How about a 15 team ACC?

[WAR PAINT]

I realize this is sort of out of the box suggestion but I believe it would maximize the TV contract the ACC is seeking.



Keep the 8 game conference schedules. How a 15 team ACC with Notre Dame playing 8 ACC games every year would work. They still get to play USC, Navy, and Stanford every year along with one other Out of Conference game. In addition they play FSU and Miami home and away every year. Such match ups would yield awesome TV ratings. That is what it is all about right? It also would give Notre Dame a great recruiting presence in Florida. Every ACC team would play every other ACC twice every 4 years.





Here is the suggested yearly match ups for the rest of the ACC would play every year. Most are in close proximity to each other.

Clemson- ................... GT.,,,,,,,, VT
BC ..................... Syracuse......... Pittsburgh
Pittsburgh................... BC ........... Syracuse
NC State .................... UNC........... Louisville
Wake Forest................... Duke........... GT
Syracuse................... BC .......... Pittsburgh
UNC.................... NC State......... Duke
Louisville..................... Virginia ........ NC State
Duke.................... Wake Forest... ....UNC
VT .......................... Virginia......... Clemson
Virginia...................... VT.......... Louisville
GT .................... Clemson.............. Wake Forest




Notre Dame would continue to play Navy, USC, and Stanford every year with one additional opponent outside the ACC every year. They would play FSU and Miami every year home or away and would be playing every other ACC team twice every 4 years.




...................................... Year 1/2.......... Year 3/4
.................................... Atlantic ........... Coastal

Notre Dame -................Clemson ............. UNC
.................................... BC................... Pitt
.................................. NC ST............... Duke
.................................... Louis. ................ VT
.................................. Syracuse................. Virginia
....................................... Wake................ GT
..................................... FSU............. FSU
.................................... Miami............. Miami

The advantages of such a set up first would be the overall exposure to more venues than Notre Dame currently has with a total variety of playing all 14 teams in the ACC 4 year, second would be the recruiting advantage of playing in Florida every year same as they do every year like they do Stanford and USC. Finally they still keep Navy every year with still the opportunity to play some other P-5 or other Division one team.

The TV ratings are always great for FSU vs ND and Miami Vs Notre Dame. All other ACC teams get Notre Dame twice every 4 years. The slice of the TV pie is divided by 15 teams rather than 16. The divisions Atlantic and Coastal would be fluid but would still have the Coastal Champion meeting the Atlantic champion every year.

 

[NDSMC78]

How about if we just leave things the way they are?

 

[WAR PAINT]

How about if we just leave things the way they are?

Certainly that works and if that truly is in best and most logical interest of Notre Dame I can certainly agree.

Though I also believe if a better mouse trap can be built it should be considered. In CFB things are always changing. That is how the world works.

Just curious why do you believe everything should be left the way they are? If that was the case why did Notre Dame ever agree to play 5 ACC games every year? Was that leaving things the way they were?

 

[cgvr]

Certainly that works and if that truly is in best and most logical interest of Notre Dame I can certainly agree.

Though I also believe if a better mouse trap can be built it should be considered. In CFB things are always changing. That is how the world works.

Just curious why do you believe everything should be left the way they are? If that was the case why did Notre Dame ever agree to play 5 ACC games every year? Was that leaving things the way they were?

A massive restructuring of the CFB landscape at some point in the future is not out of the question....

 

[11NCs]

I realize this is sort of out of the box suggestion but I believe it would maximize the TV contract the ACC is seeking.

What evidence suggests to you that ND is interested in maximizing the value of the ACC football TV contract? A genuinely out of the box suggestion would begin with accurate premises. First, ND knows how to maximize revenue for itself. Don't fall for a premise that ND's desire for independence is solely driven by nostalgia or some Pius reverence for tradition. Independence IS how ND maximizes revenue. Second, ND already generates more football revenue than 86% of the Power 5 schools AND could easily generate more if it wanted or needed to (e.g. stadium advertising, stadium naming rights, etc.). If you begin with accurate premises, then you may be able to generate a meaningful suggestion.

