Next 1st Round Pick on ND Roster

[echowaker]

Mack is an immense talent, there is just no 2 ways about that.

Based on the spring, he’s the clear #1 option at TE for 2018, so you’ll see A LOT of him. More than Kmet and much more than Wright, though you’ll see them too.

He needs to finally match his on-field production to his physical talent, but there is good reason to believe that he will in 2018.

The coaches appear to have high expectations for him, and I certainly share that opinion.

I think he’ll be the best offensive skill player (non-QB) that we have in 2018. He may well lead the team in catches too.

nothing he has done to this point endorses such optimism. i'll take kmet and wright who show much more willingness to do the dirty work.

 

[FriedmanIP]

nothing he has done to this point endorses such optimism. i'll take kmet and wright who show much more willingness to do the dirty work.

Apparently, he has… Considering that my opinion is shared by the coaches, who are choosing to make him the primary focus at tight end (thus far) based on what they’ve seen from him in both practices and games.

Additionally, Mack was probably better at the “dirty work“ than anything else in 2017. He wasn’t great at catching the ball consistently or making plays down field (which was largely influenced by QB play) but his “Chain moving catches” and especially his blocking were the best parts of his game.

I like Kmet and Wright, a lot. Both have fantastic physical talent that should help us in the future. In fact, both should help us in 2018. But neither one has done even as much on the field as Mack has.

In fact, saying that you’ll go with either one of those two players because of what Mack hasn’t shown is logically inconsistent and backwards. He’s done more on the field, and clearly more and practice, not only producing more game stats but also enough practice work that the coaches have chosen to make him the primary focus.

In reality, there’s really no basis for your stance on Kmet and Wright over Mack… Not the other way around.

 

[echowaker]

Apparently, he has… Considering that my opinion is shared by the coaches, who are choosing to make him the primary focus at tight end (thus far) based on what they’ve seen from him in both practices and games.

Additionally, Mack was probably better at the “dirty work“ than anything else in 2017. He wasn’t great at catching the ball consistently or making plays down field (which was largely influenced by QB play) but his “Chain moving catches” and especially his blocking were the best parts of his game.

I like Kmet and Wright, a lot. Both have fantastic physical talent that should help us in the future. In fact, both should help us in 2018. But neither one has done even as much on the field as Mack has.

In fact, saying that you’ll go with either one of those two players because of what Mack hasn’t shown is logically inconsistent and backwards. He’s done more on the field, and clearly more and practice, not only producing more game stats but also enough practice work that the coaches have chosen to make him the primary focus.

In reality, there’s really no basis for your stance on Kmet and Wright over Mack… Not the other way around.

All mack has shown is incredible inconsistency. physical gifts certainly there. i like the little i've seen of kmet and wright way more than anything i've seen of mack. i hope i'm wrong and mack really has a breakout season. if mack has any desire to play at the next level and make some bonus money he'll need to do that. as of right now he appears to be a late round pick at very best.

 

[echowaker]

Apparently, he has… Considering that my opinion is shared by the coaches, who are choosing to make him the primary focus at tight end (thus far) based on what they’ve seen from him in both practices and games.

Additionally, Mack was probably better at the “dirty work“ than anything else in 2017. He wasn’t great at catching the ball consistently or making plays down field (which was largely influenced by QB play) but his “Chain moving catches” and especially his blocking were the best parts of his game.

I like Kmet and Wright, a lot. Both have fantastic physical talent that should help us in the future. In fact, both should help us in 2018. But neither one has done even as much on the field as Mack has.

In fact, saying that you’ll go with either one of those two players because of what Mack hasn’t shown is logically inconsistent and backwards. He’s done more on the field, and clearly more and practice, not only producing more game stats but also enough practice work that the coaches have chosen to make him the primary focus.

In reality, there’s really no basis for your stance on Kmet and Wright over Mack… Not the other way around.

"primary focus " of what ? is he listed on the depth chart as the starter ? yes. tight end is a spot where multiple players play regularly.. i thought mack had a bright future as a freshman. he's regressed in my eyes. i believe the young guys have much more upside as all around tight ends. time will tell. i hope all of them flourish.

 

[echowaker]

Mack is an immense talent, there is just no 2 ways about that.

Based on the spring, he’s the clear #1 option at TE for 2018, so you’ll see A LOT of him. More than Kmet and much more than Wright, though you’ll see them too.

He needs to finally match his on-field production to his physical talent, but there is good reason to believe that he will in 2018.

The coaches appear to have high expectations for him, and I certainly share that opinion.

