Kelly vs good teams

[Golfnut34]

There has been a lot of discussion on this site about Kelly's inability to beat good teams. He has never won a BCS game, major bowl, been to playoff and of course a national title. So for the fans that still doubt this take a look at the stat below which is Kelly's record vs teams that finished the year with 4 losses or less 10-18
4-loss teams: 4-4
• 3-loss teams: 3-3
• 2-loss teams: 2-6
• 1-loss teams: 1-4
• 0-loss teams: 0-1

Fortunately, for Kelly he has played the easiest 6 year schedule in ND history and has played few good teams compared to previous coaches. The percentages go even lower when non power 5 teams like Temple and Navy are excluded. Kelly owes a lot to Swarbrick for his crafty scheduling helping cover up Kelly's inability to coach his team up for big games

 

[HuddleBurger]

I am enjoying your new handle. Well done, sir.

 

[KJ23]

Well. When big games came up we have Fallen short.

Bama NC game
Clemson 2015
Stanford 2015
osu 2015
fsu 2014

Need to win at least 2 out of these games for us to turn the corner. These were the elite competition games.

 

[HRC08]

All the "talk" was done by your other handle. Maybe the two of you should get together for a conversation?

 

[NDSMC78]

There has been a lot of discussion on this site about Kelly's inability to beat good teams. He has never won a BCS game, major bowl, been to playoff and of course a national title. So for the fans that still doubt this take a look at the stat below which is Kelly's record vs teams that finished the year with 4 losses or less 10-18
4-loss teams: 4-4
• 3-loss teams: 3-3
• 2-loss teams: 2-6
• 1-loss teams: 1-4
• 0-loss teams: 0-1

Fortunately, for Kelly he has played the easiest 6 year schedule in ND history and has played few good teams compared to previous coaches. The percentages go even lower when non power 5 teams like Temple and ND are excluded. Kelly owes a lot to Swarbrick for his crafty scheduling helping cover up Kelly's inability to coach his team up for big games

ND played ND? I missed that one.

 

[irish4life888]

There has been a lot of discussion on this site about Kelly's inability to beat good teams. He has never won a BCS game, major bowl, been to playoff and of course a national title. So for the fans that still doubt this take a look at the stat below which is Kelly's record vs teams that finished the year with 4 losses or less 10-18
4-loss teams: 4-4
• 3-loss teams: 3-3
• 2-loss teams: 2-6
• 1-loss teams: 1-4
• 0-loss teams: 0-1

Fortunately, for Kelly he has played the easiest 6 year schedule in ND history and has played few good teams compared to previous coaches. The percentages go even lower when non power 5 teams like Temple and Navy are excluded. Kelly owes a lot to Swarbrick for his crafty scheduling helping cover up Kelly's inability to coach his team up for big games

Easiest schedule in ND history? Care to back that up with something factual? Please enthrall us wit your knowledge.

 

[deadirishpoet]

There has been a lot of discussion on this site about Kelly's inability to beat good teams. He has never won a BCS game, major bowl, been to playoff and of course a national title. So for the fans that still doubt this take a look at the stat below which is Kelly's record vs teams that finished the year with 4 losses or less 10-18
4-loss teams: 4-4
• 3-loss teams: 3-3
• 2-loss teams: 2-6
• 1-loss teams: 1-4
• 0-loss teams: 0-1

Fortunately, for Kelly he has played the easiest 6 year schedule in ND history and has played few good teams compared to previous coaches. The percentages go even lower when non power 5 teams like Temple and Navy are excluded. Kelly owes a lot to Swarbrick for his crafty scheduling helping cover up Kelly's inability to coach his team up for big games

Very telling

 

[TurnoverMachine]

There has been a lot of discussion on this site about Kelly's inability to beat good teams. He has never won a BCS game, major bowl, been to playoff and of course a national title. So for the fans that still doubt this take a look at the stat below which is Kelly's record vs teams that finished the year with 4 losses or less 10-18
4-loss teams: 4-4
• 3-loss teams: 3-3
• 2-loss teams: 2-6
• 1-loss teams: 1-4
• 0-loss teams: 0-1

Fortunately, for Kelly he has played the easiest 6 year schedule in ND history and has played few good teams compared to previous coaches. The percentages go even lower when non power 5 teams like Temple and Navy are excluded. Kelly owes a lot to Swarbrick for his crafty scheduling helping cover up Kelly's inability to coach his team up for big games

Excellent post, Golf.