 

[WAR PAINT]

What evidence suggests to you that ND is interested in maximizing the value of the ACC football TV contract? A genuinely out of the box suggestion would begin with accurate premises. First, ND knows how to maximize revenue for itself. Don't fall for a premise that ND's desire for independence is solely driven by nostalgia or some Pius reverence for tradition. Independence IS how ND maximizes revenue. Second, ND already generates more football revenue than 86% of the Power 5 schools AND could easily generate more if it wanted or needed to (e.g. stadium advertising, stadium naming rights, etc.). If you begin with accurate premises, then you may be able to generate a meaningful suggestion.

It is not necessarily just about money. It is about great CFB games every year. If Notre Dame had Miami and FSU on their schedule every year that wouldn't be more attractive than Temple and Massachusetts? Surely you jest.


Would Notre Dame recruiting benefit by playing in Florida every year.

Would Notre Dame gain better exposure on the East coast by playing all 14 teams at least twice every 4 years?

Again, if FSU dropped UF from the schedule would they also be considered independent since they would have the same amount of mandated games?

I am confused you believe Notre Dame maximizes its revenue with the current set up.

 

[twalsh]

A massive restructuring of the CFB landscape at some point in the future is not out of the question....

Might even be guaranteed, just that nobody knows when.

 

[twalsh]

I am confused you believe Notre Dame maximizes its revenue with the current set up.

It doesn't. We have chosen not to maximize revenue in order to keep our independence. If it was about maximizing revenue we would have been in the big 10 for several years now.

 

[Nocalirish]

iNDepeNDent

 

[11NCs]

It is not necessarily just about money. It is about great CFB games every year. If Notre Dame had Miami and FSU on their schedule every year that wouldn't be more attractive than Temple and Massachusetts? Surely you jest.
Would Notre Dame recruiting benefit by playing in Florida every year. Would Notre Dame gain better exposure on the East coast by playing all 14 teams at least twice every 4 years? Again, if FSU dropped UF from the schedule would they also be considered independent since they would have the same amount of mandated games? I am confused you believe Notre Dame maximizes its revenue with the current set up.

Pardon my lack of patience with you, but confusion is not your problem. As I stated, your premises are wrong (*). Come back here after you have taken time to understand 1) Notre Dame's mission and 2) marketing and brand management. This assignment may appear to be easy. It is not. Paraphrasing Lou Holtz, 'If you've been part of the Notre Dame family, no explanation is necessary. If you haven't, none is adequate.'

(*) 1) ND is interested in modifying its mission and/or priorities to maximize the value of the ACC football contract, ND football and/or the ND Athletic Dept. FALSE. If you haven't noticed, ND already generates more revenue than any football program in the State of Florida. 2) ND needs to play Florida, FSU or Miami every year in order to better recruit the State of Florida and/or to offer ND fans great games. FALSE. If ND thought this was true, its independence would enable it to take corrective action. By the way, this year ND plays in Florida, Texas (twice) and California. 3) ND / ND football is just like FSU / FSU football or any other school. FALSE.

 

[WAR PAINT]

Pardon my lack of patience with you, but confusion is not your problem. As I stated, your premises are wrong (*). Come back here after you have taken time to understand 1) Notre Dame's mission and 2) marketing and brand management. This assignment may appear to be easy. It is not. Paraphrasing Lou Holtz, 'If you've been part of the Notre Dame family, no explanation is necessary. If you haven't, none is adequate.'

(*) 1) ND is interested in modifying its mission and/or priorities to maximize the value of the ACC football contract, ND football and/or the ND Athletic Dept. FALSE. If you haven't noticed, ND already generates more revenue than any football program in the State of Florida. 2) ND needs to play Florida, FSU or Miami every year in order to better recruit the State of Florida and/or to offer ND fans great games. FALSE. If ND thought this was true, its independence would enable it to take corrective action. By the way, this year ND plays in Florida, Texas (twice) and California. 3) ND / ND football is just like FSU / FSU football or any other school. FALSE.

Two questions?

1. In your opinion which team is more independent BYU or Notre Dame?


2. So if Notre Dame has no interest in benefiting the ACC, why did they agree to join and take on the 5 mandated games?

 

[WAR PAINT]

Back to my OP I think the Notre Dame vs Miami or FSU in recent years have been captivating games that the nation has been very interested in watching. My suggestion is simply being an advocate for more of those games in the future.
I am interested in anything that makes CFB games more captivating. Call it a proactive point of view.

