, who has so many candidates to choose from, hire an awful OC ?
If you insist on using the phrase stated opinion, would you please read the post to see if I stated anything of the sort?
Yeah you do. New guy could actually be a worse OC and have better results with a better QB. But upper level coaches and coordinators get judged on the bottom line. I don't recall a year that the Kelly-Rees system really rolled the thunder. The best years can be attributed to Kizer-Fuller or Book's scrambling under Chip Long.
So when things went wrong it was the HC-OC’s fault, but when things went right it wasn’t to their credit.
That’s an interesting but absurd perspective !
So according to you, if you average 9 yards per play but lose the game by 17-0, that‘s a highly successful OC ? ? ?He played quite a few half-games.
It's really just yards per play adjusted for the opposing team's defense. Most of the other stats are just a function of that one.
I never knew that !
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