I think he’ll be the best offensive skill player (non-QB) that we have in 2018. He may well lead the team in catches too.

what " reason" is there to believe he will in 2018 other than outright optimism ? he was better as a true freshman.

 

[FriedmanIP]

All mack has shown is incredible inconsistency. physical gifts certainly there. i like the little i've seen of kmet and wright way more than anything i've seen of mack. i hope i'm wrong and mack really has a breakout season. if mack has any desire to play at the next level and make some bonus money he'll need to do that. as of right now he appears to be a late round pick at very best.

He needs to do more on the field, no question.

But he’s done much more than either Kmet or Wright. Heck, even his freshman season was much more productive than either of theirs.

There is really no basis at all for putting either of them over Mack, beyond some type of personal agenda.

He’s both the most talented, most experienced, and most on-field proven TE on the roster.

 

[FriedmanIP]

"primary focus " of what ? is he listed on the depth chart as the starter ? yes. tight end is a spot where multiple players play regularly.. i thought mack had a bright future as a freshman. he's regressed in my eyes. i believe the young guys have much more upside as all around tight ends. time will tell. i hope all of them flourish.

He’s the primary focus at the TE position for 2018.

If you’ve read any of the practice reports, the usage of Mack dwarfs the usage of any other TE, including Kmet.

We ran 2+ TE sets on about 30% of snaps in 2017. We could maybe get that number closer to 40% in 2018, but not that much more than that.

Thus, it’s veryt impactful that Mack will be getting most of those snaps.

 

[echowaker]

Apparently, he has… Considering that my opinion is shared by the coaches, who are choosing to make him the primary focus at tight end (thus far) based on what they’ve seen from him in both practices and games.

Additionally, Mack was probably better at the “dirty work“ than anything else in 2017. He wasn’t great at catching the ball consistently or making plays down field (which was largely influenced by QB play) but his “Chain moving catches” and especially his blocking were the best parts of his game.

I like Kmet and Wright, a lot. Both have fantastic physical talent that should help us in the future. In fact, both should help us in 2018. But neither one has done even as much on the field as Mack has.

In fact, saying that you’ll go with either one of those two players because of what Mack hasn’t shown is logically inconsistent and backwards. He’s done more on the field, and clearly more and practice, not only producing more game stats but also enough practice work that the coaches have chosen to make him the primary focus.

In reality, there’s really no basis for your stance on Kmet and Wright over Mack… Not the other way around.

The basis is my opinion just as is your optimism of mack. opinion nothing more.

 

[echowaker]

He needs to do more on the field, no question.

But he’s done much more than either Kmet or Wright. Heck, even his freshman season was much more productive than either of theirs.

There is really no basis at all for putting either of them over Mack, beyond some type of personal agenda.

He’s both the most talented, most experienced, and most on-field proven TE on the roster.

most talented ? how so ? thats your opinion and you are entitled to it.

 

[FriedmanIP]

what " reason" is there to believe he will in 2018 other than outright optimism ? he was better as a true freshman.

There is more “reason” than there is for Kmet or Wright.

First, Mack is the most physically talented...and typically the best players play.

Next, the coaches greatly prefer Mack to Kmet/Wright for 2018, which became immensely clear this spring. He’s way ahead, in their eyes.

Third, he’s the most proven on the field. He’s simply produced more than Kmet and Wright have...combined.

Finally, he didn’t “regress” from 2015 to 2017. His receiving numbers weren’t great in 2017, but much of that was a result of better passing in 2015 from the QB position. If you actually watch the games closely, Mack was open A LOT and Wimbush simply didn’t get the to him. However, Mack advanced considerably as a blocker.

Mack is the clear #1 for 2018 and is poised for a major breakout year.

 

[echowaker]

He’s the primary focus at the TE position for 2018.

If you’ve read any of the practice reports, the usage of Mack dwarfs the usage of any other TE, including Kmet.

We ran 2+ TE sets on about 30% of snaps in 2017. We could maybe get that number closer to 40% in 2018, but not that much more than that.

Thus, it’s veryt impactful that Mack will be getting most of those snaps.

we shall see. it's june you're making mack out to be tyler eifert. i am taking a wait and see approach based on his regression from his freshman year. i hope he explodes this year. i just like the younger guys much better.

 

[FriedmanIP]

The basis is my opinion just as is your optimism of mack. opinion nothing more.

My opinion is based on the coaches opinion and we’ll as far superior on-field and practice production, plus superior physical skills.

You’re right about your opinion having no basis though.

