Pre season rankings right now are more meaningless than ever. Roster will change I know you know this.
Once they step on campus the rankings are pretty much meaningless. Everyone has to earn their spot and then be productive to keep it. What a player " was" in high school means about as much as to what a player "was" in college after they join the NFL. I fully understand that having more quality players increases the likelihood of success. I was just pointing that what Hartman was rated in high school has no bearing on him being at ND today.
It's as an inexact science as you can ever find.
Dayne Crist, Kansas Jayhawks, Quarterback
Dayne Crist is a Quarterback from Sherman Oaks, CA. He has committed to Notre Dame Fighting Irish.247sports.com
Patrick Mahomes II, Kansas City Chiefs, Quarterback
Mahomes is the son of former Major League Baseball relief pitcher Pat Mahomes, who attended Lindale High School near Tyler, Texas.
Recruiting rankings are the greatest invention since the wheel.
agree other than there's a different view on 5*'s coming in just like first round draft picks. They get more chances to prove themselves quickly IMO.
Agree. Do I think a guy like Keon Keeley will be a 5 star player? Absolutely. But for many 3-4 star guys it's a crap shoot. Most 5 star QB's are a bust.
Wake has had NFL prospects at WR during most of Hartman's tenure. Hartman has had more to work with at WR than ND has had the last few years. Hartman has also benefited from playing in by far the least competitive P5 conference in college football by a mile.
stars are just a symbol that represent the rarity of a prospect. it's a projection of a player's FBS future based on the best data available about the player at the time.
I think I read once that like 70% of the NFL, including it’s most talented QB’s, were 3 star or less. I wouldn’t call that rare.
There are about 25-35 five-star prospects each class, and about 150-200 four-star prospects. And about 600-800 three-star prospects
I don’t disagree. If we are arguing that per capita 5 stars produce at a higher level than 3 stars then I don’t disagree (although some positions are vastly different from others). My point is simply that using a high school star rating (whether a 1 or 5+) to describe a current college players ceiling is nauseatingly stupid. Particularly mind numbingly stupid when that player is a two time D1 NCAA AA. If someone says Hartman doesn’t have a high ceiling bc he lacks vision or throws too many picks that at least seems like a conscious thought that can try and muster an argument. It’s like saying they should bench Stetson Bennet for JT Daniels simply based on some fat moron high school recruitnicks analysis. If I were betting money at the casino I’d take Dayne Crist every time, but I’d lose my ass quite often and someone is getting rich on Mahomes. But a good better still takes Crist. No good better looks back in retrospect and says well you know, that was a good hand 10 years ago so maybe it is now. Hartman might be Stetson Bennett. The odds aren’t too far out of his favor considering what he’s done and he’s certainly a better bet than an unproven guy like Dante Moore and certainly mountains better odds than Tyler Buchner. Coming out of high school I’d rank it 1, Moore 2, Buchner 3, Hartman. But high school doesn’t mean shit in the case of Mahomes and it doesn’t mean shit in the case of Dayne Crist. One makes hundreds of millions, one is probably selling insurance. There are folks here dumb enough that had Hartman been a five star in high school, they’d be more excited today about a 2 x AA transfer and all time ACC passing leader. Guys like Hartman are very very rare to hit the portal. He’s a jackpot.
Nobody said Williams isn’t good. They aren’t mutually exclusive. You seem to really be at odds with Freeman over this Hartman thing. That must be hard for you.
I'm not. I would have brought Hartman in too. Just the people who think he is some elite player is where I disagree
I think Hartman and cj carr have a lot of similarities so this will let us know where we see our offense going with an established qb under Rees
He's 24 coming back for a 6th year and his draft projection is last round/undrafted FA. This guy has about as much chance to make an NFL 2-deep as Tate Forcier at this point.
Carr is bigger physically. Hes more athletic. And I think he'll have a bigger arm by the time he is on campus
Maybe slightly on all 3 but their style and abilities to me would lead to the same offensive scheme and game plan… still stand by my point that the offense next year could look like what tommy wants to run moving forward… minchey is different but would probably run it too if he develops
Alright man, shit, are you about through? Because you're laying it on pretty thick in this thread....
If the italicized part of your reply is your main point, which I take it to be, you are partly right and mostly wrong. Notre Dame DOES have a reduced chance of winning national championships because of the structural disadvantages in the sport (geography, use of NIL as incentive to "attend," academic expectations/demands, etc.). Doesn't mean they can't win or won't win, but I have been a fan for 50 years, and the first 25, I automatically assumed national championship candidatehood on an annual basis...not anymore.
