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Amazing how many people on here blame BVG

difference is that OSU tackled better than ND. When ND hit someone they still got an extra 2-4 yard after contact. When we where hit we went down right away or were driven back. You cant blame that on injuries thats all coaching or lack of it

Yes! Yes! Yes! Coaching.....and strength and conditioning. So what is Longo doing? or are all those tOS lineman using steroids as part of their weight training?
 
I honestly hope they just fire the guy now so some of you people can cry next season when things get worse. He just coached against one of the best teams in college football with half his defense injured/suspended and you expect miracles! Oh and the lack of offense didn't exactly help the defense out did it?

Lack of talent, lack of depth, and injuries have killed this team since he started coaching but some on here think someone else could have done better, just ignorance. Stop looking at the coaches and get realistic about the players we have on defense so you can not complain when the next defensive coordinator fails. Obviously if someone new comes in they will automatically do better with a healthy team but I am sure that will be overlooked and it still won't be a major difference.

We aren't Alabama, we don't have that type of talent and unless you start understanding that then you will never be happy. Just look at our "top" targets like Pride and Studstill, they aren't ranked high at all yet we consider them "top" targets. Meanwhile go back and watch Bama's thrashing of Sparty and they had two 5* freshmen studs at corner starting. On top of that they have a defensive line that not only stuffs the run but more importantly gets pressure on the QB, something we haven't had for a while. It isn't only Bama because you can also look at Ohio st. and see the same thing or just go down the line of the top teams that have shots at the national title each year. Here is a serious question Blue and Gold mentioned a few weeks back and it says a lot... when was the last time we had a major defensive player get drafted in the NFL and made an impact? The only one I can think of is Justin Tuck which was a long time back. Obviously some kids will be really solid college players and not do well in the NFL, which would be great, but we rarely get those special athletes anymore that you know will be destined for greatness at either level... Jaylon being the newest and I hope he heals well so he can have a long career in the NFL.

Besides the lack of big recruits people forget about the transfers/suspensions that have hurt our depth the past 4-5 years. You can't build a solid defense when kids are getting hurt and you have no talent behind them. Hey I love Joe but on how many major programs would he be starting? He played decent before getting hurt but this entire season you could see he lost speed and strength yet we had nobody to step in and take over.

Hey maybe a new coach will change the scheme and the assistants can be better overall, I would be very happy if that happens, but I don't see much changing if the talent and depth don't get better. The schedule is stronger next season and if the offense isn't playing at a higher level then we could lose 3-4 games based on our defensive outlook. I do think the offense has to get better with the added playing time, mainly at QB, and that could decide whether we are an 8, 9, or 10 win team. Offensive line will be best position so there shouldn't be excuses for the running game or pass protection, one would assume, but not sure who will be catching passes when Fuller leaves.

Oh well, it was a good season in my opinion and I honestly didn't think we would have 10 wins. We played well against Clemson and Stanford, both solid teams, but today the injuries were too much against a better team. If you have followed ND your entire life then maybe you are like me and understand we aren't the same program we were in the past and college football has changed a lot in terms of diversity. ND now recruits against more programs and with the restrictions we already have it is extremely difficult. On top of that we have to deal with other factors like location, weather, the ND lifestyle, etc... I think we can still get enough talent to make runs at a title, like 2012, but other than that one year it has been rough since the Holtz era. I seriously can't recall the last time we played a top ranked team and thought we had an honest shot at destroying that team, can you? I think this speaks a lot about the players we have these days on our team.

How do you reconcile this quote along with the fact that Schmidt remained on the field as he was the only guy that understood the reads....? Understand this too, Max received some of the best HS coaching in the country. Legendary Mission Viejo Coach Bob Johnson put not 1 but 2 sons into the NFL as quarterbacks. He and his 2 sons coached Max his whole HS career and adore the young man. In addition, their staff regularly has other former NFL talent.

"An eloquent and confident speaker, Redfield has carried 18-credit academic course loads at Notre Dame per semester, most notably learning Mandarin Chinese. When asked whether VanGorder's defense or Chinese was more difficult, he paused."

"That's a pretty good question," he responded. "I would say consistently being successful in that scheme is harder than learning Chinese."

