What would Father Hesburgh have done?

[47WimanND]

It really angers me to see that we have snowflakes on campus that are protesting Pence's commencement address and have also protested other conservative speakers.

I heard one of the senior student leaders of the anti Pence crowd say that she didn't believe Pence reflects ND' Catholic values and that it makes her feel unsafe on campus.

Yet Clinton and Obama spoke on campus and they DO reflect Catholic values????

We really have just become another in the growing number of ordinary secular progressive universities that tolerate this BS. Father Ted would have told these clowns and clownettes to get back in class or face expulsion.

 

[Irish Duck]

It really angers me to see that we have snowflakes on campus that are protesting Pence's commencement address and have also protested other conservative speakers.

I heard one of the senior student leaders of the anti Pence crowd say that she didn't believe Pence reflects ND' Catholic values and that it makes her feel unsafe on campus.

Yet Clinton and Obama spoke on campus and they DO reflect Catholic values????

We really have just become another in the growing number of ordinary secular progressive universities that tolerate this BS. Father Ted would have told these clowns and clownettes to get back in class or face expulsion.

OMG, Notre Dame students having opinions!!! OMG, Notre Dame students actually stating their opinions!!! WTF? What happened to the good old days when college students were seen but not heard?

 

[Irish Duck]

By the way, the Father Ted that I knew would have encouraged the students to state their opinions, as long as they were well-reasoned and stated with due respect.

 

[47WimanND]

By the way, the Father Ted that I knew would have encouraged the students to state their opinions, as long as they were well-reasoned and stated with due respect.

Of course they can have opinions but disrupting campus speaking engagements are another story. I refer to you the link for Fr. Ted's 15 minutes rule.

http://articles.southbendtribune.co..._1_student-activists-students-pelted-hesburgh

BTW I am primarily opposed to these self-professed needs for safe zones and the comment that Pence's commencement address makes this particular student feel unsafe. It's fine to disagree but stop with the bullshit that hearing what someone else has to say somehow infringes on your space. You don't practice free speech by shouting someone else down.

 

[rgc7]

It is very sad what I see happening to our country ! There was a Tread recently on MarioTonelli and the
Death March during WWII. That was the Greatest Generation ! There were no " Safe Spaces " during the
Great Depression and World WarII !Notre Dame was also a great Catholic University back then. It was the
dream of poor Irish, Italian, Polish, German, etc, Catholic families to send their Children to ND !
For most of those poor Catholic families it was just a dream because the reality was that they and their children had to work just to survive, and no job was too menial. Then came the War and they served their country with honor. Those that were fortunate enough to come home, went on the raise families and build our great country.
No Snow flakes, in that " Greatest Generation ! "

 

[perseverare]

^ yep; a large segment of the 'now' Pop. has no knowledge of the founding of the country or of this countries forefathers; to many George Washington is just a bridge. National pride seems non existant and if any exists, it is directed to the country of origins, the one that they left because of poverty or oppression or lack of opportunity. The countries they loved so so much they fled.
FUBAR.

 

[47WimanND]

^ yep; a large segment of the 'now' Pop. has no knowledge of the founding of the country or of this countries forefathers; to many George Washington is just a bridge. National pride seems non existant and if any exists, it is directed to the country of origins, the one that they left because of poverty or oppression or lack of opportunity. The countries they loved so so much they fled.
FUBAR.

EXACTLY My great grandparents came from Poland and Ireland to become Americans. Today they come and want voting ballots in their language and march around with the flags of their home countries and expect us to adapt to them. When Sharia Law starts becoming the law of the land in the US it will really be FUBAR. When the whole world becomes Third WOrld there will be no where else to go.

 

[Irishjohn68]

Did students protest when Obama or Slick Willy spoke at ND? Now there is a problem not having the same values as Notre Dame.

 

[NDEwing18]

Did students protest when Obama or Slick Willy spoke at ND? Now there is a problem not having the same values as Notre Dame.

Yes - they did. Were they supposed to be expelled too?

 

[IRISHJD98]

Of course they can have opinions but disrupting campus speaking engagements are another story. I refer to you the link for Fr. Ted's 15 minutes rule.

http://articles.southbendtribune.co..._1_student-activists-students-pelted-hesburgh

BTW I am primarily opposed to these self-professed needs for safe zones and the comment that Pence's commencement address makes this particular student feel unsafe. It's fine to disagree but stop with the bullshit that hearing what someone else has to say somehow infringes on your space. You don't practice free speech by shouting someone else down.

From what I've seen, which admittedly isn't much, the response has just been a social media protest calling for whiteboard quotes of things Pence has said.