 

[echowaker]

There is more “reason” than there is for Kmet or Wright.

First, Mack is the most physically talented...and typically the best players play.

Next, the coaches greatly prefer Mack to Kmet/Wright for 2018, which became immensely clear this spring. He’s way ahead, in their eyes.

Third, he’s the most proven on the field. He’s simply produced more than Kmet and Wright have...combined.

Finally, he didn’t “regress” from 2015 to 2017. His receiving numbers weren’t great in 2017, but much of that was a result of better passing in 2015 from the QB position. If you actually watch the games closely, Mack was open A LOT and Wimbush simply didn’t get the to him. However, Mack advanced considerably as a blocker.

Mack is the clear #1 for 2018 and is poised for a major breakout year.

he certainly regressed and it has nothing to do with numbers. off the field issues, inconsistent hands, so so blocking etc. again, you choose to be optimistic and thats fine. i'll take a wait and see approach.

 

[echowaker]

My opinion is based on the coaches opinion and we’ll as far superior on-field and practice production, plus superior physical skills.

You’re right about your opinion having no basis though.

it's easy to have superior as you call it on the field production. i would hope so, he's been here much longer than the others. as far the "coaches" opinion that's far from a done deal. it's june. don't overrate spring practice.

 

[FriedmanIP]

we shall see. it's june you're making mack out to be tyler eifert. i am taking a wait and see approach based on his regression from his freshman year. i hope he explodes this year. i just like the younger guys much better.

Except that the regression only exists in your mind, not in reality.

And you can like whoever you want to ... you just have to admit that every single thing that you’ve said is 100% backwards.

It’s not Mack who lacks proof relative to Kmet/Wright, it’s the younger guys that lack proof. Mack has produced far more.

It’s not a basis opinion to have Mack far ahead of Kmet/Wright, it’s a basisless opinion to think anything else. The coaches who see them every practice have Mack far ahead.

The fact that Mack is so far ahead of young and talented players, about whom you’re excited, should have to excited for Mack.

He’s poised for a major breakout year, because he’s the primary focus at TE over Kmet and Wright.

 

[FriedmanIP]

most talented ? how so ? thats your opinion and you are entitled to it.

He’s a better athlete than either one, and is currently a stronger and more developed blocker.

That’s not an opinion, it’s just reality.

Mack is the most talented TE on the roster for 2018...and it’s not all that close.

 

[echowaker]

My opinion is based on the coaches opinion and we’ll as far superior on-field and practice production, plus superior physical skills.

You’re right about your opinion having no basis though.

your obsession with thinking you're " right" is amusing. it's june everything is opinion. at least my opinions come from a long established football background.

 

[echowaker]

He’s a better athlete than either one, and is currently a stronger and more developed blocker.

That’s not an opinion, it’s just reality.

Mack is the most talented TE on the roster for 2018...and it’s not all that close.

where do you get this nonsense ? a more developed blocker ? thats silly. the young guys showed more as freshamn blocking than mack has his entire time at nd. he is at this stage a more polished receiver.

 

[FriedmanIP]

he certainly regressed and it has nothing to do with numbers. off the field issues, inconsistent hands, so so blocking etc. again, you choose to be optimistic and thats fine. i'll take a wait and see approach.

Your just making this up, it’s not based on reality.

First of all, his blocking was MUCH better than it was in 2015. It wasn’t even close. That was just a dumb thing for you to say.

Next, he was a better pass catcher in 2017 than he was in 2015. Heck, he lead the team in catches for much of the season and actually had more catches than Smythe.

I’m simply listening to the coaches who see these TEs play daily and compare them directly.

Your just choosing to ignore that and make stuff up

 

[echowaker]

Except that the regression only exists in your mind, not in reality.

And you can like whoever you want to ... you just have to admit that every single thing that you’ve said is 100% backwards.

It’s not Mack who lacks proof relative to Kmet/Wright, it’s the younger guys that lack proof. Mack has produced far more.

It’s not a basis opinion to have Mack far ahead of Kmet/Wright, it’s a basisless opinion to think anything else. The coaches who see them every practice have Mack far ahead.

The fact that Mack is so far ahead of young and talented players, about whom you’re excited, should have to excited for Mack.

He’s poised for a major breakout year, because he’s the primary focus at TE over Kmet and Wright.

" far ahead " ? who EVER said that ? now you're just making things up to cover for your lack of knowledge of the game.

