Freeman is a message board hire

[ohio1980]

Jack's not that stupid. Neither are most ADs. Nobody hires a coach based on one recruiting class.

I think he(Jack) will be retiring very soon and he just wanted to make things easy on himself. IMO
Personally I think it was a panic pick, never interviewed anyone else and he was worried about short term recruiting class(2022) the current playoff potential now and all the players endorsing Freeman. I love Freeman but is he going to be ready as a big time head coach.

 

[4-4-3]

I think he(Jack) will be retiring very soon and he just wanted to make things easy on himself. IMO
Personally I think it was a panic pick, never interviewed anyone else and he was worried about short term recruiting class(2022) the current playoff potential now and all the players endorsing Freeman. I love Freeman but is he going to be ready as a big time head coach.

Extremely insightful post.

I'd only further emphasize that the PANIC was the result of Swarbrick not having a viable short-term alternative if the recruits were to be retained.

The more I look at this -- and this is purely BLUE-SKY CONJECTURE -- the more it resembles a LEVERAGED REVERSE TAKEOVER. And while Freeman by no means DIRECTLY ORCHESTRATED IT, he certainly was the beneficiary.

Here's the scenario:

Kelly may have felt undermined by Freeman due to Freeman's overall appeal to players, recruits, fans, etc. and that may have contributed to Kelly's willingness to listen to LSU. In other words, Kelly may have sensed he was being ECLIPSED.

Once Kelly left and given the recruiting class issue, the signing day complication, Fickell's unavailability till after the playoff/bowl season and ND's players' EXTREMELY VOCAL DEMAND to hire Freeman, ND's Admin in a way LOST CONTROL of the situation and were basically FORCED to hire Freeman to protect a PERCEIVED STATUS QUO on the verge of becoming, under some as yet MYTHICAL Freeman regime, something STUPENDOUS in the very near future.

Clearly, there was a powershift that almost NECESSITATED hiring Freeman and as a result, a CLASSIC RUSH TO JUDGEMENT. Will this prove to have been a good thing in the end? NO ONE KNOWS. But it will certainly be remembered either way as a FLASH BANG DECISION made in the HEAT OF THE MOMENT.

 

[twalsh]

I think he(Jack) will be retiring very soon and he just wanted to make things easy on himself. IMO
Personally I think it was a panic pick, never interviewed anyone else and he was worried about short term recruiting class(2022) the current playoff potential now and all the players endorsing Freeman. I love Freeman but is he going to be ready as a big time head coach.

It's a risk for sure, but based on everything I'm hearing, including from some ex players, it's a risk everyone is pretty comfortable with. They think this guy has a special "it" factor that makes him worth it.

 

[Drinking The Green Koolaid]

Extremely insightful post.

I'd only further emphasize that the PANIC was the result of Swarbrick not having a viable short-term alternative if the recruits were to be retained.

The more I look at this -- and this is purely BLUE-SKY CONJECTURE -- the more it resembles a LEVERAGED REVERSE TAKEOVER. And while Freeman by no means DIRECTLY ORCHESTRATED IT, he certainly was the beneficiary.

Here's the scenario:

Kelly may have felt undermined by Freeman due to Freeman's overall appeal to players, recruits, fans, etc. and that may have contributed to Kelly's willingness to listen to LSU. In other words, Kelly may have sensed he was being ECLIPSED.

Once Kelly left and given the recruiting class issue, the signing day complication, Fickell's unavailability till after the playoff/bowl season and ND's players' EXTREMELY VOCAL DEMAND to hire Freeman, ND's Admin in a way LOST CONTROL of the situation and were basically FORCED to hire Freeman to protect a PERCEIVED STATUS QUO on the verge of becoming, under some as yet MYTHICAL Freeman regime, something STUPENDOUS in the very near future.

Clearly, there was a powershift that almost NECESSITATED hiring Freeman and as a result, a CLASSIC RUSH TO JUDGEMENT. Will this prove to have been a good thing in the end? NO ONE KNOWS. But it will certainly be remembered either way as a FLASH BANG DECISION made in the HEAT OF THE MOMENT.

No offense, 4-4-3, but I think you've been watching too many Oliver Stone movies and are reading way too much into this. You are generally a thoughtful poster who articulates some interesting ideas, but I think you went off the rails on this post. Kelly didn't leave ND because of Marcus Freeman. He left ND because of his massive ego. That is all his move is about. I have been a supporter of Kelly, and am grateful for how he restored some stability to ND's football program, but based upon how he left the program--not why--I have a high degree of ambivalence over what his final legacy at ND will be. Maybe those feelings will change over time, but I don't expect you will ever see a statue of BK ever erected outside the Stadium. Kelly crossed the Rubicon by moving to LSU. What does it say about Brian Kelly that virtually none of his assistants decided to follow him to LSU despite what I expect were promises of much higher salaries? Does that speak to BK's character or that of the coaches who stayed behind?

As for Marcus Freeman, I could not be happier with the pick. Yes, Swarbrick took a swing for the fences with MF. Will it be a home run or a long fly to the warning track? (I hope not a pop fly to shortstop.) Time will tell. But you greatly underestimate Jack Swarbrick if you think he hired MF in a "rush to judgment."

One thing I very much like about MF is that he oozes character. To a man, virtually all of his players confirm that. Did you read the story Drue Tranquill related about MF? That story told me a lot about Marcus Freeman the man, and how he relates to other people. I don't know whether that will translate to wins on the grid iron, but I like our chances.

 

[Zorich 88]

Freeman is very impressive in interviews. And he did a nice job as defensive coordinator this season, similar to Elko and Lea, maybe not quite as good as Lea who had solid defenses throughout the season.

But Freeman is no where near ready to be head coach of ND. No other major program was considering him and Swarbrick bid against himself. It boggles the mind he didn’t go after Fickell or another proven head coach.

The recruiting fan boys (you know who I’m talking about) love this hire, which is a warning sign. So do the rah rah beat reporters like Sampson and Loy who struggle to see the forest from the tree’s. I’ll never understand the urgency to keep a couple high school recruits committed when you’re hiring a coach for the next decade. It’s shortsighted and the same trap USC and so many other AD’s have fallen into.

One of Lou Somogyi’s major rules in his lifetime of following Notre Dame football
was that no assistant coach has ever worked out as head coach at ND. He would always quote Ara and Bob Davie saying the same thing. Those who don’t remember the past are condemned to repeat it.

Kelly had this program rolling, the infrastructure is as good as it’s been in 30 years, but predicting in 4-5 years Freeman will be an assistant coach in the NFL, and ND will be looking for a new coach to rebuild.

Really hope I’m wrong. I’m as diehard an ND fan as you’ll ever meet, but history and a lifetime of following college football tells me ND is about to regress.

Let me give you to names:

Dabo and Riley

Check both coaches experiences prior to being named HC.

It looks almost identical to Freeman. Age/experience. Except Dabo was NEVER even a Coordinator!