Maybe I missed it, but its not like students have occupied the administration building or made plans to burn the ROTC building.

 

[rgc7]

Unfortunately, We now have " Judges for Hire " who have been able to block President Trump from vetting
" Refugees " from Muslim countries ! One has to wonder if people still read the story of the Trojan Horse,
or actually study World History especially about Islam attacking the Christian World in 711 and the roughly 800 years years of constant War before the Western Christian Nations were able to finally drive Islam from Western Europe in 1492 ?
Now Western leaders just let them into their countries by the millions , give then housing and welfare,
and in return the " Refugees " terrorize their host countries !
Just unbelievable !

 

[47WimanND]

Did students protest when Obama or Slick Willy spoke at ND? Now there is a problem not having the same values as Notre Dame.

As I stated it's the professed need for "safe" space that bothers me. I doubt that anyone protesting Bill & Barry's speeches made any statements about their presence on campus making them feel unsafe. This is code for all points of view are fine as long as they agree with mine. Stop insulting everyone's intelligence by saying that Mike Pence speaking on campus somehow affects your safety.

 

[Irishjohn68]

Yes - they did. Were they supposed to be expelled too?

I don't have a problem with them protesting, but to say Pence doesn't hold the same values as ND does yet these same students most likely turn there heads with Obama or Slick Willy and say there ideas and values ae in line with ND's is ridiculous.

 

[NDEwing18]

I don't have a problem with them protesting, but to say Pence doesn't hold the same values as ND does yet these same students most likely turn there heads with Obama or Slick Willy and say there ideas and values ae in line with ND's is ridiculous.

Neither party can lay claim to having 100% of their views in line with the Catholic Church.

 

[rgc7]

Neither party can lay claim to having 100% of their views in line with the Catholic Church.

Agree,
But I think the Republicans are a lot closer as evident by their Pro Life positions, and the mention of God in many of President Trumps talks. Also, Christians in general , as demonstrated by the Evangelicals support of President Trump and Republicans over the Democrates in the last election. If fact, here in Phoenix,
our bishop supported the Republican position in a homily that was read at all masses before the election !

 

[yogind]

I remember students protesting when the Gipper gave the commencement

 

[NDEwing18]

Agree,
But I think the Republicans are a lot closer as evident by their Pro Life positions, and the mention of God in many of President Trumps talks. Also, Christians in general , as demonstrated by the Evangelicals support of President Trump and Republicans over the Democrates in the last election. If fact, here in Phoenix,
our bishop supported the Republican position in a homily that was read at all masses before the election !

I think it's somewhat of a useless exercise to try to determine who is "closer". Obama mentioned God a lot, too, in his speeches. For what it's worth, merely mentioning God doesn't strike me as particularly telling as to someone's religious beliefs. Call me cynical, but I tend to just group it as pandering.

 

[Irish Duck]

Unfortunately, We now have " Judges for Hire " who have been able to block President Trump from vetting
" Refugees " from Muslim countries ! One has to wonder if people still read the story of the Trojan Horse,
or actually study World History especially about Islam attacking the Christian World in 711 and the roughly 800 years years of constant War before the Western Christian Nations were able to finally drive Islam from Western Europe in 1492 ?
Now Western leaders just let them into their countries by the millions , give then housing and welfare,
and in return the " Refugees " terrorize their host countries !
Just unbelievable !

"Judges for hire?" Wow, you really have drunk the Trump Kool-Aid. You've indicated that you've read history, have you also read the Constitution?

 

[Irish Duck]

Agree,
But I think the Republicans are a lot closer as evident by their Pro Life positions, and the mention of God in many of President Trumps talks. Also, Christians in general , as demonstrated by the Evangelicals support of President Trump and Republicans over the Democrates in the last election. If fact, here in Phoenix,
our bishop supported the Republican position in a homily that was read at all masses before the election !

The Republicans may be closer as evident by their Pro Life positions but they are much farther away on issues dealing with the poor and those in need.

As to your Bishop supporting one political party or position over another, this supports my belief that religions should lose their tax exempt status. They are increasingly political entities rather than charitable and/or spiritual entities.

 

[rgc7]

I think it's somewhat of a useless exercise to try to determine who is "closer". Obama mentioned God a lot, too, in his speeches. For what it's worth, merely mentioning God doesn't strike me as particularly telling as to someone's religious beliefs. Call me cynical, but I tend to just group it as pandering.

NDE,
It may indeed be pandering ? Can not argue that with you ! However, I think my other points are valid ?