That's disheartening and an indictment of bvg's scheme.

PS We were # 92 in interceptions and # 114 in fumbles gained. In a sport where turnovers and special teams figure strongly into outcomes that totally blows.

The scheme sucks.

It falls on kelly to fix it....

https://notredame.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1791147

http://www.cfbstats.com/2015/leader/national/team/offense/split01/category12/sort05.html
 
How do you reconcile this quote along with the fact that Schmidt remained on the field as he was the only guy that understood the reads....? Understand this too, Max received some of the best HS coaching in the country. Legendary Mission Viejo Coach Bob Johnson put not 1 but 2 sons into the NFL as quarterbacks. He and his 2 sons coached Max his whole HS career and adore the young man. In addition, their staff regularly has other former NFL talent.

"An eloquent and confident speaker, Redfield has carried 18-credit academic course loads at Notre Dame per semester, most notably learning Mandarin Chinese. When asked whether VanGorder's defense or Chinese was more difficult, he paused."

"That's a pretty good question," he responded. "I would say consistently being successful in that scheme is harder than learning Chinese."

That's disheartening and an indictment of bvg's scheme.

PS We were # 92 in interceptions and # 114 in fumbles gained. In a sport where turnovers and special teams figure strongly into outcomes that totally blows.

The scheme sucks.

It falls on kelly to fix it....

https://notredame.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1791147

http://www.cfbstats.com/2015/leader/national/team/offense/split01/category12/sort05.html
Maybe Redfield could pick up the defense if he got to the meetings on time.
 
Face it the game was decided when Kelly sent 2 def starters home and Ohst started Elliott. Morals and winning football games dont mix. Why do you think the $EC is the best conf in in college football?
 
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Joker.. How could things get any worse by firing BVG? Lack of talent is such a shi8y excuse.. Inability to use talent that we have is the problem.
I have not heard one recruitstate that BVG is why they want to come to ND . Most talk about Denson,Lyght
So Todd Lyght and the other coaches should be fired as well correct? I mean if you think "objectively" BVG isn't coaching every player and considering our secondary is the worst position on the team shouldn't he be blamed? How about the defensive line and strength and conditioning coaches? We have key players at every position not developing so should we only blame one person now?

Hey I am not saying BVG is the ultimate answer because I honestly have no idea considering what he has dealt with. At the same time it gets old seeing posts on this board blaming him for everything and people not being realistic about our injuries and talent level. I personally like his schemes but maybe they are too difficult for the players at ND so if that is the case then he should be let go along with the entire defensive staff. I will just be interested to see how the same critics act next season if things don't drastically improve because I don't see us having a better defense and our schedule is tougher. I hope I am wrong but it isn't as if we have had dominating defenses at ND since our last national championship, unless I missed something? Actually you can even go back farther to the 70's and probably count the number of top 10 defenses our program has had on one hand.

Lots of questions on both sides of the ball for 2016... hoping for the best but always try and be realistic when it comes to ND.
Most recruits talk highly of lyght,Denson and Denbrock.Haven't heard of any saying BVG is the reason for choosing ND. Gilmore has better sway . I like him for enthusiasm but if I were grading him,a C- is best I can give his coaching abilities.
 
Again, care to elaborate about Obama? Who was accountable for the trumped up charges of weapons of mass destruction in Iraq that led to an unpaid for war and and spawned ISIS. Who was accountable for the widespread fraud that spilled over from Wall Street and collapsed the economy? Who is accountable for the refusal to compromise on any issue facing the country?

I chuckled back in November 2008 when I saw a bumper sticker on a car saying "it's Obama's problem now," but I never would have imagined how blaming him for everything from the common cold to the Mets' loss in the World Series would become such an effective political strategy.
Right on , brother !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
P
HDK you are so right about you comments . When Obama took office the Dow jones was at 6000 today it nearly 18000 and the price of gas was 4 dollars it's now less than 2 and unemployment has falling to 5 percent from 10 . Even the deficit has been cut in half with government spending as a percent of GDP has also cut in half . Iran has removed 75 tons of enriched uranium and he killed Osma Ben Laden
Who Bush thought was irrelivent . People who watch Fox News need to be reeducate on what the facts are
When Obama took office the Dow was at 7,949 not 6,000.
When Obama took office the price of gas was $1.89 not $4.00.
When Obama took office Unemploy rate was 7.9% not 10%.
When Obama took office the Deficit was $10.6 trillion. It will reach $20 trillion by the time he leaves office.
Obama golfed his 269th round of golf this past weekend in Hawaii while Rome burns.
Those are called facts. Try using them next time you want to argue a point.
 
