Officially Official ND vs. Cuse thread
- Thread starter Shakin' Down the Thunder
- Start date
Dungy wasn't doing anything before the injury, but you could be right. They might have scored but they wouldn't have won.
Anybody listen to what Brian Kelly just said... It's literally what I've been saying all day.
Paraphrased... My defense is elite and has been. My offense was bad in the red zone today and had bad penalties. We still scored 36 and are plenty capable but we have a lot to clean up....
No delusion. No mincing words. Striving for perfection. Love it Brian.
Paraphrased... My defense is elite and has been. My offense was bad in the red zone today and had bad penalties. We still scored 36 and are plenty capable but we have a lot to clean up....
No delusion. No mincing words. Striving for perfection. Love it Brian.
I don't believe so. He looked lost while he was playing.
Clemson is beating teams badly (looking dominant in the process).
Syracuse has had a season with a ton of good luck all season (turnover luck, lots of close wins vs bad teams, etc.)
even a dim bulb should understand coach speak.
But then when one is only about 3 watts....
This post is hilarious. You seem like the type of person that would win a 100 million dollar lottery but complain because you have to pay taxes.
Blah blah blah....recruiting rankings....blah blah blah...blah blah blah 5 stars.. blah blah blah Harry Hiestand & Tony Alford. ...blah blah blah..."poor execution vs a BAD TEAM? 8-2 and #12 in the country???
36-3 & 11-0
Would todays performance been good enough to beat Clemson.YOU DONT KNOW!!!!. If Lawrence goes down like Dungey and the D balls out maybe it is!
MORE IMPORTANTLY THEY WEREN'T PLAYING CLEMSON TODAY.
You must be really impressed with yourself and love the sound of your own voice? I do not share your sentiments.
Since your little Chicken Little hissy fit after the Stanford game last year. ND has won 12 games in a row. How many Stars does that get you on Rivals????????
IIO is not saying that NDs recruiting rankings are holding them back .. he's making an argument for the exact opposite. IM THE ONE who makes that argument, and i stick by it. ND needs a lot more good fortune to beat more talented teams as a result of their 2nd rate recruiting.
IIO is making the argument that ND can coach up/develop mediocre prospects into an elite defense like they've been all season despite not having the same amount of top 100 prospects as those elite programs. My argument is that ND has been uniquely lucky in not suffering any major injuries to the first team defense ... so it's more luck than just pure player development which means ND still needs more elite prospects.
People need to understand/read the posts before attacking them. That happens with my posts a lot too where people are attacking arguments i've never made.
IIO is making the argument that ND can coach up/develop mediocre prospects into an elite defense like they've been all season despite not having the same amount of top 100 prospects as those elite programs. My argument is that ND has been uniquely lucky in not suffering any major injuries to the first team defense ... so it's more luck than just pure player development which means ND still needs more elite prospects.
People need to understand/read the posts before attacking them. That happens with my posts a lot too where people are attacking arguments i've never made.
I bet you the coaching staff doesn't think they've over achievers, the ones who evaluated and recruited them. Your opinion on over achieving is based on rivals readings, you can have those.
Its amazing how many 3 stars are playing in the NFL and how many 5 stars are pizza delivery men or working fast food.
No one. My Dad just asked me if we(ND) are deserving of the no. 2 spot. I said no reason that Clemson should be ranked ahead of us. They haven’t done anything we haven’t done. Boston College is struggling with FSU who we all know is awful. We beat Michigan. We dominated Syracuse much more easily then Clemson did.
Mediocre prospects, wow. The defense is filled with everything but mediocre prospects. Again, your rivals worship is garbage
Brian Kelly suggested ND needed to finalize drives and clean up penalties. I don't think anyone disagreed with that.
You were going as far to say that the offense was really bad in general. People were countering some of the superfluous comments you were making with facts. Like NDs ability to move the ball, like Ian Book having another great game, etc.
The defense played plenty well enough to play with and possibly beat Clemson, today. Hard to say because Lawrence is a huge upgrade over either Syracuse quarterback. That offensive performance was nowhere near good enough to beat Clemson. 2 drop balls on 3rd down, 4 (maybe 5) false start penalties, 3 of them in the red zone (drive killers), an interception on the goal line and a solid but unspectacular 4.75 yards per carry.
All I've been arguing all game is that they'll have to be better on offense against better teams...
Thanks.. IIO has declared the defense is better than the offense! Everybody grab a chair after that mind blowing assertion
I've been in some debates with IIO about what side of the ball is better. I'm the one who has made the argument that NDs offense has been better than the defense in recent weeks, but after looking into the numbers, i recanted that position.