 

[Jersey Domer]

For what it's worth, Fr. Ted was quite progressive and welcomed more left of center speakers. God rest his soul, likely wouldn't have been happy with President Trump's rhetoric towards immigrants and likely would have declared Notre Dame a sanctuary campus. Father Ted was one of the leading voices behind welcoming President Obama to campus in the spring of 2009 my freshman year.

 

[NDEwing18]

NDE,
It may indeed be pandering ? Can not argue that with you ! However, I think my other points are valid ?

As I mentioned above, I think it's a fruitless exercise to try to determine which political party is "more" Christian. It's not like you can assign points to various viewpoints and tally them up to see who "wins".

 

[Ara64]

I think a university that brags: "GOD, COUNTRY, NOTRE DAME" would be concerned with obeying the laws of the land. Immigration laws have been apart of our legal system for centuries. You can't pick the laws you obey like a new tie or the Obama Administration. ND has 40 students on campus without proper papers according to Father Jenkins. I have a BIG problem with that situation. If the past administration cared so much for those hard working illegal aliens; why didn't Obama offer them a general amnesty? We all know the real answer to that question. I'm through with being a subway alumni. My interest in ND extends no farther than the football season. I will be watching President Trump give the commencement address at Liberty University on May 13, 2017 at 10 that morning. I won't follow ND graduation activities on anymore. I don't think Father Ted would put up with this nonsense for one minute by the way. He and Father Joyce ran a tight ship back then.

 

[Irish Duck]

I think a university that brags: "GOD, COUNTRY, NOTRE DAME" would be concerned with obeying the laws of the land. Immigration laws have been apart of our legal system for centuries. You can't pick the laws you obey like a new tie or the Obama Administration. ND has 40 students on campus without proper papers according to Father Jenkins. I have a BIG problem with that situation. If the past administration cared so much for those hard working illegal aliens; why didn't Obama offer them a general amnesty? We all know the real answer to that question. I'm through with being a subway alumni. My interest in ND extends no farther than the football season. I will be watching President Trump give the commencement address at Liberty University on May 13, 2017 at 10 that morning. I won't follow ND graduation activities on anymore. I don't think Father Ted would put up with this nonsense for one minute by the way. He and Father Joyce ran a tight ship back then.

Ara: This governments of this country, federal, state and local, always pick and choose what laws to actually enforce. The IRS doesn't go after every tax fraud because it doesn't have the resources to do so. The Feds, under Obama, chose not to pursue criminal cases involving marijuana despite the fact that Federal law clearly criminalizes the growth, possession, and/or sale of pot. By the way, Trump's DOJ is still following this lead. Immigration laws have been selectively enforced. There are still laws on the books in various states involving adultery but no one enforces this laws. Are you telling me that you've never broken the speed limit?

So you are wrong, you can pick the laws you obey "like a new tie" as the governments choose to enforce only selective laws. Good luck with supporting your friends at Liberty University.

 

[Ara64]

I was clocked one Friday night in 1983 doing 80 in a 55 zone. I was on the way to the hospital to be with a family. I paid my fine and officiated a dear Christian friend's funeral service the following Tuesday morning. Don't worry about me Mr. Duck. Have a nice day and two wrongs never make a right.

 

[Irish Duck]

And reality may not make it right, either, but it is reality. My condolences to you on your friend's passing.

 

[rgc7]

The Republicans may be closer as evident by their Pro Life positions but they are much farther away on issues dealing with the poor and those in need.

As to your Bishop supporting one political party or position over another, this supports my belief that religions should lose their tax exempt status. They are increasingly political entities rather than charitable and/or spiritual entities.

1. If the Democrats do more to help the poor, why are the poor always poor ? Why are they trapped in failing schools ? Why are the murder rates so high in minority communities ?
It seems to me a lot better approach would be to create jobs in the inner cities, give the children the right
to attend the best schools possible, and arrest the criminals, gang members, and drug dealers so that
the majority of decent minority citizens and their children can safely walk the streets in their own communities ?
2.My Bishop never mentioned a political party, but as my statement says: " He supported the Republican POSITION ."
3. Until the Johnson Amendment was passed in 1954, Churches did have the right to speak out on political
issues. The Johnson Amendment restricted the Church's Freedom Of Speech ! In spite of the Johnson Amendment, Religious leaders should not sell their souls for a few pieces of silver ! They must have the courage to speak out against any laws that are immoral ! Jesus mever feared to speak out !
Trump has promissed to over turn the Johnson Amendment.
4. As far as the Constitution goes, there is a seperation of Powers , and the President has the duty to Protect
the Nation , no one elected some obscure judge or judges to determine what our National Security and our immigration policy should be ?
Non Citizens have no right to enter the US , but once Non citizens are here they do have certain constitutional rights.
The President has the Constitutional granted power to restrict immigration from any Area of the World
if he determines that they pose a threat to our Nation.
The Supreme Court will over rule these radical judges !

