Dude, get your rocks off on someone else. You call me a simpleton then ok.
Jaylon Smith Wins
- Thread starter wicker
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Okay well your dismissive, sarcastic response when I took the time to write something legit was uncalled for. Don't expect someone to be all nice back. Baby.
ND has the best LB in the country and he was held back all year - what am I supposed to say? Am I supposed to agree with you that the Irish should be blitzing a walk-on LB instead of J.Smith? If BVG wants to be disruptive then do it with you best player IMO.
Do you guys think that maybe Jaylon was first, extremely valuable in coverage and second was the first key the opposing qb checked to see if Schmidt was in coverage? That could have factored into the planning, doncha think? Not trying to get in the middle here.
It really doesn't matter. We all sat back and watched ND's defense this year. Whether Jaylon blitzed or not is not my call...I just think he could have made a difference over Schmidt blitzing. Regardless, we will not be talking the two next year even if Jaylon comes back.
I think there are a number of possibilities as to why Smith didn't blitz more. As you said, I think value in pass coverage is reason #1. He was outstanding defending the screen game (Virginia, in particular).
Best LB in the country is subjective. Not everyone agrees with that. On top of that, best LB in what? Overall, speed, pass rushing, pass coverage? There are many skills to playing LB.
You don't simply blitz your best LB just because he's your best player. Its a team game. You wouldn't throw the ball or have the QB run the ball every time because he's your best player, right? There are multiple ways to attack the opposition.
Besides, who says that Smith is even good at blitzing? Its a skill just like tackling, pass coverage, or anything else. He may be a good linebacker, but that doesn't mean he's amazing at every possible linebacker skill.
As I said above, I happen to think he didn't blitz much because he was more valuable in pass coverage.
What exactly did I say that's delusional? Must be nice living in a world where you can't handle any contrarian opinions. Funny. I remember at the start of the year I posted about some defensive issues ND was having.
You kept saying how that means I must think I can do better than the ND coaches. All I was doing was pointing out issues and you kept on about how I must be smarter than the coaches. Talk about delusional and inability to comprehend. Now you're talking about how Jaylon isn't being utilized properly, but I actually make some counter points saying maybe he is.
Now you get all defensive and sarcastic. You need to learn how to not be an insecure little bitch you ****ing tw@t.
Honestly, I do not even remember what you are talking about. Maybe you confuse me with someone else or maybe you hang onto things that should be let go...IDK. Jaylon is said to have the quickest 7yds. in football - why he has only one sack this year is unexplainable to me. Nothing you or anyone else say can change my thoughts on this. Thanks for thinking so much of me that you carry a torch for months
Honestly, I do not even remember what you are talking about. Maybe you confuse me with someone else or maybe you hang onto things that should be let go...IDK. Jaylon is said to have the quickest 7yds. in football - why he has only one sack this year is unexplainable to me. Nothing you or anyone else say can change my thoughts on this. Thanks for thinking so much of me that you carry a torch for months
Its a simple memory. I remember lots of insignificant things, and its not like I have the converation inscribed on my bedpost.
I'm being peaceable now. Sacks don't tell the whole story. Manti Te'o, who I think was better than Smith, only had 1.5 sacks his senior year. He had 5 his junior year even though ND was a little more agressive (blitzing wise) towards the end of his senior year.
That's just the way it goes sometimes. There are a lot of reasons that a particular player may have a bunch of sacks or none at all. I happen to think that ND just wasn't a good defensive team.
Plus, a lot of sacks are a result of team play. If Jaylon comes clean and gets pressure because the offense blew the protection (happened a couple times vs. Texas), did he do a good job? Sure, but the sack/pressure was given to him by someone else's mistake. Same thing with a coverage sack. Or maybe a player gets the sack because someone forced the QB out of the pocket, the defender then pushes the QB out of bounds and gets a sack in the stat sheet.
Its just a somewhat irrelevant stat to use IMO.
Have a nice night.
I have to preface this comment with the fact I have never coached in football. That said, I cannot imagine having someone so talented and quick off the snap as Jaylon and just holding them back. I never liked or understood Okwara dropping into coverage either. ND had better talent but coaching neutralized them. Maybe coaches have to get 'cutesy' in the NFL and fake teams out but not in college. BVG is supposed to be an aggressive coach but I do not see it in games...take advantage of your talent and quit trying to out-think your opponentl
With the exception of the location of the hashmarks, the game is the same from middle school to NFL. Pretty close to the same rules everywhere. If anything, its easier to confuse middle school up to college kids playing offense because the coaching isn't as good, the players aren't as experienced, and there is less practice/study time. However, its also easier to confuse your own defense. That's the trade-off and why the game comes down to execution.
As far as Jaylon's speed off the edge, there's always a trade-off. What happens then in coverage? You're more likely to have someone like Schmidt covering someone or having to beat linemen to get to the pass catcher -- which considering how often ND blitzes, they probably saw more screen passes than your typical defense. I'd rather have Smith in coverage than Schmidt for sure.
Even still, there's more to pass rushing than just good acceleration/speed -- understanding of one's job, different pass rush moves. Perhaps the coaches weren't comfortable having Smith blitz? They did blitz him more towards the end of the season if I recall correctly too.
Also, on Okwara dropping into coverage. That's a pretty standard thing that most teams do. Its called a zone blitz. You know BJ Raji, the guy that's like 340 lbs? He scored a touchdown on a pick six in the NFC championship off of a zone blitz.
