Similar, my Junior year, my team lost in the championship game. I threw my runner up medal/award away before getting on the bus. Don't regret it. Took awhile to get over.
Locker room after the game
- Thread starter edub72
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We had a guy on the high school basketball team who would punch lockers and yell after we lost. It struck me as overly dramatic.
I generally recall going man on man when blitzing often enough during the season. It didn't work this time. In fact I saw the opposite fail in this game...a front 3 on a 3rd and long that Ohio State successfully converted.
I don't have an issue with the call. Came down to execution. Ohio State has great offensive weapons that can take what's given regardless of scheme in such situations.
This wasn't Sark calling for a behind the play run vs tOSU...that was dumb. This one is more justified.
And believe me, I feel ND would have won if they made that stop. Wasn't meant to be.
Agreed ……… injuries had a devastating impact on the game and the outcome
At that juncture of the game, with 3rd and 11, and Gray one on one with Smith, there should’ve been a safety over the top to help Gray out
That was a tactical error
I know this is a bit late, but honestly I'm glad they were upset and emotional after that game... would you really want them to not care a lot? I'm sure this Wolken person has never competed for anything in his life.
Being reported on the pictagram (take it FWIW) that Jayden Thomas came to the defense of Gray and shouted expletives at reporters. If true, don’t mind it and sounds isolated.
Is this why we didn't hear Watt's name all night? We blitzed him? Or anOSU avoided him.
Wolken’s perspective and his lack of situational awareness is telling
The players we’re upset, and that’s natural
What Wolken doesn’t tell you is WHY the players were upset
Wolken indicates that the players were upset with the media
My guess is as follows:
The players were naturally upset at the loss, and my guess is that some of the questions could be viewed as being inappropriate, especially given the circumstances.
We all know that reporters can be scumbags when they question people
One only has to look at the White House press reporters when Trump was president
I suspect that some of the questions were inappropriate, and that the players reacted emotionally.
My suggestion
Keep the reporters out of the locker room for a half an hour after the players enter after the game
Let the players blow off steam, let them vent their emotions, give them time to cool down
And then let the jackals in
How stupid, look what this OSU offense did to everyone but Michigan, I mean everyone.
ND had a terrible second quarter and played admirably in the second half. Al Golden was phenomenal in his two years here, I mean phenomenal. Give me a break, some of you fans are just unserious, silly people.
The team that ND FIELDED wasn't the EQUAL of the one OSU FIELDED.
The odds makers saw what a SIGNIFICANT ENOUGH MISMATCH on paper this was even to the point of UNDERESTIMATING it. I suspect people will object to the word MISMATCH, but I would argue that anytime ND CANNOT RUN ITS RUN OFFENSE, it's in TROUBLE.
ND played with TREMEMDOUS HEART after LOSING ITS POISE during the MIDDLE EIGHT -- a time frame it had DOMINATED. But there's nothing to be ASHAMED OF.
The BETTER TEAM WON.
See what happens NEXT TIME.
However you DEFINE that term.
As discussed, tOSU is the only outfit significantly standing out against all teams. Look what they did to Tennessee and Oregon. And even when having an off game, they still reasonably beat Texas.
Minimally ND is the clear #2 in all this context. As to tOSU, I wouldn't use the term MISMATCH. Sure, tOSU is better.
I did my best to highlight that Buckeye 3rd and 11 as the embodiment of ND. A chance to surge back, recovering from being put on their heels...perhaps taking it to OT, fitting for what they've been.
tOSU was the one team they couldn't do it against. And, per our earlier discussion...I don't think most reasonable fans of college football will see ND as a loser. ND belonged. ND is a legit #2.
And I am confident there will be a next time. MF is young, lean, and angry. So is the team.
That's cool with me. Obviously there can only be 1 winner...and obviously there can only be 1 number 2 in a final.
I'll take it!
I don't think it's clear at all that Notre Dame is the number two team either. I think they are comfortably in the middle of the second tier of teams that are all behind OSUThat's cool with me. Obviously there can only be 1 winner...and obviously there can only be 1 number 2 in a final.
I'll take it!
Notre Dame would be in 50/50 games with a lot of those tier two teams. Tier 2: Texas, Oregon, Ole Miss, PSU, Notre Dame
I think Notre Dame is a back end top five team this year
Also ND has the 10th ranked talent but a top five team and the same head coach returning to coach up more talent beyond what their talent rankings suggest they should perform at
The only question for the program going forward: Is Notre Dame going to figure out how to get some high four star and five-star market share in the talent pool from other blue bloods and modern powers in college football this class/going forward?