 

[rgc7]

I was clocked on Friday night doing 80 in a 55 zone. I was on the way to the hospital to be with a family. I paid my fine and officiated a dear Christian friend's funeral service the following Tuesday morning. Don't worry about me Mr. Duck. Have a nice day and two wrongs never make a right.

God Bless you ! Ara,

 

[TOMMY_23]

OMG, Notre Dame students having opinions!!! OMG, Notre Dame students actually stating their opinions!!! WTF? What happened to the good old days when college students were seen but not heard?

Dear libtard,

Were they JUST stating opinions at UC-Berkeley this past winter? These students are simply trying to silence the speech of someone, Pence, who has a differing opinion than them.

Why not allow him to speak (they're trying to prevent him) then the students can offer their thoughts on what he has to say? These snowflakes are highly hypocritical but I wouldn't expect someone like you to understand.

 

[NDEwing18]

Dear libtard,

Were they JUST stating opinions at UC-Berkeley this past winter? These students are simply trying to silence the speech of someone, Pence, who has a differing opinion than them.

Why not allow him to speak (they're trying to prevent him) then the students can offer their thoughts on what he has to say? These snowflakes are highly hypocritical but I wouldn't expect someone like you to understand.

What exactly are they doing to "silence" Mike Pence?

 

[TOMMY_23]

Neither party can lay claim to having 100% of their views in line with the Catholic Church.

Walk that fence. I've never seen such stubborn people in my life like you, stu, and Quest.

 

[NDEwing18]

Walk that fence. I've never seen such stubborn people in my life like you, stu, and Quest.

I'm more than happy to "walk that fence", whatever that means.

Look at the statements from the U.S. Catholic bishops on gay marriage, immigration, the refugee situation, abortion, the death penalty, women in the church, etc. - it's a platform that doesn't line up neatly with either party.

 

[TOMMY_23]

What exactly are they doing to "silence" Mike Pence?

It's coming. Just check back with this thread when Pence is on campus. I hope I'm wrong.

https://www.google.com/amp/www.theb...ce-as-commencement-speaker-senior-claims/amp/

I don't think anyone anticipated the snowflakes at UC-B doing what they did back in January. I hope ND students are different. But, when they start saying #notmyVP, which is moronic to begin with, it seems to me that they're trying to stop him from speaking. Why else would they say they feel unsafe?

I expect the ugliness to get worse leading up to commencement. I don't get the online protests. The only reason to protest is to rachet up violence. Let him speak and then respond to him with your opinion. It's really quite simple.

 

[NDEwing18]

It's coming. Just check back with this thread when Pence is on campus. I hope I'm wrong.

https://www.google.com/amp/www.theb...ce-as-commencement-speaker-senior-claims/amp/

I don't think anyone anticipated the snowflakes at UC-B doing what they did back in January. I hope ND students are different. But, when they start saying #notmyVP, which is moronic to begin with, it seems to me that they're trying to stop him from speaking. Why else would they say they feel unsafe?

I expect the ugliness to get worse leading up to commencement. I don't get the online protests. The only reason to protest is to rachet up violence. Let him speak and then respond to him with your opinion. It's really quite simple.

How is that any different than the people who said that Obama was "not their President"? Or were those people not "snowflakes"?

 

[rgc7]

It's coming. Just check back with this thread when Pence is on campus. I hope I'm wrong.

https://www.google.com/amp/www.theb...ce-as-commencement-speaker-senior-claims/amp/

I don't think anyone anticipated the snowflakes at UC-B doing what they did back in January. I hope ND students are different. But, when they start saying #notmyVP, which is moronic to begin with, it seems to me that they're trying to stop him from speaking. Why else would they say they feel unsafe?

I expect the ugliness to get worse leading up to commencement. I don't get the online protests. The only reason to protest is to rachet up violence. Let him speak and then respond to him with your opinion. It's really quite simple.

Thanks Tommy,
I really hope that those kids are not representative of ND or their generation of young people ? Talk about idiotic statements, those top the cake ! To actually to be fearful to listen to a speaker who may have another point of view ! If they every heard the names that my Drill Instructor called me , they would have
" Melted " right on the spot !

 

[ivan brunetti]

I'm more than happy to "walk that fence", whatever that means.

Look at the statements from the U.S. Catholic bishops on gay marriage, immigration, the refugee situation, abortion, the death penalty, women in the church, etc. - it's a platform that doesn't line up neatly with either party.

I think "walk the fence" must mean attempt to be fair and nonpartisan.