 

[FriedmanIP]

it's easy to have superior as you call it on the field production. i would hope so, he's been here much longer than the others. as far the "coaches" opinion that's far from a done deal. it's june. don't overrate spring practice.

He’s only “been here” for 1 more season than them, as he was suspended for 2016.

And the coaches opinion is BEYOND clear, if you’ve read any of the practice reports. They have Mack WAYYYYY ahead of Kmet and Wright.

You’re literally attempting to ignore facts to support your agenda.

 

[echowaker]

Your just making this up, it’s not based on reality.

First of all, his blocking was MUCH better than it was in 2015. It wasn’t even close. That was just a dumb thing for you to say.

Next, he was a better pass catcher in 2017 than he was in 2015. Heck, he lead the team in catches for much of the season and actually had more catches than Smythe.

I’m simply listening to the coaches who see these TEs play daily and compare them directly.

Your just choosing to ignore that and make stuff up

what did i make up ? more catches than smythe ? yes but nd used tight ends sparingly in the pass game last year. no one is calling mack this dominant player other than you. all i've said is based on what my educated eyes have seen i prefer the young guys going forward. that doesn't mean mack doesn't have a place in the offense.

 

[FriedmanIP]

your obsession with thinking you're " right" is amusing. it's june everything is opinion. at least my opinions come from a long established football background.

It doesn’t matter what your background is...the basis for your opinions doesn’t exist.

Mack has shown himself to be the superior TE prospect inuterslly every single aspect for 2018
- Coaches opinions .... check
- In game production ... check
- practice production ... check
- physical talent ... check

Mack is the runaway top TE in literally every category, which is why the coaches have made him the primary focus at the position for 2018.

This stuff isn’t tough

 

[FriedmanIP]

where do you get this nonsense ? a more developed blocker ? thats silly. the young guys showed more as freshamn blocking than mack has his entire time at nd. he is at this stage a more polished receiver.

You’re clearly not watching the games if you think either Kmet or Wright are as developed and proficient of blockers as Mack is right now.

There are some great articles about it on this site, assuming you don’t want to just go back and watch the games.

This is just silly.

 

[echowaker]

He’s only “been here” for 1 more season than them, as he was suspended for 2016.

And the coaches opinion is BEYOND clear, if you’ve read any of the practice reports. They have Mack WAYYYYY ahead of Kmet and Wright.

You’re literally attempting to ignore facts to support your agenda.

i have no agenda. merely calling you out on your baseless optimism on mack in 2018. i hope he does breakout but nothing in his career to this point indicates that is likely. hopefully he's a solid contributor. that is my expectation based on what he has shown to date.

 

[FriedmanIP]

what did i make up ? more catches than smythe ? yes but nd used tight ends sparingly in the pass game last year. no one is calling mack this dominant player other than you. all i've said is based on what my educated eyes have seen i prefer the young guys going forward. that doesn't mean mack doesn't have a place in the offense.

You’ve made up BS about Mack regressing from 2015 and even more BS about is relative blocking proficiency compared to Kmet/Wright.

In fact, you have yet to say 1 single thing in this thread that’s accurate.

For example, NDs TE caught more passes and a higher percentage of our total passes than they have in years, while also having 2+ TEs on the field more than 30% of the snaps (compared to about 10% in 2016)....but now you claim they were used sparingly

You just make crap up

 

[echowaker]

You’re clearly not watching the games if you think either Kmet or Wright are as developed and proficient of blockers as Mack is right now.

There are some great articles about it on this site, assuming you don’t want to just go back and watch the games.

This is just silly.

i ve watched all the games. if you think mack is a better blocker you've reinforced my opinion that you lack basic knowledge of the game. he's pedestrian at best at it. hopefully he improves this season.

 

[FriedmanIP]

what did i make up ? more catches than smythe ? yes but nd used tight ends sparingly in the pass game last year. no one is calling mack this dominant player other than you. all i've said is based on what my educated eyes have seen i prefer the young guys going forward. that doesn't mean mack doesn't have a place in the offense.

The coaches have made it quite clear, Mack’s “place in the offense” is as the clear-cut #1 TE and probably as the teams overall leading pass catcher.

Much of the offense will run through him in 2018

 

[FriedmanIP]

i have no agenda. merely calling you out on your baseless optimism on mack in 2018. i hope he does breakout but nothing in his career to this point indicates that is likely. hopefully he's a solid contributor. that is my expectation based on what he has shown to date.

Your the one with baseless opinion on Kmet and Wright for 2018.

Mack is not only the most proven TE (by far) but the coaches have made it clear that he’s their top guy at the position, and it’s not close.