P

When Obama took office the Dow was at 7,949 not 6,000.
When Obama took office the price of gas was $1.89 not $4.00.
When Obama took office Unemploy rate was 7.9% not 10%.
When Obama took office the Deficit was $10.6 trillion. It will reach $20 trillion by the time he leaves office.
Obama golfed his 269th round of golf this past weekend in Hawaii while Rome burns.
Those are called facts. Try using them next time you want to argue a point.

if folks do not like that we entered a war in iraq that is fine. Lets agree to this the removal and inaction of troops in iraq has created the isis state. the on slaughter of muslims in europe and elsewhere. ... more people have dropped out of the economy and less business have started . Obama care is not a benefit but a blight. side note I was very underemployed and looked into obama care. For me the price would be about 750 per month and my wife to that its 1500 a month. if i paid for that I could not pay my mortgage. all these up and coming lefties do not have a clue. worse economy no health care , the most dangerous time in years.
 
if folks do not like that we entered a war in iraq that is fine. Lets agree to this the removal and inaction of troops in iraq has created the isis state. the on slaughter of muslims in europe and elsewhere. ... more people have dropped out of the economy and less business have started . Obama care is not a benefit but a blight. side note I was very underemployed and looked into obama care. For me the price would be about 750 per month and my wife to that its 1500 a month. if i paid for that I could not pay my mortgage. all these up and coming lefties do not have a clue. worse economy no health care , the most dangerous time in years.

Stay tough zona and keep slugging.
 
Again, care to elaborate about Obama? Who was accountable for the trumped up charges of weapons of mass destruction in Iraq that led to an unpaid for war and and spawned ISIS. Who was accountable for the widespread fraud that spilled over from Wall Street and collapsed the economy? Who is accountable for the refusal to compromise on any issue facing the country?

I chuckled back in November 2008 when I saw a bumper sticker on a car saying "it's Obama's problem now," but I never would have imagined how blaming him for everything from the common cold to the Mets' loss in the World Series would become such an effective political strategy.

I'd care to elaborate.
First off, Hilary Clinton voted to authorize the war in Iraq.
Her husband sat on his ass for eight years and got blow jobs while Bin laden and the rest of his murderers attacked us on many fronts including NY, Tanzania, Saudi Arabia, Kenya. the USS Cole. He had many chances to take Bin Laden out and didn't. His failures to address Radica Islam's repeated attacks on our country led to the death of 60 of my co workers and 3,000 others on 9/11.

The spawning of ISIS that you refer to shows your lack of understanding of global terrorism that has been in place LONG before our feckless president took office. Al Queda, the Taliban, the Muslim Brotherhood. ISIS (sorry ISIL) Boko Harram, Islamic Revolutionary Guard. call it whatever the **** you want. Radical Islamic terrorism exists, whether Obama wants to acknowledge it or not. They hate everything we stand for as a country and want to kill us all, even idealogs like you who have their heads buried in the sand. I guess I have a different view from the 84th floor of the the South Tower.

Try watching a channel other than MSNBC or Al Jazerra.

The widespread fraud that collapsed the economy was a result of the collapse of the housing market that started 20 years earlier with Barney Frank and his band of brothers in congress who mandated that EVERYONE has a right to own a home. I have no time to explain it to you. There are many books. Try to steer clear of the Rachel Maddow best sellers list.

A little knowledge is dangerous.
 
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if folks do not like that we entered a war in iraq that is fine. Lets agree to this the removal and inaction of troops in iraq has created the isis state. the on slaughter of muslims in europe and elsewhere. ... more people have dropped out of the economy and less business have started . Obama care is not a benefit but a blight. side note I was very underemployed and looked into obama care. For me the price would be about 750 per month and my wife to that its 1500 a month. if i paid for that I could not pay my mortgage. all these up and coming lefties do not have a clue. worse economy no health care , the most dangerous time in years.
Obama care is better than the Repl plan of no plan at all. What exactly have the Repls done the last 8 years for the country other than repeal gun laws?
 