Even under ultra-conservative Diaco, guys like Fleming, who almost always rushed the passer, dropped into coverage at times. Its not being cute, its standard football.
Good talk.
Well, I am just a simpleton who wants to give a QB 2 secs to make a decision rather than 7 secs. You are much more sophisticated and understand that it's a lot better to give a QB more time and confuse him by taking your playmakers out of the equation. Thanks for schooling me.
Yes...why I put Lambert that high was his ability against the pass. He might have been the best inside/middle line backer of all time against the pass...and was very tough against the run too.
I love people who think they know....but don't have a god damn clue how to play the position which makes you twice as ignorant.
I'm still laughing at your fast flow excuse why Jaylon ran half way across the earth chasing a running back who didn't have the football from a zone read.
Oh that's right....you said don't worry about it Jaylon...just take off blindly and if the qb keeps it we will give him about 15 yards to where our safeties will be.
NOBODY teaches line backer play like that unless they hope to be fired immediately.
Still laughing...thank you for bringing that play back up.
It was still largely a running league when Lambert played. Just so you know Lambert didn't start at linebacker in college until Youngstown States' starter left to be a roadie for the Rolling Stones. Jack Ham and Andy Russell were better players imho.
Agreed. Nobis was the best I saw until LT came to the NFL. But I also remember another of the best ever in one Ted Hendricks "The Mad Stork". He was so good, they let him play Monster - a position he basically created based on instincts to where the ball was going to go and everyone else play their responsibilities. LT was the only other LB I saw have that freedom. He was just fast enough and strong enough to beat his match-up on any play and still get to the ball. Mike Curtis was another MLB that was pretty good. Smaller for MLB but as tough as any.
If I'm starting a defense and can pick anybody, I'm picking the 3 levels and starting with Lawrence Taylor, then Ronnie Lott, then either Randy White or Merlin Olsen with Howie Long getting honorable mention.
White was more disruptive Olsen was steadier but at an extremely high level he also benefitted by playing next to Deacon Jones. as opposed to Ed Jones for White[smile]the other linebackers you mentioned were also in my mind. I think Mike Curtis[an old Dukie I think] played outside ? His tackle on the on the fan and his comments afterwards were priceless. If you're going in that direction Nick Buonoconti enters the conversation. Lott /Blount and Willie Wood are candidates at the third level.imho
Haha I forgot about that until you mentioned Curtis nailing that fan. Bill Bergey from Philly was another that was very good. That freak from the Ravens was good but loses big points for murder? I think. Wife beater too? Anyway shouldn't even give that idiot a mention.
Yes, many good front 4's back in the day. Fearsome Foursome, Purple People Eaters, Steele Curtain...many helped the individual stars to be able to shine for sure.
#1 Lambert played at Kent State
#2 what kind of ridiculous statement is to say they didn't throw much so we diminish that . If you are the best middle linebacker in pass coverage ...they might have thrown the ball 18-22 attempts per game then but there were 27 other middle line backers during his career who were not as good against the pass as he was. He was better than the greats who played before him against the pass. Given he was above average against the run, had the attitude, the look, etc....I rank him #2 of all time.
Going by the example you state, would be like suggesting Joe Montana was not as good as Drew Brees, Manning, Favre, etc..etc. Because back then he didn't throw it as much as those guys listed.
Jack Ham was the best outside linebacker ever. This one is not really close to debate. (I'm not talking about 3-4 ) outside backers that rush every play (LT)...
I'm talking about stay at home contain make the tackle on the Ryde linebacker.
Ham was so smart first of all...secondly as was he the sure tackler..as defensive players were then who came under a prime Joe Paterno.
The Andy Russell I knew wore his heart on his sleeve. Everyone loved Andy. Andy was a very solid, good player. He wasn't on the same level as Lambert and Ham on that defense. Again not that Andy was bad, those other two were just that good.
It is a unique debate to have because of the different eras.
Butkus, Nitschke, Mike Curtis, ...all could play on my team...Spielman was a tackling machine.
As well as Doleman, Jackson, Taylor...Hendricks, the whole front Nine of the 85 Bears...
Could I also have the college only version of Hugh Green? Whoa.......
Rosey Grier,/Roger Brown Lamar Lundy,Merlin Olsen and David "Deacon" Jones were the second "Fearsome foursome" Extra points if you can name the first one.[smile]
Sorry I tend to get those MAC teams confused, I had two college teammates who played on that team with Lambert that's where I got the story. And yes He had the look I question the substance behind the hype. He frequently appeared to me to be standing over a running back or receiver running his mouth after a couple of his teammates had already made the play. Just my opinion of course but I've held it for 35 plus years so ridiculous or not that's my story and I'm sticking to it.[smile]
Hmmm...I was gonna mention Jack Youngblood to his Merlin Olsen, but, may be before my time on the original? Oh, and that DE that went to Hollywood soon after his NFL career...forgetting his name too...Fred Dryer! That was the one.
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Fred Dryer.
Jim Katcavage, Dick Modzeleski Rosey Grier and Andy Robustelli
Anyone here remember those NFL sticker books Sunoco put out in '72? I would walk 2 miles with my friends every single day to a Sunoco Station that would give us those stamps. We had to walk by one station to get there because they wouldn't give us the stamps unless we made a purchase. I filled one book and my brother filled two. Man, those were the days
