What a tool Franklin is! Marcus Freeman looked like he would have rather been anywhere else but up on the stage with that putz.
Another good reason to kick their ass tomorrow night!
Another good reason to kick their ass tomorrow night!
Today's Orange Bowl press conference
- Thread starter Pennick4
- Start date
He certainly said some things that didn’t help his team tomorrow, that’s for sure.
He continues to remind everyone why he's not very well liked. As condescending as they come.
Freeman looked pissed then you have the comment jab Franklin took at ND not being in a conference. I like it give Freeman motivation just like Cigs did for the Indiana game.
Penn State was independent for 100 years....until 1993. They haven't established themselves at the top of the conference in football and basketball. I think Franklin speaks more for the SEC than he does the B1G. He is a conference microcosm of Brian Kelly......losing the big games. Now....PSU is a very good team. But taking a dig at Notre Dame's independence in a press conference was ill-advised. It was disrespectful to Marcus Freeman and Notre Dame given the platform. That conversation was misplaced....didn't say it was wrong to have...just not in a playoff press conference. To bring up "injuries" was total amateur hour. There are players on ND's team who can't play in this game due to injuries. The PSU head coach should not address their injuries. Stupid. Franklin should have received some guidance before this press conference. Expound on non-field issues of your own team......not your opponent's.
“I know a lot of times when coaches talk like this, people roll their eyes. But I think when every decision that we make is based on finances, then we're not making great decisions that's in the student-athlete and the game of football's best interest. I think there's been conversations about — obviously, you talk about just the differences between our two programs and conferences. I think it should be consistent across college football.
“I think, again, this is no knock on coach [Freeman] or Notre Dame, but I think everybody should be in a conference. I think everybody should play a conference championship game or no one should play a conference championship game. I think everybody should play the same number of conference games.
Lol. No knock on Freeman when he's repping ND and sitting right next to him.
“I think, again, this is no knock on coach [Freeman] or Notre Dame, but I think everybody should be in a conference. I think everybody should play a conference championship game or no one should play a conference championship game. I think everybody should play the same number of conference games.
Lol. No knock on Freeman when he's repping ND and sitting right next to him.
Freeman represented ND will class and poise. Meanwhile Franklin, true to his nature got up their and whined like a little girl. Thanks for the extra motivation, I am sure Al Golden's stop troops are looking forward to seeing you and your boys from Happy Valley tomorrow night, Especially when they run a Lionel Train up your ass.
I think it’s ridiculous to mention that everyone should be in a conference. He said something about it being a challenge for the committee. No, it’s really not. ND is still playing 8-10 Power 4 opponents. What more do you want?
It’s not ND’s fault that these conferences all expanded to a ridiculous 16-18 teams out of greed and then kept the conference championships so they can make more money. My guess is that, if PSU were still independent, he would not be making that argument.
Conference championships will occasionally hurt a team. They will occasionally help a team. You take the good with the bad. This was your choice. Just cancel your conference championship and do split conference titles or some other way to award it. Don’t then cry because a team like Clemson jumped you though because Clemson won game 13.
It’s not ND’s fault that these conferences all expanded to a ridiculous 16-18 teams out of greed and then kept the conference championships so they can make more money. My guess is that, if PSU were still independent, he would not be making that argument.
Conference championships will occasionally hurt a team. They will occasionally help a team. You take the good with the bad. This was your choice. Just cancel your conference championship and do split conference titles or some other way to award it. Don’t then cry because a team like Clemson jumped you though because Clemson won game 13.
Clearly his comments were directed at Uconn.
Franklin is a dbag for sure but the question posed, I don't really blame him for saying what he said. I think most conference coaches echo something similar to this. Its what he has to say when it pertains to ND and not being in a conference. No big deal, not reading anything into it.
Bottom line... ND needs to play well and win the game. If they lose tomorrow night, the talking heads and conferences will once again be loud mouthing that ND should be in a conference because someone else got left out, etc.
Bottom line... ND needs to play well and win the game. If they lose tomorrow night, the talking heads and conferences will once again be loud mouthing that ND should be in a conference because someone else got left out, etc.
He is kind of a putz. He's definitely lacking in the charisma MF possesses in abundance. But his teams play hard for him. Just like us, he's right on the doorstep.
Eh it shouldn't matter. If we beat PSU it will be because we are better and more prepared, not because Franklin said everyone should be in a conference.