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Yeah, but we're trying to get rid of the poll mentality. It's not like a macho thing, like with Dale Earnhardt. It's just meaningless. Well maybe not entirely, we did make it to the final, a matter of public record, that really did happen. And we did make it through all those rounds. And so that's awesome! And we are to be commended. We're not #2 though, there's no such thing. There's no gold, silver and bronze, this ain't the olympics.That's cool with me. Obviously there can only be 1 winner...and obviously there can only be 1 number 2 in a final.
I'll take it!
I don't agree with all of this but the point that it's national title or bust is one that makes a lot of sense
Fair points, but I would argue that the MISMATCH was no more apparent than in that VERY THIRD AND ELEVEN. Though it would probably have been a mismatch against almost ANY single-coverage corner. And it's not because Gray isn't a good player. It's just that he was lining up against a really SUPERIOR ONE.
I would also argue that there wasn't even ONE MOMENT -- at least for me -- where ND looked like the BETTER TEAM. That first drive everyone credits ND for having run so well? To me, it was a GRIND that required them fighting for -- and at times barely making -- EVERY SINGLE YARD. Meanwhile OSU comes storming right back, using fewer plays, like a HOT KNIFE THROUGH BUTTER.
Not saying ND is not a really good team. But as I pointed out elsewhere, Tyson was a GREAT FIGHTER but against LENNOX LEWIS, not so much.
And that's how I'm using the word MISMATCH. As opposed to EVENLY MATCHED as per EASILY DETECTABLE to the EYE. But substitute any word you PREFER. OSU was clearly the better team.
Definitely not the only question for the program, just the only one that you will pose, hourly.
Sub out the bottom quarter of NDs 85 man roster, and instead make all of those guys 5 star and high 4 star talent instead (which is what neutralizing the talent gap with a team like Georgia or OSU would look like) and then give these present ND coaches THAT tier 1 talent to develop and maximize and ND is OSU this year instead.
It's that simple.
Having tier 1 talent doesn't automatically guarantee that your team will produce in the tier 1 ... ND fans know this better than anybody: Charlie Weis had a collection of the biggest stars in college football during his last two seasons here, and squandered it by doing less than anybody else with more than anybody else in college football.
Having tier 1 talent gives your team a wider range/higher range of potential upside in your team's production during the season but it doesn't guarantee that you will perform to your upside. I believe coaches have a major impact on everything else (talent development, scheme, personnel hires, gameday decision making & playcalling, scouting, culture development, etc.)
If all of this ancillary stuff that coaches are responsible for are performing optimally AND your talent is in the tier 1 of talent you are this year's version of OSU.
NDs coaches were at least as good as OSUs coaches this year, the biggest difference is that OSUs organization is just kicking NDs ass in the operations office/talent acquisition side of the program in the transfer portal and on the recruiting trail by securing and investing in rarer/higher quality talent overall.
Having tier 1 talent gives your team a wider range/higher range of potential upside in your team's production during the season but it doesn't guarantee that you will perform to your upside. I believe coaches have a major impact on everything else (talent development, scheme, personnel hires, gameday decision making & playcalling, scouting, culture development, etc.)
If all of this ancillary stuff that coaches are responsible for are performing optimally AND your talent is in the tier 1 of talent you are this year's version of OSU.
NDs coaches were at least as good as OSUs coaches this year, the biggest difference is that OSUs organization is just kicking NDs ass in the operations office/talent acquisition side of the program in the transfer portal and on the recruiting trail by securing and investing in rarer/higher quality talent overall.
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I agree with all your points.. But I still disagree with using the term MISMATCH...which has a clear connotation that isn't the one you portray.
And there are more choices than MISMATCH vs EVENLY MATCHED. Now that we're at it, how about ND DECENTLY MATCHED a SUPERIOR tOSU?
Again, all good, for me it's academic stuff. I remain happy with this season. Fueling my hopes for greater glory...and we've had discussions how this was not the case since Holtz.
@chaseball @savvyandsassier
A final is a final. By definition #1 and #2. Not a ranking, although the ranking rightfully reflects this playoff championship.
Sure, there are nuances. I get margins might be so tight among some teams that perhaps luck separates ND from PSU? Maybe, maybe not.
Hence I go with the concrete results. In this case, a clear gold and silver.
Bronze? Debate it. Please!
