So tired of hearing you can't win at ND. Since 2000 only 13 of 130 teams have played in BCS or Playoffs. And ND is one of them. And all these great programs that the media people talk about have some recent success but certainly nothing spectacular. National Champs...since 2000 .BIG12 (2) Texas one since 1970s Okl one since 1980s, Pac12 none and none for sc since 1970s (don't count probation and secondary polls), SEC BAMA LSU auburn fla, BIG 10 (2)OSU. m one since 1940s. ACC FSU Miami. I may have missed one or two but I count only 13 teams in BCS or playoffs. And ND is one even with the mediocre coaching since 1997.
ND IS A TOP LEVEL JOB
- Thread starter wny
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It's B-level with tons of pressure and no help from the administration. Hence you have to take a shot. PJ Fleck.
It's the worst of all scenarios... The administration wants everyone to believe it's an A-level program...charging an arm & a leg for tickets, signing an NBC contract, getting involved in the "tough" ACC football conference, promoting the great BK...but that same administration supports it @ a B-level!
Make no mistake...this is all about the mirage that ND is still a top-5 program. It's not!!
Make no mistake...this is all about the mirage that ND is still a top-5 program. It's not!!
Money aside sorry it's not anymore. An I'm a die hard Irish Fan. If it were then we would have our pick of coaches. I am a firm believer that we can be a perennial 10 win team with the occasional 8 and 4 season. Enough kids are still being brought up today with strong family values that believe in great educations and football second. So we will always get good recruits and the occasional elite recruit.
Best thing said today.
I've been saying about this elitist and arrogant mindset for a while. Some on here don't see it this way but I do.
Notre Dame the proud brand somehow along the way turned into this everyone is beneath us attitude.
I'm not solely talking about admissions but on that subject I think Brian Kelly is the biggest **** head ever. His I shop from a different aisle statement is arrogant, self serving,self excusing ...and worst of all so very insulting to the material he is looking at.
Now he might think in his deranged mind he's complementing those players but in reality he's basically saying...look at me, I can't win big games because the kids I get are not as athletic as other schools have access to.
But this would require two ounces of intellect and this person can't even figure out its not wise to have our QB drop back to pass ...46 times in the middle of a ****ing hurricane.
We just need a hungry coach who has the mindset of
I will find a way instead of these coaches who find an excuse
I think Kelly's ego finally caught up . Remember we were in the National Championship game against Alabama in 2012, then in 2014 played #1 Florida State and had the winning touchdown in the end zone called back because of a penalty and after that fell apart in the second half of season ,injuries ,etc. Last year we had the tough opening loss to Clemson and the last second loss to Stanford in the last regular season game .we were in the conversation as being a Final Four until that last game..
Kelly's arrogance
Kelly's arrogance
I forgot to add Kelly's demeanor and arrogance grew in 3 seasons because ND had not been in that position since the early 1990s (maybe I forgot Weis first year at ND) . Kelly can just point to 2012 , 2014 and in particular 2015 that he had brought ND football back to national football prominence in those 3 years ."Look what I've accomplished ,". Now in 2016 things are falling apart .
Can't see us salvaging this season unless Kelly changes his approach does something a little different. That would be hard for Kelly .Play calling is not good
Can't see us salvaging this season unless Kelly changes his approach does something a little different. That would be hard for Kelly .Play calling is not good
This is the reality. I wonder if the NBC contract has any performance-based clauses in it? Maybe if this putrid football would cause the contract to be re-negotiated to a regional package or lesser guaranteed money, the administration would have to start working to foster a championship-level program.
Otherwise, it's going to be more of the same: "Would you like to hear our fight song? It's one of the most famous in all of college football."
But who is the right coach? It's hard to imagine Saban, Meyer, or Harbaugh being interested, especially not with the inherent pressure and the recruiting restrictions involved. Kelly's pedigree was as good as you can ask for, outside of a coach like Saban, Meyer, etc., so who is out there that would want the job that would be less of a gamble then Kelly was?
Of course Saben, Meyer or Harbaugh are not going to be interested. Big time coaches NEVER leave a successful, big time program to go to another one. When was the last time a successful coach just quit and went to another school? The only one in recent memory I can think of is Bret Bielema leaving Wisky for Arkansas
Won't happen and the main underlying reason: ND does not belong to a conference and basically has NO CHANCE AT ALL for the goal of all top-notch coaches - the playoffs and NC. The only shot for a playoff spot as an independent is if ND goes undefeated and even then it's not a done deal. The Playoff committee is made up of mostly P5 member representatives. There's now 4 open spots for the five P5 conference champions. Do some of you really expect for ND to be included over conference champions after turning their noses up about joining a conference for years ? Really ? If Kelly leaves/or is let go, enjoy your search for a top-notch coach that doesn't have NC aspirations.
