Thoughts On The Navy Game

[Harpo Marxist]

1. Deshone Kizer may have been the worst player on the field today. His accuracy is absolutely deplorable, a trend that has continued. I'm ready for him to move on because he's not improving. The NFL will draft him high based on potential, but that accuracy is going to keep him on the bench unless he commits to fixing it.

2. The fact that Scott Booker has not been fired shows continude incompetence on Kelly's behalf to manage his staff. Loyalty is huge aspect of football, but loyalty to a fault is insanity and will and should cost a head coach his job.

3. You have to go for it on that 4th down because Navy is never kicking a field goal. You have to score when you have the opportunity, but then again, when your QB is playing is poorly as Kizer I don't know if you trust him to pick up 4 yards. He missed reads all over the field.

4. I feel for the defense. They played hard again today and were well prepared. In particular, I thought Onwualu, Martini and Love battled like crazy. Love passion and effort from a young group on that side of the ball. They were screwed by another special mistake, or they hold Navy to 21 points, a very good defensive effort against a tough offense to handle.

5. Kevin Stepherson is going to be a poor man's Will Fuller. Really good player in the making. Better hands than Fuller, not quite the speed. He and St. Brown give you some nice weapons on the perimeter for the future.

6. Congrats to Navy, those kids play damn hard and are well coached... With that said and mean no disrespect to the US Naval Academy, but those kids get soooo much pitty from the refs for being undersized. I'm not going to go on the cut block vs chop block soap box, but they get with the most blatant holds on the perimeter and the refs don't even think of flagging them. At one point the announcers said they have only 17 total penalties this year, which infuriates me. Yes there are missed or uncalled penalties on each play in college football, but point of attack penalties are almost never ignored. What thr kids get away with (just because of who they are) along the sidelines, right in front of the refs, is abysmal and embarrassing for the sport. It' been going on for years.

I have great respect for everything those kids stand and play for, but it's year, after year, of the same nonsense. I don't care how small they are, the rules ought to be the same for everyone.

7. Brian Kelly is on his way out, and it will be interesting to see if Swarbrick and University swallow the millions they'll pay out, or if they give Kelly another year in which this team will undoubtedly be better. I've gone on record saying that they'll win at least 8 games, but they're not going to the playoffs under this staff. Kelly has done a lot to prepare this program for success and has the next staff set up fairly well for success, but it's obviously approaching the time (some would argue the time has passed) for fresh ideas and new energy in South Bend. Kelly's teams haven't quit on him and they are competitive every week, but competitive is for up-and-coming programs, Notre Dame is an established program. There is no reason a coach at ND can't win 9+ games each year.

JMO.

the problem is....the rules aren't brought up when Notre Dame wins....this was yet another loss against an underdog. To continue losing against teams that Notre Dame should beat is toxic. For Notre Dame to be in this position against the backdrop of a hybrid "Independent/ACC" status.....compounds the setbacks to the program.

 

[Java65]

You are doing more than being hard on Kizer. You are overemphasizing his mistakes by ignoring the good things he did. Yes, his mistakes should be noted and the criticism should be sharp but beyond the really bad throws he made he also made some really good throws and he made some great decisions on the read option. He picked up key first downs on his own.

Your point about our offense also limiting the number of possessions we had, that's true, but it doesn't negate the fact that our defense could not stop Navy's offense except on 2 occasions, one of which was nullified. If our offense had been more efficient and had scored quicker it just means our defense would have had to go out on the field sooner which means they likely would have gotten tired sooner. Also, quicker scores for our offense also means more possessions for Navy's offense. Maybe both teams could have scored more points if our offense had been more efficient but there was nothing I saw in this game that led me to believe our D would have stopped Navy more often if our offense had simply scored more quickly.

Rep 1000 times. Kizer is the offense, the rest of the offense ranges from good to terrible. The OL and TE are not good. The running game, minus Kizer, is nonexistent. ESB is good but not consistent, ditto for Hunter. The problem is the same as it's always been under Kelly, he puts the weight of the world on his QB's shoulders because the rest of the offense is not good.

 

[IrishInOntario]

What a way to spin it! "Hold a good Navy offense to 28 points?" But let's look at it a little closer. Not counting the end of the half, Navy had 6 possessions all game. We only stopped them once. They had 4 touchdowns (long, time-consuming drives) and one drive to run out the clock at the end, that went over 7 minutes. They had 320 yards rushing on 56 carries (5.7 ypc). They went 8-13 on 3rd downs and 4-5 on 4th downs. Bottom line: our defense couldn't stop them!!

Kizer wasn't great, but normally when you score on 5/6 possessions (3 TDs/2 FGs), you should be in pretty good shape to win a game.

Equally good spin on your end...