College fan...you miss my point. BVG owns The scheme and defensive philosophy, not the position coaches. You might want to go to the Buffalo newspaper Dec 24th edition online and read an article discussing Polians view of Rex Ryan's defense, which is similar in complexity to BVG's. I linked it last week here. Polian was not dissing Ryan, but pointing out how difficult it was for the professional players to run his system, and a train wreck unless the complexities were mastered by many. Just of the opinion that BVG's scheme and system is too complex for student athletes, and that BVG's skill set is better suited for the NFL. I would probably be more optimistic about the impact of playing a season with most of our players healthy, except for the fact that Joe Schmidt was considered irreplaceable because only he understands the scheme and how to line folks up, and NO ONE was developed to carry this responsibility next year. We can agree to disagree.

Like I said, if his scheme's are too complicated for young kids then he shouldn't be coaching ND. At the same time if he were at Bama I have a feeling they wouldn't have as much of an issue. This of course goes back to my points about not having so many injuries and mainly the talent we have. It seems many on this board have the ridiculous notion our players are on the same level as programs like Bama which is not the truth. Yes we have players who would start on any team in the country, both sides of the ball, but top to bottom and depth wise it isn't that close to top programs.

I made a point before asking when we had a dominate player end up with a great NFL career and the only person I could think of was Justin Tuck. Again if players can be great at ND and not have those types of NFL careers I am fine with it as I know most would be. Still the Blue and Gold article about Jaylon, prior to his injury, made great points concerning the lack of top draft picks and how these recruits look at NFL players thinking, 'that is what I want.' Maybe it won't be the deciding factor for all kids choosing a college but even if it brings us 3-4 solid players that makes a difference.

Regardless of what happens I know we both want what is best for this program. Let's hope whoever is coaching, I mean on offense and defense, things change for the better because if not we will not have a legitimate shot at another title. It is hard for many to accept this but it really is the truth about our team.
 
Like I said, if his scheme's are too complicated for young kids then he shouldn't be coaching ND. At the same time if he were at Bama I have a feeling they wouldn't have as much of an issue. This of course goes back to my points about not having so many injuries and mainly the talent we have. It seems many on this board have the ridiculous notion our players are on the same level as programs like Bama which is not the truth. Yes we have players who would start on any team in the country, both sides of the ball, but top to bottom and depth wise it isn't that close to top programs.

I made a point before asking when we had a dominate player end up with a great NFL career and the only person I could think of was Justin Tuck. Again if players can be great at ND and not have those types of NFL careers I am fine with it as I know most would be. Still the Blue and Gold article about Jaylon, prior to his injury, made great points concerning the lack of top draft picks and how these recruits look at NFL players thinking, 'that is what I want.' Maybe it won't be the deciding factor for all kids choosing a college but even if it brings us 3-4 solid players that makes a difference.

Regardless of what happens I know we both want what is best for this program. Let's hope whoever is coaching, I mean on offense and defense, things change for the better because if not we will not have a legitimate shot at another title. It is hard for many to accept this but it really is the truth about our team.
Bama would have more of a problem. Their players mostly leave after 3 years. Not enough time in the system. He needs 5 yr contract guys with plenty of time to practice and study film.
 
Bama would have more of a problem. Their players mostly leave after 3 years. Not enough time in the system. He needs 5 yr contract guys with plenty of time to practice and study film.

My point was more about their talent compared to ours and considering they keep losing players to the NFL every 3 years it is basically hard to argue.
 
My point was more about their talent compared to ours and considering they keep losing players to the NFL every 3 years it is basically hard to argue.

ot... 'bama is monstrous. Did you catch the jumbo package they deployed?
They put 2 d linemen in the backfield with Henry....close to 900 pounds of violence with a head start. msu didn't stop it....
 