As to the 15 team ACC merely a suggestion over a 16 team ACC with the 16 th team not being a team beneficial to the ACC. The positives of such an arrangement out weigh the negatives by a considerable margin.


By the same token should Texas decide to join with Notre Dame that indeed would be a Game Changer!


Finally, if the status quo remains and Notre Dame stays just the same that works as well. Not that big of a deal though it does seem some ND fans are really sensitive about the issue and maintaining their vestiges of independence due to them having one extra game over teams like FSU to choose Out of conference.

 

[Irishjohn68]

Two questions?

1. In your opinion which team is more independent BYU or Notre Dame?


2. So if Notre Dame has no interest in benefiting the ACC, why did they agree to join and take on the 5 mandated games?

ND joined the ACC so the other sports would have a home conference.

ND is more independent then BYU. BYU wants to join the BIg 12 conference for football.

 

[francade]

Still don't get the "one extra game" angle. Playing usc navy & Stanford every year certainly doesn't equate to playing 3 more ACC teams per year. Far from it. Dumb argument to try and make ND look less independent than we really are. Playing 8-9 ACC games per year would suck a lot worse than having to play 5, which also sucks. Understanding the nat'l brand is part of the problem for all these rival fans that seem so concerned for our well-being. It's so transparent that they could care less about our well being and just can't take the fact that ND can stay independent. Full time membership of any conference (nothing in particular against the ACC) is not what ND wants and will forever change the ND brand. I'm hopeful that never changes.

Ps. the nd Miami games have been far from captivating recently. They've been beatdowns. Here's hoping that doesn't change come halloween weekend.

 

[SiberianKnightmare]

I stopped reading after the arguments were made to get ND more exposure. Because that's ND's problem, lack of exposure.

 

[NDSMC78]

Back to my OP I think the Notre Dame vs Miami or FSU in recent years have been captivating games that the nation has been very interested in watching. My suggestion is simply being an advocate for more of those games in the future.
I am interested in anything that makes CFB games more captivating. Call it a proactive point of view.

As to the 15 team ACC merely a suggestion over a 16 team ACC with the 16 th team not being a team beneficial to the ACC. The positives of such an arrangement out weigh the negatives by a considerable margin.


By the same token should Texas decide to join with Notre Dame that indeed would be a Game Changer!


Finally, if the status quo remains and Notre Dame stays just the same that works as well. Not that big of a deal though it does seem some ND fans are really sensitive about the issue and maintaining their vestiges of independence due to them having one extra game over teams like FSU to choose Out of conference.

Why is it so difficult to grasp that there is a huge difference between playing 5 ACC schools a year and 8 or 9 ACC schools a year?

 

[WAR PAINT]

Why is it so difficult to grasp that there is a huge difference between playing 5 ACC schools a year and 8 or 9 ACC schools a year?

I have no problem with grasping that statement. Do you fail to grasp the statement that Notre Dame has 8 games already mandated or spoken for? 5 ACC +USC, NAVY, AND STANFORD.


That leaves 4 games left to choose which is one more than FSU gets to choose because they choose to play UF every year.

 

[WAR PAINT]

I stopped reading after the arguments were made to get ND more exposure. Because that's ND's problem, lack of exposure.

If that is what you took from my commentary you clearly have missed the point.

Answer the following questions:

1. Would Notre Dames presence playing in Florida every year improve or diminish their recruiting?
2. Would Notre Dame playing FSU and Miami get better TV ratings than Nevada and Army this year?
3. I read one of the reasons for Notre Dame joining the ACC was that the majority of their fans reside on the East Coast.
Is that correct?

 

[NDSMC78]

I have no problem with grasping that statement. Do you fail to grasp the statement that Notre Dame has 8 games already mandated or spoken for? 5 ACC +USC, NAVY, AND STANFORD.


That leaves 4 games left to choose which is one more than FSU gets to choose because they choose to play UF every year.

And if ND joined the ACC, ND would have 11 or 12 games "mandated" as you use the term, every year. You hear only what you want to hear.

 

[WAR PAINT]

And if ND joined the ACC, ND would have 11 or 12 games "mandated" as you use the term, every year. You hear only what you want to hear.

