I care about a 10-3 season in MF second season as HC.....everything is relevant
If HC, recruiting, and talent doesn't change, we are very likely to be in the very same position this time next year
- Thread starter chaseball
- Start date
It’s obvious that he doesn’t care about ND’s academics whatsoever. He’s been called out on this repeatedly by multiple posters yet never addresses it. I take that as a tacit admission that he believes ND should lower its academic standards to win championships. He knows at least at some level that won’t happen, so admitting that torpedoes not only all of his inane, meaningless “assessments” of the program, but also his sole purpose for being here (namely suggesting that he alone can fix ND’s “problems” as he perceives them to be). Alternatively, it’s certainly possible that he’s just dense.
The message that our goal is to win a NC AND maintain our integrity as an academic institution with values is not getting through to you.
I think he gets the message about winning NCs. He just doesn’t give a damn about our academic standards; that’s why his arguments are inane.
Anytime ND fails, you just play the "academic standards" or "integrity" card despite there being no evidence and despite the fact that NDs graduation rate in football has actually declined from the Weis era, and that ND has been involved in their fair share of scandals (academic and otherwise) for much of the last 15 years.
Why do you constantly pretend to be a Notre Dame fan? What fan continually attacks the school one pulls for? ND DOES have admissions standards higher than almost all of the other schools in the NCAA. ND DOES require its students to under at least some of the rigors of academics. ND DOES require students to attend class. Really, what is wrong with you?
I have told you many, many times---go find another school which will satisfy your desire for success on the gridiron.
No evidence of “academic standards” or “integrity?” You really have no idea what you’re talking about.
And per an ND press release from May of this year:
2022 University of Notre Dame APR Ratings by Sport
Baseball — 997
Football — 989
Men’s Basketball — 977
Men’s Cross Country — 1,000
Men’s Fencing — 1,000
Men’s Golf — 993
Hockey — 1,000
Men’s Lacrosse — 998
Men’s Soccer — 987
Men’s Swimming and Diving — 1,000
Men’s Tennis — 993
Men’s Track — 1,000
Softball — 1,000
Women’s Basketball — 994
Women’s Cross Country — 1,000
Women’s Fencing — 1,000
Women’s Golf — 1,000
Women’s Lacrosse — 1,000
Women’s Rowing — 1,000
Women’s Soccer — 997
Women’s Swimming and Diving — 1,000
Women’s Tennis — 1,000
Women’s Track — 997
Volleyball — 1,000
Here is where Notre Dame has ranked annually among FBS institutions in terms of raw numbers of individual team 1,000 APR scores:
2022 –– 1. Duke 16; 2. Notre Dame 14
So you obviously just make up things out of whole cloth. You need not be surprised when nobody takes you seriously, fraud.
It’s not only academic standards but abiding by the rules. Chase has suggested (too many times to count) that ND should compete at all costs. Which means the Deion/USC approach and paying players outside of NIL, both won’t work at ND. Integrity matters
You truly are a POS. You want a football factory not a university. So go root for the NFL.
I have very rarely used the ignore feature here, but the redundancy and anti ND bs that Chase spews will no longer be a source of irritation for me.
Oh boy. You really mean “free speech” doesn’t include anything counter to your thoughts
Actually it’s worse than you and Chase and that is saying something
“Ouch”. Has been taken! ? Got anything else (btw: I’m not trying to bust or be a smart ass )
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BG756? Who is Jillery? (Will telling me put you on double secret probation? ? I won’t tell anyone I asked you!)
I don't see any harm in discussing the elephant in the room, nobody else wants to. I'll keep bringing up the elephant and you will all keep taking the blue pill and we'll keep having the same conversations while nothing changes at ND for another 10 more years but our desire for ND to be a winner will still bond us together.
There is no elephant. You just don't have a real understanding of what Notre Dame is all about.
Surprised to see you respond this way. Chase never belittles anybody or uses foul language. He backs up his assertions with data. He wants to see the ND of 88-93 again, so do I.
It's quite simple: the truth hurts, and deep down somewhere inside, he knows im right.
He is polite, and a straight-shooter, I assume he'd tell us exactly how he feels.
Let's talk more about 3-9 vs 9-3... would you like to retract that statement? You see no difference in 9-3 this year vs Kelly 4-8? We could get 10 this year. That's a step forward for MF, and, back to the consistency established under Kelly. Had Freeman not shit the bed against Marshall and Stanford last year I think you'd see the recruiting uptick we all expected. We need 11-1 next year with a 1st round playoff win to keep this train moving forward!
