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OT: What Is Happening At The White House?

I didn't vote for Trump or Clinton, I wrote someone in. Trump needed to surround himself with experienced people - his staff is letting him down left and right.

I'm a gun owner, and so are most of my friends. I haven't had a chance to read what congress did recently regarding mentally ill people purchasing, but I'd love to see mentally ill people get treatment and have no firearms.

Why can't these electeds work to find middle ground?
 
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Granite45 said:
Considering the difference in popular vote, liberal-leaning voters outnumber conservative-leaning voters. Electoral College supporting less populated states saved Trump, but he certainly has no mandate for his actions and policies, but he does have the Presidential authority, but he also does not truly speak for the average American.
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Clinton's entire margin in the popular with made up by the difference in California a state that had no Republican in the Senate race. It was two democrats. Many republicans, sadly, didn;t vote because Clinton was going to win the state and there was no Senator to vote for. Even if everyone voted you think win California big speaks to the average American?
 
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beachcardinal said:
Clinton's entire margin in the popular with made up by the difference in California a state that had no Republican in the Senate race. It was two democrats. Many republicans, sadly, didn;t vote because Clinton was going to win the state and there was no Senator to vote for. Even if everyone voted you think win California big speaks to the average American?
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No, only the average intelligent American.
Comrade Trumpsky will eventually be tried for treason.
 
Momo222 said:
I didn't vote for Trump or Clinton, I wrote someone in. Trump needed to surround himself with experienced people - his staff is letting him down left and right.

I'm a gun owner, and so are most of my friends. I haven't had a chance to read what congress did recently regarding mentally ill people purchasing, but I'd love to see mentally ill people get treatment and have no firearms.

Why can't these electeds work to find middle ground?
Click to expand...

But can you deny the mentally ill a Constitutional right?
 
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rgc7 said:
Ontario,
I enjoyed reading your comments, and no matter what type of health care , there are certainly pros and cons.
When I lived and worked in Germany as a young man. Germany had what seemed like a perfect
system of Socialized Medicine. It seemed like a dream come true !
Medical, Dental, eye care, prescription Drgs, Vacations for Cures and rehabilitation, etc.
why did it work so well ? The older population was decimated in WWII , the German economy was growing
and the need for labor was large, The Young working people paying into the system greatly outnumbered
the relatively small older population.
Then the Wall came down, and a large influx of East Germans flooded the system, The guest
workers who came into Germany and the flood of immigrants needed all types of welfare. Taxes, Taxes, Taxes !
In short, All socialzed systems fail when they run out of " Other Peoples Money "
America can not afford a truely Socialized Medical System ! Too many people on Welfare, shortage of
jobs, too big a deficit, too many immigrants legal and illigal, etc!
Too many Doctors,in many case, are more business men than Medical Doctors. I was very fortunate
as a young man ( without any medical insurance during my first year of employment ) with a growing family to find two great Family Doctors, who delivered my children and treated my family concerned more about
the welfare of my family than their bottom line.
now, most doctors will not even take a patient without the "Right" type of insurance.
I don't know too many details about Canadian Insurance, but , " Correct me if I am Wrong " , but
waiting lists are long in Canada, and Many More well to do Canadians come to the USA to avoid waiting
in Canada.
I also go to mexico because of the unaffordable dental care here in the USA, and there are also
many Canadians doing the same thing.
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Cool perspective and a good read! Thanks for the input on Germany, especially!

As for you question surrounding Canadians going to the U.S. for Healthcare because of waits. That is definitely true in some instances. While Canadian emergency and life saving medicine is some of the best and most efficient and cost affective in the world, that comes at a price. Often elective procedures and those considered to be not immediately neccessary, can get quite back-logged. Canadians do not die on the table because they don't have coverage, but the wait sure as heck can take a long time to get a knee or hip replaced. It will be covered, but you'll wait, while those in greater need are prioritized.

A small, but very real number of Canadians head South every year to have elective procedures that they don't want to wait for. That is, of course, if they can afford to pay out of pocket. We see that with the "Snowbirds" who head to Florida and the Carolinas in the winter months. The vast majority of their ranks are wealthy, retired Canadians, looking to escape the winter. The ones in need of minor / moderate medical attention that would leave them on a wait list here in Canada, will often book their procedures down in their winter destinations and pay for it out of pocket.
 
IrishInOntario said:
Cool perspective and a good read! Thanks for the input on Germany, especially!