I hear perfectly well and understand that point. I just disagree that Notre Dame is still totally independent.

 

[NDSMC78]

I hear perfectly well and understand that point. I just disagree that Notre Dame is still totally independent.

Good. Your disagreement is noted. Go bother some Florida fans.

 

[topdecktiger]

Your idea has too many holes. The ACC still has to maintain divisions to have a CCG. They also have to play a round robin in those divisions. One division would have 8 teams, meaning 7 division games. With an 8 game schedule, that leaves only one crossover game available. That means, for example, Florida ST would either have to give up the Miami game, or else never get to play schools from the other division. Alternately, the other division would have 6 games, and need 2 crossovers to get to 8. Since the other division only has 1 available crossover game, the opposite division is short a conference game. Even if you go to 9 games, you still that problem.

The NCAA has granted the MAC a waiver because they have unbalance divisions (with 13 schools). The bigger division doesn't have to play a round robin. However, then you have the problem of teams that might tie for the division, and have not played head to head.

 

[WAR PAINT]

Your idea has too many holes. The ACC still has to maintain divisions to have a CCG. They also have to play a round robin in those divisions. One division would have 8 teams, meaning 7 division games. With an 8 game schedule, that leaves only one crossover game available. That means, for example, Florida ST would either have to give up the Miami game, or else never get to play schools from the other division. Alternately, the other division would have 6 games, and need 2 crossovers to get to 8. Since the other division only has 1 available crossover game, the opposite division is short a conference game. Even if you go to 9 games, you still that problem.

The NCAA has granted the MAC a waiver because they have unbalance divisions (with 13 schools). The bigger division doesn't have to play a round robin. However, then you have the problem of teams that might tie for the division, and have not played head to head.

You may be right and I probably missed something. Perhaps you can explain what is wrong with this proposal. I will just list Clemson, FSU, and UNC as examples for your opinion since you already have Notre Dame's proposed schedule.


...............................Atlantic ½........... Coastal ¾
Clemson................. GT............. ..........GT

.................................VT .......................VT

.................................BC...................... UNC

...............................NC State.............. Pittsburgh

...............................Louisville............... Duke

...............................Syracuse................ Virginia

.............................Wake Forest............ Miami

....................................FSU.................. Notre Dame



..............................Atlantic ½ .................. Coastal ¾
FSU....................... Clemson.................... UNC

................................BC........................... Pittsburgh

................................NC State................... Duke

...............................Louisville..................... VT

...............................Syracuse.................... Virginia

..............................Wake Forest................ GT

..............................Notre Dame............... Notre Dame

..............................Miami......................... Miami



................................Atlantic ½.................... Coastal ¾
UNC....................... NC State..................... NC State

.................................Duke............................ Duke

................................Clemson...................... Pittsburgh

....................................BC............................ VT

..............................Louisville....................... Virginia

................................Syracuse....................... GT

..............................Wake Forest................... Miami

....................................FSU.......................... Notre Dame


There would still be divisions and there would still be 8 conference games. The only thing that changes is division membership every 2 years. Everyone still plays all the members of their division each year. They still play a conference championship. Perhaps I am missing something from your commentary. Please explain again.

The first 2 years Clemson would play the same 6 teams in currently plays in the Atlantic Division along with GT and VT The next 2 years they would play the 6 members of the Coastal along with Notre Dame and Miami.


Again, perhaps there is something I am overlooking. If that is the case keep the status Quo or bring in Texas and Notre Dame!

 

[topdecktiger]

You may be right and I probably missed something. Perhaps you can explain what is wrong with this proposal. I will just list Clemson, FSU, and UNC as examples for your opinion since you already have Notre Dame's proposed schedule.


