Anyone else seeing this nonsense spill over to other college teams including ND? I truly believe the Missouri players should have forfeited their scholarships and the coach canned. Father Hesburgh would never have caved in to this extortion. I guarantee this would never have occurred if Missouri had a good record. So happy I am done paying tuition to schools that ill prepare their students by filling their heads with liberal nonsense.
Missouri players
- Thread starter GaryFriend
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How long did you pay tuition to schools which " ill prepare their students by filling their heads with liberal nonsense"?
Am I seeing this nonsense spill over to college teams? No. At the same time, universities should expect that when they give student-athletes a tremendous amount of leverage, those student-athletes are occasionally going to stumble on a way to utilize that leverage.
The fact that Missouri doesn't have a good record is irrelevant. If I made seven figures, I'd probably quit bitching about my taxes - but the fact that I don't doesn't mean that I don't have a good argument for bitching about them now.
Missouri would be in a lot worse shape if they kicked all of their minority football players off the team and fired Pinkel. It would be a PR disaster.
Father Hesburgh was, in everything I've come across, sensitive to the issues of racial injustice. He never would have put himself in the position that the Missouri administration did in the first place.
I don't know all the facts, but part of me does tthink a bad pecedence was set by people resigning that quickly. So on that level I may agree with you, but I 100% do not understand your reference to "liberal nosense"
It sounds like the university administration was bumbling on a couple of fronts (both race- and non-race-related), though I'm not quite sure how different things are going to be with a new person in charge. Of course, I'm not a student or a faculty member at Missouri, so I'll really leave that judgment up to the people on the ground in Columbia.
I think that the people who resigned recognized that they were fighting a losing battle. Rather than being dragged through all that, they got out quickly. I can't blame them for escaping from an untenable position.
You are probably right. Just hope it doesn't snowball across the college landscape. I still don't get the OP's reference to "liberal nonsense".
Its his way of being dismissive of the point of the protests without addressing the merits of it.
These college students are spoiled brats who have no idea what suffering and persecution really is. They want every place to be a safe zone like it was elementary school. The college administrators created this society of victimhood and it's quite funny watching the children bite the hand that feeds them.
I think it goes back further than what college administrators are doing. College isn't such that people can matriculate there and within a couple of weeks, change how they feel and react to things.
I read this in an article online. I think it's an interesting viewpoint that's relevant.
Here’s one of the ways that white men at Yale are most privileged of all: When a white male student at an elite college says that he feels disempowered, the first impulse of the campus left is to show him the extent of his power and privilege. When any other students say they feel disempowered, the campus left’s impulse is to validate their statements. This does a huge disservice to everyone except white male students. It’s baffling that so few campus activists seem to realize this drawback of emphasizing victim status even if college administrators sometimes treat it as currency.
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics...tolerance-of-student-activism-at-yale/414810/
Here’s one of the ways that white men at Yale are most privileged of all: When a white male student at an elite college says that he feels disempowered, the first impulse of the campus left is to show him the extent of his power and privilege. When any other students say they feel disempowered, the campus left’s impulse is to validate their statements. This does a huge disservice to everyone except white male students. It’s baffling that so few campus activists seem to realize this drawback of emphasizing victim status even if college administrators sometimes treat it as currency.
http://www.theatlantic.com/politics...tolerance-of-student-activism-at-yale/414810/
I am not sure you are in a position to know what "these college students" are experienced or have experienced. Please define what is real suffering and persecution for the rest of us.
I find it interested when people bring politics into every situation. "Liberals" vs "Conservatives" is the new "Whites" vs "Non-Whites." Such a sad country we've become.
Exactly. Rather than think something through, belittle it as "liberal" without any further thought.
Interesting situation ! I have been of the opinion for a number of years
That there is no longer a real exchange of ideas, and yes, that the majority of professors are both Liberal, Democrats, and socialists.
The result of this is that college students are getting exposed
To one side of just about ever issue rather that having a vigorous exchange
Of ideas on both sides of every issue.
Further, unless one is wealthy or is going to a University for
For a professional or technical degree, I think that, from an investment
Point of view, generally speaking, a good high school education, a community college, and just reading great books is a far better investment and education.
As far as safe zones go, the colleges should provide a physical
Safe Zone , but I don't know how a college, with fair admissions standards, can provide safe zones from ideas, thoughts, and speech
That a student or group of students may find offensive.