 

[TurnoverMachine]

Well. When big games came up we have Fallen short.

Bama NC game
Clemson 2015
Stanford 2015
osu 2015
fsu 2014

Need to win at least 2 out of these games for us to turn the corner. These were the elite competition games.

Five combined games at scUM and Stanford he's 0-5 in those. Kelly is a fraud and I've stated it since 2011. I've been trashed because I've wanted ND to have a great coach not an average one. Nonsensical to me.

 

[TurnoverMachine]

Easiest schedule in ND history? Care to back that up with something factual? Please enthrall us wit your knowledge.

Well, Kelly does dominate the likes of Wake Forest, BYU, Purdue, and Air Force. There is no denying that. He's also 1-9 in big road/neutral games.

 

[Nocalirish]

Criticism is easy. Who do you pick to replace him? Take your stats and answer to the "new coach" thread with the rest of the losers.

 

[TimTerrific]

Golfnut, whoever that is, and Turmover Machine are prime examples of many, ND Fans, ND Haters and more, who come here mindlessly spouting off about a game they know little about.

 

[hvillebill]

Criticism is easy. Who do you pick to replace him? Take your stats and answer to the "new coach" thread with the rest of the losers.

These guys never can answer that question, and it gets asked repeatedly. A couple on here have a "wish list" but no one that is realistic.

 

[NDSMC78]

Five combined games at scUM and Stanford he's 0-5 in those. Kelly is a fraud and I've stated it since 2011. I've been trashed because I've wanted ND to have a great coach not an average one. Nonsensical to me.

You have been trashed because you are a fraud. No one believes you are an ND fan.

 

[TimTerrific]

Kelly is a top five coach who has proven so at every stop and his success at Notre Dame is only growing. How dumb many here prove so every day.

 

[perseverare]

since fans on this forum are not in agreement on who the 'good teams' are; the rest is never going to be a universal truth.

 

[twalsh]

Excellent post, Golf.

 

[twalsh]

since fans on this forum are not in agreement on who the 'good teams' are; the rest is never going to be a universal truth.

Perse, there are some who believe us beating the team eliminates them from the "good" category. Hence, we will never beat anyone worth a damn, in their minds.

 

[perseverare]

I think what fans want to see is ND beating a team that ND is not expected to beat. That used to occur with regularity.

Ok., USC and LSU were good wins; beating MSU is a good win. But those games were not huge upsets as a ND W was close to 50/50.

Had ND beaten tOSU that would have been a significant type of W. Had ND beaten FSU last season it would have been that kind of W (regardless of FSU folding).

Getting to the big game is one thing, Winning it is the real success. Kelly needs to get to the big game and win it; else he may be viewed as the Bud Grant of college football. However, the problem is a bit complex. ND gets notoriety that other teams do not, they have a profitable brand and bring in revenues. So 10 wins will likely get ND into a game where they face an opponent bigger, faster and stronger. A catch 22.

 

[cgvr]

There has been a lot of discussion on this site about Kelly's inability to beat good teams. He has never won a BCS game, major bowl, been to playoff and of course a national title. So for the fans that still doubt this take a look at the stat below which is Kelly's record vs teams that finished the year with 4 losses or less 10-18
4-loss teams: 4-4
• 3-loss teams: 3-3
• 2-loss teams: 2-6
• 1-loss teams: 1-4
• 0-loss teams: 0-1

Fortunately, for Kelly he has played the easiest 6 year schedule in ND history and has played few good teams compared to previous coaches. The percentages go even lower when non power 5 teams like Temple and Navy are excluded. Kelly owes a lot to Swarbrick for his crafty scheduling helping cover up Kelly's inability to coach his team up for big games

So, he's 3-11 versus "elite" competition (teams with 2 losses or less)....