I bet there were a few people on the Sooners and Tigers message boards that posted a lot of words similar to yours.

But simply put, you are wrong!

 

[banmate6]

You sound like someone with an IQ north of 135. As well-reasoned a case for not hiring Freeman as I’ve seen here. And I’m with you on about 95% of it.

Some additional points I’ve thought about based on some – though NOT ALL – of your comments:

• Whenever you see such universal euphoria and positive emoting over something that should be approached on a highly rational basis, you know people are betting with their hearts not their heads. It’s a dead giveaway. This is a feel good story people are INSISTING they tell themselves. Anyone standing in the way of it needs to realize that they’re staring down a runaway FREIGHT TRAIN. The flip side, of course, is that any sharp REVERSAL OF FORTUNE here will make for ONE ANGRY TRAIN WRECK.
• I don’t think Swarbrick made a decision so much as he was FORCED into making the one he made. The PERCEPTION was that he couldn’t let this recruiting class and the next one fall apart. It would have been the equivalent of losing TOO MUCH CAPITAL in a share market. Besides, he doesn’t have to wait FIVE YEARS to ax Freeman if he doesn’t work out. The movement of coaches AND players is about to become BREATHTAKINGLY FLUID. The way things are TRENDING, you may see a coach fired after ONE BAD GAME.
• I don’t know where things stood with Fickell who was my own hands-down choice. Question is, aside from ND’s view of him – whatever it was – would he have been willing to PULL A KELLY? Leave his team in the lurch on the verge of possibly winning an NC? And would ND have ASKED HIM TO, thereby losing the HIGH MORAL GROUND it found itself standing on given Kelly’s fandango? And, yes, this is an ethical question. Because in situations like this, LYING can quickly become the order of the day and all decisions largely commercial IF YOU ALLOW THAT TO HAPPEN.
• Then there’s the entire social/cultural/justice issue, for which I’m sure I’ll be attacked over for bringing up. But was ND looking to strike a blow for EQUITY? And/or did it fear being labeled RACIST or CANCELLED if it DIDN’T PROMOTE FREEMAN? Though more muted at the time, both of these issues were HOVERING IN THE AIR with Willingham – both as respects his hiring AND firing. To put it bluntly, was ND afraid of losing the TEAM if Freeman wasn’t hired? To say that none of this couldn’t have POSSIBLY CROSSED ND’S BRAIN TRUST'S MINDS strikes me as EXTREMELY NAÏVE. Race is still the elephant in the room, and yet we punish ourselves BOTH FOR CONFRONTING IT AND NOT CONFRONTING IT. So then, did ND just CONFRONT IT, DODGE IT or simply TAKE A KNEE?
• Yet, regardless of ANY of these considerations, the ONE THING THAT SWARBRICK DID NOT BASE HIS DECISION ON is Freeman’s WON-LOSS RECORD AS A HEAD COACH. Because there isn’t any won-loss record. So, in PURELY PRAGMATIC TERMS this is a HOPE-BASED, PURE-FAITH HIRE with a lot of people looking for what they consider to be some LONG-OVERDUE, RIGHTEOUS OUTCOME. Will that happen? Who knows? But regardless of how it turns out, I strongly believe that Kelly forced ND into having to make a decision it had NO INTENTION, DEISRE or EXPECTATION of making. ND’s HAND HAS BEEN FORCED HERE. We’ll see how what’s basically a SHOTGUN MARRIAGE turns out.
• One afterthought concerning Kelly's decision -- Did he think he'd already lost the team to Freeman? And that the loyalty was already flowing in that direction? I wonder. After all, the coaches are staying with Freeman. Did Kelly view him as a rival or even usurper? Was Kelly's ego a factor?

You make excellent points. But ultimately it's about odds. On pure odds, Freeman will probably not make a quick and steady transition...simply because most non-head coaches without time in a big program don't.

But, my gut says he will be the exception indeed. He's got some positives some of us have discussed. It all comes down to: can he be what college football success now requires, an effective CEO, good at operations, game day football, as well as motivation and identifying talent.

He's going to have a lot of help at ND in the CEO areas.

 

[4-4-3]

You make excellent points. But ultimately it's about odds. On pure odds, Freeman will probably not make a quick and steady transition...simply because most non-head coaches without time in a big program don't.

But, my gut says he will be the exception indeed. He's got some positives some of us have discussed. It all comes down to: can he be what college football success now requires, an effective CEO, good at operations, game day football, as well as motivation and identifying talent.

He's going to have a lot of help at ND in the CEO areas.

Fair points.

Particularly re a seamless transition.

People seem to have forgotten that Kelly, despite his years of coaching and 72% W-L percentage, went 8-5 and 8-5 his first two seasons at ND.

Given the current euphoria bordering on hysteria over Freeman, if he goes 8-5 two years in a row, it will look pretty Faust-like to to today's SOCIAL MEDIA-MOLDED fan base.

And, yes, THE PERCEPTION is that Freeman has better players than Kelly had in 2010. But by 2012, those same Kelly players -- mainly the upperclassmen he'd inherited as underclassmen -- were, regardless of their talent level on paper, playing for an NC they may very well have won but for having to play Bama. Who was responsible for that? To a large extent, KELLY.

Will Freeman go 12-0 in year three and play for an NC? For ANYONE -- that would be a BIG ASK.

But, hey, THAT'S WHAT THE LAST GUY DID. And it's ALSO THE BAR.

 

[Patrirish]

Extremely insightful post.

I'd only further emphasize that the PANIC was the result of Swarbrick not having a viable short-term alternative if the recruits were to be retained.

The more I look at this -- and this is purely BLUE-SKY CONJECTURE -- the more it resembles a LEVERAGED REVERSE TAKEOVER. And while Freeman by no means DIRECTLY ORCHESTRATED IT, he certainly was the beneficiary.

Here's the scenario:

Kelly may have felt undermined by Freeman due to Freeman's overall appeal to players, recruits, fans, etc. and that may have contributed to Kelly's willingness to listen to LSU. In other words, Kelly may have sensed he was being ECLIPSED.

Once Kelly left and given the recruiting class issue, the signing day complication, Fickell's unavailability till after the playoff/bowl season and ND's players' EXTREMELY VOCAL DEMAND to hire Freeman, ND's Admin in a way LOST CONTROL of the situation and were basically FORCED to hire Freeman to protect a PERCEIVED STATUS QUO on the verge of becoming, under some as yet MYTHICAL Freeman regime, something STUPENDOUS in the very near future.

Clearly, there was a powershift that almost NECESSITATED hiring Freeman and as a result, a CLASSIC RUSH TO JUDGEMENT. Will this prove to have been a good thing in the end? NO ONE KNOWS. But it will certainly be remembered either way as a FLASH BANG DECISION made in the HEAT OF THE MOMENT.

Question for you:

Do you roll the dice on the long term future of Notre Dame football based on one recruiting class ?

That doesn’t seem like a prudent strategy or trade off to me !

 

[TheSodFather]

Question for you:

Do you roll the dice on the long term future of Notre Dame football based on one recruiting class ?

