The Importance of a Good RB

[Get Nasty]

Before a few posters on here start eating their crow, we all support ND and want everyone on ND's team to be successful. Lets all be happy for a heck of a win.

Saturday night is exactly why you need to have a good RB. I agree with others that you don't need to have saquan barkley to be a good football team, but a playoff contender just can't get it done with Tony Jones or Avery Davis getting too many carriers. I don't think Dex is a first round running back by any means but the gap between his ability and Jones/Davis is THISSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS big. So many yards are left on the field with the Jones and even worse, Davis just doesn't know what he's doing out there or how to run like a RB (2 fumbles should end his season except for garbage minutes). Our offense doesn't get the explosive plays in the passing game (books only weakness it seems so far) so we need some in the running game. The fact that jones is slow and not powerful is alarming. If you're not going to be electric you need to at least be powerful, first drive showed he couldn't move an inch forward after contact and all we needed was a yard the first carry and 6 inches the second carry (should have QB sneaked). Not getting 1 yard and 6 inches when necessary is critical, he was so slow hitting the hole.

We need jones to be healthy and do as much as he can to spell Dex until Armstrong gets back. But when Armstrong is back healthy this needs to be a 1a 1b armstrong/dex show with Jones helping grind the clock in the fourth when needed. Jones just isn't a good back, he's serviceable and holds the offense back since defenses will never put an extra hat in to defend him. To run read option or RPO successfully you need your RB to be a threat and hit the hole hard forcing the DE to crash.

 

[BGI User 1596]

Before a few posters on here start eating their crow, we all support ND and want everyone on ND's team to be successful. Lets all be happy for a heck of a win.

Saturday night is exactly why you need to have a good RB. I agree with others that you don't need to have saquan barkley to be a good football team, but a playoff contender just can't get it done with Tony Jones or Avery Davis getting too many carriers. I don't think Dex is a first round running back by any means but the gap between his ability and Jones/Davis is THISSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS big. So many yards are left on the field with the Jones and even worse, Davis just doesn't know what he's doing out there or how to run like a RB (2 fumbles should end his season except for garbage minutes). Our offense doesn't get the explosive plays in the passing game (books only weakness it seems so far) so we need some in the running game. The fact that jones is slow and not powerful is alarming. If you're not going to be electric you need to at least be powerful, first drive showed he couldn't move an inch forward after contact and all we needed was a yard the first carry and 6 inches the second carry (should have QB sneaked). Not getting 1 yard and 6 inches when necessary is critical, he was so slow hitting the hole.

We need jones to be healthy and do as much as he can to spell Dex until Armstrong gets back. But when Armstrong is back healthy this needs to be a 1a 1b armstrong/dex show with Jones helping grind the clock in the fourth when needed. Jones just isn't a good back, he's serviceable and holds the offense back since defenses will never put an extra hat in to defend him. To run read option or RPO successfully you need your RB to be a threat and hit the hole hard forcing the DE to crash.

But he can pick up a blitz!

 

[NDIRISH53]

I don’t like attacking him as a player, but I think pointing out he just isn’t an athlete nor a threat is fair. Dexter has some of the best vision and instinct I have ever seen out of the running back position, and aside from one time where he got ran over on a blitz pick up, I thought he did a good tough job pass blocking. As a matter of fact, there was a few times when I said “damn these guys are right, that was some poor pass blocking” and it was jones who I mistaked for Dex.

It’s very telling that the coaches know he isn’t effective due to the fact that we had 2 backs get get out of school, another suspended for 4 games, and he still didn’t start against Michigan, but someone who has never played one down and is a converted receiver did. Those 2 plays where he couldn’t get the first down infuriated me.

At this point him and Mack are what they are, just not that good. They still have a role on the team however.

 

[Kelso86]

Before a few posters on here start eating their crow, we all support ND and want everyone on ND's team to be successful. Lets all be happy for a heck of a win.

Saturday night is exactly why you need to have a good RB. I agree with others that you don't need to have saquan barkley to be a good football team, but a playoff contender just can't get it done with Tony Jones or Avery Davis getting too many carriers. I don't think Dex is a first round running back by any means but the gap between his ability and Jones/Davis is THISSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS big. So many yards are left on the field with the Jones and even worse, Davis just doesn't know what he's doing out there or how to run like a RB (2 fumbles should end his season except for garbage minutes). Our offense doesn't get the explosive plays in the passing game (books only weakness it seems so far) so we need some in the running game. The fact that jones is slow and not powerful is alarming. If you're not going to be electric you need to at least be powerful, first drive showed he couldn't move an inch forward after contact and all we needed was a yard the first carry and 6 inches the second carry (should have QB sneaked). Not getting 1 yard and 6 inches when necessary is critical, he was so slow hitting the hole.

We need jones to be healthy and do as much as he can to spell Dex until Armstrong gets back. But when Armstrong is back healthy this needs to be a 1a 1b armstrong/dex show with Jones helping grind the clock in the fourth when needed. Jones just isn't a good back, he's serviceable and holds the offense back since defenses will never put an extra hat in to defend him. To run read option or RPO successfully you need your RB to be a threat and hit the hole hard forcing the DE to crash.