Obama care is better than the Repl plan of no plan at all. What exactly have the Repls done the last 8 years for the country other than repeal gun laws?
NoCal, Did you vote for Nancy Pelosi too?
The ACA is nothing more than a redistribution of wealth. It was forced upon the American public despite a majority of Americans being against it. Obama lied when he said you could keep your doctor.
He lied when he said your premiums wouldn't go up. He lied when he talked about the long term costs of ACA.
The administration hired a man, Jonathan Gruber (paid him in the hundreds of thousands) to go out and tout the long term cost benefits of the ACA, posing as an objective expert. Gruber was later exposed when caught on tape saying the administration preyed on the "stupidity" of Americans to get ACA passed.

Ironic that Nancy Pelosi, the pride of San Francisco was quoted as saying "we have to pass the ACA to find out what's in it". ALL FACTS. look it up.
 
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Obama care is better than the Repl plan of no plan at all. What exactly have the Repls done the last 8 years for the country other than repeal gun laws?

Listen my leftie friend. How is it better if one can not afford it. its a bad plan and not very well thought out. it was written by the lobbyist that obama railed against!!!! it is not cost competitive it does not give you options. if you are making 25k a year with no benefits the government does not subsidize you to pay for health care. I know because that was my situation, I had a mortgage no good job prospects and crappy job. 750 * 2 a month * 12 = about 18k. How can I eat pay utilities and my mortgage on that, you have no elfin clue. you are just a mindless brainwashed leftie who bought into the obama / media bs " And you live in california where you complain about the taxes move to other states like arizona and try to ruin those states as you destroyed your own with your stupid left wing ideas. there is a republican plan it was better than this piece of crap. you just believe the media which put out there that there was not one.. This was out there when obama offered his you moron http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/top-house-republican-unveils-obamacare-replacement/article/2564446

I know you will always say the republicans never offered a plan but you are wrong. typical msnbc bs
 
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also no call irish, the republicans did not do a good job in congress they went along with the socialist democrats in fear they would be blamed for the govt shutdown. because the media which backs the left will blame them . they are cowards. talk about politicians being of one stripe. they all approve h1b visa programs written by lobbyist signed by obama. which folks work to end their jobs and train replacements from asia that cost less, companies like souther cal edison and disney were very notorious in taking advantage of this. Yes the republicans are compliant cowards. at least the democrats believe in the crap that is ruining our country. i see this in arizona where wages with out doubt are going down for construction, call center jobs etc. these are not great jobs but they are jobs. The endless supply of illegal labor that the democrats wants so they can destroy the country with socialism and guarantee themselves power for eternity.
 
Obama care is better than the Repl plan of no plan at all. What exactly have the Repls done the last 8 years for the country other than repeal gun laws?
Wow. Just ****ing wow. Where in any of that was he touting something republican? Republican has ZERO to do with any of that. Why? Obama care sucks. Period. It has nothing to do with a yeah what about perspective. Nothing! Black and white.....it was a lie that preyed on those trendy sponges in our country who hear something trendy then just blindly rally behind that for the week.
 
Uninterested in political debate but where are you that gas is $4.00?
I bought gas at $1.84 a gallon just yesterday.
gas will fluctuate. two reasons for the current drop. lots of drilling in the west usa and release of sanctions on iran. we were up to almost 4 now its down under 2. I expect it to level off again until the next great problem in the middle east and russia
 
just a college fan.......you make a lot of sense. However, I still wish we had Bob Diaco back. That 2012 defense was really something (especially when ND had no offense to lean on.)
 
the goal identified at the start was a playoff birth and/or a major bowl W

When a goal is not achieved then, what? You try to analyse what the reasons for falling short are and what is needed going forward to achieve the goal.

The defensive staff has to be accountable.
The offense though better does need to address inconsistency and RZ issues.

Accountability happens, especially when the goal is missed.
 
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So Todd Lyght and the other coaches should be fired as well correct? I mean if you think "objectively" BVG isn't coaching every player and considering our secondary is the worst position on the team shouldn't he be blamed? How about the defensive line and strength and conditioning coaches? We have key players at every position not developing so should we only blame one person now?