I have nothing against his opinion. He may even be right for all i know. It's just such a d-bag move to do it at an orange Bowl press conference sitting right next to the HFC of an independent.
Coaches dont want ND's schedule. The B1G coaches found out this year that cross country trips dont end up well. I know at 1 point B1G teams were 3-11 out west. Im not sure what their records the next week but I know NFL teams struggle the next week if they travel to opposite coast. Plus having to play option team every year regardless of record is a chore.
ND traveled to California, Texas, Georgia, NY twice. Conference coaches would hate that type of schedule.
It's funny you should mention UConn, because I think they would end up in Penn State's conference if Franklin got what he's asking for. I mean, if teams are forced to join conferences then some governing body would need choose who goes where. And that governing body would base it on geography, right? So Mr. Franklin, here's your new 16-team conference based on your wishes:
BC
UMass
UConn
Syracuse
Buffalo
Army
Rutgers
Temple
Maryland
Navy
James Madison
West Virginia
Penn State
Pitt
Kent St.
Akron
Being in a conference is so entirely an institutional and organizational norm, that regardless of what a putz JF is, the notion that all teams should be in a conference, so as to facilitate a better playoff for instance, or for purposes of more uniform scheduling or whatever it is, is definitely not outrageous. Having one program hold out as a so-called 'independent' to the possible detriment of the sport, or at least the playoff, is a nuisance, it just is. As long as we're going to have at large bids then ND can hang on as an independent, but the greater good of CFB counts for something. ND doesn't have to do anything it doesn't want to, but the rest of CFB is certainly entitled to be annoyed, if ND is screwing everything up. Which I don't think they are, but it might not last that way forever, ie a super league, or something akin to that.
I would have loved to hear Marcus Freeman respond to the question about being in a conference as follows:
"At one time Notre Dame wanted badly to join a conference. For those that know college football history, many years ago Knute Rockne attempted on multiple occasions to have Notre Dame join the Big 10. But Fielding Yost, the athletic director of one of the conference's blue blood programs, the University of Michigan, blocked Notre Dame's admission into the conference and then conspired with other ADs to blackball Notre Dame from playing other teams in the conference. And why did Yost do that? Because he was was motivated by anti-Catholic and anti-immigrant bigotry and was jealous of Rockne's success with Notre Dame's fledging football program. Having been denied entry into the Big 10, Notre Dame was forced to travel nationally, scheduling games with Army and USC, among others. And so Yost's conniving bigotry ended up badly for the Big 10, because Notre Dame's independence allowed it to become a national brand. There we sit today. And now Coach Franklin wants us to just toss that all that history aside and join a conference? Well, no thank you, we like where we are at."
But of course, Marcus has too much class to do that.
I suppose most ND fans here are aware of this history, but if you want to do a deeper dive, read Murray Sperber's Shake Down the Thunder or John Kyrk's Natural Enemies.
All that said, I suspect the day will come, probably soon, when Notre Dame is going to have to join a conference.
"At one time Notre Dame wanted badly to join a conference. For those that know college football history, many years ago Knute Rockne attempted on multiple occasions to have Notre Dame join the Big 10. But Fielding Yost, the athletic director of one of the conference's blue blood programs, the University of Michigan, blocked Notre Dame's admission into the conference and then conspired with other ADs to blackball Notre Dame from playing other teams in the conference. And why did Yost do that? Because he was was motivated by anti-Catholic and anti-immigrant bigotry and was jealous of Rockne's success with Notre Dame's fledging football program. Having been denied entry into the Big 10, Notre Dame was forced to travel nationally, scheduling games with Army and USC, among others. And so Yost's conniving bigotry ended up badly for the Big 10, because Notre Dame's independence allowed it to become a national brand. There we sit today. And now Coach Franklin wants us to just toss that all that history aside and join a conference? Well, no thank you, we like where we are at."
But of course, Marcus has too much class to do that.
I suppose most ND fans here are aware of this history, but if you want to do a deeper dive, read Murray Sperber's Shake Down the Thunder or John Kyrk's Natural Enemies.
All that said, I suspect the day will come, probably soon, when Notre Dame is going to have to join a conference.