 

[Irish Duck]

1. If the Democrats do more to help the poor, why are the poor always poor ? Why are they trapped in failing schools ? Why are the murder rates so high in minority communities ?
It seems to me a lot better approach would be to create jobs in the inner cities, give the children the right
to attend the best schools possible, and arrest the criminals, gang members, and drug dealers so that
the majority of decent minority citizens and their children can safely walk the streets in their own communities ?
2.My Bishop never mentioned a political party, but as my statement says: " He supported the Republican POSITION ."
3. Until the Johnson Amendment was passed in 1954, Churches did have the right to speak out on political
issues. The Johnson Amendment restricted the Church's Freedom Of Speech ! In spite of the Johnson Amendment, Religious leaders should not sell their souls for a few pieces of silver ! They must have the courage to speak out against any laws that are immoral ! Jesus mever feared to speak out !
Trump has promissed to over turn the Johnson Amendment.
4. As far as the Constitution goes, there is a seperation of Powers , and the President has the duty to Protect
the Nation , no one elected some obscure judge or judges to determine what our National Security and our immigration policy should be ?
Non Citizens have no right to enter the US , but once Non citizens are here they do have certain constitutional rights.
The President has the Constitutional granted power to restrict immigration from any Area of the World
if he determines that they pose a threat to our Nation.
The Supreme Court will over rule these radical judges !

rgc7, I appreciate your passion but you may want to do a little more research and/or rely less on Conservative websites. First of all, and as your dear Lord said, "There will always be poor amongst us." There are poor because we are human and we make mistakes. For some of us, the mistakes are of little import but for others, it can be devastating. Under the Republican leadership, the gap between rich (and ultra-rich) and the poor is expanding and the middle-class is shrinking. That is not a mistake. That is an intentional policy of the Republican Party. Under the proposed Trumpcare, millions would lose insurance coverage and the rich would receive tax breaks. Is this something that your bishop supports as being part of the Republican Position?

As you point out, Federal judges are not elected. They are nominated by the President and approved by Congress. The judicial branch is responsible for ensuring that neither of the other two branches violates the Constitution. National security and immigration issues are still subject to the Constitution. Either live with it or try and amend the Constitution. I will guarantee that these "radical judges" are a hell of a lot smarter than you.

Churches don't have a "freedom of speech." Individuals may and that is protected by the Constitution. Churches don't have that same freedom. Trump has promised to repeal the Johnson Amendment and he has also promised to build a wall on the Mexican border which will be paid by Mexico and that Obamacare will be repealed. He also promised that he wouldn't play golf because he'd be too busy. How's he doing so far on those promises?

Finally, the vast majority of churches (including the Catholic church) have been corrupted by greed and materialism. Your bishop has a very simple choice. He can either comply with the current law (the Johnson Amendment) or he can give up his tax exempt status and speak his mind. He can't have it both ways. Is there really any doubt but that he'll choose to retain his tax exempt status because, after all, where would he be without taxpayer support. I find it offensive that my tax dollars are used, in part, to support religious organizations and leaders like your bishop. Unfortunately, I don't see that changing in my lifetime.

 

[Irish Duck]

Dear libtard,

Were they JUST stating opinions at UC-Berkeley this past winter? These students are simply trying to silence the speech of someone, Pence, who has a differing opinion than them.

Why not allow him to speak (they're trying to prevent him) then the students can offer their thoughts on what he has to say? These snowflakes are highly hypocritical but I wouldn't expect someone like you to understand.

I always love it when Conservatives show their level of intelligence by starting with calling names like "libtard" and "snowflake." If you are going to try and make an intelligent argument, you lose all credibility when you start like that.

Next, is it safe to assume that your real objection to the Cal-Berkeley protests was that you support the beliefs of Milo Yiannopoulos? While I don't support the violence that occurred, I do support the protests. Personally I am against raping young boys but if you and Milo Y. believe in that, so be it.

 

[perseverare]

Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.
Surely some revelation is at hand;
Surely the Second Coming is at hand.

W.B Yeats (Second Coming)

 

[NDEwing18]

Turning and turning in the widening gyre
The falcon cannot hear the falconer;
Things fall apart; the centre cannot hold;
Mere anarchy is loosed upon the world,
The blood-dimmed tide is loosed, and everywhere
The ceremony of innocence is drowned;
The best lack all conviction, while the worst
Are full of passionate intensity.
Surely some revelation is at hand;
Surely the Second Coming is at hand.

W.B Yeats (Second Coming)

Jingle bells, Batman smells.
Robin laid an egg.
The Batmobile
Lost its wheel
And the Joker got away.

A. Lincoln (Gettysburg Address)