Hey I am not saying BVG is the ultimate answer because I honestly have no idea considering what he has dealt with. At the same time it gets old seeing posts on this board blaming him for everything and people not being realistic about our injuries and talent level. I personally like his schemes but maybe they are too difficult for the players at ND so if that is the case then he should be let go along with the entire defensive staff. I will just be interested to see how the same critics act next season if things don't drastically improve because I don't see us having a better defense and our schedule is tougher. I hope I am wrong but it isn't as if we have had dominating defenses at ND since our last national championship, unless I missed something? Actually you can even go back farther to the 70's and probably count the number of top 10 defenses our program has had on one hand.

Lots of questions on both sides of the ball for 2016... hoping for the best but always try and be realistic when it comes to ND.
Camcor
How do you reconcile this quote along with the fact that Schmidt remained on the field as he was the only guy that understood the reads....? Understand this too, Max received some of the best HS coaching in the country. Legendary Mission Viejo Coach Bob Johnson put not 1 but 2 sons into the NFL as quarterbacks. He and his 2 sons coached Max his whole HS career and adore the young man. In addition, their staff regularly has other former NFL talent.

"An eloquent and confident speaker, Redfield has carried 18-credit academic course loads at Notre Dame per semester, most notably learning Mandarin Chinese. When asked whether VanGorder's defense or Chinese was more difficult, he paused."

"That's a pretty good question," he responded. "I would say consistently being successful in that scheme is harder than learning Chinese."

That's disheartening and an indictment of bvg's scheme.

PS We were # 92 in interceptions and # 114 in fumbles gained. In a sport where turnovers and special teams figure strongly into outcomes that totally blows.

The scheme sucks.

It falls on kelly to fix it....

https://notredame.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1791147

http://www.cfbstats.com/2015/leader/national/team/offense/split01/category12/sort05.html
Vangorder needs to go. Complicated pro defenses do not belong in college football. These young adults have to study for their college courses. Not figuring out a complex defensive scheme that obviously doesn't work in college football...and yes, it is just my opinion.
 
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Camcor

Vangorder needs to go. Complicated pro defenses do not belong in college football. These young adults have to study for their college courses. Not figuring out a complex defensive scheme that obviously doesn't work in college football...and yes, it is just my opinion.
Thanks Coach.
 
Thanks Coach.
You're welcome. Keep embracing those 350-400 yds per game allowed by Vangorder's defenses. I used to HATE Diaco's bend don't break defensive schemes. They are treasure worthy these days
 
You're welcome. Keep embracing those 350-400 yds per game allowed by Vangorder's defenses. I used to HATE Diaco's bend don't break defensive schemes. They are treasure worthy these days
I think we should change DC each and every week. Post less and read more.
 
apparently there have been comments heard, made by participants at the Army All Star Game, where recruits expressed reservation about BVG. That, if accurate, would be troubling and potentially damaging.
 
apparently there have been comments heard, made by participants at the Army All Star Game, where recruits expressed reservation about BVG. That, if accurate, would be troubling and potentially damaging.
Potentially damaging for sure. Perse, what is the source of this?
 
Potentially damaging for sure. Perse, what is the source of this?


there is a thread by Loy and a day 1; premium, but there are replies and some comments that are open - it is clear reference to recruits and BVG - we will certainly know more as the posts continue. Maybe Cool9 or D_Master can add more detail.
 
Camcor

Vangorder needs to go. Complicated pro defenses do not belong in college football. These young adults have to study for their college courses. Not figuring out a complex defensive scheme that obviously doesn't work in college football...and yes, it is just my opinion.
You are correct.
I have pointed out in threads how over the moon southern cal was when they got Monte Kiffin. He did some legendary stuff in the NFL, but they ran into heavy complexity issues with him too. Plus, there are athletes that didn't get the best HS coaching coming in as Fr. "Complexity"/sophisticated schemes can be overwhelming and also makes building depth more difficult. Max's remarks are alarming considering his high end background. It doesn't surprise me that Schmidt of Mater Dei grasped it. He received excellent HS coaching and was ahead of the curve on arrival.
PS keep your eye on JT Daniels QB FR Mater Dei. If he stays healthy he will shatter every record there...
 
posters can go read the threads on TOS about the Army All Star Game interviews and comments.
That they, the posts, are there is not rumor or unsubstantiated; anyone that knows how to read may do so. The above poster will have to remain clueless.
 
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