Last edited:
No one would ever say anything like that. They'd have way, way, way too much discretion and good sense. Not because the rest of the outside world is all arrayed against ND, and their forces have SB completely surrounded. But rather because, are you serious that you would ever make a self-pitying speech like that? That would be shocking if anyone ever did. Ned Yost. I know that's not his name but that's what I call him now. Ned. If it weren't for old Neddy, ND would be in the Big Ten right now! But the man was a bigot, and he had it in for the papists. Again, it would be shocking if an official representative of ND ever said such a thing. And so revealing.
Actually that would be effin' awesome if MF gave a thoughtful, measured reply carefully explaining to a stunned media ND's well-worn tale of woe, and why they will never join a conference, and certainly not the Big Ten. On account of this institutional grudge. The Catholic Church, if there's any institution in this crazy world that is just so weak and vulnerable and harried. The Catholic Church, home of the very moral concept of forgiveness. Their entire spiritual raison d'être, the sine qua non, and it will be a cold day in hell before America's most famous catholic institution ever forgives anyone. Indeed they pride themselves and define themselves on this eternal defiance of their very essence. I guess he who is without sin can cast the first stone?
Of course Marcus would never say that. And neither would Bevacqua or any other official representative of ND, no matter that it is true. I was just channeling my inner Savvy and going off on a riff.
Notre Dame buried the hatchet with UM many years ago, and that is a good thing for college football. I hope we continue to play Michigan for many years. And yes, as Catholics, we should be forgiving of others, no matter how terrible their transgressions.
I only posted what I did because when I listened to Franklin there was this subtle subtext from Franklin that Notre Dame isn't in a conference because it thinks it is too good to belong to one, when in fact there are historical reasons for that independence. I suspect Franklin knows nothing of that history, just as many other critics of ND's independence are ignorant of history.
Last edited:
This is the seminal book on the history of Notre Dame football. For those of you who wish to know more about the beginnings of Notre Dame football, this is a must read.
Well I"m glad you were just screwing around. Because it's one thing to have become accustomed to being 'independent', and to have a sentimental weakness for it and not want to give it up. At any cost. But the whole Fielding Yost thing, it truly is ancient history. And I was only half kidding myself about the forgiveness part. Speaking of ancient history, remember Fr. Coughlin? I don't think he was associated with ND, but he was catholic, and from the midwest, and apparently pretty bigoted or become that way. I don't really know much about his story. I'm just saying it goes both ways.
Using his logic about everyone should be in a conference. I guess he means it’s unfair to make the playoff if you’re independent or something. Well does he think everyone should have access to equal amounts of NIL money ? Does he think no one should schedule FCS teams ? Does he believe a 12 game schedule should be the same for everyone, 6 home and 6 away ? Some have 7 home and 5 away. Is that fair ? What about academics ? Do all players require going to class and having basic core subjects to pass ? You get the point. Cherry picking what he thinks is unfair is actually unfair for him to say. If you want a level playing field and conformity then all teams in the FBS have to play by the same rules. Heck Penn state and players have their own dorms. ND players room with everyday students. I love ND being independent. They truly play a national schedule. That is awesome
I will say, it is one thing to be resentful, and let it bother you about ND's independence, heck it bothers me sometimes. That's probably all it is. People take it as being stuck up, otherwise they don't really care. But of all the blue blood programs that don't have advantages, that are somehow inherent to their own existence or whatnot, ND would be one of them, just because of their strict academic requirements. That's a disadvantage to trying to win a championship. ND could renounce those standards any time they want, but they clearly are committed to it. As well as the fact that ND cannot qualify for an automatic bid. Another disadvantage.
But, having said all that, why should any of these other schools whatever their gripe is, care about the continuance of ND's independence? That's ND's cross to bear. I just think being in a conference is great, and there's a community to it, and it's fun, and you develop rivalries, and take a greater interest in those various rivals and you play for a conf championship and all that. Conferences are awesome!
But, having said all that, why should any of these other schools whatever their gripe is, care about the continuance of ND's independence? That's ND's cross to bear. I just think being in a conference is great, and there's a community to it, and it's fun, and you develop rivalries, and take a greater interest in those various rivals and you play for a conf championship and all that. Conferences are awesome!
Tremendous post. Cry some more Franklin.