That doesn’t seem like a prudent strategy or trade off to me !

Luckily for us the expert, the guy who is paid to make that decision Jack Swarbrick doesn’t agree

His track record of picking coaches is pretty good. Your track record in general is not so good at pretty much anything

Stick to you day job!

 

[ftnfan62]

Definition of insanity is to do the same thing and expect different results. We have tried this multiple times as have others schools. The odds are not in our favor.

That said, he has a few things going for him that If it is to work out, we can probably point to.

He is an excellent recruiter. 5 stars hide coaching mistakes. Just ask UGA.

He has kept his staff in tact. Not like Elston and Tommy didn’t do good this year.

The players will play for him.

The ship has sailed, nothing we can do now but root for him and the Irish.

I so hope he is the first coach at ND to win a NY in year zero. I’d love to see BK have to live with that.

 

[4-4-3]

No offense, 4-4-3, but I think you've been watching too many Oliver Stone movies and are reading way too much into this. You are generally a thoughtful poster who articulates some interesting ideas, but I think you went off the rails on this post. Kelly didn't leave ND because of Marcus Freeman. He left ND because of his massive ego. That is all his move is about. I have been a supporter of Kelly, and am grateful for how he restored some stability to ND's football program, but based upon how he left the program--not why--I have a high degree of ambivalence over what his final legacy at ND will be. Maybe those feelings will change over time, but I don't expect you will ever see a statue of BK ever erected outside the Stadium. Kelly crossed the Rubicon by moving to LSU. What does it say about Brian Kelly that virtually none of his assistants decided to follow him to LSU despite what I expect were promises of much higher salaries? Does that speak to BK's character or that of the coaches who stayed behind?

As for Marcus Freeman, I could not be happier with the pick. Yes, Swarbrick took a swing for the fences with MF. Will it be a home run or a long fly to the warning track? (I hope not a pop fly to shortstop.) Time will tell. But you greatly underestimate Jack Swarbrick if you think he hired MF in a "rush to judgment."

One thing I very much like about MF is that he oozes character. To a man, virtually all of his players confirm that. Did you read the story Drue Tranquill related about MF? That story told me a lot about Marcus Freeman the man, and how he relates to other people. I don't know whether that will translate to wins on the grid iron, but I like our chances.

No offense taken. And what I was suggesting was only a scenario -- nothing I could reconstruct brick by brick.

Still, I think there were a number of underlying dynamics here and that Freeman may CLEARY have been preferred by the players to Kelly. Freeman is borderline Gen X/Millennial while Kelly is Late Boomer. I think the team GOT Freeman but not Kelly. The contrast was too strong and too much to Kelly's disadvantage. But that's simply my view.

As for the "rush to judgement" argument, I in no way mean to underestimate or otherwise denigrate Swarbrick. While I don't think he's BRILLIANT, he's certainly CLEVER, and I actually think he had LITTLE ROOM TO MANEUVER HERE. Personally, I would have gambled on holding the class together, but I can certainly understand his not wanting to take the chance.

Trouble was, there wasn't TIME ENOUGH to EVALUATE OTHER CANDIDATES. When is that ever optimal? NEVER -- except MAYBE when you're in the kind of crunch Swarbrick was faced with. Still, whenever you have to make a SNAP DECISION, you never find out what you NEVER GOT A CHANCE TO FIND OUT. Your criteria and options are then NECESSARILY REDUCED.

As for how Freeman will do, I'm pretty agnostic, and I avoid making predictions. My main concern is that he's being talked about by about 90% of the people on boards like this as TOTALLY CAN'T FAIL. To me, that's the HEART TALKING, not the head. Guys with far greater experience than Freeman have not only had severe growing pains but have also outright failed. Those, too, are plausible outcomes. So, I'm already PSYCHOLOGICALLY HEDGED as per NEXT SEASON.

 

[TheSodFather]

Definition of insanity is to do the same thing and expect different results. We have tried this multiple times as have others schools. The odds are not in our favor.

That said, he has a few things going for him that If it is to work out, we can probably point to.

He is an excellent recruiter. 5 stars hide coaching mistakes. Just ask UGA.

He has kept his staff in tact. Not like Elston and Tommy didn’t do good this year.

The players will play for him.

The ship has sailed, nothing we can do now but root for him and the Irish.

I so hope he is the first coach at ND to win a NY in year zero. I’d love to see BK have to live with that.

Times are different. Freeman is getting the job based on the leadership skills of an 11 month job interview which he exhibited the total package.

Jack just spent 12 years with Kelly and helped guide him through his early issues and the 4-8

He mentored and helped BK make the changes necessary for the past 5 years to happen

Swarbrick is still here. He is obviously going to take a role in helping mentor MF as he learns his new responsibility’s.

They have insulated him by keeping the core staff and letting him play to his strengths as he develops his identity as head coach.

The environment has been and continues to be built around him to be as successful as his talent takes him which is the same as it would be for any coach.

Right now his talent and their confidence in supporting him far outweigh any growing pains. If your paying attention you can see Jack and ND are building this thing perfectly right now

 

[4-4-3]

Question for you:

Do you roll the dice on the long term future of Notre Dame football based on one recruiting class ?

That doesn’t seem like a prudent strategy or trade off to me !

Personally, no.

As I mentioned in my post, the situation "almost necessitated" Swarbrick hiring Freeman, but I stopped short of saying he had no choice but to do it. And, as it was, I called it a "rush to judgement."

But I do understand the difficulty of the situation he was in and the resulting calculus.

Still, myself, I would not have done it as I don't like making snap decisions. For me, examining as many options as possible has always turned out better.

There's no question that hiring a head coach at ND who doesn't have prior head coaching experience is a HUGE GAMBLE. That many don't seem to realize this I find surprising. But then, people often think that the SHINY NEW THING has MAGICAL POWERS.

 

[HRC08]

Truth is.. he wasn't going to be available for a couple of weeks. We lose our two classes, a bunch of players hit the portal and we're back to 2010.

Freeman was going to either become HFBC at ND or would be coaching somewhere else in ‘22.

Marcus Freeman will never again consider Luke Fickell a friend. That bridge is burned and it’s not because of Freeman.

Message Board fans didn’t hold sway with jack swarbrick but I do believe his hands were tied here. Fans, players, recruits AND former players were showing their vocal support of Marcus Freeman.. Hell even Dick Vitale Tweeted out his support for MF and added a recommendation that I held and posted on this board “Let him hire an ex Head Coach like Nick Saban does.” in order to placate the group hesitant due to his lack of experience.

Frankly I was surprised so many felt the same as I did. Maybe times are a changing and ND is starting to become a younger more hip program and fan base.

 

[tbone3114]

Freeman is very impressive in interviews. And he did a nice job as defensive coordinator this season, similar to Elko and Lea, maybe not quite as good as Lea who had solid defenses throughout the season.