& one of those wins is Navy this year....

Ouch.....

tulsa, navy, so fl, northwestern...we're fortunate to not have 4-8 va on the list....

 

[bizzybecknd]

D

Five combined games at scUM and Stanford he's 0-5 in those. Kelly is a fraud and I've stated it since 2011. I've been trashed because I've wanted ND to have a great coach not an average one. Nonsensical to me.

Dan Mullen anybody? hahaha

 

[perseverare]

ND fans enamoured with the experienced retreads is in keeping with the tradition of mediocrity established in 1997. Fans want a HC that has proven experience with losses not some young hotshot or budding superstar!
Let that young guy go somewhere else and win! There is guarded tradition here; it must be preserved!

The young hotshot coaches, seeking opportunity will gain no favor here! They say ND is their 'dream school' ?
Well they will go elsewhere for establishing the reputation, then they can beg that ND fans will take them back!
But, will they want to return?

 

[hvillebill]

D

Dan Mullen anybody? hahaha

Excellent reply!!

For some odd reason (other than just throwing crap against the wall) TOM has a hard-on for Mullen. I pointed out his career stats, including a losing record in the SEC to him and he had nothing to say about it.

 

[cgvr]

D

Dan Mullen anybody? hahaha

Chuck Martin did better than kelly at GVSU....

kelly inherited a D2 GVSU team that went 11-1 and 10-2 the prior 2 years to his takeover.

The next 10 years kelly went 9-3, 8-3, 6-3-2, 8-4, 8-3, 8-3, 9-2, 9-3, 5-5, 7-4….

After 10 years he broke through with 13-1, 14-0, and 14-1 records….

He finished with a WP of .76923 2 NCs

Chuck Martin took the reins from kelly and went 10-3, 13-0, 15-0, 12-1, 11-1, 13-2

He finished with a WP of .91358 2 NCs

 

[Duo]

There has been a lot of discussion on this site about Kelly's inability to beat good teams. He has never won a BCS game, major bowl, been to playoff and of course a national title. So for the fans that still doubt this take a look at the stat below which is Kelly's record vs teams that finished the year with 4 losses or less 10-18
4-loss teams: 4-4
• 3-loss teams: 3-3
• 2-loss teams: 2-6
• 1-loss teams: 1-4
• 0-loss teams: 0-1

Fortunately, for Kelly he has played the easiest 6 year schedule in ND history and has played few good teams compared to previous coaches. The percentages go even lower when non power 5 teams like Temple and Navy are excluded. Kelly owes a lot to Swarbrick for his crafty scheduling helping cover up Kelly's inability to coach his team up for big games

Golfnut........

Kelly's inspiration for his offense has been a variation of what Tiger Ellison and Mouse Davis did in the Run and Shoot.

Wikipedia:

"The Run & Shoot system uses a formation consisting of one running back and usually four wide receivers, although some variants have substituted an athletic and bigger tight end to help block for the running game.

The basic idea behind the Run & Shoot is a flexible offense that adjusts "on the fly," as the receivers are free to adjust their routes as they are running them in response to the defensive coverage employed.

At the Collegiate level, the 1989 Houston Cougars football team demonstrated the scoring potential of the run and shoot offense as quarterback Andre Ware set 26 NCAA records and won the Heisman Trophy while the #14 ranked Cougars finished the season 9-2. Houston quarterback David Klingler continued the success of the run and shoot throwing for 9,430 yards and 91 touchdowns, including 716 yards and 11 touchdown passes in a single game which were all records."

The philosophy is pass first. However, Kelly seems to be evolving a bit after watching the success of some of the elite college coaches featuring RB's. (i.e. Saban, Meyer, Stoops, Fisher, Swinney).