In the previous 5 games against (all ND wins) here were the scores.

41-24 (ND win)
49-39 (ND win)
38-34 (ND win)
50-10 (ND win)
56-14 (ND win)

ND averaged 46.6 PPG over its past 5 games vs Navy (all wins...) Today they scored 27, 19.6 points below their average.

ND averaged 22.2 PPG surrenders over its past 5 games vs Navy (all wins...) Today they surrendered 28, 5.5 points above their average.

So whose fault was it?... A defense that gave up less than an non converted TD more than their average, or an offense scored almost 3 TD's less than their average?

Navy plays horrible defense against any quality opponent. You have to score points and score quickly, giving yourself more opportunities for possessions by not limiting the clock on yourself. The defense was pretty well in line with the way they played in previous wins, the offense was far from it.

And before you point to number of possessions being a factor, I say again... Notre Dame lost a possession because of special teams (not the defense) and had greater time of possession than Navy in the first half, which means they milked their own clock and cost themselves an extra position, or 2, in the first half.

Could the defense gotten off the field quicker and more often? Of course. Should the 28 points they surrendered have been enough the hehe you lose this game. Absolutely not. A history of wins, combined with what we saw in terms of missed opportunities from the offense today says so.

 

[Java65]

I have never seen a coach that gets nearly every major decision in a game wrong. It's unreal that for 7 years he is wrong nearly every time when it comes to big decisions

 

[theskibro]

1. Deshone Kizer may have been the worst player on the field today. His accuracy is absolutely deplorable, a trend that has continued. I'm ready for him to move on because he's not improving. The NFL will draft him high based on potential, but that accuracy is going to keep him on the bench unless he commits to fixing it.

2. The fact that Scott Booker has not been fired shows continude incompetence on Kelly's behalf to manage his staff. Loyalty is huge aspect of football, but loyalty to a fault is insanity and will and should cost a head coach his job.

3. You have to go for it on that 4th down because Navy is never kicking a field goal. You have to score when you have the opportunity, but then again, when your QB is playing is poorly as Kizer I don't know if you trust him to pick up 4 yards. He missed reads all over the field.

4. I feel for the defense. They played hard again today and were well prepared. In particular, I thought Onwualu, Martini and Love battled like crazy. Love passion and effort from a young group on that side of the ball. They were screwed by another special mistake, or they hold Navy to 21 points, a very good defensive effort against a tough offense to handle.

5. Kevin Stepherson is going to be a poor man's Will Fuller. Really good player in the making. Better hands than Fuller, not quite the speed. He and St. Brown give you some nice weapons on the perimeter for the future.

6. Congrats to Navy, those kids play damn hard and are well coached... With that said and mean no disrespect to the US Naval Academy, but those kids get soooo much pitty from the refs for being undersized. I'm not going to go on the cut block vs chop block soap box, but they get with the most blatant holds on the perimeter and the refs don't even think of flagging them. At one point the announcers said they have only 17 total penalties this year, which infuriates me. Yes there are missed or uncalled penalties on each play in college football, but point of attack penalties are almost never ignored. What thr kids get away with (just because of who they are) along the sidelines, right in front of the refs, is abysmal and embarrassing for the sport. It' been going on for years.

I have great respect for everything those kids stand and play for, but it's year, after year, of the same nonsense. I don't care how small they are, the rules ought to be the same for everyone.

7. Brian Kelly is on his way out, and it will be interesting to see if Swarbrick and University swallow the millions they'll pay out, or if they give Kelly another year in which this team will undoubtedly be better. I've gone on record saying that they'll win at least 8 games, but they're not going to the playoffs under this staff. Kelly has done a lot to prepare this program for success and has the next staff set up fairly well for success, but it's obviously approaching the time (some would argue the time has passed) for fresh ideas and new energy in South Bend. Kelly's teams haven't quit on him and they are competitive every week, but competitive is for up-and-coming programs, Notre Dame is an established program. There is no reason a coach at ND can't win 9+ games each year.

JMO.

excellent points the one thing you did not say that the masses want to hear and hear again is Kelly flat out sucks and Kelly is good for giving the other team at least 7 points a game
Jack sucks too This program has never had balls to do the right thing they give extensions and reward mediocrity As Ara said, not counting this season Kelly has averaged 9 wins a year that is not good enough now factor in this year and it is pitiful

The only thin I hate more than losing is a mentality that tolerates losing. Jack sucks

 

[DieHard_Irish]

excellent points the one thing you did not say that the masses want to hear and hear again is Kelly flat out sucks and Kelly is good for giving the other team at least 7 points a game
Jack sucks too This program has never had balls to do the right thing they give extensions and reward mediocrity As Ara said, not counting this season Kelly has averaged 9 wins a year that is not good enough now factor in this year and it is pitiful

The only thin I hate more than losing is a mentality that tolerates losing. Jack sucks

This!!!!!