But Freeman is no where near ready to be head coach of ND. No other major program was considering him and Swarbrick bid against himself. It boggles the mind he didn’t go after Fickell or another proven head coach.

The recruiting fan boys (you know who I’m talking about) love this hire, which is a warning sign. So do the rah rah beat reporters like Sampson and Loy who struggle to see the forest from the tree’s. I’ll never understand the urgency to keep a couple high school recruits committed when you’re hiring a coach for the next decade. It’s shortsighted and the same trap USC and so many other AD’s have fallen into.

One of Lou Somogyi’s major rules in his lifetime of following Notre Dame football
was that no assistant coach has ever worked out as head coach at ND. He would always quote Ara and Bob Davie saying the same thing. Those who don’t remember the past are condemned to repeat it.

Kelly had this program rolling, the infrastructure is as good as it’s been in 30 years, but predicting in 4-5 years Freeman will be an assistant coach in the NFL, and ND will be looking for a new coach to rebuild.

Really hope I’m wrong. I’m as diehard an ND fan as you’ll ever meet, but history and a lifetime of following college football tells me ND is about to regress.

FREEMAN will succeed!!! and be around for a long time! Those who lack discernment and vision .... they call them experts!

 

[tbone3114]

Extremely insightful post.

I'd only further emphasize that the PANIC was the result of Swarbrick not having a viable short-term alternative if the recruits were to be retained.

The more I look at this -- and this is purely BLUE-SKY CONJECTURE -- the more it resembles a LEVERAGED REVERSE TAKEOVER. And while Freeman by no means DIRECTLY ORCHESTRATED IT, he certainly was the beneficiary.

Here's the scenario:

Kelly may have felt undermined by Freeman due to Freeman's overall appeal to players, recruits, fans, etc. and that may have contributed to Kelly's willingness to listen to LSU. In other words, Kelly may have sensed he was being ECLIPSED.

Once Kelly left and given the recruiting class issue, the signing day complication, Fickell's unavailability till after the playoff/bowl season and ND's players' EXTREMELY VOCAL DEMAND to hire Freeman, ND's Admin in a way LOST CONTROL of the situation and were basically FORCED to hire Freeman to protect a PERCEIVED STATUS QUO on the verge of becoming, under some as yet MYTHICAL Freeman regime, something STUPENDOUS in the very near future.

Clearly, there was a powershift that almost NECESSITATED hiring Freeman and as a result, a CLASSIC RUSH TO JUDGEMENT. Will this prove to have been a good thing in the end? NO ONE KNOWS. But it will certainly be remembered either way as a FLASH BANG DECISION made in the HEAT OF THE MOMENT.

I am just thankful it was not your responsibility to hire the next head coach! Freeman WILL SUCCEED ... and he will bring a NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP to ND...First black coach to win a National championship!!!!!

 

[4-4-3]

I am just thankful it was not your responsibility to hire the next head coach! Freeman WILL SUCCEED ... and he will bring a NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP to ND...First black coach to win a National championship!!!!!

You can't be any gladder it wasn't my job than I am.

And you're entirely welcome to your fervent religious belief. You would have made a great CRUSADER beneath the walls of Jerusalem.

DEUS VULT (God Wills It).

 

[SIhoosier26]

Right. And so if he goes 9-3 for the next four years, then what?

It's true about ND fans, it really is, it is a fair statement.... ND fans don't want to win. Winning is incidental. They might want to talk about winning...

But that's where it ends. That's all really ND fans want is to talk. Talk and talk and talk and talk.... And frankly it's boring to talk about winning. The only fun for you guys is repeatedly, almost ritually tearing into the negative. And then when your bluff is actually called, nervously convincing yourselves that everything's going to be awesome, and your old coach really was bad.

And eventually you'll just move on to the next one, and then rinse and repeat or however the expression goes...

Then go somewhere else, you post like a child who's mad that he didn't get the toy he wanted in his happy meal.

Give it up, BK won nothing and he quit on his team before a potential playoff birth. He's an asshole.

 

[SIhoosier26]

It wasnt. Id say Dabo, Ryan Day, Riley recent success as young 1st time coaches at major programs played a role. Then the staff, players, alumni rallying around Freeman & im sure Swarbrick's own interactions with Freeman were the main reasons. Keeping a top 5 class together played a part but wasnt the only reason.

Two top 5 classes, if it was Luke Fickell it would be the 2024 class most likely before he would be on an even playing field in terms of recruiting. One of the main reasons I hate the early signing period.

 

[88ND]

I hear ya. I’m a positive person and hate to be down on a hire from day 1, but looking at Fickell’s record the guy can flat out coach.

4-8
11-3
11-2
10-1
12-0

You just wonder what Fickell is quietly thinking. Fwiw, I heard he wanted the ND job. Devout Catholic. He hired Freeman, and had great defenses with and without him.

Uuuhhh....
1-0
10-3
11-3
12-0

You know what that is?

Brian Kelly's record @Cincinnati.

In 12 years he beat one top 5 team without it's all world QB @ home.

Major bowl win? No.
Playoff win? No.
Competitive in either? NO!!!

Fickell might be a grear coach but using his record @Cinci to sell it is absurd.

Look at Ara's and Lou's records prior to their hiring.

Saban's record @ MSU?

There is no science to this shit especially using a record from Cinci. It only means he's doing good at Cincinnati. That's it!!

 

[88ND]

Two top 5 classes, if it was Luke Fickell it would be the 2024 class most likely before he would be on an even playing field in terms of recruiting. One of the main reasons I hate the early signing period.

Agreed and this rush to get signed and get on campus early is horseshit. These kids need time to still be a kid.
The NFL pipe dream isn't realized by 98 percent of college football players. In other words you ain't playing on Sunday's no matter how soon you get on campus.
You might get lucky and get a sunday call...but by and large MOST never play past Saturday. MOST!

 

[UDPride]

An hire not named Saban would be a risk.

The difference between this internal promotion and all the other ND promotions that failed is Notre Dame football is in a very different place in this latest move. Those other ones were at a time when the Irish were slipping. Holtz's final years were slipping. Those others are just from the stone age and arent even relevant.

Freeman doesnt need to re-invent the wheel. He just needs to polish the one in front of him.

 

[bullpride9]

To properly analyze the Freeman hire everyone must look at all the texture and layers that AD Swarbrick had to consider. Once considered it is clear this was the wisest course of action given the circumstances. Notre Dame's decision was forced on them by Brian Kelly. For those that are unsure or uncomfortable with the Freeman hiring (I am not among them), remember Brian Kelly has done something unprecedented for a coach trying to cement a positive top tier college football legacy. No coach leaves a program on the eve of a possible decision for that team to make the college playoffs, with a possibility to compete once again for a National Championship. NO COACH. A coach trying to instill a Hall of Fame legacy sticks it out, and then after the season, if he's had too much, or worn out his welcome he retires, suggests he needs to spend more time with his family and long days in the sun. He recommends a coach as his heir and allows Swarbrick to go on a national coaching search with the 2022 class intact, and assistants not looking to jump ship ASAP, and him not trying to poach them too. For recent perspective this is how Bob Stoops, and Urban Meyer (unbelievable giving this guy credit for something classy) went out from Oklahoma, and OSU respectively, hell even Lou eventually took a job at South Carolina, but spent some time away. You spend a year in the broadcast booth surveying the landscape, surely if ND made the playoff once again this year, he would be the top candidate for any job that opened up....Penn State, FSU, UF....just as Bob Stoops' name gets bandied about virtually every time a job comes open.

