Why did ND settle for Freeman?
- Thread starter Ole.Ted
- Start date
Funny this topic just got posted. I read an article on SB Nation and this was a comment left by one of the folks who responded. What do you all think?
"Why is hiring a head coach at ND who is a project “not a bad thing”? I’m amazed at the bottomless pit of excuses many have for Coach Freeman. Davies, Willingham, and Weis all were way better prepared to take on this job and failed so badly that for awhile it seemed that ND would never be relevant again.
Then along came grumpy, stubborn, pudgy, anti-charismatic Brian Kelly, who took the dumpster fire that was ND football and had them in the national championship game in his third year, and ,while he had his setbacks, churned out double digit wins and two trips to the BCS in his last years. People here said that wasn’t good enough, that he’d hit his ceiling, that he was making excuses for himself with his “shopping down the right aisle” statements.
He then goes to LSU, a program that won the NC 3 years ago, where he has a great shot at capping his career with a championship, finally. I hope he does, because I’m grateful for what he did here at ND, where there will never be another NC unless ND gets serious about being able to beat the elite teams that have been winning championships.
That mean accessing the portal, not just for grads, but especially undergrads. Being more realistic about entry standards for players who are likeTony Rice and Chris Zorich, fine young men who to this day represent ND honorably, but would not be granted entry at today’s Notre Dame. Consider accepting JUCOs who look like they can fit the culture and keep up with the ND grind. Get real about todays world of CFB or stop expecting any ND coach to deliver miracles.
Marcus Freeman is a fine young man, high character, hugely charismatic, earnest, honest, great family man, the very opposite superficially at least from Brian Kelly. Freeman some day may have been a good HC for ND. But due to his own hubris, Jack’s laziness, the Administration’s glee at the “look” of this hire, it’s too soon for him and he’s in a job that he is not prepared to succeed in. Especially if success is defined as winning championships. You can’t talk to Tressel every week and learn how to be the HC at ND. The successful coaches like Ara, Lou, and yes, Kelly, all said they needed every bit of their head coaching experience in order to survive and win at ND. This isn’t Clemson before Dabo, where expectations were realistically low. And, frankly, Freeman is not as good as Dabo, who’s won two NCs at a school that was never to CFB what ND was. And he’s beaten Saban twice.
ND fans have wildly unrealistic expectations vs where the Administration stands on how it views what is acceptable to play football at ND. The ND fans can turn vicious. Dan Divine won a national championship and didn’t do it often enough, so he was run out of town. After his dog had been killed.
I don’t want Freeman or his family to suffer the ignominy that is likely coming. He’d better learn very fast and he better get the right, seasoned staff into the key roles under him quickly while he’s still in at least a semi-honeymoon period. Every day he loses to teams he shouldn’t, more of the luster wears off and if he does it often enough, the powers that be will bite the bullet and part ways, regardless of the blood-letting in the media that will inevitably come.
As for the players, how well will they be developed under this staff? Will Merriweather stay with no qb on the near horizon who can help him shine, or will he go into the portal to find the right situation to be groomed into a Sunday player?
We don’t get the elite skill players on offense that we need to be elite: Game-changer qb, corps of elite receivers, top notch running backs, elite DBs. Why would they come here? For them, the 40 year decision is “what has the best chance of getting me to a successful career in the NFL”. The smart ones (and yes, they are smart, many of them), know that the best fit is a school with a track record of developing talent to be drafted and then stick in the NFL. We send linemen and TEs to the NFL, but rarely the skill players, especially at QB, where we haven’t had a successful qb in the NFL since Rick Mirer in 1993, who lasted 12 years but threw more picks than tds everywhere he went. Frankly, the last star qb ND sent to the NFL was none other than Joe Montana, in 1979. We had others since then, but all of them failed at the NFL level.
Meanwhile Bama has three starting qbs in the NFL, another on his way after this season, and more first round receivers and running backs and dbs than I can count. Clemson has two starting qbs (including the suspended star Watson) and multiple others, as does OSU. That’s what Marcus Freeman has to compete against, with way more restrictions ( self imposed) than any of the true elites. Can’t do it.
That said, losing to Marshall and Stanford means he’s not in the same ballpark. We didn’t suddenly go from an 11-2 program last year to not being able to beat Marshall and Stanford this year. What we did was hire an inexperienced HC and leave in place an OC who seems to need a Brian Kelly to prop him up.
It is what it is. "
"Why is hiring a head coach at ND who is a project “not a bad thing”? I’m amazed at the bottomless pit of excuses many have for Coach Freeman. Davies, Willingham, and Weis all were way better prepared to take on this job and failed so badly that for awhile it seemed that ND would never be relevant again.