The elephant:
- Notre Dame isn't losing because of academic/spiritual/character/intelligence exclusivity on their football roster, they are losing because they are simply not good enough to win, period.
- That ND can't win under the status quo and that the problems/impediment to ND winning a national title is the leadership at the highest levels of ND itself.
- That recruits and talent matter more than anything else, and that ND is getting its but kicked in the competition to secure both
- That the players on the football field are literally the most valuable commodity in your entire institution and that you are no better than anybody else
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You must have gotten along great with all your teachers if you always think you know better. Grades muast have been great.
You’re right about how he conducts himself. But, that Had nothing to do with my post or reaction.
These are not facts. They are your opinions. I'm really tired of dealing with you. You say the same thing over and over and over, but other than suggesting that ND loosen up its academic requirements, all you do is complain. You don't listen to what anyone else has to say.
ND is not going to change. Deal with it.
Yep. In his view, it all comes down to our talent not being good enough because we aren’t getting the elite HS talent.
Despite demonstrating repeatedly that he has absolutely no knowledge of ND’s curriculum and admission requirements, here are the facts:
Why aren’t we getting enough elite talent? The fact is a good percentage of HS players don’t have the grades to get into ND. Many that do don’t want the rigors of ND’s academic demands and want the easiest path to the NFL. Given those circumstances, what would be the only solution? Lowering academic standards.
The OP can suggest this a million times, but it isn’t going to happen. Despite being told this repeatedly, he just keeps whining about it. If he’s looking for a football factory with no academic standards who will let in any elite HS player regardless of their ability to read and write, ND obviously isn’t that. There are many other schools that fit that criteria, yet he continues to insist that ND become something that it fundamentally will never be. Let him continue to pound his head against the wall.
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As demonstrated in my post above, he makes things up out of whole cloth to support his claims. He’s a total fraud.
I asked you to provide specifics as to what you would do and you provided a high level overview about how you would commit a ton of resources and $$$ to bring in the best coaches, and have the best facilities, etc.
So tell me how would you bring in the elite recruiting classes? Would you pay the recruits, fund the NIL collectives to be able to pay the recruits? Lower academic standards? provide an easier academic curriculum for these elite athletes who don't value academics and just want to play football?
please explain in DETAIL.
You spout a bunch of sh1t on this forum, with very little substance on how you would actually fix it?
You are one of those let's just throw millions of dollars at a problem when it only needs a $10 part to fix it.
Ohh, ok. Joe ping you two dating?
Please analyze the veracity of his data.
And show me where he spends as many posts on the good things, as he does posting opinion pieces
As for 88-93, sure we want that. Duh
Not dating, just bang on occasion.
Dude posts a link 95% of the time with any data he spews.
He doesn't post much positive, I agree. He ignores my direct questions often when we disagree. He is not a troll tho, I know what those look like.
As for 88-93, are we letting in Tony Rice and Chris Zorich on the regular? Name the last few. Whatever the reason ND is NOT landing kids consistently in the top 30 needs to be identified and adjusted. If we are only going to land kids south of the Top 30, and mostly south of the Top 100, then our development (strength and nutrition) and coaching needs to be Tier 1.
Is our training table available three meals a day yet? This year we have a 2nd year head coach and 1st year OC. Is that tier 1 coaching? Does ND hire rookie Finance, Biology, IT professors to teach? I doubt it. They probably hire the best in their field of expertise. Do the same in football. It's not just a sport, it's a lucrative profession for the best of the best - which now starts paying in college vs the pros. And do the right thing by making the kids take legit classes and go to them.
I think we have the talent to compete, mostly. But we were lacking at WR this year. Kelly left a very thin WR room behind. Freeman's been trying to rebuild it, and brought in a very good freshman class this year. They had a good freshman year as a group.
Yours is a CONTRARIAN POSITION that disregards what many see as the UNIQUE NATURE of the overall ND experience, making you not only an off-key choir member but also a debunker of the ND ETHOS.
For the PARTISANS here, any analysis of ND’s football program can only go so deep. The MERE IDEA of a complete OVERHAUL of the football program is by definition VERBOTEN as it would entail ND, the university, violating its EDUCATIONAL MISSION.