Things wont change until fans stop going to games. Michigan was very bad under Hoke. The Big house had empty seats all over the place. The administration can actually see that. $$$$$. The Stanford game this week may not be a full sell out but empty bleachers will not be present. Note: Im going this weekend because this is our DADS weekend that we do every year. Otherwise I would be mowing my yard. $125 bucks per ticket does not match the quality of play.
Think of it as visiting an old artifact from ancient times and your donation is preserving its past glory.
ND is not a job an established 'star' would take an unnecessary risk on.
Best hope if finding the next major head coaching na e who is still regarded as an up n comer.
That is the guy who will listen.
Best hope if finding the next major head coaching na e who is still regarded as an up n comer.
That is the guy who will listen.
Meyer left Florida where he won NCs and came to OSU where he won NC.
Saban left LSU where he won NC and came to Alabama where he won NCs.
It is possible.
Meyer is an Ohio native and grew up idolizing Woody Hayes/Archie Griffin/OSU. He even had a picture of Woody in his office the whole time he was at Florida. College Hall of Famer Earle Bruce - former Buckeye coach - was his mentor and just this Saturday dotted the "i" during Script Ohio - a very rare accomplishment for non-band members. Zach Smith - Earle's grandson - is an assistant on Urban's staff. Both Bruce and Urban remain close today. Basically, he came home when he accepted the OSU head coaching position.
No.
Meyer quit UF under very strange circumstances and was working at ESPN for a year before taking the OSU job. Saban went to coach the Miami Dolphins and was a huge failure and was fired then took the Bama job.
ND is absolutely a top college job. ND has an unmatched national brand, fantastic facilities, a beautiful campus, a great academic reputation, and a stadium soon to take a back seat to no one. Yes, the Irish expect their players to go to school, but that hasn't kept great players from coming to ND. To be a head college coach you've got to have a big ego and there is no place where winning gains national attention like ND.
Regardless ,ND is a brand name in college football . Meyer ,Saban will never take ND job . Both will be at the Ohio State and Alabama for a few more years probably winning a few more NCs ,then probably take a job at ESPN. Meyer and Saban are recruiting a very high level every year insuring top 10 teams .
Peterson and Herman are very comfortable at Washington and Houston (probably joining the Big12 expansion)
I agree with most here that somewhere there are rising top flight young coaches .Somewhere.
Also ,I believe that Brian Kelly never wanted to be at ND for the long term anyway , but because of the collapse this season, pro teams who were once looking at B. Kelly are now having their reservations . And I don't think any high profile colleges would hire Kelly with all the negativity coming out with his handling of the players.
Kelly is here at least the next 2 years ,either trying to right the ship or getting fired . But I also believe the administration doesn't think that ND can compete with the Alabamas ,Ohio States, Clemsons every year and would be happy with winning seasons ,8-4, 9-3, , a 10-20 ranking ,occasionally breaking the top 10 .
I also wonder how much damage this negative press will affect our recruiting .
Peterson and Herman are very comfortable at Washington and Houston (probably joining the Big12 expansion)
I agree with most here that somewhere there are rising top flight young coaches .Somewhere.
Also ,I believe that Brian Kelly never wanted to be at ND for the long term anyway , but because of the collapse this season, pro teams who were once looking at B. Kelly are now having their reservations . And I don't think any high profile colleges would hire Kelly with all the negativity coming out with his handling of the players.
Kelly is here at least the next 2 years ,either trying to right the ship or getting fired . But I also believe the administration doesn't think that ND can compete with the Alabamas ,Ohio States, Clemsons every year and would be happy with winning seasons ,8-4, 9-3, , a 10-20 ranking ,occasionally breaking the top 10 .
I also wonder how much damage this negative press will affect our recruiting .
It is that belief and unsaid admission by the ND administration (including JS) that ND is not going to compete with the elite 8 or so and that the football program is backsliding a bit, that is the single most significant reason that Kelly will be at ND 2 more years. Play like a champion, yes, but know you are now 'The Middle'. Kelly is a middle of the pack H.C. who can most years get 7,8 wins.
It's over at ND unless or until the administration sees the $$$ dwindling and decides to open the flood gates and be the ND of the 20s-40s. Make no mistake ND is one of a few schools that could be elite if they were really behind the program.
How much. Influence do the big time alumni spenders have with the administration ? Dwindling revenues ? Also dwindling viewership on NBC perhaps forcing ND to join ACC ( 8 conference games plus USC, Navy, Stanford ,plus a mid major ) in football with its' national brand gone ? No Georgia, No Oklahoma , No Michigan or Michigan State. No Texas. no TCU or any other Big 12, Big 10, SEC teams on its' schedule ?