All you’ve done is State your agenda and then make up crap to try and support it, because reality does not do so.

 

[FriedmanIP]

i ve watched all the games. if you think mack is a better blocker you've reinforced my opinion that you lack basic knowledge of the game. he's pedestrian at best at it. hopefully he improves this season.

Mack is a significantly better blocker than either Kmet or Wright at this point. In fact, blocking was probably the best part of his game in 2017 and definitely the area where he made the biggest strides.

If you need more confirmation on that point, read any of the great film breakdown and evaluations that the analysts from this site do on this very point.

Your “opinion” has already been thoroughly and publicly debunked.

It’s becoming clear that your incapable of addressing this pint without making crap up, even for a single post.

 

[echowaker]

You’ve made up BS about Mack regressing from 2015 and even more BS about is relative blocking proficiency compared to Kmet/Wright.

In fact, you have yet to say 1 single thing in this thread that’s accurate.

For example, NDs TE caught more passes and a higher percentage of our total passes than they have in years, while also having 2+ TEs on the field more than 30% of the snaps (compared to about 10% in 2016)....but now you claim they were used sparingly

You just make crap up

tight ends caught 25% that's not a lot considering the backs don't catch many balls and a far cry from the eifert days. last year. mack averaged 8.7 yds per catch.

 

[echowaker]

The coaches have made it quite clear, Mack’s “place in the offense” is as the clear-cut #1 TE and probably as the teams overall leading pass catcher.

Much of the offense will run through him in 2018

i would put macks chances at being the leading pass catcher at less than 10%. no reason to think otherwise based on past performance.

 

[echowaker]

Mack is a significantly better blocker than either Kmet or Wright at this point. In fact, blocking was probably the best part of his game in 2017 and definitely the area where he made the biggest strides.

If you need more confirmation on that point, read any of the great film breakdown and evaluations that the analysts from this site do on this very point.

Your “opinion” has already been thoroughly and publicly debunked.

It’s becoming clear that your incapable of addressing this pint without making crap up, even for a single post.

mack is a pedestrian blocker at best. kmet is significantly better as was smythe. your opinion is no better than mine.

 

[NDAFArly]

I can’t keep up with this thread...

You guys are going so fast.

I just saw the question about Alize Mack (Jones) blocking ability?

I don’t know who is arguing what, but I know the analysts on here & the ND coaches (including Long & Heistand) have all said he is an excellent blocker. Even noted that in games he wasn’t getting catches he was still blocking really well. The BC & NC State games stand out because he was out on the right side to help out with their dominant DL’s & he made a huge difference.

 

[echowaker]

Mack is a significantly better blocker than either Kmet or Wright at this point. In fact, blocking was probably the best part of his game in 2017 and definitely the area where he made the biggest strides.

If you need more confirmation on that point, read any of the great film breakdown and evaluations that the analysts from this site do on this very point.

Your “opinion” has already been thoroughly and publicly debunked.

It’s becoming clear that your incapable of addressing this pint without making crap up, even for a single post.

what analysts ? this site ? oh please.

 

[NDAFArly]

what analysts ? this site ? oh please.

Chip Long & some guy named Harry Heistand said so.

 

[echowaker]

I can’t keep up with this thread...

You guys are going so fast.

I just saw the question about Alize Mack (Jones) blocking ability?

I don’t know who is arguing what, but I know the analysts on here & the ND coaches (including Long & Heistand) have all said he is an excellent blocker. Even noted that in games he wasn’t getting catches he was still blocking really well. The BC & NC State games stand out because he was out on the right side to help out with their dominant DL’s & he made a huge difference.

i think he's pedestrian at best. i don't give a damn what analysts on this site say. i guarantee my background is every bit as extensive if not more. i use my eyes and knowledge. i think kmet is far superior. as a blocker and a relief pitcher.

 

[echowaker]

Chip Long & some guy named Harry Heistand said so.

did they say he was better than kmet and wright or is that just more premium board gossip ? no one said mack didn't play well in those games. i'm talking straight up ability.

 

[echowaker]

gotta go. you guys have a great day ! good talk russ !!!

 

[FriedmanIP]

i would put macks chances at being the leading pass catcher at less than 10%. no reason to think otherwise based on past performance.

Mack is 2nd on the team in career catches and 2nd on the team in catches from 2017....so that’s not really true. Just another thing you’ve made up.

Furthermore, the analysts for this very site disagree with you and have expressly stated as much.

Again, you have an agenda...you just don’t have any basis for it.