As for you question surrounding Canadians going to the U.S. for Healthcare because of waits. That is definitely true in some instances. While Canadian emergency and life saving medicine is some of the best and most efficient and cost affective in the world, that comes at a price. Often elective procedures and those considered to be not immediately neccessary, can get quite back-logged. Canadians do not die on the table because they don't have coverage, but the wait sure as heck can take a long time to get a knee or hip replaced. It will be covered, but you'll wait, while those in greater need are prioritized.

A small, but very real number of Canadians head South every year to have elective procedures that they don't want to wait for. That is, of course, if they can afford to pay out of pocket. We see that with the "Snowbirds" who head to Florida and the Carolinas in the winter months. The vast majority of their ranks are wealthy, retired Canadians, looking to escape the winter. The ones in need of minor / moderate medical attention that would leave them on a wait list here in Canada, will often book their procedures down in their winter destinations and pay for it out of pocket.
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Don't forget the medical travel industry that is thriving in the US to get affordable services and medication. Regulaltion D alleviated some of the prescription expenses but was quite a windfall for drug companies.

I have read that Canadians who vacation or travel to the US often buy medical insurance for while they are here. A US hospital visit can wipe out a year or more of income.
 
REMND said:
Don't forget the medical travel industry that is thriving in the US to get affordable services and medication. Regulaltion D alleviated some of the prescription expenses but was quite a windfall for drug companies.

I have read that Canadians who vacation or travel to the US often buy medical insurance for while they are here. A US hospital visit can wipe out a year or more of income.
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Definitely true on all accounts. I do love that the Canadian Government caps to the best of its ability, the cost of prescription drugs here. They can still be costly, of course, but a lot cheaper than a lot of other people pay.

I'm a true believer in free markets and Capital ism in about 95% of my life... But I see absolutely no reason why corporations should be able to charge astronomical amounts of money to people for medication that they need for their survival. I'm all for not approving a medication's in your country if the company that owns it wants to charge such a savage cost for it that that vast majority of their he people who need it, can't afford it.

I think sometimes we need to fall back on common sense.
 
beachcardinal said:
Clinton's entire margin in the popular with made up by the difference in California a state that had no Republican in the Senate race. It was two democrats. Many republicans, sadly, didn;t vote because Clinton was going to win the state and there was no Senator to vote for. Even if everyone voted you think win California big speaks to the average American?
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The main point is that Trump does not have a mandate.
 
wicker said:
But can you deny the mentally ill a Constitutional right?
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Yes. Guns aren't the problem, it's the people who use them inappropriately that are. Whether it be Columbine or Orlando or any other situation like them, people with mental issues pulled the trigger.
 
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Granite45 said:
And you know them so well that you can speak for them. Seems you are acting in the manner that you are criticizing.
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Well living in Southern California I do have contac with a lot of Norcal liberals. It is a generalization, but a relatively accurate one. It is personified in Norcal Irish. Hnece his belief that intelligent American all feel the way he does.
 
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Granite45 said:
The main point is that Trump does not have a mandate.
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I guess unless you consider the electoral vote, the 10090 seats the Republicans have gained in the last eight yeat at the state and federal level, the fact the they kept control of the Senate in an unfavorable year when many more Republican seats were at state and the fact that in several states were Senate Democrats are up for re election in two years are in states the Trump carried by 20 or more points, and that the vast majority of state now have a Republican Governor and control of both house and that he won by a popular vote landslide if you consider all the all states except New York and California, well then I guess that is true. He certainly doesn't have one in California and New York if that is the standard.
 
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beachcardinal said:
Well living in Southern California I do have contac with a lot of Norcal liberals. It is a generalization, but a relatively accurate one. It is personified in Norcal Irish. Hnece his belief that intelligent American all feel the way he does.
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All intelligent Americans do feel the way I do. The truth hurts doesn't it UOJ guy.
 
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Bodizephax said:
Shut your pie hole Purse junior. Trump is awesome.
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Shut my pie hole???? Wow! Great response, IF YOUR 12!!!

Name one thing that Trump has done since becoming President that has made home awesome.
 
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IrishInOntario said:
Definitely true on all accounts. I do love that the Canadian Government caps to the best of its ability, the cost of prescription drugs here. They can still be costly, of course, but a lot cheaper than a lot of other people pay.

I'm a true believer in free markets and Capital ism in about 95% of my life... But I see absolutely no reason why corporations should be able to charge astronomical amounts of money to people for medication that they need for their survival. I'm all for not approving a medication's in your country if the company that owns it wants to charge such a savage cost for it that that vast majority of their he people who need it, can't afford it.