"Not getting 1 yard and 6 inches when necessary is critical, he was so slow hitting the hole."

Obviously, the O-Line NOT getting a push had zero impact on that play -- correct?

 

[Get Nasty]

"Not getting 1 yard and 6 inches when necessary is critical, he was so slow hitting the hole."

Obviously, the O-Line NOT getting a push had zero impact on that play -- correct?

IF it was easy anyone could do it. On the 4th and 6 inches it should have been a QB sneak, but it wasn't and Brock blocked the wrong guy. Oline did well on that play. But still, jones didn't make him miss, and didn't move him. On the play before there wasn't much push but again, you need 1 yard, the play wasn't blown up, it just didn't get the push you need from oline or RB. You need a RB to either have the power to get the yard, moves to not let him tackle you squarely, or ability to get skinny and find a crease.. 1-1 in the hole vs a LB you need to at least get a yard. He did not, adams had the same problem last year. He hit the hole too slow and with no power. Now, if adams got going he was impossible to bring down without him gaining extra yards.

 

[88ND]

Stop please....

Dexter is quicker. Yes.

But to say he's Sssssooooooooo much better than what else we have is absurd.

What you fail to realize is this....

Every single back in our stable has more room to run now that teams have to play us honest.

It doesn't matter Ian book thriwing 40 yard darts or 15 yard darts...the defensive opponent has to play our offense honest now. In other words no loading up the box.

That alone by default gives our backs more room.

Period

 

[Kelso86]

Stop please....

Dexter is quicker. Yes.

But to say he's Sssssooooooooo much better than what else we have is absurd.

What you fail to realize is this....

Every single back in our stable has more room to run now that teams have to play us honest.

It doesn't matter Ian book thriwing 40 yard darts or 15 yard darts...the defensive opponent has to play our offense honest now. In other words no loading up the box.

That alone by default gives our backs more room.

Period

hey man -- lay off the common sense! No room on a message board for that! lol

 

[Get Nasty]

Stop please....

Dexter is quicker. Yes.

But to say he's Sssssooooooooo much better than what else we have is absurd.

What you fail to realize is this....

Every single back in our stable has more room to run now that teams have to play us honest.

It doesn't matter Ian book thriwing 40 yard darts or 15 yard darts...the defensive opponent has to play our offense honest now. In other words no loading up the box.

That alone by default gives our backs more room.

Period

If you honestly think the game plays out the same way without Dex, then we were watching two different games.

He is SsSSSSSSSSoooooooooo much better than anything we put out at RB vs Stanford. I believe Armstrong has the ability to be a better all around back than Dex, he's jut not there yet and couldn't play saturday or most likely the next two weeks.

TJ has 17 carries for 79 yards with Book as QB. Do you want me to post Dex's or Armstrongs stats with Book as QB?

 

[88ND]

IF it was easy anyone could do it. On the 4th and 6 inches it should have been a QB sneak, but it wasn't and Brock blocked the wrong guy. Oline did well on that play. But still, jones didn't make him miss, and didn't move him. On the play before there wasn't much push but again, you need 1 yard, the play wasn't blown up, it just didn't get the push you need from oline or RB. You need a RB to either have the power to get the yard, moves to not let him tackle you squarely, or ability to get skinny and find a crease.. 1-1 in the hole vs a LB you need to at least get a yard. He did not, adams had the same problem last year. He hit the hole too slow and with no power. Now, if adams got going he was impossible to bring down without him gaining extra yards.

Adams galloped.
Exactly why all the east west running plays vs. good defenses were never a positive play. Too slow getting the edge. Once he got going he had sprinter speed. Quickness is what he lacked.

 

[Shakin' Down the Thunder]

Dexter is a solid player. With that said however, he is not consitant

Dexter is a talent for sure just not consistent enough which is why he has struggled to play for 4 years. Id like to see Smith and C'bo get some carries as well. I do not think they have played in 4 games yet so it wouldn't cost them a redshirt year.

Lol. Guy puts up 161 yards on 21 carries against a top 10 team, but nope not consistent enough.

 

[TOMMY_23]

Stop please....

Dexter is quicker. Yes.

But to say he's Sssssooooooooo much better than what else we have is absurd.

What you fail to realize is this....

Every single back in our stable has more room to run now that teams have to play us honest.

It doesn't matter Ian book thriwing 40 yard darts or 15 yard darts...the defensive opponent has to play our offense honest now. In other words no loading up the box.

That alone by default gives our backs more room.

Period

I usually agree with you, but not here. Dexter will be a stud NFL back while the others will likely never get a carry there. #HORSE

 

[VTND]

Lol. Guy puts up 161 yards on 21 carries against a top 10 team, but nope not consistent enough.

He did it for one game.....so yea not consistent enough. He has basically been invisible for 3 years at ND has one good game and you all crown him like he is the best back in the country.

 

[TOMMY_23]

Lol. Guy puts up 161 yards on 21 carries against a top 10 team, but nope not consistent enough.

Some people are stubborn. Dex is a freak.