 

[Harpo Marxist]

the "players are playing their hearts out" mantra will be ever present. Yes...they do...and the sun will rise in the morning. But that isn't nearly enough. This coaching staff is dysfunctional at worst.....inept at best. Next season is the "hot seat" season with Kelly "No. 1 hotseat coach".....and that is how the season will start. Not good after a year like this one.

 

[IrishBlessings]

I barely watched the Miami game and I didn't watch the Navy game. So whoever posted that the fans are disinterested is spot on. Only good thing about this is cheap ticket prices and ND gear.

Not sure what the attendence was today - but there seemed to be a lot of empty seats. I watched off and on and as long as BK is coach I wont spend another dime on a ticket to a ND game. Wont buy another dam thing from ND.

ND football is a thing of the past. BK and JS have no clue - absolutely no clue on what a good coach does and looks like.

 

[HillRock86]

1. Deshone Kizer may have been the worst player on the field today. His accuracy is absolutely deplorable, a trend that has continued. I'm ready for him to move on because he's not improving. The NFL will draft him high based on potential, but that accuracy is going to keep him on the bench unless he commits to fixing it.

2. The fact that Scott Booker has not been fired shows continude incompetence on Kelly's behalf to manage his staff. Loyalty is huge aspect of football, but loyalty to a fault is insanity and will and should cost a head coach his job.

3. You have to go for it on that 4th down because Navy is never kicking a field goal. You have to score when you have the opportunity, but then again, when your QB is playing is poorly as Kizer I don't know if you trust him to pick up 4 yards. He missed reads all over the field.

4. I feel for the defense. They played hard again today and were well prepared. In particular, I thought Onwualu, Martini and Love battled like crazy. Love passion and effort from a young group on that side of the ball. They were screwed by another special mistake, or they hold Navy to 21 points, a very good defensive effort against a tough offense to handle.

5. Kevin Stepherson is going to be a poor man's Will Fuller. Really good player in the making. Better hands than Fuller, not quite the speed. He and St. Brown give you some nice weapons on the perimeter for the future.

6. Congrats to Navy, those kids play damn hard and are well coached... With that said and mean no disrespect to the US Naval Academy, but those kids get soooo much pitty from the refs for being undersized. I'm not going to go on the cut block vs chop block soap box, but they get with the most blatant holds on the perimeter and the refs don't even think of flagging them. At one point the announcers said they have only 17 total penalties this year, which infuriates me. Yes there are missed or uncalled penalties on each play in college football, but point of attack penalties are almost never ignored. What thr kids get away with (just because of who they are) along the sidelines, right in front of the refs, is abysmal and embarrassing for the sport. It' been going on for years.

I have great respect for everything those kids stand and play for, but it's year, after year, of the same nonsense. I don't care how small they are, the rules ought to be the same for everyone.

7. Brian Kelly is on his way out, and it will be interesting to see if Swarbrick and University swallow the millions they'll pay out, or if they give Kelly another year in which this team will undoubtedly be better. I've gone on record saying that they'll win at least 8 games, but they're not going to the playoffs under this staff. Kelly has done a lot to prepare this program for success and has the next staff set up fairly well for success, but it's obviously approaching the time (some would argue the time has passed) for fresh ideas and new energy in South Bend. Kelly's teams haven't quit on him and they are competitive every week, but competitive is for up-and-coming programs, Notre Dame is an established program. There is no reason a coach at ND can't win 9+ games each year.

JMO.

I agree with every point but 7. Why do you think Kelly has set this program up for success? He's staring at at least two more losses this year. Recruiting is likely to take a hit as some of the higher rated players decide to take a look at other schools. I guarantee you rival coaches are in their ears telling them either that Kelly is a poor coach and you don't want to go to a program that won't sniff the playoffs OR they are telling recruits Kelly is on his way out the door. He won't be there when you graduate. ND should be 9-0 at this point and in contention for a playoff berth. Kelly isn't getting the job done. Time to stop blaming his staff and put the blame squarely on Kelly's shoulders. The buck stops with him.

 

[shooter1977]

What did Urban Meyers Dad say in 2004?

Urban's dad advised him to coach at Florida over ND. Told him it's too hard to win at ND.

 

[mbd11]

Equally good spin on your end...

In the previous 5 games against (all ND wins) here were the scores.

41-24 (ND win)
49-39 (ND win)
38-34 (ND win)
50-10 (ND win)
56-14 (ND win)

ND averaged 46.6 PPG over its past 5 games vs Navy (all wins...) Today they scored 27, 19.6 points below their average.