I think sometimes we need to fall back on common sense.
Click to expand...
Ontario and Remnd,

All good points ! I live Arizona and we have many snow birds coming to Arizona every year, some even own some very beautiful and expensive homes that they only use for a few months every year.
I never thought of their buying Travel Insurance ? If it covers their proceedures here, it seems like a good way " To beat the system " ?
I have mixed feelings about the cost of drugs. On the one hand, I would certainly want them as inexpensive as possible.
However, as an investor in Biotech Companies, I am absolutely certain, that their research will,
hopefully, in my lifetime , will result in cures for some of the most deadly illnesses know to man.
This research is extremly time consuming and costly and failures are very common. There has to be a financial payoff to the investors who risk their money to fund this research ! So it is very difficult to say
just how costly a drug can be ?
Here is another thought on costs : If a drug can keep people off Chemo, or dialysis, or out of long
hospital stays, etc , how much money, pain ,and suffering does that drug actuall safe the patient ?
How much is it worth to get relief fron pain, immobility, etc. back to a normal quality of life ?
 
Nocalirish said:
All intelligent Americans do feel the way I do. The truth hurts doesn't it UOJ guy.
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The truth is every intelligent person in America feels the way you do. That is your position? Do you have any idea how foolish that is? Ben Carson is stupid, correct? General Mattis, stupid correct? Everyone who vote for Trump or now thinks he is OK, stupid. Come on, you can do better than that...or at least an intelligent person could.
 
Granite45 said:
Again, from your perspective. These targets of yours could just as easily generalize about you.
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That's true, but the generalization that Northern Californian are very liberal is not really that much of a stretch, is it? Granted Norcal is just one example but he just posted that every American who doesn't feel the way he does is stupid. To me that is very representative. There is no thought. No argument. No use of facts. Just a blanket statement that , "every intelligent American", feel the way he does. Now this statement is obviously moronic, be he actually believes it. Hillary of course, is not a Californian but her "deplorables" statement is an attitude quite often reflected in Northern California.

As to use the same generalization type of generalization against me, that is factual true, since my response was to his generalization. My original post however, contained facts and reason.
 
rgc7 said:
Ontario and Remnd,

All good points ! I live Arizona and we have many snow birds coming to Arizona every year, some even own some very beautiful and expensive homes that they only use for a few months every year.
I never thought of their buying Travel Insurance ? If it covers their proceedures here, it seems like a good way " To beat the system " ?
I have mixed feelings about the cost of drugs. On the one hand, I would certainly want them as inexpensive as possible.
However, as an investor in Biotech Companies, I am absolutely certain, that their research will,
hopefully, in my lifetime , will result in cures for some of the most deadly illnesses know to man.
This research is extremly time consuming and costly and failures are very common. There has to be a financial payoff to the investors who risk their money to fund this research ! So it is very difficult to say
just how costly a drug can be ?
Here is another thought on costs : If a drug can keep people off Chemo, or dialysis, or out of long
hospital stays, etc , how much money, pain ,and suffering does that drug actuall safe the patient ?
How much is it worth to get relief fron pain, immobility, etc. back to a normal quality of life ?
Click to expand...

I have a friend who works in pharmaceuticals. She said that they had drugs that took 10 years to go the the FDA at a cost of one billion dollars. It is not easy to recoup that amount on money and lost time. If we reduce that time and cost, we reduce the cost of drugs.
 
Zorich 88 said:
Shut my pie hole???? Wow! Great response, IF YOUR 12!!!

Name one thing that Trump has done since becoming President that has made home awesome.
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Trump has done nothing that made, I guess you meant him, awesome. Neither has he done anything destructive. See my original post is you want, what I beehive to be a fair summary.
 