Then along came grumpy, stubborn, pudgy, anti-charismatic Brian Kelly, who took the dumpster fire that was ND football and had them in the national championship game in his third year, and ,while he had his setbacks, churned out double digit wins and two trips to the BCS in his last years. People here said that wasn’t good enough, that he’d hit his ceiling, that he was making excuses for himself with his “shopping down the right aisle” statements.
He then goes to LSU, a program that won the NC 3 years ago, where he has a great shot at capping his career with a championship, finally. I hope he does, because I’m grateful for what he did here at ND, where there will never be another NC unless ND gets serious about being able to beat the elite teams that have been winning championships.
That mean accessing the portal, not just for grads, but especially undergrads. Being more realistic about entry standards for players who are likeTony Rice and Chris Zorich, fine young men who to this day represent ND honorably, but would not be granted entry at today’s Notre Dame. Consider accepting JUCOs who look like they can fit the culture and keep up with the ND grind. Get real about todays world of CFB or stop expecting any ND coach to deliver miracles.
Marcus Freeman is a fine young man, high character, hugely charismatic, earnest, honest, great family man, the very opposite superficially at least from Brian Kelly. Freeman some day may have been a good HC for ND. But due to his own hubris, Jack’s laziness, the Administration’s glee at the “look” of this hire, it’s too soon for him and he’s in a job that he is not prepared to succeed in. Especially if success is defined as winning championships. You can’t talk to Tressel every week and learn how to be the HC at ND. The successful coaches like Ara, Lou, and yes, Kelly, all said they needed every bit of their head coaching experience in order to survive and win at ND. This isn’t Clemson before Dabo, where expectations were realistically low. And, frankly, Freeman is not as good as Dabo, who’s won two NCs at a school that was never to CFB what ND was. And he’s beaten Saban twice.
ND fans have wildly unrealistic expectations vs where the Administration stands on how it views what is acceptable to play football at ND. The ND fans can turn vicious. Dan Divine won a national championship and didn’t do it often enough, so he was run out of town. After his dog had been killed.
I don’t want Freeman or his family to suffer the ignominy that is likely coming. He’d better learn very fast and he better get the right, seasoned staff into the key roles under him quickly while he’s still in at least a semi-honeymoon period. Every day he loses to teams he shouldn’t, more of the luster wears off and if he does it often enough, the powers that be will bite the bullet and part ways, regardless of the blood-letting in the media that will inevitably come.
As for the players, how well will they be developed under this staff? Will Merriweather stay with no qb on the near horizon who can help him shine, or will he go into the portal to find the right situation to be groomed into a Sunday player?
We don’t get the elite skill players on offense that we need to be elite: Game-changer qb, corps of elite receivers, top notch running backs, elite DBs. Why would they come here? For them, the 40 year decision is “what has the best chance of getting me to a successful career in the NFL”. The smart ones (and yes, they are smart, many of them), know that the best fit is a school with a track record of developing talent to be drafted and then stick in the NFL. We send linemen and TEs to the NFL, but rarely the skill players, especially at QB, where we haven’t had a successful qb in the NFL since Rick Mirer in 1993, who lasted 12 years but threw more picks than tds everywhere he went. Frankly, the last star qb ND sent to the NFL was none other than Joe Montana, in 1979. We had others since then, but all of them failed at the NFL level.
Meanwhile Bama has three starting qbs in the NFL, another on his way after this season, and more first round receivers and running backs and dbs than I can count. Clemson has two starting qbs (including the suspended star Watson) and multiple others, as does OSU. That’s what Marcus Freeman has to compete against, with way more restrictions ( self imposed) than any of the true elites. Can’t do it.
That said, losing to Marshall and Stanford means he’s not in the same ballpark. We didn’t suddenly go from an 11-2 program last year to not being able to beat Marshall and Stanford this year. What we did was hire an inexperienced HC and leave in place an OC who seems to need a Brian Kelly to prop him up.
It is what it is. "
Is the defense really a problem?
21 pts vs OSU
19 pts vs Marshall
17 pts vs Cal
32 points vs UNC
20 points vs BYU
16 pts vs Stanford
The problem is at OC, and then QB and lack of WR threat. Buchner was never it, Pyne has shown flashes he can be good, but he is inconsistent.
21 pts vs OSU
19 pts vs Marshall
17 pts vs Cal
32 points vs UNC
20 points vs BYU
16 pts vs Stanford
The problem is at OC, and then QB and lack of WR threat. Buchner was never it, Pyne has shown flashes he can be good, but he is inconsistent.
"Sorry, but the sun belt conference and every other conference that`s not in the power five are considered division two."