ND averaged 22.2 PPG surrenders over its past 5 games vs Navy (all wins...) Today they surrendered 28, 5.5 points above their average.

So whose fault was it?... A defense that gave up less than an non converted TD more than their average, or an offense scored almost 3 TD's less than their average?

Navy plays horrible defense against any quality opponent. You have to score points and score quickly, giving yourself more opportunities for possessions by not limiting the clock on yourself. The defense was pretty well in line with the way they played in previous wins, the offense was far from it.

And before you point to number of possessions being a factor, I say again... Notre Dame lost a possession because of special teams (not the defense) and had greater time of possession than Navy in the first half, which means they milked their own clock and cost themselves an extra position, or 2, in the first half.

Could the defense gotten off the field quicker and more often? Of course. Should the 28 points they surrendered have been enough the hehe you lose this game. Absolutely not. A history of wins, combined with what we saw in terms of missed opportunities from the offense today says so.

Your logic doesn't make a whole lot of sense here, IIO, because if we'd had more possessions, so would've Navy. Last year, Navy had 9 possessions and scored 24 points. This year, they had 6 possessions and scored 28 points (and would've probably scored 35 if the clock hadn't run out at the end). So per possession, our defense did a better job on them last year. Because 24 points in 9 possessions is less than 3 pts per possession.

But last year we forced 3 turnovers. This year, we didn't force any turnovers and also couldn't get off the field on 3rd and 4th downs.

 

[IrishInOntario]

I agree with every point but 7. Why do you think Kelly has set this program up for success? He's staring at at least two more losses this year. Recruiting is likely to take a hit as some of the higher rated players decide to take a look at other schools. I guarantee you rival coaches are in their ears telling them either that Kelly is a poor coach and you don't want to go to a program that won't sniff the playoffs OR they are telling recruits Kelly is on his way out the door. He won't be there when you graduate. ND should be 9-0 at this point and in contention for a playoff berth. Kelly isn't getting the job done. Time to stop blaming his staff and put the blame squarely on Kelly's shoulders. The buck stops with him.

What I mean by that is that Brian Kelly has made huge strides regarding the infrastructure of ND's program. He has pushed for and hired a ton of staff in the recruiting department, the media and social media department, he has done a ton to help modernize ND's brand. He pushed for the scoreboard and the turf field. He was also responsible for the modern training table and huge advancement in strength and conditioning over his predeccessors. The next coach will have significantly more resources to work with than Kelly had when he arrived.

His on field coaching has been extremely disappointing at times, but what he did (with Jack's help) to ramp up the infrastructure of the program and to modernize it and make it "cool" in a generation where that's vitally important to recruiting, cannot be overstated.

The next guy has what he needs to win at a high level. The team just needs some scheme and attitude adjustments and better in game decision making.

Kelly is a politician. He successfully politicked for the things necessary to the success of the very top programs, under the agreement that he would deliver wins because of it.. Like many politicians, he didn't live up to his end of the deal, but that doesn't change the importance of the things that have been put into place for the he next guy.

 

[HillRock86]

What I mean by that is that Brian Kelly has made huge strides regarding the infrastructure of ND's program. He has pushed for and hired a ton of staff in the recruiting department, the media and social media department, he has done a ton to help modernize ND's brand. He pushed for the scoreboard and the turf field. He was also responsible for the modern training table and huge advancement in strength and conditioning over his predeccessors. The next coach will have significantly more resources to work with than Kelly had when he arrived.

His on field coaching has been extremely disappointing at times, but what he did (with Jack's help) to ramp up the infrastructure of the program and to modernize it and make it "cool" in a generation where that's vitally important to recruiting, cannot be overstated.

The next guy has what he needs to win at a high level. The team just needs some scheme and attitude adjustments and better in game decision making.

Kelly is a politician. He successfully politicked for the things necessary to the success of the very top programs, under the agreement that he would deliver wins because of it.. Like many politicians, he didn't live up to his end of the deal, but that doesn't change the importance of the things that have been put into place for the he next guy.

All solid points, however, I'm sure a new coach is going to want to put his own imprint on the program and will change personnel to fit his style of coaching. I still worry about the impact this disaster will have on recruiting. I did not think ND would make it into the Top 10 this year, and I now worry that ND may slip out of the Top 20. Do you share those concerns?

 

[stu4don]

Agreed IIO. Just hard to watch. Do like some of our young talent but wonder what's happened to Kizer and the guy everyone is talking about as Kelly's heir apparent, Sanford. Kizer made three bad throws on that last drive that would have put us up two scores. Don't get me started about special teams. They've lost us three gams this season... We haven't had a team with real fire, real toughness since the Holtz era....