There has to be somebody or something that changes our future
There has to be somebody or something that changes our future
ND was built on subway alum support. Maybe fitting to die with it. Not sure but, hope you're wrong
Proof is right in front of us that the Football program is taking a back seat. The Football Stadium renovation is completely focused on Academic. "Smoke and Mirrors" from ND........Its over guys. 1998 was a long time ago...
we will find out how much influence the alumni really have in the next week or so. IF ND gets blown out by Stanford and Kelly is still the coach then we will know the Alumni do not run things. If he is fired then we will know that they at the very least have significant voice.
Wonder how much leverage the big time alumni donors have with the administration and athletic department ? . Kelly will be at ND unless the team totally collapses this year . Besides , I will repeat myself again on this post. No major college program would hire Kelly and the NFL teams like the Bears are moving past ,considering him . Stuck at ND .That wasn't his plan.
LOL... yea because he knew he was going to get fired. If I recall he just up and left and didn't say a word to anyone on the team.
If that was the case, we wouldn't be settling on a coach we did. I'm not saying that Kelly is a better coach, but he wasn't our first choice. Is no Lou Holtz, and he's not going to get the support any ministration that holds initially had before Whadsworth came along. The way that the administration handles certain students infractions, what it handled differently at all the schools, creates situations in our depth chart. That with a limited pool of students to choose from for football, severely restricts on ability to increase the depth on the football team that other schools can. Our coaching isn't top notch, because one can see how old the schools with lesser quality athletes beat us. I'm not saying Notre Dame should change, but we are not in school the coaches want to flock to.
ND is a clearly a top tier job but changing head coaches in college football is tricky because the timing works against a school from having a clear plan of succession. The timing of the bowls and playoffs, the beginning of in house visits for recruits and the recruit signing date (first Wed. In Feb.) all overlap each other. All the good coaches are working during that period of time. VT lucked out because Beamer agreed to retire before the season ended, and they were able to keep Bud Foster. On the other hand, LSU is in a state of flux. The interim coach wants the job (Ed O.) but the boosters seem to want a bigger name with HC experience.
ND is a national school with THE gold standard name recognition. It's biggest problem is having a deal with NBC. NBC is about as focused on the sport of college football as is the BBC. There is no feeder programming on NBC for your games. If ND had a deal with ESPN, you would be shocked how many ads of your football program would be blasted to sports fans watching sports on TV. ND leaders have this belief that being on free TV (i.e., not a cable channel) is better for its fans. I used to believe that too. But the world has changed. Sports fans all have cable. It took a while for FSU fans to accept the reality of the Four Letter gang in Bristol as we always hated the way they pumped up the SEC. But now that ESPN lost half its Big Ten contract to FOX, they have been really really nice to us and to the ACC in general. They already had College Gameday at UL and at CU. Never would have happened 5 years ago. You should see the way ESPN pumps up college football and lacrosse. With ND on ESPN, everyone would know your fight song (again).
As for your coach, that of course is your decision to make. But I doubt that ND struggles to find a quality candidate. Just don't think "outside the box" this time. I won't name names, but the school has been too cute by half a few times in the past.
ND is a national school with THE gold standard name recognition. It's biggest problem is having a deal with NBC. NBC is about as focused on the sport of college football as is the BBC. There is no feeder programming on NBC for your games. If ND had a deal with ESPN, you would be shocked how many ads of your football program would be blasted to sports fans watching sports on TV. ND leaders have this belief that being on free TV (i.e., not a cable channel) is better for its fans. I used to believe that too. But the world has changed. Sports fans all have cable. It took a while for FSU fans to accept the reality of the Four Letter gang in Bristol as we always hated the way they pumped up the SEC. But now that ESPN lost half its Big Ten contract to FOX, they have been really really nice to us and to the ACC in general. They already had College Gameday at UL and at CU. Never would have happened 5 years ago. You should see the way ESPN pumps up college football and lacrosse. With ND on ESPN, everyone would know your fight song (again).
As for your coach, that of course is your decision to make. But I doubt that ND struggles to find a quality candidate. Just don't think "outside the box" this time. I won't name names, but the school has been too cute by half a few times in the past.
Believe we would go for an up and coming relatively young coach at a mid-major . A lot of these mid major coaches started at big time programs under top not coaches . To prove themselves ,they go to these mid majors to turn football programs around , hoping to eventually land a head coaching job in one of the big 6 conferences.
Another possibility is to hire a defensive or offensive coordinator from a top 5-10 program , not sure about that .
No matter where the next coach comes from , ND like any other big time program will be a pressure cooker on day1.
Another possibility is to hire a defensive or offensive coordinator from a top 5-10 program , not sure about that .
No matter where the next coach comes from , ND like any other big time program will be a pressure cooker on day1.