Brian Kelly instead chose the path of least resistance, and worse than that he chose the classless route leaving the program on the alter staring down the precipice once again of greatness, a national title. Who has ever done that in the history of college athletics, let alone leaving one of the top programs of all time in that circumstance? Brian Kelly affirmed to all he cared very little for those players, coaches, certainly the University, and fans. It almost feels like Brian Kelly was afraid of the thought this team might actually make the playoffs, not measure up, and his legacy would get further cemented as the guy failing to win the big one, which could possibly mean no LSU, or PSU, or FSU, or UF offer in the future. This could go down as the most selfish decision of all-time among coaches from college and pro- WHICH IS SAYING A LOT!

Now about the decision to hire Freeman, Brian Kelly's decision to sneak out of town in the dead of night with no concern for the state of the program left Swarbrick very limited room to work with. This is a 6th ranked 11-1 team, with a real chance to make the playoffs. What is bigger for Notre Dame is not how we perform in the playoffs, but rather possibly getting selected and being capable of telling the world, AND RECRUITS, we are the ONLY TEAM who has been in the playoffs 3 of the last 4 years (presuming Alabama loses to UGA this weekend as expected). That's huge, historic even, and to think Brian Kelly's decision could have possibly derailed this circumstance makes it as appalling as it was shocking.

Swarbrick could have spent a long time deliberating over this, as some say don't let a recruiting class dictate a long-term decision....however that's looking at this decision in a vacuum, that's assuming BK gave ADS time to deliberate and do a true national search. That's presuming maybe things in the football program were not what they seemed and new blood, and new life needed to be injected. By ALL ACCOUNTS, this football program is now on as good of footing as it was since the 88-93 period, which is amazing. Players and recruits all talk about the 'family atmosphere' created at ND, a 'brotherhood' which was established and maintained by that football staff, and the football operations staff like Balis. Sit around and wait for Fickell to get through this run, as it has been rumored was his desire, could destroy all that has been built around the program. This isn't about one, or two classes, this is about an environment and atmosphere, a brotherhood where players coming in want to play for, and stick around in. Yes, Kelly helped forge that, but he's not what maintained it, and nurtured it, those were all the coaches retained. Those type of environments are hard to create, but easy to breakdown. An environment where there are now rumors Foskey, and the twins are considering returning, possibly Lugg (don't be fullish to argue that losing a 6th year versatile lineman would be good), and Bauer, as well as possibly Austin, and Lenzy. Those guys don't even contemplate that if this all fell apart this week. That's a culture that is hard to re-create, and one we would undoubtedly take a risk, or hope that a Fickell or other coach could replicate once we made that decision on them in the next 1-4 weeks.

In today's world of hypersensitivity, and rapid-fire decision making it's critical for leaders to make decisions quickly and contingency for change not concerning themselves with outside influences- everyone has an opinion and are not afraid to voice it on social media. The thought of seeing a half-dozen or more of the staff walk out the door, several kids transfer out, few NFL eligible players decide not to return, and a recruiting class disintegrate and a future class looking to be top 3 to fall apart while we wait, weeks upon weeks for a possible successor to Kelly wasn't prudent at this juncture, because Kelly made it that way. Furthermore, if a few chips fall this weekend and by chance 2-3 teams ahead of ND lose, it would be even more horrible to see the Selection Committee decide on a two-loss program like Alabama, or OKST hop ahead of us because the Selection Committee deems to much turmoil in the ND program to warrant a selection, we lose miserably in whatever NYD bowl we attend....and then Fickell or the new coach are in a modest rebuild job, and the existing culture is decimated.

This decision was an easy one, a no brainer quite frankly, particularly since it came with most of the key components of the existing coaches, and support staff as well as full player, and recruiting class buy-in. That speaks to how they all think of Freeman too which is an outstanding sign, and quite a bit of what they think of Kelly which is also interesting. This decision could have the potential to end like Coker at Miami, which is fine by me, if it warrants a national title and going 35-3 over the next 3 years which is what Coker did his first 3 years chalked full of top tier talent at Miami. As assistants departed, and less quality returned, and Coker didn't have the chops to replenish and maintain the culture things slowly slid sideways (and many University related issues plagued Miami that were out of Coker's control too), but I think anyone would take that legacy if it came with a National Title. You see really it is not about this decision, which was the only prudent one for AD Swarbrick to make because Brian Kelly forced it, it is about the next one. The sample size is large enough to clearly illustrate Freeman is among the most elite recruiters in the nation, so worst case is Freeman struggles a bit, and as someone analogously compared this circumstance to possibly the Ron Zook era at UF where Zook went 23-15 but assembled an unprecedented amount of talent at UF which allowed Urban to immediately step in and dominate- I believe the worst case will be a blend between Coker and Zook, because Coker's situation more closely resembles Freeman's- so this decision was the right one, the one that will be critical is Swarbrick's next one. Swarbrick smartly didn't risk breaking everything down with hopes his next hire could rebuild, he instead maintained with hopefully the sense to keep a close eye on the program and ready to pull the trigger if he sees anything starting to faulter. If Freeman doesn't turn out to be the next Dabo how quickly will he pull the trigger to get the program right, and if he does turn out to be the next Dabo...well turn the lights out Swarbrick was a genius, or rather Brian Kelly's dirtbag move did us all a favor.

 

[BM16]

Freeman is very impressive in interviews. And he did a nice job as defensive coordinator this season, similar to Elko and Lea, maybe not quite as good as Lea who had solid defenses throughout the season.

But Freeman is no where near ready to be head coach of ND. No other major program was considering him and Swarbrick bid against himself. It boggles the mind he didn’t go after Fickell or another proven head coach.

The recruiting fan boys (you know who I’m talking about) love this hire, which is a warning sign. So do the rah rah beat reporters like Sampson and Loy who struggle to see the forest from the tree’s. I’ll never understand the urgency to keep a couple high school recruits committed when you’re hiring a coach for the next decade. It’s shortsighted and the same trap USC and so many other AD’s have fallen into.

One of Lou Somogyi’s major rules in his lifetime of following Notre Dame football
was that no assistant coach has ever worked out as head coach at ND. He would always quote Ara and Bob Davie saying the same thing. Those who don’t remember the past are condemned to repeat it.

Kelly had this program rolling, the infrastructure is as good as it’s been in 30 years, but predicting in 4-5 years Freeman will be an assistant coach in the NFL, and ND will be looking for a new coach to rebuild.