If it is time for a new coach, who do/can we get? Is P. J. Fleck worth taking a chance on at this time? Harbaugh was in his 40s when he took over at Stanford. Meyer was 39 when he took over Utah's program. Saban was in his mid 40s when he took over MSU...

I know you like Schiano (50) but he seems to come with a lot of baggage.

Fleck turns 36 in November. Too young? Thoughts?

 

[deadirishpoet]

1. Deshone Kizer may have been the worst player on the field today. His accuracy is absolutely deplorable, a trend that has continued. I'm ready for him to move on because he's not improving. The NFL will draft him high based on potential, but that accuracy is going to keep him on the bench unless he commits to fixing it.

2. The fact that Scott Booker has not been fired shows continude incompetence on Kelly's behalf to manage his staff. Loyalty is huge aspect of football, but loyalty to a fault is insanity and will and should cost a head coach his job.

3. You have to go for it on that 4th down because Navy is never kicking a field goal. You have to score when you have the opportunity, but then again, when your QB is playing is poorly as Kizer I don't know if you trust him to pick up 4 yards. He missed reads all over the field.

4. I feel for the defense. They played hard again today and were well prepared. In particular, I thought Onwualu, Martini and Love battled like crazy. Love passion and effort from a young group on that side of the ball. They were screwed by another special mistake, or they hold Navy to 21 points, a very good defensive effort against a tough offense to handle.

5. Kevin Stepherson is going to be a poor man's Will Fuller. Really good player in the making. Better hands than Fuller, not quite the speed. He and St. Brown give you some nice weapons on the perimeter for the future.

6. Congrats to Navy, those kids play damn hard and are well coached... With that said and mean no disrespect to the US Naval Academy, but those kids get soooo much pitty from the refs for being undersized. I'm not going to go on the cut block vs chop block soap box, but they get with the most blatant holds on the perimeter and the refs don't even think of flagging them. At one point the announcers said they have only 17 total penalties this year, which infuriates me. Yes there are missed or uncalled penalties on each play in college football, but point of attack penalties are almost never ignored. What thr kids get away with (just because of who they are) along the sidelines, right in front of the refs, is abysmal and embarrassing for the sport. It' been going on for years.

I have great respect for everything those kids stand and play for, but it's year, after year, of the same nonsense. I don't care how small they are, the rules ought to be the same for everyone.

7. Brian Kelly is on his way out, and it will be interesting to see if Swarbrick and University swallow the millions they'll pay out, or if they give Kelly another year in which this team will undoubtedly be better. I've gone on record saying that they'll win at least 8 games, but they're not going to the playoffs under this staff. Kelly has done a lot to prepare this program for success and has the next staff set up fairly well for success, but it's obviously approaching the time (some would argue the time has passed) for fresh ideas and new energy in South Bend. Kelly's teams haven't quit on him and they are competitive every week, but competitive is for up-and-coming programs, Notre Dame is an established program. There is no reason a coach at ND can't win 9+ games each year.

JMO.

Really Navy gets pitty?

Stop it

And your rant about the defense?
How many rushing yards did they give up........oh that's right pitty

 

[HDK]

I usually enjoy your insight but it sounds an awful lot like you are putting this loss on Kizer as much as BK and you are giving the defense a free pass. Our defense was awful today. Yes, if they had held Navy to 21 points they might not have been as bad but, against option teams like Navy, time of possession matters - a LOT - almost as much as the number of points given up. We only had 2 offensive possessions in the second half. Two. It's hard to put the loss on an offense when they can't get on the field because your defense can't get off the field. Sure, the D finally made a stop near the end of the 3rd quarter, and yes, our special teams royally screwed us yet again to give Navy another chance to continue their drive. But guess what? Navy did continue their drive until they made it all the way to the end zone. Why? Because our defense went back to being awful. Their stop against Navy's offense at that point in the game was the anomaly, what happened after that was the norm. If we didn't have that penalty it would have been only the 2nd stop in the game (not counting Navy's possession at the end of the 1st half) and there was absolutely no evidence we would have gotten a 3rd stop.

As far as Kizer is concerned, yes, he made some really, really bad throws and bad reads. But he was still 19/27, 227yds, 3tds/0int. The offense scored on every possession but one. The offense and Kizer weren't great but they were good and performed well enough to win had our defense been able to get off the field. To the extent that Kizer's accuracy has regressed, it seems every QB at ND has regressed under Kelly while at ND and that includes the backups (think Hendrix and Zaire). I don't think it makes sense to single out Kizer when the trend seems to be very clear. Why should we want to move on to the next guy if we can't fix this trend?

Your other points were spot on.

Kizer is half the player he was last year. So either he played over his head all last year or he was a beneficiary of the Bryan Kelly destroy your quarterback's confidence school of coaching. People talk about how high he is going to be drafted. I can't see him even playing in the NFL. Maybe he'll be a clipboard holder for some team, but he's not NFL material at this point.