beachcardinal said:
I guess unless you consider the electoral vote, the 10090 seats the Republicans have gained in the last eight yeat at the state and federal level, the fact the they kept control of the Senate in an unfavorable year when many more Republican seats were at state and the fact that in several states were Senate Democrats are up for re election in two years are in states the Trump carried by 20 or more points, and that the vast majority of state now have a Republican Governor and control of both house and that he won by a popular vote landslide if you consider all the all states except New York and California, well then I guess that is true. He certainly doesn't have one in California and New York if that is the standard.
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Beach,
I have tried to have a serious debate on the whole issue, and found that very few posters really want to debate the issues. Some like to name call, so I just ignore those posters. Other just use talking points,
that require very little thought, so I just stopped trying to debate the issue on this board.
I try to read the online WP, BBC, and a number of other publications. I even try to watch CNN
a few times a day. I can not find one possitive thing that any of them ever say or write about President Trump.
I will not debate the issues again on this board, but just state why I voted for President Trump;
1. I am a Catholic and Trump is a right to life president ! As far as I know, the Catholic Church still believes
" That all Life begins at conception" !
2. I believe in a strong national defense. I know first hand the disasterous consequences of a weak military !
3. I believe in uniting our country, rebuilding our inner cities and our inferstructure.
4. I believe in lower taxes, " A rising tide lifts all ships " John Fitzgerald Kennedy .
5. I believe in energy independents, using all forms of energy available
6. I believe in " Draining the swamp " by cutting waste and streamlining governmental agencies.
7. I believe that minorities must be given the right to go to the same schools that all other children go to.
8. I believe that Minorities must be protected from violent criminals in their own communities. Yes, " Black
Lives do matter ", but it is not the Police who are killing Blacks in our inner cities.
9. I believe that we must close our borders.
10. Both my study of history and of the Koran tell me ,without any doubt, that Muslims are not like
any other type of past immigrants who ever came to our country, because their alligence is primarlly
to Sharia law which is incompatable with the Judio Christian foundations of our constitution and of our freedoms. They are also anti women, anti Jew, anti Christian, and anti gay.
Those are the reasons I voted for President Trump. I have tried to debate these issues in the past,
and I am not going to do it again on this board. However, I would certainly be interested in reading any serious views, pro or con , on why people voted for the Democrats.
One other point, Mr. Trump is our President, I really think in all fairness, he deserves a chance
to govern and if he fails after his first term, we have the right to vote hin out.
 
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I find it very disturbing that Trump crowd's are 99% white. That is not America! He has no message that reaches all Americans.
 
beachcardinal said:
I have a friend who works in pharmaceuticals. She said that they had drugs that took 10 years to go the the FDA at a cost of one billion dollars. It is not easy to recoup that amount on money and lost time. If we reduce that time and cost, we reduce the cost of drugs.
Click to expand...

Exactly Beach ! I just enjoy researching and reading all of the research that these companies are doing !
This research just touches the surface of the mind of the Divinity. As amazing and fascinating as the research is, it is just scratching the surface.
If mankind can keep from destroying itself, young people can look forward to
long and good quality lives !
 
beachcardinal said:
That's true, but the generalization that Northern Californian are very liberal is not really that much of a stretch, is it? Granted Norcal is just one example but he just posted that every American who doesn't feel the way he does is stupid. To me that is very representative. There is no thought. No argument. No use of facts. Just a blanket statement that , "every intelligent American", feel the way he does. Now this statement is obviously moronic, be he actually believes it. Hillary of course, is not a Californian but her "deplorables" statement is an attitude quite often reflected in Northern California.
Click to expand...

It is an issue of "n" inasmuch as opposing groups always attempt to belittle an opposing opinion.

One difficulty with Clinton's deplorables comment was that she said this about 50% of Trump's supporters at the same time polls showed that >50% of Trump's supporters believed Obama was not a citizen and that he was a Muslim; both demonstrably false. Certainly Clinton erred in her comment, but 50% Trump's supporters did themselves no credit holding such views; sort of a modern day flat-earth society.
 
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beachcardinal said:
I have a friend who works in pharmaceuticals. She said that they had drugs that took 10 years to go the the FDA at a cost of one billion dollars. It is not easy to recoup that amount on money and lost time. If we reduce that time and cost, we reduce the cost of drugs.
Click to expand...

Except, a lot of the costs are used to lower taxes as business expenses so much of the rhetoric is over-stated; it is unlikely that the true cost was a billion dollars.
 
Granite45 said:
Except, a lot of the costs are used to lower taxes as business expenses so much of the rhetoric is over-stated; it is unlikely that the true cost was a billion dollars.
Click to expand...
Does it need to be to make drugs more costly? Would 500 million be acceptable to you?
 