Conference affiliations are quickly becoming all about television money and less about historical or geographic rivalries. Why are USC and UCLA in a conference that has historically been a collection of Midwest/rust belt schools? Crazier still, why is Stanford in the ATLANTIC Coast Conference when you can literally see the Pacific Ocean from parts of its campus? All this coast to coast travel cannot be good for the athletes when they are expected to juggle school along with the sport they are playing, especially for sports like basketball and baseball where teams are playing many more games over the course of a season. It is insane.
piss on you
ND does not owe anyone a DAMN THING
take your attitude and shove it up your ass.
It has nothing to do with reality but your stupidity
ALL this crap about ND owing anyone is GARBAGE
All this crap about it inconveniencing the CFP is GARBAGE
The only idiots talking about this are our board morons
All this crap about it inconveniencing the CFP is GARBAGE
The only idiots talking about this are our board morons
Hes BK par deux. Can't win big games and is an arrogant D-Bag.
He wants it consistent but doesn’t have a problem w/ Ohio state playing the same amount of games as us? Piss on Franklin. The ‘ND needs to join a conference’ talk is such a loser position. Bitching and moaning about absolutely nothing. CCGs can help or hurt teams so the fact that we don’t play one is a wash. Stfu already about ND joining a conference, jackass.
Actually the CCG's didn't hurt the losing teams. PSU lost theirs, didn't drop in the CFP and honestly received the easiest path to the semi-finals.
This. What about OSU this year? They didn’t play in a conf game! He is an asshat
He tried to make it seem like his insult was an oops moment. But you could see that it was so orchestrated, because he did not even pause when he looked over to freeman. Interesting how he is talking so big in a year that they did not even have to play Michigan. But I can't wait to see how they move forward with his plan to have every team play in a conference championship. Just so many contradictions in what that jackass said
you can see that he is clearly on an anti Notre Dame - they must join a conference - crusade. Solution is to just beat his ass so we don't have to listen to his asinine comments for the rest of the year. Let's get that chant going.. we hate - Penn State!
Franklin is the most insufferable coach in the country right next to Ryan Day. I hope ND pounds them into the turf tonight. Will never forget a guy I went to high school with who went to Penn State try to tell me that if Joe Pa knew what Jerry Sandusky was doing he never would have kept him there.....for 30 years. Yeah, right. LET'S GO IRISH. I have my pint glass I got at a restaurant in Belfast five years ago waiting in the freezer for tonight.
Agree!
He crossed the lines at that presser. He is a joke of a coach that cannot win the big game. What is he something like 1-14 vs to 5 teams???
He doesn't need to say anything about conference/playoff alignment. He needs to be more worried about the ND football team that is about to drag his team up and down the field for 4 quarters.
“Actually the CCG's didn't hurt the losing teams. PSU lost theirs, didn't drop in the CFP and honestly received the easiest path to the semi-finals.”
You’re absolutely right, NJ. My point was that in the past, CCGs could either help or hurt. Now they declared that losses in CCGs shouldn’t hurt teams. So their bitching and moaning to begin w/ was BS & now that it can’t hurt (only help) conference teams, they should just stfu and realize that we’re getting screwed & they’re not, and they certainly shouldn’t be crying about it like baldy did.
You’re absolutely right, NJ. My point was that in the past, CCGs could either help or hurt. Now they declared that losses in CCGs shouldn’t hurt teams. So their bitching and moaning to begin w/ was BS & now that it can’t hurt (only help) conference teams, they should just stfu and realize that we’re getting screwed & they’re not, and they certainly shouldn’t be crying about it like baldy did.
Not only is Franklin ignorant of the historic reasons for ND's independence, he is apparently ignorant of why and how PSU joined the Big 10 in the first place. Recall that PSU was itself an independent up until 1993. Its move into the Big 10 was done not out of any high-minded principles, or because PSU desired to set up rivalries with the existing members of the Big 10, but because PSU found itself in desperate financial straits and needed the promise of conference revenue sharing to keep its athletic department afloat. This article (which I found posted on the NDN site) details that history pretty well:
www.blackshoediaries.com
Interesting that the vote to take PSU into the Big 10 was 7-3, so even after months of negotiations there were some schools strongly opposed to it. And the article goes into detail on some of the resentment from other schools of bringing PSU in, which apparently smoldered for a number of years.
I guess Franklin forgot about all that stuff. Makes his complaints about ND not being in a conference look pretty shallow.