 

[HuddleBurger]

4th and 4, down 4 against a ball control offense let's kick a fg. Can't wait for next year with this great coach of ours.

Kelly's no fool. He knows a field goal gets him another "near win," which holds a ton of value with this administration. Job security in the Era of Mediocrity.

 

[dgndfan]

Kelly was out coached again. Plain and simple. The defense is still horrible. Plain and simple. The special teams are a joke. The sideline dancing looks ridiculous. Kizer is overrated. Very erratic. No way he is a first round pick. This group always finds a way to lose. There is nothing good to say about this team. All in all , an embarrassment.

 

[NDIRISH53]

Did something happen to tranquil that I missed? Missed the first half. I remember him playing fantastic against GT last year

 

[Legendsteve]

IIO hit the nail on the head: Navy plays horrible defense against any QUALITY opponent. ND is NOT a quality opponent. Hence the result. Navy 28 ND 27.

 

[Granite45]

T
Spare us the, I don't want ND to be a football factory like USC or Alabama. That's what they were under Holtz and even more so in the Rockne and Leahy days. I've had former players under Holtz tell me this verbatim.

And shame on these former players if they support the weakening of Notre Dame as an academic position.

 

[Telx1]

Did something happen to tranquil that I missed? Missed the first half. I remember him playing fantastic against GT last year

Expected a big game from Drue, and he was in on a number of tackles early on, but he whiffed on more than his share that led to big gains.

 

[HRC08]

It seems like there are fewer and fewer ND fans who care. More people were on the message boards back in the day when Willingham and Weis were stinking up the joint. There doesn't seem to be as many people who give a damn nowadays.

I'm in this group. Ashamed to say that I've not watched one play of the last two games. I'm in the middle of a move and haven't watched any sports or tv for that matter.

If the Irish weren't underachieving, there's no doubt that I'd have made time to watch every play of both games. I'm just over all of the losing and watching a Brian Kelly team roll out the same game plan every single week regardless of opponent or weather conditions. I can't think of any other coach in any other sport that doesn't change their philosophy based on who they are playing. And I'm not saying moving away from their strengths or top plays but an overall emphasis on attacking a certain aspect of an opponent's offense and defense. ND plays the same game plan 11 out of 12 games or maybe 12 out of 12. It's lazy or arrogance, idk which.

 

[ndhell]

I'm in this group. Ashamed to say that I've not watched one play of the last two games. I'm in the middle of a move and haven't watched any sports or tv for that matter.

If the Irish weren't underachieving, there's no doubt that I'd have made time to watch every play of both games. I'm just over all of the losing and watching a Brian Kelly team roll out the same game plan every single week regardless of opponent or weather conditions. I can't think of any other coach in any other sport that doesn't change their philosophy based on who they are playing. And I'm not saying moving away from their strengths or top plays but an overall emphasis on attacking a certain aspect of an opponent's offense and defense. ND plays the same game plan 11 out of 12 games or maybe 12 out of 12. It's lazy or arrogance, idk which.

The worst was the game in the hurricane against the Wolf Pack. Kelly kept throwing the ball LOL.

 

[Nocalirish]

Fire him before saying he would be back and an assistant coaches the team. Happens all the time. Now Swarbrick look's like an incompetent liar at seasons end if he choses to fire him then.

Jack already looks incompetent. Why prove it by keeping Kelly for another 4-8 season. Jack and Kelly both need to go. ND is the laughing stock of college football.

 

[JRepp]

I don't see Kizer getting any better, rather the opposite. His play has deteriorated all season. Why? I don't know, but it's fairly obvious. I just think this is the most under coached team that I've seen. ND won't do it, but they need to fire the HC and get someone who knows how to win with power football and defense. Otherwise we will continue as we are.

I am confused...you state you don't know why, but then you state it is fairly obvious. Not sure I want you giving out any advice.

 

[DieHard_Irish]

I am confused...you state you don't know why, but then you state it is fairly obvious. Not sure I want you giving out any advice.

It's fairly obvious he's deteriorated, his accuracy has been terrible of late, but I don't really know why that is.

 

[Java65]

It's fairly obvious he's deteriorated, his accuracy has been terrible of late, but I don't really know why that is.

It's happened to every single QB under Kelly.. they all regressed dramatically under him.

 

[aoi_toku]

What I mean by that is that Brian Kelly has made huge strides regarding the infrastructure of ND's program. He has pushed for and hired a ton of staff in the recruiting department, the media and social media department, he has done a ton to help modernize ND's brand. He pushed for the scoreboard and the turf field. He was also responsible for the modern training table and huge advancement in strength and conditioning over his predeccessors. The next coach will have significantly more resources to work with than Kelly had when he arrived.