A final is a final. By definition #1 and #2. Not a ranking, although the ranking rightfully reflects this playoff championship.
Sure, there are nuances. I get margins might be so tight among some teams that perhaps luck separates ND from PSU? Maybe, maybe not.
Hence I go with the concrete results. In this case, a clear gold and silver.
Bronze? Debate it. Please!
This type of post is a big part of the problem in this Forum.@chaseball @savvyandsassier
A final is a final. By definition #1 and #2. Not a ranking, although the ranking rightfully reflects this playoff championship.
Sure, there are nuances. I get margins might be so tight among some teams that perhaps luck separates ND from PSU? Maybe, maybe not.
Hence I go with the concrete results. In this case, a clear gold and silver.
Bronze? Debate it. Please!
Of any players who deserved to be distraught it was the running backs who barely touched the ball.
Yeah, it's true. There's no denying it. But it's one of my little hobbyhorses. Maybe they should have a 3rd place game like in the World Cup.@chaseball @savvyandsassier
A final is a final. By definition #1 and #2. Not a ranking, although the ranking rightfully reflects this playoff championship.
Sure, there are nuances. I get margins might be so tight among some teams that perhaps luck separates ND from PSU? Maybe, maybe not.
Hence I go with the concrete results. In this case, a clear gold and silver.
Bronze? Debate it. Please!
I would say that ND did a GOOD JOB keeping up with a TEAM that it WASN'T LIKELY TO BEAT given the players ON THE FIELD on THAT NIGHT.
ND COULDN'T RUN ITS GROUND GAME. NOR COULD IT STOP OSU'S OFFENSE, ESPECIALLY WHEN IT COUNTED.
As for the SEMANTICS, how about ND WAS OVERMATCHED in that its OL couldn't RUN BLOCK, its DL and LB's COULDN'T CONTAIN OSU'S BACKS OR QB-RUN GAME, its DL COULDN'T APPLY ANY PRESSURE, its O went most of the game without any CHUNK PLAYS, and with the game on the line, its more VULNERABLE CB, despite having POSSIBLY saved two games (USC and PSU), couldn't match up with OSU's BEST RECEIVER.
And, yes, that last example may have involved coaching. Yet, what gameplan were ND's coaches expected to come up with to contain THIS OSU TEAM? Did they do things wrong so much -- or was OSU SIMPLY TOO GOOD? I'll go with the LATTER.
What I found particularly telling is that OSU went 5 for 5 in THE RED ZONE; while ND, only 1 for 2.
Actually, I would still argue for calling all of that a MISMATCH in the sense of ND's having GOTTEN BEATEN IN MOST PHASES OF THE GAME, but I'm glad to settle for OVERMATCHED. Because in fact ND was.
ND put up a VALIANT FIGHT, and while NOT HUMBLED, it still lost DECISIVELY.
I was a sprinter and never came in higher than third in a major invitational meet. I just couldn't get to the next gear. That ND team that lost to OSU earlier this week couldn't get to the NEXT GEAR EITHER.
It was simply OVERMATCHED.
Those mistakes and bad plays ND was guilty of? They were the direct result of playing A STRONGER TEAM.
Sometimes, you JUST LOSE.
Wolken approached Christian Gray about the Smith play.--intending to find out how he screwed up. He basically got run out by players protecting Gray. I have no issue with them protecting their brother at that moment in that way. His "amateur hour" comment shows that he has personally injected his own feelings into the story. I am a peaceful man, but if I ever see that guy on an unlit street it will definitely be a tense environment.
you are the type of poster who is a big problem on this forum
Again, I agree on the minutia. In the way you described being beaten in phases of the game. I bet if you scored efficiency in each phase, maybe F+ has this...in total score it would be reasonably close, not a mismatch.
The score itself was 11 points difference. Not a rout. It kinda reflects my intuitive odds of 55:45 OSU vs ND.
Let them play 5 games. ND could win 1 or even 2 in my book. Both team would learn and adjust after each game in a series...again, very hypothetical.
Yes, ND just lost to a better team. We all agree. It's still hold to ND being a legit #2 and capable of playing with tOSU.
So all those teams that you claim are doing better than ND in recruiting - Oregon, PSU, LSU, Bama, UGA, Ole Miss, Tenn, Texas…are all BUSTS!
Cool story
Wolken is an assclown with no respect from his peers and he is completely out of line in every way. He should not be asking the type of questions he asked and he should respect a losing teams emotions and put his fragile ego aside rather than whining like a liberal pos
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