 

[Shakin' Down the Thunder]

He did it for one game.....so yea not consistent enough. He has basically been invisible for 3 years at ND has one good game and you all crown him like he is the best back in the country.

First off, where did I crown him anything? Secondly, who cares about his last 3 years? Live in the present for once.

 

[VTND]

First off, where did I crown him anything? Secondly, who cares about his last 3 years? Live in the present for once.

LOL oook

 

[Shakin' Down the Thunder]

LOL oook

Huh? That's your comeback?

 

[Get Nasty]

He did it for one game.....so yea not consistent enough. He has basically been invisible for 3 years at ND has one good game and you all crown him like he is the best back in the country.

Not even close, what everyone is saying is we need Dex to get the carries and give us consistent production, we believe he will based on all the talk the last 6 months and 1 game of monster production, and it has to happen with armstrong out because our remaining rbs are just not good right now.

 

[VTND]

Huh? That's your comeback?

Stop trying to pick a fight chief.

 

[NDAFArly]

It’s funny how people who don’t understand football throw out hyperbole.

Watch the breakdown of the game & listen to the ND staff talk about how the strategy worked out.

1) Stanford is not as athletic as ND & uses scheme & toughness to win games.
2) ND felt they could out-scheme Stanford with multiple different looks on offense & out-athlete them.

ND started off with Dex gashing them with speed. Then Stanford adjusted the 2nd half & ND then came out with Jones & Davis to spread the field. Stanford adjusted by saying we don’t think you will pass consistently with Dex in the game, so they slowed ND down a little. Then Chip Long cape out with two RBs who catch the ball out of the backfield & blocks, & Stanford once again got out-schemed & ND moved the ball at will again.
Then Stanford was worn down chasing ND backs & receivers all over the field & ND reinserted Dex with fresh legs who once again gashed the tired, slower Stanford defense.

It was a great gameplan that worked using 3 different backs in 3 different ways to keep Stanford on the back foot.
Jones will never be the homerun thread as Dex, just like Dex will never be the 2 back, spread offense, receiving & blocking back Jones is. ND needs both. Saying Jones isn’t any good is just stupid & shows a lack of football knowledge. Brian Kelly & Chip Long both seem to think he is very important in their offense.

Side note: Jones went for over 100 yards in a game the other team gave 0% respect to Wimbush passing & stacked the box. He also averaged 5 ypc agsinst Michigan in a game yards were at a premium. He also led ND in receiving (and rushing) in a game that ND had no offense & he saved them. Those are instances where Jones actually is more valuable than Dex.

 

[Get Nasty]

It’s funny how people who don’t understand football throw out hyperbole.

Watch the breakdown of the game & listen to the ND staff talk about how the strategy worked out.

1) Stanford is not as athletic as ND & uses scheme & toughness to win games.
2) ND felt they could out-scheme Stanford with multiple different looks on offense & out-athlete them.

ND started off with Dex gashing them with speed. Then Stanford adjusted the 2nd half & ND then came out with Jones & Davis to spread the field. Stanford adjusted by saying we don’t think you will pass consistently with Dex in the game, so they slowed ND down a little. Then Chip Long cape out with two RBs who catch the ball out of the backfield & blocks, & Stanford once again got out-schemed & ND moved the ball at will again.
Then Stanford was worn down chasing ND backs & receivers all over the field & ND reinserted Dex with fresh legs who once again gashed the tired, slower Stanford defense.

It was a great gameplan that worked using 3 different backs in 3 different ways to keep Stanford on the back foot.
Jones will never be the homerun thread as Dex, just like Dex will never be the 2 back, spread offense, receiving & blocking back Jones is. ND needs both. Saying Jones isn’t any good is just stupid & shows a lack of football knowledge. Brian Kelly & Chip Long both seem to think he is very important in their offense.

Side note: Jones went for over 100 yards in a game the other team gave 0% respect to Wimbush passing & stacked the box. He also averaged 5 ypc agsinst Michigan in a game yards were at a premium. He also led ND in receiving (and rushing) in a game that ND had no offense & he saved them. Those are instances where Jones actually is more valuable than Dex.

Yes he is more valuable than Dex when Dex is suspended, other than that, need Dex to hold down the fort until Armstrong gets back.

 

[NotreDomer1]

"Not getting 1 yard and 6 inches when necessary is critical, he was so slow hitting the hole."

Obviously, the O-Line NOT getting a push had zero impact on that play -- correct?

It’s hard to be upset with Jones’s play this year. He has been a playmaker for sure. The 4th down play was not his fault. The LG (Bars) doubled down on the DT with Mustpher and sustained that block unnecessarily. That completely left Kmet in a bad position of having to choose which LBer to block. The other LBer was completely unblocked and drilled Jones for no gain. Bars, I assume, was only supposed to help Mustipher get proper position on the DT and then peel forward and take on the unblocked LBer. *IF* that had happened, Jones walks into the end zone from midfield.

Jones did miss a few holes though after rewatching the game. Dex seems to make difficult plays look routine. He hits the hole fast and makes the defense react to him. I remember one run, he cut inside of a LBer so fast the LBer ended up getting dragged for a six yard gain hanging on for dear life. He just so special with his cuts.