...............................Atlantic ½........... Coastal ¾
Clemson................. GT............. ..........GT

.................................VT .......................VT

.................................BC...................... UNC

...............................NC State.............. Pittsburgh

...............................Louisville............... Duke

...............................Syracuse................ Virginia

.............................Wake Forest............ Miami

....................................FSU.................. Notre Dame



..............................Atlantic ½ .................. Coastal ¾
FSU....................... Clemson.................... UNC

................................BC........................... Pittsburgh

................................NC State................... Duke

...............................Louisville..................... VT

...............................Syracuse.................... Virginia

..............................Wake Forest................ GT

..............................Notre Dame............... Notre Dame

..............................Miami......................... Miami



................................Atlantic ½.................... Coastal ¾
UNC....................... NC State..................... NC State

.................................Duke............................ Duke

................................Clemson...................... Pittsburgh

....................................BC............................ VT

..............................Louisville....................... Virginia

................................Syracuse....................... GT

..............................Wake Forest................... Miami

....................................FSU.......................... Notre Dame


There would still be divisions and there would still be 8 conference games. The only thing that changes is division membership every 2 years. Everyone still plays all the members of their division each year. They still play a conference championship. Perhaps I am missing something from your commentary. Please explain again.

The first 2 years Clemson would play the same 6 teams in currently plays in the Atlantic Division along with GT and VT The next 2 years they would play the 6 members of the Coastal along with Notre Dame and Miami.


Again, perhaps there is something I am overlooking. If that is the case keep the status Quo or bring in Texas and Notre Dame!

If you are going to rotate the divisions, then that would eliminate the problem of not playing all the schools. (Although, you have to realize that there are some rivalry games that would need to be protected, which in quick glance at your setup, you didn't account for.)

However, you are still left with the problem of scheduling. Let's just take the divisions as they are now, with Notre Dame added to the Atlantic. Let's also assume 8 conference games.

Atlantic ....... Coastal
BC....... Duke
Clemson....... GT
Florida St....... Miami
Louisville....... UNC
NC State....... Pitt
Syracuse....... UVA
WF....... VT
Notre Dame

Ok, so take Clemson. They have 7 other teams in the division to play. Now they have only 1 crossover game available. Now take Duke. They only have 6 other division teams to play. That means they need 2 crossover games. Now, let's look at what happens when we assign all the Atlantic teams crossover games:

BC-Duke
FSU-Miami
Louisville-UNC
NCST-Pitt
Syracuse-UVA
WF-VT
Notre Dame - Duke

Ok, everybody has their crossover. So now, all the Atlantic teams have their full 8 game schedule. However, the Coastal schools are only at 7 games: they have 6 division games and 1 crossover. They still need an additional crossover to get to 8. Ok, so, were does the 8th game come from? We were able to get 2 for Duke. They get BC and Notre Dame, so Duke is at 8. However, what do we do for the other Coastal schools? They all only have 7 games. All the Atlantic schools are at 8. Miami, for example, only has 7 games, 6 divisions + Florida St crossover. Nobody is left for them to play. If Miami plays 8 games, that means somebody in the Atlantic has to play 9. Same thing for Pitt, UNC, UVA, VT.

So here's your problem. That would mean an unbalanced schedule, because the Atlantic schools would have to play 9 conference games, while the Coastal would only have to play 8. Furthermore, within the Atlantic division, two schools would only play 8 conference games, while the other 6 schools would play 9.

The only way avoid that problem is not to require the Atlantic to play a round robin. That way, all schools in the conference could play the same amount of games. However, if you did that, then you would have a situation where two teams in the Atlantic could tie, but not have played head-to-head.

 

[IRISHJD98]

Two questions?

1. In your opinion which team is more independent BYU or Notre Dame?


2. So if Notre Dame has no interest in benefiting the ACC, why did they agree to join and take on the 5 mandated games?

To answer the second question first, Notre Dame entered into a scheduling agreement with the ACC because it benefited Notre Dame. You can spin it as Notre Dame being "mandated" to play 5 ACC football games a year. But the ACC is now contractually obligated to supply Notre Dame with 5 football opponents per year. That's important for us. Without a scheduling agreement with conferences, its logistically very difficult schedule quality teams - especially teams from the more powerful conferences - in October and November when teams are in the middle of their conference schedules.

Keep in mind that ND already had a scheduling agreement with the Big East and had been scheduling three games a year with the Big 10 right before the ACC deal, which amounted to 6-7 games a year between the two conferences. When ND decided to replace its football scheduling agreement with the Big East to a football scheduling agreement with the ACC, the Big 10 was screwing around with its football own commitments and the stability of Big East in a way that seemed calculated to limit ND's ability to continue scheduling quality opponents with either those conferences. More and more we had to schedule Big 10 teams for September, which wasn't helpful filling October or November dates. Jim Delany was lobbying for a cross over series with the Pac 12 that would have further limited ND's ability to schedule Big 10 teams. And the Big 10 showed interest in moving to 9 game conference schedules that would further limit scheduling opportunities. Following Jim Delany's lead, Michigan was playing hard to get about extending the ND series. Big 10 teams were no longer reliable opponents,and the better Big East teams were being picked off one by one.