Penn State History: Joining The Big Ten
A detailed history of how Penn State joined the Big Ten and the animosity they experienced.
www.blackshoediaries.com
Interesting that the vote to take PSU into the Big 10 was 7-3, so even after months of negotiations there were some schools strongly opposed to it. And the article goes into detail on some of the resentment from other schools of bringing PSU in, which apparently smoldered for a number of years.
I guess Franklin forgot about all that stuff. Makes his complaints about ND not being in a conference look pretty shallow.
The Big East was courting them first, but I believe Pitt was fiercely against them joining the Conference. Wonder if the Big East would still be intact if PSU had been in that conference.Not only is Franklin ignorant of the historic reasons for ND's independence, he is apparently ignorant of why and how PSU joined the Big 10 in the first place. Recall that PSU was itself an independent up until 1993. Its move into the Big 10 was done not out of any high-minded principles, or because PSU desired to set up rivalries with the existing members of the Big 10, but because PSU found itself in desperate financial straits and needed the promise of conference revenue sharing to keep its athletic department afloat. This article (which I found posted on the NDN site) details that history pretty well:
Penn State History: Joining The Big Ten
A detailed history of how Penn State joined the Big Ten and the animosity they experienced.
Interesting that the vote to take PSU into the Big 10 was 7-3, so even after months of negotiations there were some schools strongly opposed to it. And the article goes into detail on some of the resentment from other schools of bringing PSU in, which apparently smoldered for a number of years.
I guess Franklin forgot about all that stuff. Makes his complaints about ND not being in a conference look pretty shallow.
You are wrong, sir. PSU did not give up their cherished, treasured, sublime independence, which no one gives a F about anywhere other than ND fans, for whom it has become a fetish typically deified for its own sake, but occasionally defended when under attack as being a totally superior status to enjoy purely on strategic and economic grounds.... they did not do so only because their backs were against the proverbial wall and they were almost insolvent, otherwise they would be happily and preferably 'independent' to this day.Not only is Franklin ignorant of the historic reasons for ND's independence, he is apparently ignorant of why and how PSU joined the Big 10 in the first place. Recall that PSU was itself an independent up until 1993. Its move into the Big 10 was done not out of any high-minded principles, or because PSU desired to set up rivalries with the existing members of the Big 10, but because PSU found itself in desperate financial straits and needed the promise of conference revenue sharing to keep its athletic department afloat. This article (which I found posted on the NDN site) details that history pretty well:
Penn State History: Joining The Big Ten
A detailed history of how Penn State joined the Big Ten and the animosity they experienced.
Interesting that the vote to take PSU into the Big 10 was 7-3, so even after months of negotiations there were some schools strongly opposed to it. And the article goes into detail on some of the resentment from other schools of bringing PSU in, which apparently smoldered for a number of years.
I guess Franklin forgot about all that stuff. Makes his complaints about ND not being in a conference look pretty shallow.
I feel like I can say with absolute certainty, without knowing any insider details, that it was done simply as a reasonable, prudent decision to make, as there is no reason to be averse to conference membership, certainly not a conference like the Big Ten, and that the time had come and they were going to go ahead and make this move, whatever changes it might have on the status quo for PSU that up to that point that they had through sheer time and inertia gotten used to, and was comfortable as an old shoe. And so they joined the Big Ten. And it was a great move for them. Natural move, no downsides really. Win win win all around.
But you insist on portraying it differently, which I think hurts your cause. Don't defend 'independence' on the merits. It makes you look weak, as if you need reassurance, and justification as a particularly sound and superior arrangement for a CFB program to want to have and jealously maintain. Just say that's how we roll at ND, that's how we like to do it, which is true. And never mind what our reasons are, which frankly it'd be better not to get into. And F y'all if you don't like it. You're being honest that way. And it's way more of an alpha move.
You made my point for me. PSU joined the Big 10 due largely, if not solely, to financial considerations. PSU was looking out after its own self interests, as it should. But the reverse is also true. If financial (or any other) considerations dictate that independence is a better thing for ND, why is that any of Franklin's concern? His argument is a bad one. If there comes a time when it will be in ND's best interests to join a conference, I expect it will. But that time isn't here now. And it isn't Franklin's business to preach to us about it.
Last edited:
Latest posts
-
Basketball MBB: Game Thread | No. 4 Duke 86, Notre Dame 78 FINAL- Latest: Eric Hansen
-
-
Breaking Notre Dame adds Louisville grad transfer DT Jared Dawson
- Latest: Eric Hansen
-