Given that there’s a new AD and, I believe, ADMIN coming in, I expect ND’s mission to be RATIFIED, not ALTERED. Will a certain amount of TWEAKING of the football program being allowed? Who knows? But for me, that’s the only real question. In which case, yes or no and, if yes, how much?
Your position that ND AS NOW STRUCTURED CAN’T IMPROVE MUCH MORE tracks closely with mine and that of other REALISTS HERE. Where it differs from mine, specifically, is at the point where you argue that ND’s ADMIN simply needs to MODERNIZE and CHANGE ITS SPOTS. Would that it were so. But like the PARTISANS, I don’t see that happening.
And whereas you keep hammering home the point of what’s wrong and what needs changing – and, again, from a perspective that argues that change is POSSIBLE – my own argument simply points out the impossibility of ND’s being academically excellent and football-dominant at the same time.
In other words, I recognize the issue to the same extent as you but have ZERO confidence that it will EVER even be addressed, let alone resolved.
The PARTISAN ARGUMENT, on the other hand, states that despite ND’S INTERNAL CONTRADICTIONS, football supremacy can still be ACHIEVED via the right combination of COACHING, RECRUITING, WEIGHT TRAINING, FACILITIES IMPROVEMENTS, NIL TWEAKING, ETC. – never for a moment acknowledging that NONE OF THIS IS POSSIBLE unless ND’S ADMIN is 100% ALL-IN and as committed to its football program as it is to its educational mission.
When there are LIMITATIONS AT THE ADMIN LEVEL, what then FILTERS DOWN to the program at the OPERATIONAL LEVEL results in REDUCED AVAILABLE HORSEPOWER, leading to less a) room to maneuver and b) MARGIN FOR ERROR.
To me, this CAKE AND EAT IT attitude is not only HUBRISTIC but, frankly, verging on DELUSIONAL. But as you’ve pointed out elsewhere, when this approach doesn’t work, PARTISANS are quick to HIDE behind what I agree is the DISINGENUOUS “BUT WE’RE ND AND DON’T DO THOSE KINDS OF THINGS” argument.
But then, what does that get them? In fact, It’s an UNCONSCIOUS ADMISSION OF THE PROGRAM’S INHERENT STRUCTURAL LIMITATIONS.
Right now, ND is built for 10-3 seasons with occasional DEVIATIONS to 11-1 and 8-5. ND could get lucky, catch lightning in a bottle and win an NC in one of those storied, CINDERELLA seasons. But given that Ara won only two NC’s and Holtz 1, the chances of ND winning even one in the years ahead is still EXTREMELY LOW.
Yet, PARTISANS will never accept such a prognosis as they will never accept that ND is playing on a SELF-IMPOSED UNLEVEL PLAYING FIELD. For most PARTISANS, the NEED TO WIN is so COMPELLING that to ACCEPT THE REALITY of the situation would be tantamount to GIVING UP THEIR FAITH.
Yup, what we’re talking about here for many is a BELIEF SYSTEM.
AND THAT’S EXACTLY WHAT YOU’RE BANGING UP AGAINST.
At the same time, if you’re expecting MEANINGFUL CHANGE at the ADMIN LEVEL, I wouldn’t HOPE TOO HARD.
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Chase is probably one of those guys that never set foot in a college classroom.
I REDACTED most of your comment because it's IRRELEVANT to my RESPONSE, and most of what YOU WROTE as is the NORM was WASTED SPACE.
US PARTISANS UNDERSTAND AND ACCEPT THAT NOTRE DAME IS AT AN UNFAIR ADVANTAGE WHEN COMPARED TO THE FOOTBALL FACTORIES.
WE UNDERSTAND AND ACCEPT THAT THE FOOTBALL FACTORIES CAN RECRUIT THE ELITE ATHLETES WITHOUT CONSIDERATION FOR ACADEMICS, ACADEMIC CURRICULUM, AND DIRECT AND/OR INDIRECT PAYMENTS TO THE STUDENT ATHLETES.
WE UNDERSTAND THAT NOTRE DAME IS DOING THINGS THE RIGHT WAY, AND GRADUATING THEIR STUDENT ATHLETES WITH MEANINGFUL DEGREES.
SO PLEASE, DON'T SPEAK FOR US "PARTISANS" WHEN YOU HAVE ZERO CLUE AS TO WHAT WE THINK AND BELIEVE.