His on field coaching has been extremely disappointing at times, but what he did (with Jack's help) to ramp up the infrastructure of the program and to modernize it and make it "cool" in a generation where that's vitally important to recruiting, cannot be overstated.

The next guy has what he needs to win at a high level. The team just needs some scheme and attitude adjustments and better in game decision making.

Kelly is a politician. He successfully politicked for the things necessary to the success of the very top programs, under the agreement that he would deliver wins because of it.. Like many politicians, he didn't live up to his end of the deal, but that doesn't change the importance of the things that have been put into place for the he next guy.

All that tells me is he does well in an office manager scenario - makes sure the place looks nice, ensures employees' workstations are up to date, and the windows are clean.

But an office manager has no clue how to turn a profit for the company.

 

[ndhell]

Jack already looks incompetent. Why prove it by keeping Kelly for another 4-8 season. Jack and Kelly both need to go. ND is the laughing stock of college football.

I don't think the rest of the college football even cares at this point. The college football world is getting along just fine with or without ND being good.

 

[stu4don]

When it comes to Navy's grinding hard to stop offense it often comes down to one play. And once again, special teams (12 men on the field, I mean really?!) let us down. We were moving the ball at will and would have gone up two scores.

 

[zonairish]

It's happened to every single QB under Kelly.. they all regressed dramatically under him.

They lose confidence.

 

[tkirish]

A few things I need to say. ND football is over as we know it. Now I'm not saying forever, but the issues with the Irish go much much deeper than the coach. Think about it. Go back ten, fifteen years. Look at all the teams that have beaten ND during that span. It's pathetic. On their worst day, they would never lose to Tulsa or Duke. Navy has beaten them 4 times in the last 9 years and came very close on a couple other occasions. I said this before and I'm sticking with it. ND does not get the talent to compete for championships. They get talent to compete with Navy, Maryland, Duke. That's where they are talent wise. Coaching is part of the reason but not the main reason. Now more than ever those in charge of the school do not care one way or another about winning football games. It's irrelevant to the academic people. So year after year they put out the PR crap and we all buy into it. It's over people! OVER!!! Until someone at the top decides that football is an important part of the university, nothing will ever change. They are happy with mediocrity for football. As long as the players graduate that is all that matters.

Anyone who has tickets to the last home game should stay home. Nothing would send a message more than people simply stop going to games and watching on TV. Stop buying the overpriced merchandise too. As long as the stadium is filled and people watch, nothing will change. This isn't about one bad year. This is about 25 plus years of futility and being embarrassed year after year. NBC need to pull their contract. That would be the biggest slap in the face. Nick Saban couldn't win a championship at ND. Why? Because as great as he is at coaching, it still comes down to having great players. ND has none. They have good players. There is a difference. I'm sick of hearing how difficult it is defending Navy. It's difficult because the ND players are not that good. I don't give a crap what anyone says. They stink. ND should win by 21 against Navy every year. They should manhandle them. But every year ND gets manhandled by Navy. Believe it or not Bob Davie might have been the best coach out of the last 4. He was put in a bad spot. At least his defenses were pretty good. Again, it's sucks but the reality is, ND football is done unless those at the top decide to make it something special again. I'm not counting on that.

 

[Kelso86]

IIO, I usually agree with most, but not all of your points. I think you hit 100% today. I thought going in that Navy would score at least 28, but that we would score in the low forties. The defense played well enough to win, but the offense didn't, and you have to look at Kizer for his poor throws to wide open receivers and for missing so many open receivers with his tunnel vision. The ST play cost us the game, but it shouldn't have come down to this. Love was beyond impressive. Kelly should do himself and the university a favor and take a break from the sidelines and get a tv jig. I watch Wisconsin and Michigan play with confidence and disciplined aggression, and ND's play is passive by comparison. Settling for the FG was incredibly passive for a team with our record playing a time eating ball control offense that we had trouble stopping all day. A passive coach who lacks confidence in his offense breeds a passive team.

The defense played well? What game were you watching?

 

[DieHard_Irish]

A few things I need to say. ND football is over as we know it. Now I'm not saying forever, but the issues with the Irish go much much deeper than the coach. Think about it. Go back ten, fifteen years. Look at all the teams that have beaten ND during that span. It's pathetic. On their worst day, they would never lose to Tulsa or Duke. Navy has beaten them 4 times in the last 9 years and came very close on a couple other occasions. I said this before and I'm sticking with it. ND does not get the talent to compete for championships. They get talent to compete with Navy, Maryland, Duke. That's where they are talent wise. Coaching is part of the reason but not the main reason. Now more than ever those in charge of the school do not care one way or another about winning football games. It's irrelevant to the academic people. So year after year they put out the PR crap and we all buy into it. It's over people! OVER!!! Until someone at the top decides that football is an important part of the university, nothing will ever change. They are happy with mediocrity for football. As long as the players graduate that is all that matters.

