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First Ranking In

Top 10 (maybe top 5?? 7???) with wins the next two weeks. Irish control their own destiny. 11-1 with wins at MSU, Miami and Stanford... how could they be left out?
 
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Top 10 (maybe top 5?? 7???) with wins the next two weeks. Irish control their own destiny. 11-1 with wins at MSU, Miami and Stanford... how could they be left out?
Washington state is not better than us
 
Oklahoma state best win is Texas tech. We have better wins and a better loss. Clemson is close to a push on wins but a terrible loss that makes up for maybe a slight edge in their wins. Oklahoma has a better win right now but a week 6 loss to a terrible Iowa state team should put them below us. I'll take our sparty road win and week two 1 pt loss to Georgia all day over their Ohio state early win and mid season iowa state loss. Our wins and loss is better then USC best win and loss. Are résumé smokes washingtons, not even close. Am I crazy to be frustrated we do not come in at 9 this week? I know if we win out things will take care of itself. Where do you guys honestly think we should come in ranked at this week?
 
Top 10 (maybe top 5?? 7???) with wins the next two weeks. Irish control their own destiny. 11-1 with wins at MSU, Miami and Stanford... how could they be left out?
They could if there are four undefeated teams left.
TCU, Bama, Penn State, .....
Or three undefeated and a one loss Clemson team who wins the ACC
 
Clemson will not go ahead of us if we both win out. That loss was aweful to syracuse. 3-3.
 
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Clemson will not go ahead of us if we both win out. That loss was aweful to syracuse. 3-3.

Remember Clemson gets an extra game, so does the BIG and Big 12. I'm not advocating joining a conference, just saying.
 
Will not matter if we win out. They lost to Syracuse for god sake. Only way that happens if UGA goea 7-5. But it's still a long season.
 
Coaches poll is strange. They basically do not jump teams it seems. You get your ranking based on last year and you lose your ranking based on losses. There is no SOS.

ND based on its schedule and record should be ahead of Michigan and Washington. Probably a few others.

Based on the SOS, record and type of loss feels like we should be in the 9-11 range.

If we beat USC ND moves well into the top 10. I'd guess 8
 
If our schedule is stronger then a team from those conf. With a extra game it shouldn't matter. Just about all the teams that play that extra game have a 1aa team or terrible non power five team on the schedule which should negate that extra game in my opinion. The way our schedule is set up every year if we go 11-1 we will have beat either the number one or number 2 ranked team in PAC 10 acc most likely and sec or big in the years we play Ohio state Michigan and Georgia.
 
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I think it comes down to we have to win games that matter. If we lose to USC and the other ranked teams, finishing 8 and 4 then it's exactly what people expect. Sparty is our only respectable win. Have to start winning some big games to get respect.
 
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Remember Clemson gets an extra game, so does the BIG and Big 12. I'm not advocating joining a conference, just saying.
Ohio St. didn't get to play an extra game last year and they got into the playoff ahead of the conference winning team that played an extra game and actually beat them head to head. The playoff committee has made it clear - the extra game conference champions win can be important but it is NOT the most important thing they look at and it is much further down their list of criteria than most people think.
 
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Clemson will not go ahead of us if we both win out. That loss was aweful to syracuse. 3-3.
That's ridiculous.

Middle of season loss that was very close.

28-24.

Remember this is NOT 1977 NCAA 115 scholarships any longer. The gap between the really good and the really average is not that far.

28-24 loss is not that bad...

Moreover if Clemson the defending champ wins out and that's their only blemish we will NOT get in over them.

Having said that will TCU and Penn State, and Bama all go undefeated? Very unlikely in most years is there more than one undefeated let alone two...and three??? No.

But BK's luck would be that we win out and the very scenario I stated plays out. Like of all years that three undefeated teams unlikely of happening would happen and keep us out. Ha ha


I would like to see us get in no matter what.

All we can do is win out, and put it in the football god's hands. Starting with USC.

Notre Dame has not played against so many future Sunday players as they will this Saturday.

USC right now is a cluster **** but they're ridiculously talented.

Beat Tro JAN and we'll go from there.

One game at a time.
 
USC is not ridiculously talented in my opinion. Alabama is. Alabama beat USC 52 to 6 last year without breaking a sweat. Georgia also has more talent than USC. Just my opinion,.

*** I think Clemson will lose at least once more as they still have to play Georgia Tech, at North Carolina State, Florida State, South Carolina and maybe the ACC championship. They are not the same Clemson of the last couple of years---they lost a lot of top players to the NFL. They should be great next year maybe. Their QB is really banged up too.

*** Penn State should lose two more games--They play Michigan, at Ohio State, and at Michigan State for the next three games. And if they get through that they get to play in the Big ten Championship. I think Wisconsin or Ohio State will win the big ten.

*** I really believe the extra game the conference use for their Championship helps the Irish as it gives another top team a loss-- I think I am the only person that thinks that.

11 and 1 and the Irish get in IMO. There is so much time left in the season for teams to get upset or lose due to tougher schedules.