Really hope I’m wrong. I’m as diehard an ND fan as you’ll ever meet, but history and a lifetime of following college football tells me ND is about to regress.

There are legitimate concerns. It's a risk, as is ANY coaching hire. We just have to see how it pans out on the field. I'm not upset Freeman is the choice, I'm not elated and jumping up and down with excitement with it either. If the players seem to gravitate towards him like they do, and some of the coaches too, that's a heck of a start. Buying in is all part of the process. What we will learn next year is how prepared Freeman is to manage the team, manage in the heat of the moment in games and make the adjustments necessary when they are needed.

 

[r2p2]

To properly analyze the Freeman hire everyone must look at all the texture and layers that AD Swarbrick had to consider. Once considered it is clear this was the wisest course of action given the circumstances. Notre Dame's decision was forced on them by Brian Kelly. For those that are unsure or uncomfortable with the Freeman hiring (I am not among them), remember Brian Kelly has done something unprecedented for a coach trying to cement a positive top tier college football legacy. No coach leaves a program on the eve of a possible decision for that team to make the college playoffs, with a possibility to compete once again for a National Championship. NO COACH. A coach trying to instill a Hall of Fame legacy sticks it out, and then after the season, if he's had too much, or worn out his welcome he retires, suggests he needs to spend more time with his family and long days in the sun. He recommends a coach as his heir and allows Swarbrick to go on a national coaching search with the 2022 class intact, and assistants not looking to jump ship ASAP, and him not trying to poach them too. For recent perspective this is how Bob Stoops, and Urban Meyer (unbelievable giving this guy credit for something classy) went out from Oklahoma, and OSU respectively, hell even Lou eventually took a job at South Carolina, but spent some time away. You spend a year in the broadcast booth surveying the landscape, surely if ND made the playoff once again this year, he would be the top candidate for any job that opened up....Penn State, FSU, UF....just as Bob Stoops' name gets bandied about virtually every time a job comes open.

Brian Kelly instead chose the path of least resistance, and worse than that he chose the classless route leaving the program on the alter staring down the precipice once again of greatness, a national title. Who has ever done that in the history of college athletics, let alone leaving one of the top programs of all time in that circumstance? Brian Kelly affirmed to all he cared very little for those players, coaches, certainly the University, and fans. It almost feels like Brian Kelly was afraid of the thought this team might actually make the playoffs, not measure up, and his legacy would get further cemented as the guy failing to win the big one, which could possibly mean no LSU, or PSU, or FSU, or UF offer in the future. This could go down as the most selfish decision of all-time among coaches from college and pro- WHICH IS SAYING A LOT!

Now about the decision to hire Freeman, Brian Kelly's decision to sneak out of town in the dead of night with no concern for the state of the program left Swarbrick very limited room to work with. This is a 6th ranked 11-1 team, with a real chance to make the playoffs. What is bigger for Notre Dame is not how we perform in the playoffs, but rather possibly getting selected and being capable of telling the world, AND RECRUITS, we are the ONLY TEAM who has been in the playoffs 3 of the last 4 years (presuming Alabama loses to UGA this weekend as expected). That's huge, historic even, and to think Brian Kelly's decision could have possibly derailed this circumstance makes it as appalling as it was shocking.

Swarbrick could have spent a long time deliberating over this, as some say don't let a recruiting class dictate a long-term decision....however that's looking at this decision in a vacuum, that's assuming BK gave ADS time to deliberate and do a true national search. That's presuming maybe things in the football program were not what they seemed and new blood, and new life needed to be injected. By ALL ACCOUNTS, this football program is now on as good of footing as it was since the 88-93 period, which is amazing. Players and recruits all talk about the 'family atmosphere' created at ND, a 'brotherhood' which was established and maintained by that football staff, and the football operations staff like Balis. Sit around and wait for Fickell to get through this run, as it has been rumored was his desire, could destroy all that has been built around the program. This isn't about one, or two classes, this is about an environment and atmosphere, a brotherhood where players coming in want to play for, and stick around in. Yes, Kelly helped forge that, but he's not what maintained it, and nurtured it, those were all the coaches retained. Those type of environments are hard to create, but easy to breakdown. An environment where there are now rumors Foskey, and the twins are considering returning, possibly Lugg (don't be fullish to argue that losing a 6th year versatile lineman would be good), and Bauer, as well as possibly Austin, and Lenzy. Those guys don't even contemplate that if this all fell apart this week. That's a culture that is hard to re-create, and one we would undoubtedly take a risk, or hope that a Fickell or other coach could replicate once we made that decision on them in the next 1-4 weeks.

In today's world of hypersensitivity, and rapid-fire decision making it's critical for leaders to make decisions quickly and contingency for change not concerning themselves with outside influences- everyone has an opinion and are not afraid to voice it on social media. The thought of seeing a half-dozen or more of the staff walk out the door, several kids transfer out, few NFL eligible players decide not to return, and a recruiting class disintegrate and a future class looking to be top 3 to fall apart while we wait, weeks upon weeks for a possible successor to Kelly wasn't prudent at this juncture, because Kelly made it that way. Furthermore, if a few chips fall this weekend and by chance 2-3 teams ahead of ND lose, it would be even more horrible to see the Selection Committee decide on a two-loss program like Alabama, or OKST hop ahead of us because the Selection Committee deems to much turmoil in the ND program to warrant a selection, we lose miserably in whatever NYD bowl we attend....and then Fickell or the new coach are in a modest rebuild job, and the existing culture is decimated.

This decision was an easy one, a no brainer quite frankly, particularly since it came with most of the key components of the existing coaches, and support staff as well as full player, and recruiting class buy-in. That speaks to how they all think of Freeman too which is an outstanding sign, and quite a bit of what they think of Kelly which is also interesting. This decision could have the potential to end like Coker at Miami, which is fine by me, if it warrants a national title and going 35-3 over the next 3 years which is what Coker did his first 3 years chalked full of top tier talent at Miami. As assistants departed, and less quality returned, and Coker didn't have the chops to replenish and maintain the culture things slowly slid sideways (and many University related issues plagued Miami that were out of Coker's control too), but I think anyone would take that legacy if it came with a National Title. You see really it is not about this decision, which was the only prudent one for AD Swarbrick to make because Brian Kelly forced it, it is about the next one. The sample size is large enough to clearly illustrate Freeman is among the most elite recruiters in the nation, so worst case is Freeman struggles a bit, and as someone analogously compared this circumstance to possibly the Ron Zook era at UF where Zook went 23-15 but assembled an unprecedented amount of talent at UF which allowed Urban to immediately step in and dominate- I believe the worst case will be a blend between Coker and Zook, because Coker's situation more closely resembles Freeman's- so this decision was the right one, the one that will be critical is Swarbrick's next one. Swarbrick smartly didn't risk breaking everything down with hopes his next hire could rebuild, he instead maintained with hopefully the sense to keep a close eye on the program and ready to pull the trigger if he sees anything starting to faulter. If Freeman doesn't turn out to be the next Dabo how quickly will he pull the trigger to get the program right, and if he does turn out to be the next Dabo...well turn the lights out Swarbrick was a genius, or rather Brian Kelly's dirtbag move did us all a favor.

suddenly eyes are opened

 

[twalsh]

Marcus Freeman will never again consider Luke Fickell a friend. That bridge is burned and it’s not because of Freeman.