Anyone who has tickets to the last home game should stay home. Nothing would send a message more than people simply stop going to games and watching on TV. Stop buying the overpriced merchandise too. As long as the stadium is filled and people watch, nothing will change. This isn't about one bad year. This is about 25 plus years of futility and being embarrassed year after year. NBC need to pull their contract. That would be the biggest slap in the face. Nick Saban couldn't win a championship at ND. Why? Because as great as he is at coaching, it still comes down to having great players. ND has none. They have good players. There is a difference. I'm sick of hearing how difficult it is defending Navy. It's difficult because the ND players are not that good. I don't give a crap what anyone says. They stink. ND should win by 21 against Navy every year. They should manhandle them. But every year ND gets manhandled by Navy. Believe it or not Bob Davie might have been the best coach out of the last 4. He was put in a bad spot. At least his defenses were pretty good. Again, it's sucks but the reality is, ND football is done unless those at the top decide to make it something special again. I'm not counting on that.

I agree for the most part on the school, the administration and the money, but not on the talent level. We have talent, both undercoached and under utilized.

 

[Rockne's Rambler]

Does Washington get better recruits than ND? Or Washington State?

 

[ndhell]

A few things I need to say. ND football is over as we know it. Now I'm not saying forever, but the issues with the Irish go much much deeper than the coach. Think about it. Go back ten, fifteen years. Look at all the teams that have beaten ND during that span. It's pathetic. On their worst day, they would never lose to Tulsa or Duke. Navy has beaten them 4 times in the last 9 years and came very close on a couple other occasions. I said this before and I'm sticking with it. ND does not get the talent to compete for championships. They get talent to compete with Navy, Maryland, Duke. That's where they are talent wise. Coaching is part of the reason but not the main reason. Now more than ever those in charge of the school do not care one way or another about winning football games. It's irrelevant to the academic people. So year after year they put out the PR crap and we all buy into it. It's over people! OVER!!! Until someone at the top decides that football is an important part of the university, nothing will ever change. They are happy with mediocrity for football. As long as the players graduate that is all that matters.

Anyone who has tickets to the last home game should stay home. Nothing would send a message more than people simply stop going to games and watching on TV. Stop buying the overpriced merchandise too. As long as the stadium is filled and people watch, nothing will change. This isn't about one bad year. This is about 25 plus years of futility and being embarrassed year after year. NBC need to pull their contract. That would be the biggest slap in the face. Nick Saban couldn't win a championship at ND. Why? Because as great as he is at coaching, it still comes down to having great players. ND has none. They have good players. There is a difference. I'm sick of hearing how difficult it is defending Navy. It's difficult because the ND players are not that good. I don't give a crap what anyone says. They stink. ND should win by 21 against Navy every year. They should manhandle them. But every year ND gets manhandled by Navy. Believe it or not Bob Davie might have been the best coach out of the last 4. He was put in a bad spot. At least his defenses were pretty good. Again, it's sucks but the reality is, ND football is done unless those at the top decide to make it something special again. I'm not counting on that.

You gotta Drain The Swamp in South Bend.

 

[Telx1]

The

The defense played well? What game were you watching?

Same as you. You didn't really think the defense was going to stop Navy's run game did you? Thought they played well enough to win the game, which was my point. The stupid 12 man penalty that gave Navy the first down and extended their nine minute third qtr possession for a touchdown kept the defense on the field too long and likely cost us the game. Still our offense should have scored enough to beat their 28 points. Our offense stopped itself, Navy sure as hell didn't.

 

[deadirishpoet]

The

Same as you. You didn't really think the defense was going to stop Navy's run game did you? Thought they played well enough to win the game, which was my point. The stupid 12 man penalty that gave Navy the first down and extended their nine minute third qtr possession for a touchdown kept the defense on the field too long and likely cost us the game. Still our offense should have scored enough to beat their 28 points. Our offense stopped itself, Navy sure as hell didn't.

The defense did not play well unless the bar is being lowered ....again

 

[Bodizephax]

I would like to get the Navy coach to coach ND. Revamp the offense to the triple option with a little more passing. It would be like going into a time machine and bringing Lou Holtz back. ND could still recruit top defensive players and they would be more fresh because of offensive ball control. ND would still be able to recruit good running backs and athletes that want a chance to lead the team at QB like Tony Rice.
We, as fans get to caught up in recruiting flashy skill when what really matters is recruiting hardnosed players who are not afraid to mix it up.
Hire Ken N ! And play winning Holtz style football !!