The Sun Belt Conference is a NCAA Division 1 conference -- the Power 5, + ND, are also NCAA Division 1 conferences. NO ONE refers to the Sun Belt as a Division 2 Conference
3-4 yrs? Not in this era, Tenn./USC as examples of quick transition. Why should nd fans have to expect 3-4 yr holiday for a coach who inherited one of the top 5,6,7 programs in the country?
I hear you but those two inherited hot messes. Freeman inherited 4 preseason AA, a preseason #5 ranking and a boatload of 4th,5th and 6 yr guys and a 3 game schedule. You just don’t lose to Stanford , Marshall and arguably a gift win vs cal and not expect ALOT of heat
Notre Dame is not Tennessee or USC. Freeman will get at least 3 or 4 years. ND fans will have exactly zero say in the matter.
Pete Carroll (2001-2009)
Lane Kiffin (2010-13)
Clay Helton (2015-21)
Steve Sarkisian (2014-15)
Steve was let go because he relapsed into alcoholism.
Why did you settle on being a Michigan fan?
I decided to report this comment……… for being way too funny!
Oh look who it is? Dude... I will tell you this. SC will beat ND by 20. So go hang out at the Beach Ball or Blackie's and stop with the patronizing crap on here.
I think it will be close and Nd will win.
What about the question was patronizing? The poster said the new coach had to be given leeway because of the installation of new schemes. I asked how the schemes changed from last year.
What is wrong with asking that?
This is correct. SC is not yet "back" despite the hype, but I believe this process will speed up the recovery. Some existing players were told that their play was not up to standard, they could keep their scholarship and remain in school, but could not expect to play on the team.
Then the staff went to the portal to find and recruit the best players they could.
If a school thinks there is something wrong that, that everyone recruited needs to stay on the team whether they can contribute or not, that is fine. But the time to rebuild will be longer.
I do wonder if the people that feel that way use the same standard at their businesses. I have never had a problem with having to earn one's spot on a team.
Hmmmm. So Jaxson Dart is not up to standard?
Look dude. Your school is dirty. From Varsity Blues to Karen Bass to Stinkin Lincoln Riley. SC will always navigate in grey areas to get what they want. Coaches pushing a few guys in the portal is one thing. Wholesale roster ejects basically puts an asterisk on any accomplishments.
Jaxon Dart wasn't asked to leave or "cut" as your post mentioned. So, what has that do with this?
Let me make sure I understand you point. If "a few players" can't perform it is ok to remove them from the team, but if more than a few players it is wrong. It is interesting logic. What is the maximum number of players that make it OK? I sure teams would want to know to avoid an asterisk season.
Dart left, I believe, because he correctly thought Caleb was coming and did not think he could successfully compete against him. He was not asked to leave, and the coaches hoped he would stay. He, like everyone else on any sports team, faced the risk of being beaten out and he close to avoid the risk.Ha! yeah pretty sure Caleb Williams coming made that a moot point. You go on sand on with your word dance like people are dumb.
Let me finish your next response for you.
"But Dart left before Caleb actually committed to USC"
But away, under your standard, that would have been fine if Caleb was one of a "few" people coming in. As you stated it is the, "Wholesale roster ejects." aspect which is the problem. (which is weird, didn't rooster only eject with one other person?)
So, I will ask again: What is a highest number of players that SC could take from the portal that would make it ok for Dart to be afraid of being beaten out for the starting spot. I assume it is less than the number that SC took from the portal and more than the number that ND took from the portal. So please let us know.
Look, if your position is that recruited players are entitled to remain on the teams for four or five years whether they help the team and contribute or not, that is fine. If that is ND's position, that is fine as well. It just will take longer to rebuild.
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The only dumb one on this thread is youHa! yeah pretty sure Caleb Williams coming made that a moot point. You go on sand on with your word dance like people are dumb.
Let me finish your next response for you.
"But Dart left before Caleb actually committed to USC"
Kelly left us hanging. I think Swarbrick was caught flat-footed by that. So in our coaching search, he did a rush job because of the recruiting deadlines coming up. And he decided the easiest thing to do was promote Freeman, who was considered an ace recruiter.
But it was a roll of the dice by Swarbrick, to hire an unproven assistant instead of doing a full coaching search for a proven head coach.
That being said, I'm willing to give Freeman more time. Let's see how the team finishes the season.
But it was a roll of the dice by Swarbrick, to hire an unproven assistant instead of doing a full coaching search for a proven head coach.
That being said, I'm willing to give Freeman more time. Let's see how the team finishes the season.
Looked it up and we've held every team under their season average. OSU's averaging 49 ppg, UNC 42 ppg, BYU 32 ppg and Stanford 27 ppg. So I'd say the defense isn't the main problem.