The defense is the better recruited side of the ball, and the better part of the team in general (NDs offense is ranked 15th or so since Ian Book/Dexter Williams took over, defense has been ranked 3rd all season)
The offense is Ian Book and Dexter Williams right now, and a lot of mediocrity/inconsistency otherwise
The defense is the better recruited side of the ball, and the better part of the team in general (NDs offense is ranked 15th or so since Ian Book/Dexter Williams took over, defense has been ranked 3rd all season)
The offense is Ian Book and Dexter Williams right now, and a lot of mediocrity/inconsistency otherwise
Point totals = Execution. ND was average today on offense, scoring below their average point totals since Book took over. It's fine. They still won. The sky is not falling. But it was substandard (their standard, not mine). Alabama 50+ today, Ohio State 50+ today, Georgia 50+ today, Clemson plays tonight... ND played the best opponent of those teams but could have also scored 50 had they executed better.
I just want better execution because it's going to matter 2 games from now. It's simple criticism, I'm not suggesting that the sky is falling.
nobody is asserting anything. I want ND to win a playoff game. They're going to have to play better on offense to do that(I'll assert that). I don't have a problem with pointing that out. If you have a problem with me pointing that out, good for you.
gee just maybe when we are in the playoffs the guys will actually be more determined and concentrate better.....
Since it will be a case of playing for all of the marbles unlike today...
amazing no one thinks of that...
"I just want better execution". You took the words right out of BK's mouth. BK and staff aren't blind. They see that it will be a busy week of practice "cleaning things up" and that doesn't even include Special Teams.
I don't think the defense is mediocre, and I don't think their prospects are mediocre. In fact I think they're playing slightly above their ranking which is awesome. They have about 8-10 NFL'ers (2 deep) in the group, a couple that will be drafted high. That's what you would expect out of a defense of quality 4 star, across the board talent, developed by an excellent coaching staff. Very similar to Michigan.
I don't see why you think I'm not crediting the defense. They're not Alabama, whose defense is built on 5 star (and high 4 star talent), is also excellently coached and will send probably 13-15 of their 2 deep to the NFL.
That's the difference. It's a small difference, but it matters in the end.
Exactly. I was pumped to hear what he said after the game. As I pointed out above.
You think you just do that?... Turn it on against a much better opponent, under a lot of pressure, with the national championship on the line.
I've never seen a team do that. You build to that. I'm really hoping they clean up the offense this week and smash USC going into the playoffs.
i don't think the difference is that small.
If ND loses someone like Jerry Tillery, or one of their two LBs, or if they lose Julian Love there's a MASSIVE drop off.
Alabama (and several other teams that recruit 2 deep the way they do) can lose some superstars and have drop off but the next guy will still be one of the most gifted athletes on the field and the defense will still perform for the most part to expectations.
ND has had a ton of injury luck on the defensive side of the ball all season which plays into their top 5 ranking on defense.
* when i site rankings im using F/P+ which quantifies defensive production at the per play level, and adjusts for quality of opponent.
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Most coaches are never satisfied until the championship is in their pocket. They always finds something to bitch about. I agree that the Irish left quite a few points on the field but they were not totally inept.
In some ways this is perfect. Kelly can be a tyrant all week about the offensive miscues (especially on the offensive line) heading to USC. They should be sharp as hell next week. Nick Saban or Lou Holtz would feast this week. The offense would hate them... It would be a relentless reminder about every mistake they made in the game. All about the mental edge and having them pissed off heading to So Cal next week.
Just let it go and enjoy 11-0! It doesn't come around very often anymore. This is a good football team. Just enjoy what it is!
when i call NDs prospects "mediocre" i don't mean mediocre on the scale of all 130+ FBS programs .. i mean mediocre relative to the top 25 or so programs/the ones that really matter
and i use that word in the literal sense (not derogatory) as in not bad, but not great.
Well I have. maybe you are not as much an expert as you claim to be...
Is anybody Alabama? That comparison is dull and irrelevant. Slightly better than their rankings? You telling me Drue, Love, Okwara, Gilman are playing slightly better than their rankings?
Who cares what they were ranked as 17 years olds?
Do you really think there is that much seperation between Clemson and ND? I for sure as hell don't, I think ND beats them tomorrow. Again, it's Bama and everybody else.
No, I don't think there is much difference between Clemson and a Notre Dame team that plays to their potential on both sides of the ball. That's why I'm critiquing the ND offense. The offense that showed up tonight is not beating Clemson. If the ND offense improves on tonight, doesn't settle and finishes those plays off, ND could play for a national title.
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