rgc7 said:
Beach,
I have tried to have a serious debate on the whole issue, and found that very few posters really want to debate the issues. Some like to name call, so I just ignore those posters. Other just use talking points,
that require very little thought, so I just stopped trying to debate the issue on this board.
I try to read the online WP, BBC, and a number of other publications. I even try to watch CNN
a few times a day. I can not find one possitive thing that any of them ever say or write about President Trump.
I will not debate the issues again on this board, but just state why I voted for President Trump;
1. I am a Catholic and Trump is a right to life president ! As far as I know, the Catholic Church still believes
" That all Life begins at conception" !
2. I believe in a strong national defense. I know first hand the disasterous consequences of a weak military !
3. I believe in uniting our country, rebuilding our inner cities and our inferstructure.
4. I believe in lower taxes, " A rising tide lifts all ships " John Fitzgerald Kennedy .
5. I believe in energy independents, using all forms of energy available
6. I believe in " Draining the swamp " by cutting waste and streamlining governmental agencies.
7. I believe that minorities must be given the right to go to the same schools that all other children go to.
8. I believe that Minorities must be protected from violent criminals in their own communities. Yes, " Black
Lives do matter ", but it is not the Police who are killing Blacks in our inner cities.
9. I believe that we must close our borders.
10. Both my study of history and of the Koran tell me ,without any doubt, that Muslims are not like
any other type of past immigrants who ever came to our country, because their alligence is primarlly
to Sharia law which is incompatable with the Judio Christian foundations of our constitution and of our freedoms. They are also anti women, anti Jew, anti Christian, and anti gay.
Those are the reasons I voted for President Trump. I have tried to debate these issues in the past,
and I am not going to do it again on this board. However, I would certainly be interested in reading any serious views, pro or con , on why people voted for the Democrats.
One other point, Mr. Trump is our President, I really think in all fairness, he deserves a chance
to govern and if he fails after his first term, we have the right to vote hin out.
Click to expand...

It is astounding. Saw a CNN headline that said Trump forced Christie to eat meatloaf!. Not kidding. Obviously this is not news but the editors thought there was something in there that might make him look bad so they used it. The problem is Trump does have flaws, but the media has lost so much credibility (more believe Trump than the media) that the true stories get lost in the hogwash.
 
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Zorich 88 said:
I find it very disturbing that Trump crowd's are 99% white. That is not America! He has no message that reaches all Americans.
Click to expand...
Trump got more of the black and Hispanic vote then Romney did, but perhaps you thought the same of him. Maybe a Mormon isn't America either. And of course no President has ever had a message that works for all Americans.
 
beachcardinal said:
It is astounding. Saw a CNN headline that said Trump forced Christie to eat meatloaf!. Not kidding. Obviously this is not news but the editors thought there was something in there that might make him look bad so they used it. The problem is Trump does have flaws, but the media has lost so much credibility (more believe Trump than the media) that the true stories get lost in the hogwash.
Click to expand...

Remember the headline where he said he grabs women by the pussy! No kidding. Now that's astounding!
 
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NIN Irish said:
Remember the headline where he said he grabs women by the pussy! No kidding. Now that's astounding!
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Exactly my point. All the stuff that should be a problem like your example, isn't because it gets lost in the nonsense. The important tuff gets shrugged off because the public knows the press is unfair to him. It sad, but the press has been it own worse enemy of this.
 
Bodizephax said:
1.Opened up the Dakota pipe line. I could name several more good things Trump has done but you only asked for one.
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Here's sort of a summary:
There was supposed to be a 90 ban on five countries identified by Obama as suppoting terror that was stayed by the courts.The pipeline has been restored. Border enforcement has been doubled. New rules are in place requiring an agency writing new regulation to consider the cost and to cancel two existing regs. There has been a federal hiring freeze.

Oh yeah, and Trump has been a big meanie to the press (Although he did not try to expel a news media from all press conferences as Obama tried with Fox, nor order a phone tap on a reporter as Obama did.) There has been nominated, a supremely qualified Supreme Court Justice who was approved 98-0 for the circuit court who may be too conservative for some. There have been announcements of new jobs and a new 7 billion dollar capital investment in Arizona. The market it at it highest level ever. There have been several demonstrations, some of them destructive.He got Boeing to reduce the cost of the 21 new Air Force One planes and will probably get a reduction on the F35
 
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beachcardinal said:
Here's sort of a summary:
There was supposed to be a 90 ban on five countries identified by Obama as suppoting terror that was stayed by the courts.The pipeline has been restored. Border enforcement has been doubled. New rules are in place requiring an agency writing new regulation to consider the cost and to cancel two existing regs. There has been a federal hiring freeze.

Oh yeah, and Trump has been a big meanie to the press (Although he did not try to expel a news media from all press conferences as Obama tried with Fox, nor order a phone tap on a reporter as Obama did.) There has been nominated, a supremely qualified Supreme Court Justice who was approved 98-0 for the circuit court who may be too conservative for some. There have been announcements of new jobs and a new 7 billion dollar capital investment in Arizona. The market it at it highest level ever. There have been several demonstrations, some of them destructive.He got Boeing to reduce the cost of the 21 new Air Force One planes and will probably get a reduction on the F35
Click to expand...


Trump is the peoples President.
 
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