*** Like 88 says one game at a time. Beat USC !
 
USC is not ridiculously talented in my opinion. Alabama is. Alabama beat USC 52 to 6 last year without breaking a sweat. Georgia also has more talent than USC. Just my opinion,.

*** I think Clemson will lose at least once more as they still have to play Georgia Tech, at North Carolina State, Florida State, South Carolina and maybe the ACC championship. They are not the same Clemson of the last couple of years---they lost a lot of top players to the NFL. They should be great next year maybe. Their QB is really banged up too.

*** Penn State should lose two more games--They play Michigan, at Ohio State, and at Michigan State for the next three games. And if they get through that they get to play in the Big ten Championship. I think Wisconsin or Ohio State will win the big ten.

*** I really believe the extra game the conference use for their Championship helps the Irish as it gives another top team a loss-- I think I am the only person that thinks that.

11 and 1 and the Irish get in IMO. There is so much time left in the season for teams to get upset or lose due to tougher schedules.

*** Like 88 says one game at a time. Beat USC !
I agree with everything minus the talent part.
If you were talking best coached good talent then Bama has that locked up with Clemson coming in a very close second along with Ohio State.

On sheer talent alone and playing on Sunday in the future USC is right there with anyone. They are just in disarray at times. Perhaps they're very much like our teams have been under Kelly for much of his tenure. Plenty of Sunday level talent but no coaching.
 
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I agree with everything minus the talent part.
If you were talking best coached good talent then Bama has that locked up with Clemson coming in a very close second along with Ohio State.

On sheer talent alone and playing on Sunday in the future USC is right there with anyone. They are just in disarray at times. Perhaps they're very much like our teams have been under Kelly for much of his tenure. Plenty of Sunday level talent but no coaching.

You got me worried now ! But thanks for the info.
 
Ohio St. didn't get to play an extra game last year and they got into the playoff ahead of the conference winning team that played an extra game and actually beat them head to head. The playoff committee has made it clear - the extra game conference champions win can be important but it is NOT the most important thing they look at and it is much further down their list of criteria than most people think.

It is pretty easy to judge between and 11-1 and 12-2 from the same conference wo have a lot of common opponents. But that doesn't really apply in most ND scenarios.
 
USC is not ridiculously talented in my opinion. Alabama is. Alabama beat USC 52 to 6 last year without breaking a sweat. Georgia also has more talent than USC. Just my opinion,.

*** I think Clemson will lose at least once more as they still have to play Georgia Tech, at North Carolina State, Florida State, South Carolina and maybe the ACC championship. They are not the same Clemson of the last couple of years---they lost a lot of top players to the NFL. They should be great next year maybe. Their QB is really banged up too.

*** Penn State should lose two more games--They play Michigan, at Ohio State, and at Michigan State for the next three games. And if they get through that they get to play in the Big ten Championship. I think Wisconsin or Ohio State will win the big ten.

*** I really believe the extra game the conference use for their Championship helps the Irish as it gives another top team a loss-- I think I am the only person that thinks that.

11 and 1 and the Irish get in IMO. There is so much time left in the season for teams to get upset or lose due to tougher schedules.

*** Like 88 says one game at a time. Beat USC !
Dilly! Dilly!
 
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It is pretty easy to judge between and 11-1 and 12-2 from the same conference wo have a lot of common opponents. But that doesn't really apply in most ND scenarios.
The point of my post wasn't to judge whether or not the committee made the right decision regarding two teams in the same conference. I was rebutting the false notion that playing an extra game is something the playoff committee values highly. They don't. It can help but, according to their own rules, they aren't even supposed to look at conference championships unless they need to break a tie between two highly regarded teams. If there's no tie they don't look at it.

And as far as your premise that's it's easier to judge teams within the same conference I'd say it's the opposite. ND plays a national schedule every year against teams in at least 3 different power 5 conferences and often 4 as they are this year. After playing such a tough diverse schedule it's much easier to judge them than it is to judge teams that only play 1 non-conference power 5 team or some that don't play any. Even if it's easy for the committee to say, "we think we know who the best team is in the Big 10" that fact doesn't necessarily say anything about how they view a particular team. Again, playing an extra game and winning a conference championship can help, but it isn't the first thing the committee looks at. Historically, they have viewed strength of schedule and strength of record much higher than winning a conference and those two criteria favor ND.
 
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The point of my post wasn't to judge whether or not the committee made the right decision regarding two teams in the same conference. I was rebutting the false notion that playing an extra game is something the playoff committee values highly. They don't. It can help but, according to their own rules, they aren't even supposed to look at conference championships unless they need to break a tie between two highly regarded teams. If there's no tie they don't look at it.

And as far as your premise that's it's easier to judge teams within the same conference I'd say it's the opposite. ND plays a national schedule every year against teams in at least 3 different power 5 conferences and often 4 as they are this year. After playing such a tough diverse schedule it's much easier to judge them than it is to judge teams that only play 1 non-conference power 5 team or some that don't play any. Even if it's easy for the committee to say, "we think we know who the best team is in the Big 10" that fact doesn't necessarily say anything about how they view a particular team. Again, playing an extra game and winning a conference championship can help, but it isn't the first thing the committee looks at. Historically, they have viewed strength of schedule and strength of record much higher than winning a conference and those two criteria favor ND.