Huh? Why do you think that?

 

[familypsychologist]

Extremely insightful post.

I'd only further emphasize that the PANIC was the result of Swarbrick not having a viable short-term alternative if the recruits were to be retained.

The more I look at this -- and this is purely BLUE-SKY CONJECTURE -- the more it resembles a LEVERAGED REVERSE TAKEOVER. And while Freeman by no means DIRECTLY ORCHESTRATED IT, he certainly was the beneficiary.

Here's the scenario:

Kelly may have felt undermined by Freeman due to Freeman's overall appeal to players, recruits, fans, etc. and that may have contributed to Kelly's willingness to listen to LSU. In other words, Kelly may have sensed he was being ECLIPSED.

Once Kelly left and given the recruiting class issue, the signing day complication, Fickell's unavailability till after the playoff/bowl season and ND's players' EXTREMELY VOCAL DEMAND to hire Freeman, ND's Admin in a way LOST CONTROL of the situation and were basically FORCED to hire Freeman to protect a PERCEIVED STATUS QUO on the verge of becoming, under some as yet MYTHICAL Freeman regime, something STUPENDOUS in the very near future.

Clearly, there was a powershift that almost NECESSITATED hiring Freeman and as a result, a CLASSIC RUSH TO JUDGEMENT. Will this prove to have been a good thing in the end? NO ONE KNOWS. But it will certainly be remembered either way as a FLASH BANG DECISION made in the HEAT OF THE MOMENT.

This conjecture appears untenable. It was reported BK intended to make MF the highest paid assistant coach in the land if he went to LSU. BK, a relatively astute and experienced head coach, unequivocally would not hire MF at LSU if he believed MF usurped his role as head coarch.

 

[notredamerises23]

BK had the program rolling today compared to his 4-8 season of 2016...

But the program isn't rolling when talking about elite teams around the country.

You haven’t been posting for the entire season and are back now—interesting. Yes, BK had the program rolling right at the doorstep of something really big with these upcoming classses, something you yourself said in another thread. If the program weren’t rolling, why would it hire an assistant from the staff?

 

[88ND]

You haven’t been posting for the entire season and are back now—interesting. Yes, BK had the program rolling right at the doorstep of something really big with these upcoming classses, something you yourself said in another thread. If the program weren’t rolling, why would it hire an assistant from the staff?

He's been at the doorstep nearly all of hid 12 years (minus the 4-8 seadon) and that's the problem.

The only thing I said pro BK was he finally cleaned up some of the self inflicted damage like falase starts, wasting timeouts...etc. then he leaves.

Big picture good riddance.
12 years of almost is very telling. Honestly it's worse than you think.
This season was the weakest schedule ND had since possibly ever. That's not his fault the teams turned out to be weak but the lone tough game was a loss per usual. It was even at home.

Last year in a weird covid season he finally beat a top 5 team but without it's star QB. One top 5 victory in 12 years?
Good luck in the Bayou and thank you for coming.

 

[savvyandsassier]

He's been at the doorstep nearly all of hid 12 years (minus the 4-8 seadon) and that's the problem.

The only thing I said pro BK was he finally cleaned up some of the self inflicted damage like falase starts, wasting timeouts...etc. then he leaves.

Big picture good riddance.
12 years of almost is very telling. Honestly it's worse than you think.
This season was the weakest schedule ND had since possibly ever. That's not his fault the teams turned out to be weak but the lone tough game was a loss per usual. It was even at home.

Last year in a weird covid season he finally beat a top 5 team but without it's star QB. One top 5 victory in 12 years?
Good luck in the Bayou and thank you for coming.

You realize that a Marcus Freeman-coached team will also have false starts? They will also blow timeouts. Just to remind you of that.

Will Marcus Freeman go 43-3 over the next four years? That's to be determined.....

 

[Zorich 88]

You realize that a Marcus Freeman-coached team will also have false starts? They will also blow timeouts. Just to remind you of that.

Will Marcus Freeman go 43-3 over the next four years? That's to be determined.....

Tommy Reese is also apart of that 43-3 record. So is a lot of the staff.

43-3 was not all because of Kelly.

 

[savvyandsassier]

Tommy Reese is also apart of that 43-3 record. So is a lot of the staff.

43-3 was not all because of Kelly.

Why are you spelling his name wrong? I thought you liked Tommy Rees now. Why would you disrespect him by deliberately spelling his name wrong....

And no, that's not true. He gets all the credit. Under these circumstances he gets all the credit.

 

[88ND]

You realize that a Marcus Freeman-coached team will also have false starts? They will also blow timeouts. Just to remind you of that.

Will Marcus Freeman go 43-3 over the next four years? That's to be determined.....

Just to remind...no no...enlighten you...
I haven't advocated for Freeman nor opposed the hiring.
I am however very pro new chapter that's been over due as the BK tenure has showed it's ceiling long ago.

I'm curious why you've got this somber attitude about BK leaving. If you're ok with just being a good team BK is your guy.
If you'd like to compete the best in CFB he's not. That's not opinion. That's 12 years of documented embarrassing performances on the grandest stages.

What am I missing here?

 

[Kontiki09]

This conjecture appears untenable. It was reported BK intended to make MF the highest paid assistant coach in the land if he went to LSU. BK, a relatively astute and experienced head coach, unequivocally would not hire MF at LSU if he believed MF usurped his role as head coarch.

AND if Kelly were to ever get usurped by MF, it would absolutely be at LSU, where the fans would certainly relate to MF more than BK.

That conjecture is not only untenable, but it also flies in the face of logic. Not a good take IMO.

 

[Zorich 88]

Why are you spelling his name wrong? I thought you liked Tommy Rees now. Why would you disrespect him by deliberately spelling his name wrong....

And no, that's not true. He gets all the credit. Under these circumstances he gets all the credit.

I get it, you really don't wanna debate, you just wanna post garbage. Go get your Tiger gear and hit the road.

 

[savvyandsassier]

Just to remind...no no...enlighten you...
I haven't advocated for Freeman nor opposed the hiring.
I am however very pro new chapter that's been over due as the BK tenure has showed it's ceiling long ago.

I'm curious why you've got this somber attitude about BK leaving. If you're ok with just being a good team BK is your guy.
If you'd like to compete the best in CFB he's not. That's not opinion. That's 12 years of documented embarrassing performances on the grandest stages.

What am I missing here?

Okay, well that's fine... I'm just saying that even though the excitement around Freeman is rocking and rolling, that the team isn't going magically never make mistakes anymore... They'll probably make them about as much BK's teams did. Again, because football teams make mistakes....