Unlike the Big 10 and Michigan, USC demonstrated a commitment to protecting the ND rivalry when the Pac 12 expanded. The Pac 12 didn't try to screw with that. So between USC and Stanford we can trust that we've got a quality late November opponent for the foreseeable future. The ACC is providing us with 5 games, most of which appear to be slated for October and November, and we've dialed back the number of games we're scheduling with Big 10 teams. The ACC's fair with its scheduling, and that gives us the opportunity to schedule Texas or Georgia early in the year while giving the Big 10 the big bird. And I'm cool with that.

As far as BYU goes, the real issue isn't about which program is "more independent". Its about which program has a sustainable model for football independence. I think most people, including those that follow BYU, do not believe BYU can sustain its present football independence very long. I think many BYU fans believe that their non-football programs took a step down in conference affiliation when BYU went to football independence. But I'm not a BYU fan so I won't claim to be an expert.

So sure, we've given up a degree of football independence. But complete football independence wouldn't mean much if we couldn't schedule quality opponents. And I'd rather depend on the ACC for 5 games than those untrustworthy Big 10 bastards for even a single game.

 

[88ND]

I have no problem with grasping that statement. Do you fail to grasp the statement that Notre Dame has 8 games already mandated or spoken for? 5 ACC +USC, NAVY, AND STANFORD.


That leaves 4 games left to choose which is one more than FSU gets to choose because they choose to play UF every year.

All of this is way wrong.
#1 we play the ACC so the other sports have other teams to compete against.

The day the big east essentially blew apart essentially left the Irish other sports in a panic mode.

Moreover...you act like the only good material is located in Florida. Western PA, Texas, MID WEST, areas all would disagree and so would Notre Dame. Hence they try to have a presence abroad.

Lastly, why in the hell does anyone want to do the ridiculous trendy thing with conferences. It's getting old frankly .

We should be cherishing and celebrating our independence.

 

[WAR PAINT]

If you are going to rotate the divisions, then that would eliminate the problem of not playing all the schools. (Although, you have to realize that there are some rivalry games that would need to be protected, which in quick glance at your setup, you didn't account for.)

However, you are still left with the problem of scheduling. Let's just take the divisions as they are now, with Notre Dame added to the Atlantic. Let's also assume 8 conference games.

Atlantic ....... Coastal
BC....... Duke
Clemson....... GT
Florida St....... Miami
Louisville....... UNC
NC State....... Pitt
Syracuse....... UVA
WF....... VT
Notre Dame

Ok, so take Clemson. They have 7 other teams in the division to play. Now they have only 1 crossover game available. Now take Duke. They only have 6 other division teams to play. That means they need 2 crossover games. Now, let's look at what happens when we assign all the Atlantic teams crossover games:

BC-Duke
FSU-Miami
Louisville-UNC
NCST-Pitt
Syracuse-UVA
WF-VT
Notre Dame - Duke

Ok, everybody has their crossover. So now, all the Atlantic teams have their full 8 game schedule. However, the Coastal schools are only at 7 games: they have 6 division games and 1 crossover. They still need an additional crossover to get to 8. Ok, so, were does the 8th game come from? We were able to get 2 for Duke. They get BC and Notre Dame, so Duke is at 8. However, what do we do for the other Coastal schools? They all only have 7 games. All the Atlantic schools are at 8. Miami, for example, only has 7 games, 6 divisions + Florida St crossover. Nobody is left for them to play. If Miami plays 8 games, that means somebody in the Atlantic has to play 9. Same thing for Pitt, UNC, UVA, VT.

So here's your problem. That would mean an unbalanced schedule, because the Atlantic schools would have to play 9 conference games, while the Coastal would only have to play 8. Furthermore, within the Atlantic division, two schools would only play 8 conference games, while the other 6 schools would play 9.