It's not even a tie. If the teams are at all similar then they look at conference championship etc.

I wasn't saying ND vs Washington is easier to judge than PSU and Washington. It's PSU vs Ohio that was relatively easy to adjudicate.

And since ND won't be unequivocally better than anyone except an unlikely Sparty, they will most assuredly give the champion a pass. There is really no other reason why the phrase "conference championship" appeared from the get go.
 
It's not even a tie. If the teams are at all similar then they look at conference championship etc.

I wasn't saying ND vs Washington is easier to judge than PSU and Washington. It's PSU vs Ohio that was relatively easy to adjudicate.

And since ND won't be unequivocally better than anyone except an unlikely Sparty, they will most assuredly give the champion a pass. There is really no other reason why the phrase "conference championship" appeared from the get go.
Well then, I guess this really comes down to whether or not the committee finds it easy to view two non-conference affiliated teams as being similar (the actual term they use is "comparable"). In other words, because the term "comparable" can be very subjective we might guess that the committee has often viewed two highly regarded power 5 teams with similar records as being comparable which makes it easier for them to always look at conference championships as a determining factor but that hasn't been the case. When Baylor was at their peak and dominating everyone in the Big 12 the committee consistently ranked them lower than the rest of the sports world specifically because their strength of schedule was extremely weak. They didn't view Baylor as being comparable to some of the other teams that were highly regarded. And more to the point, in 2015 for the first few weeks of the playoff committee's rankings a 1-loss ND team was ranked ahead of several undefeated power 5 teams and other highly regarded 1-loss power 5 teams. When asked why, the committee chair cited ND's strength of schedule and declared ND was "solidly" ahead of those other teams. They didn't see ND as being comparable to them. They viewed us as being significantly better. It wasn't until we had a very poor showing against BC that the committee decided to drop us in the rankings, and the committee cited that poor showing as the primary reason for the drop.

So far the playoff committee has not done anything to suggest that it will default to conference championships to determine the 4 best teams. Their rankings history has shown that they value strength of schedule and strength of record more. They do not view highly regarded teams as being similar or comparable as often as most people think. Of course, sometimes they do, but they've made enough significant distinctions to conclude that they try not to take the easy way out to determine their rankings.
 
That's ridiculous.

Middle of season loss that was very close.

28-24.

Remember this is NOT 1977 NCAA 115 scholarships any longer. The gap between the really good and the really average is not that far.

28-24 loss is not that bad...

Moreover if Clemson the defending champ wins out and that's their only blemish we will NOT get in over them.

Having said that will TCU and Penn State, and Bama all go undefeated? Very unlikely in most years is there more than one undefeated let alone two...and three??? No.

But BK's luck would be that we win out and the very scenario I stated plays out. Like of all years that three undefeated teams unlikely of happening would happen and keep us out. Ha ha


I would like to see us get in no matter what.

All we can do is win out, and put it in the football god's hands. Starting with USC.

Notre Dame has not played against so many future Sunday players as they will this Saturday.

USC right now is a cluster **** but they're ridiculously talented.

Beat Tro JAN and we'll go from there.

One game at a time.

There is no way, ND plays that schedule, wins out, and Clemson gets the nod over them. You can take that to the bank and bet your house on it. Clemson lost to a 3-3 team. ND lost by 1 point to #2. If it comes down to an 11-1 ND with a loss to GA and a 11-1 Clemson with a loss to Syracuse and a schedule somewhere in the 40th vs ND's top 10 its just not going to happen. Agree with your point that you have to win out. That's kind of the premise of the quote. ND will have more than likely beaten one top team from every conference minus the SEC. You can already see and hear the talking heads saying all goes through ND at this point. Its a HUGE if....9-3 would be an amazing turn around with that schedule but the committee will reward that schedule at 11-1.
 
There is no way, ND plays that schedule, wins out, and Clemson gets the nod over them. You can take that to the bank and bet your house on it. Clemson lost to a 3-3 team. ND lost by 1 point to #2. If it comes down to an 11-1 ND with a loss to GA and a 11-1 Clemson with a loss to Syracuse and a schedule somewhere in the 40th vs ND's top 10 its just not going to happen. Agree with your point that you have to win out. That's kind of the premise of the quote. ND will have more than likely beaten one top team from every conference minus the SEC. You can already see and hear the talking heads saying all goes through ND at this point. Its a HUGE if....9-3 would be an amazing turn around with that schedule but the committee will reward that schedule at 11-1.
Well they wouldn't be 11-1 Clemson would be 12-1 if in for consideration for a playoff spot.
They have a conference championship game and are the returning champs.

I wouldn't bet anything on us getting picked over them in that scenario.
 
Clemson will not go ahead of us if we both win out. That loss was aweful to syracuse. 3-3.
If they both win out, Clemson will be in the playoffs for sure. They will win the ACC if they win out. Now ND would be there too.
 
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