And what are you talking about, I love BK! I'm not going to rehash the whole thing, and my love affair with BK.... But I was devastated by him leaving. Shit happens, it's not the end of the world, but I figured he'd coach for three more years and retire with honors off into the sunset. So I was obviously devastated....

Naturally, i've always chafed at all the toxic BK haters swarming around the ND fan world. Though really it's only been these last several seasons that it's reached a fever pitch, which is insanely ironic given how BK 2.0 was finally able to restore ND to the top of CFB universe, and yet the haters have never been more full of themselves than they have been right up to now. Pretty much when Ian Book took over at QB, and the team's winning run really began... It was kind of a combo deal. The Book/Brian years really seemed to shoot it into orbit, what had up to that point been more of a low-boil steady dislike and disrespect for the guy....

I figure that's why BK left. He wanted out. The money was good too, there's no doubt. But he was ready to get out of dodge, and I think we can both see why. Look at this place! And it's all over twitter, it's everywhere, the orgy of BK-bashing from ND fans and assorted online hangers-on. I'm just ready for a tic toc video of BK being burned in effigy on a row boat on the campus pond, whatever that lake is called.....

I guess it's called St. Mary's Lake....

 

[88ND]

Okay, well that's fine... I'm just saying that even though the excitement around Freeman is rocking and rolling, that the team isn't going magically never make mistakes anymore... They'll probably make them about as much BK's teams did. Again, because football teams make mistakes....

And what are you talking about, I love BK! I'm not going to rehash the whole thing, and my love affair with BK.... But I was devastated by him leaving. Shit happens, it's not the end of the world, but I figured he'd coach for three more years and retire with honors off into the sunset. So I was obviously devastated....

Naturally, i've always chafed at all the toxic BK haters swarming around the ND fan world. Though really it's only been these last several seasons that it's reached a fever pitch, which is insanely ironic given how BK 2.0 was finally able to restore ND to the top of CFB universe, and yet the haters have never been more full of themselves than they have been right up to now. Pretty much when Ian Book took over at QB, and the team's winning run really began... It was kind of a combo deal. The Book/Brian years really seemed to shoot it into orbit, what had up to that point been more of a low-boil steady dislike and disrespect for the guy....

I figure that's why BK left. He wanted out. The money was good too, there's no doubt. But he was ready to get out of dodge, and I think we can both see why. Look at this place! And it's all over twitter, it's everywhere, the orgy of BK-bashing from ND fans and assorted online hangers-on. I'm just ready for a tic toc video of BK being burned in effigy on a row boat on the campus pond, whatever that lake is called.....

I guess it's called St. Mary's Lake....

This is what I don't understand.

You say resurrect to the top of the football world.

What have we won under BK.

I'm NOT talking titles because you need luck for that to happen.

1 win against a top 5 team in twelve years in a weird covid season playing it's #2 QB....that's it. That's Brian Kelly's biggest win in 12 years.

Major Bowl or playoff win? Zip.
Competitive in either? Just being competitive mind you...in either of those? Nope.

Things will be ok without BK. I promise you.

 

[savvyandsassier]

This is what I don't understand.

You say resurrect to the top of the football world.

What have we won under BK.

I'm NOT talking titles because you need luck for that to happen.

1 win against a top 5 team in twelve years in a weird covid season playing it's #2 QB....that's it. That's Brian Kelly's biggest win in 12 years.

Major Bowl or playoff win? Zip.
Competitive in either? Just being competitive mind you...in either of those? Nope.

Things will be ok without BK. I promise you.

I'm not going to do this. BK has brought ND to the very top of CFB world. That's inarguable. We haven't won a championship, that's particularly hard to do. At least you grant that much.

But everything else is aces! And it's BK's doing, it just is. He's the coach.... And that's all there is to that!

And so Marcus Freeman got the call to replace him, he was already on staff so he knows what he's getting himself into. And let's see if he can take the handoff and finally get it over the line... He looks like a star in the making, so we'll see...

I was just recapping how I'm a huge BK supporter, and obviously I'm very disappointed, to say the least, in all the events of the last week. I'm a little disappointed myself that BK didn't reject LSU and just stay on at ND, but that's his decision. And very dissapointed and quite horrified at the general aftermath. Not terribly surprised, but it was even worse than I would have imagined.... Way worse in fact.

Hopefully it's finally lifting, and will be gone after the final weekend of the regular season. And the mob will have gotten it all out of their system.... And I wish BK good luck at LSU. He'll need it, but if he plays his cards right I think he can go on one final run in the SEC as well....

 

[Kontiki09]

I'm not going to do this. BK has brought ND to the very top of CFB world. That's inarguable. We haven't won a championship, that's particularly hard to do. At least you grant that much.

But everything else is aces! And it's BK's doing, it just is. He's the coach.... And that's all there is to that!

And so Marcus Freeman got the call to replace him, he was already on staff so he knows what he's getting himself into. And let's see if he can take the handoff and finally get it over the line... He looks like a star in the making, so we'll see...

I was just recapping how I'm a huge BK supporter, and obviously I'm very disappointed, to say the least, in all the events of the last week. I'm a little disappointed myself that BK didn't reject LSU and just stay on at ND, but that's his decision. And very dissapointed and quite horrified at the general aftermath. Not terribly surprised, but it was even worse than I would have imagined.... Way worse in fact.

Hopefully it's finally lifting, and will be gone after the final weekend of the regular season. And the mob will have gotten it all out of their system.... And I wish BK good luck at LSU. He'll need it, but if he plays his cards right I think he can go on one final run in the SEC as well....

Meh, I don't really see BK beating Bama, GA, or Texas Tech, so long as Saban, Smart, and Jimbo are there, respectively.

Do you think Kelly will have success against those teams?

 

[88ND]

I'm not going to do this. BK has brought ND to the very top of CFB world. That's inarguable. We haven't won a championship, that's particularly hard to do. At least you grant that much.

But everything else is aces! And it's BK's doing, it just is. He's the coach.... And that's all there is to that!

And so Marcus Freeman got the call to replace him, he was already on staff so he knows what he's getting himself into. And let's see if he can take the handoff and finally get it over the line... He looks like a star in the making, so we'll see...

I was just recapping how I'm a huge BK supporter, and obviously I'm very disappointed, to say the least, in all the events of the last week. I'm a little disappointed myself that BK didn't reject LSU and just stay on at ND, but that's his decision. And very dissapointed and quite horrified at the general aftermath. Not terribly surprised, but it was even worse than I would have imagined.... Way worse in fact.

Hopefully it's finally lifting, and will be gone after the final weekend of the regular season. And the mob will have gotten it all out of their system.... And I wish BK good luck at LSU. He'll need it, but if he plays his cards right I think he can go on one final run in the SEC as well....

Your definition of "top of the CFB world" is far different than mine.

Being embarrassed and looking like we don't belong in that elite convo is the 12 year BK staple.

If you want to be mad be pissed at Bill Snyder for not winning out in 2012 because that was the only chance BK had at winning a game on that highest stage.