The only way avoid that problem is not to require the Atlantic to play a round robin. That way, all schools in the conference could play the same amount of games. However, if you did that, then you would have a situation where two teams in the Atlantic could tie, but not have played head-to-head.

I see where my mistake lies but if there were no divisions would it work? I realize that the B1G and SEC voted against the ACC trying to do this. Just the two best teams every year would create a better championship game.

 

[northvanole]

Not sure why there are multiple threads on the same issue. As I wrote in the other thread, ND is the most independent of all college football teams. And I explain why elsewhere in the other thread.

 

[topdecktiger]

I see where my mistake lies but if there were no divisions would it work? I realize that the B1G and SEC voted against the ACC trying to do this. Just the two best teams every year would create a better championship game.

No divisions is problematic. Defining the two "best" teams is way too subjective. Even if you go by committee rankings, that's still too subjective. You could have a situation where teams have the same record, so there isn't a clear cut way to say who is "best." Or, you might have one time is clearly the best, but #2 and 3 are tied and there isn't really a way to determine who should go. Without divisions, it's possible that the two or three best teams in the conference didn't play each other, and there really wouldn't be a good tie breaker. It's basically a way to play favorites to just get the teams you want into the CCG, rather than having teams actually earn it on the field. With divisions, everyone plays head to head, so you can get a clear cut winner.

 

[BGI User 348]

Does anyone notice that BK frequently says that ".....since ND does not play for a conference championship....."?

 

[WAR PAINT]

No divisions is problematic. Defining the two "best" teams is way too subjective. Even if you go by committee rankings, that's still too subjective. You could have a situation where teams have the same record, so there isn't a clear cut way to say who is "best." Or, you might have one time is clearly the best, but #2 and 3 are tied and there isn't really a way to determine who should go. Without divisions, it's possible that the two or three best teams in the conference didn't play each other, and there really wouldn't be a good tie breaker. It's basically a way to play favorites to just get the teams you want into the CCG, rather than having teams actually earn it on the field. With divisions, everyone plays head to head, so you can get a clear cut winner.

Oh well... So when are Texas and Notre Dame all in! Duck duck incoming!


Hey I think both would elevate the ACC to the number one overall P-5 conference in America. IMO

 

[Epictitus]

How about if we just move out of the ACC and get in to a league that has respect of th nation.

 

[scotchirishblood]

How about if we just move out of the ACC and get in to a league that has respect of th nation.

Ridiculous!

There has been plenty of discussion from the sport pundits that the ACC could have two members in the playoffss. That's respect. Plus, when it comes to other sports the ACC is easily respected as one of (if not the) top conference overall. ND is right where they should be. Plus academically what Power Five Conference is ranked higher? Do your research.

 

[twalsh]

How about if we just move out of the ACC and get in to a league that has respect of th nation.

It's just killing you that this ACC thing is working out so well, isn't it? Better learn to like it, or find another team to root for. It's here to stay.

 

[cgvr]

How about if we just move out of the ACC and get in to a league that has respect of th nation.

Can you please rank the conferences in order of "respect of th nation"?

 

[Nocalirish]

It's just killing you that this ACC thing is working out so well, isn't it? Better learn to like it, or find another team to root for. It's here to stay.

Only idiots learn to like things that are not beneficial to their teams. The ACC "thing" is killing ND's strength of schedule this year and for years to come.

 

[NDSMC78]

Only idiots learn to like things that are not beneficial to their teams. The ACC "thing" is killing ND's strength of schedule this year and for years to come.

No it's not. ND's SOS is just fine.

 

[scotchirishblood]

Only idiots learn to like things that are not beneficial to their teams. The ACC "thing" is killing ND's strength of schedule this year and for years to come.

Ridiculous.

The Nevadas and Armys of the world are having a greater effect than anything the ACC has to offer to the strength of schedule.

 

[twalsh]

Only idiots learn to like things that are not beneficial to their teams. The ACC "thing" is killing ND's strength of schedule this year and for years to come.

Dang, you just made that up.

 

[twalsh]

Only idiots learn to like things that are not beneficial to their teams. The ACC "thing" is killing ND's strength of schedule this year and for years to come.

Per Sagarin, our 2015 SOS, #17, was our best in the last 6 years, and that was.of course, within the ACC agreement period. Ergo, I repeat, you just made that up.