I also see our country being torn apart by every type of protest.
Women, gays, anti police, etc.
As far as police go I think that the people who need police
Protection the most, are protesting the most, and thus getting less
And less of the badly needed police protection that they need resulting
In a high murder rate and crimes against the majority of people trying
To just live peaceful lives in minority communities.
In my opinion, The university of Missouri is just another sign of the divisions That are destroying both our freedoms and our Nation.
I view this claim as nonsense. More people than ever before in our country's history enjoy the freedoms which only some had before. Minorities, women and gays have access to more rights and privileges than they had fifty years ago, or even ten years ago. Obviously, there are some who view this as "destroying the country" or "destroying our freedoms." I think this is a rather skewed way of approaching the subject.
Comparing population groups, economic stats disagree completely with your premise. Of course, individuals from any group can different from the statistical norm.
Boy I hate to weigh in on what is on the fringe of politics but liberal or not, there is a generation of kids in college that due to their upbringing (helicopter parents) that aren't equipped to begin to take that toe dip in the adult world on their own. So kids are ultra sensitive and have made a habit of pressing administrators to "make the meany stop." I wish it were a joke but at cal Berkeley they've coined these uncomfortable occurances as "micro aggressions." They've made it part of their institutional rules to try and protect kids from perceived verbal slights etc.
Now, there are schools going the other direction thankfully. Look schools should stay true to their mission of preparing kids for the real world, where people disagree and you need to be equipped to handle disagreements and resolve conflicts. You learn how to do that in college, where In theory you go to freely express your ideas and have them challenged. Nobody wants to be challenged or disagreed with because that is confrontation.
As I said there are colleges that have signed a commitment to free speech, my alma mater (the UofC), Purdue and others have gone on record thankfully to protect this.
As for Missouri, for these kids that feel so unsafe. I'd just suggest that they may actually be in the safest places. If they wanna see what unsafe really is, come to the south side of Chicago where a nine year old was just shot as gang retaliation for something his father did. College campuses unsafe because of words. Shameful.
Now, there are schools going the other direction thankfully. Look schools should stay true to their mission of preparing kids for the real world, where people disagree and you need to be equipped to handle disagreements and resolve conflicts. You learn how to do that in college, where In theory you go to freely express your ideas and have them challenged. Nobody wants to be challenged or disagreed with because that is confrontation.
As I said there are colleges that have signed a commitment to free speech, my alma mater (the UofC), Purdue and others have gone on record thankfully to protect this.
As for Missouri, for these kids that feel so unsafe. I'd just suggest that they may actually be in the safest places. If they wanna see what unsafe really is, come to the south side of Chicago where a nine year old was just shot as gang retaliation for something his father did. College campuses unsafe because of words. Shameful.
Providing as FYI, written from one black man's perspective on all of this...
http://j.school/post/133025099640/crying-wolfe-exposes-real-problem
I usually don't like Whitlock and hesitated to link as such, but I think his perspective overall should be considered, even if I don't agree with everything in that article.
http://j.school/post/133025099640/crying-wolfe-exposes-real-problem
I usually don't like Whitlock and hesitated to link as such, but I think his perspective overall should be considered, even if I don't agree with everything in that article.
My guess is most of those "protesters" are getting almost full AID....they are for sure at yale. In the old days you had to WORK for an education. Heck I was on a full ride but had both summer jobs and part time jobs to earn $. Enough with the PC crap.
May God help Save Our Country!
May God help Save Our Country!
I'm guessing that most of those "protestors" are taking out significant student loans which are non-dischargeable in bankruptcy proceedings, and will be "working" for their education for the next 40-plus years, postponing marriage, children and a house in order to pay such loans off.
What does their getting aid have to do with whether or not they are right or at the very least have a right to protest? Also I agree with NDEWING, I think the assumption they don't work is reckless and doesn't address whether or not their position is valid.
I think it's a rather safe bet, too, to assume that very few of them are getting full aid. Most state legislatures have been cutting back more and more with respect to funding of public universities. To the extent people are getting "aid", I doubt that it is without strings attached.
This is simply not true. The administration handled things appropriately. The university notified the police about the swastika, and the police are investigating. That's exactly what should happen. The student who made the racist remark to the group was suspended from school. Again, that's exactly what should happen, and the university dealt with the situation appropriately. The student body president, who claimed he was called a racial slur, well this incident happened off campus. That's out of the hands of the university. They can't control something that happens off campus.
You are just unwilling to consider the possibility that maybe the students are actually wrong. Anyone being intellectually honest about the situation has to consider that possibility, especially in light of the evidence at hand.
His reference is that liberal protestors frequently use charges of racism to stifle debate.
1. The events referenced were catalysts for the protest but were not the sole reasons for the protest.
2. Your explanation for the reference to "liberal nonsense" doesn't make sense contextually with his post.
2. Your explanation for the reference to "liberal nonsense" doesn't make sense contextually with his post.
I don't know. Try any number of countries in the middle east. Try living life as a female in those countries. How about living life day to day in Africa where the terrorists run wild and universities and villages are major targets for extreme violence. How about North Korea? Lots of pain and suffering there. Did I pass the test? I would advise all student complainers and protesters who want to live life in a fantasy safe space, lock yourself in your room and don't leave the house.
The fact is that protesters all along the political spectrum often attempt to stifle debate.
My comment was in connection to issues that had been taking place at the university in addition to race.
I have to agree with you. You seem to be one of the few commenting on this thread that has hit the real hot button.
It's always "them" vs. "us." What happened to the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA?
granite,
You may disagree, but what is the 4 year cost of a College degree ?
How much could a person have earned during those 4 year ?
So there is both the out of pocket costs plus 4 years of lost wages.
The total is a rather large sum of money.
The other question is, once the student graduates, is how marketable is the degree ?
I also recently had a new home built, and many of the craftsmen
Do rather well financially.
In any case, great to exchange ideas and consider all polnts of view.
How do any of those examples invalidate the suffering and persecution of others? I don't know why extreme cases of basic human rights violations are the only persecution that matters. Since when did we use the middle east, Africa or North Korea as the measuring stick for the correct way to treat people? You are essentially saying since your life isn't as bad as it would be if you were under the rule of ISIS you do not have a right to complain.
These are the basic principles of post-structural thought dating back to the beginnings of existentialism.I have to agree with you. You seem to be one of the few commenting on this thread that has hit the real hot button.
It's always "them" vs. "us." What happened to the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA?
P
This post is exactly right. The president of a university lost his job because students didn't want to be offended. Introduce racism and there was no debate, the president never had a chance. Never mind the facts trickling out hat there may not have been any evidence corroborating this.
Anyone find it strange that Missouri students feel unsafe due to racial tension, at a school where students of all races filled a stadium to support the first black gay athlete coming out? Are our memories that short?
This post is exactly right. The president of a university lost his job because students didn't want to be offended. Introduce racism and there was no debate, the president never had a chance. Never mind the facts trickling out hat there may not have been any evidence corroborating this.
Anyone find it strange that Missouri students feel unsafe due to racial tension, at a school where students of all races filled a stadium to support the first black gay athlete coming out? Are our memories that short?
1. No, that's not correct. This is again an instance of you taking the students at face value, and not investigation their claims. The protest didn't start over race. They started because of the student who went on a hunger strike because of his insurance being cancelled. The group ConcernedStudents1950 have been around for awhile. They have a political goal they are trying to achieve, not related to any particular incident. What happened was the hunger strike and the 1950 group wound up merging together, and used the "incidents" simply as a spring board to advance their real agendas.
2. My explanation makes perfect sense. The CS1950 group's list of demands doesn't include anything about racial incidents. They just have a liberal agenda, and they use claims of race to shut down opposition and achieve their goals.
Because the students at Missouri aren't "suffering" and the aren't being "persecuted."
1. That student who went on the hunger strike started the hunger strike after the calls to action were already being made by groups on campus so I don't believe you are getting your timeline right.
2. It doesn't do because he isn't talking about the student's political positions he is talking about the Professors'. In either case race here isn't being used to shut down opposition it is being used to address the opposition there is a difference. The student groups were saying that the administration was racists and therefore should be fired, rather their position was the administration doesn't do enough to address racism and therefore should be fired. In the first example racism is being used as a collateral attack against a position, in the second example a reference to racism is being used as the basis of a position.
Again, how are you in a position to make that claim? Why are the examples provided the only way suffering/persecution exist in the world?