There is a lot more about the advantages and pitfalls of the Run and Shoot in Wikipedia.

 

[perseverare]

it went back to the 49'ers with John Brodie. I think Red Hickey was the coach.

 

[IrishBlooded]

There has been a lot of discussion on this site about Kelly's inability to beat good teams. He has never won a BCS game, major bowl, been to playoff and of course a national title. So for the fans that still doubt this take a look at the stat below which is Kelly's record vs teams that finished the year with 4 losses or less 10-18
4-loss teams: 4-4
• 3-loss teams: 3-3
• 2-loss teams: 2-6
• 1-loss teams: 1-4
• 0-loss teams: 0-1

Fortunately, for Kelly he has played the easiest 6 year schedule in ND history and has played few good teams compared to previous coaches. The percentages go even lower when non power 5 teams like Temple and Navy are excluded. Kelly owes a lot to Swarbrick for his crafty scheduling helping cover up Kelly's inability to coach his team up for big games

I guess since I don't see in numbers what good would be. I'm sure you will be able to present your record of success for an example

 

[TurnoverMachine]

Golfnut, whoever that is, and Turmover Machine are prime examples of many, ND Fans, ND Haters and more, who come here mindlessly spouting off about a game they know little about.

The truth hurts. All I do is state facts. Coach Kelly has yet to win at scUM, Stanford, or either of the ACC major opponents. He hasn't won a major bowl either. How am I hating? I'm stating.

 

[TurnoverMachine]

Kelly is a top five coach who has proven so at every stop and his success at Notre Dame is only growing. How dumb many here prove so every day.

You're a ####### #####. Top 5 lol. Talk about delusuonal.

How can he be top-5 when he hasn't done anything????????????

Top 5
1. Saban
2. Meyer
3. Stoops
4. Shaw
5. Harbaugh

He's not even close to the top ten. The only person that looks stupid is you. Trust me I know more than you.

 

[TurnoverMachine]

I guess since I don't see in numbers what good would be. I'm sure you will be able to present your record of success for an example

Classic response. Enjoy 8-4.

 

[hvillebill]

Classic response. Enjoy 8-4.

How about this?

If ND goes 8-4 next year, I'll leave the board. If they do better than that, you leave.

However, one of your other handles will still be here anyway.

 

[NDSMC78]

Don't you have some babies to abort today? I'm sorry!!!!! Kelly is the best coach on earth!!!!!!!!!! Fool.

Typical classy reponse by this poster. Stupid and rude doesn't begin to cover it.

 

[NDSMC78]

You're a ####### #####. Top 5 lol. Talk about delusuonal.

How can he be top-5 when he hasn't done anything????????????

Top 5
1. Saban
2. Meyer
3. Stoops
4. Shaw
5. Harbaugh

He's not even close to the top ten. The only person that looks stupid is you. Trust me I know more than you.

No one on this board is as consistently uninformed as you are. No one.

 

[IrishBlooded]

Classic response. Enjoy 8-4.

I enjoy football. And understand my input into ND has absolutely no effect on what happens within the program. It is the same as people on here says 'we won' it had nothing to do with you.

I have never said Kelly was my first choice or that I enjoy any season that doesn't end with a title. However with this current model, and restrictions, about 10 to 11 wins is going to be the ceiling for ND for some time.

However if someone on here is going to stand on a soap box and preach that someone actually doing a job isn't good enough for their personal standard then I think they should be able to prove how much better they can do.

If not shut the hell up.

 

[vivalas]

Harbaugh at 5? You can't be serious. I thought you knew what you were talking about

 

[vivalas]

From 2014.... http://www.wsj.com/news/interactive/COUNT0820

I'll give ya shaw, Saban, Meyer and stoops. Not much else there....harbaugh isn't listed but don't had 3 bad years at Stanford, and 1 average year at Michigan. Curious to see your next five in.

 

[perseverare]

How about this?

If ND goes 8-4 next year, I'll leave the board. If they do better than that, you leave.

However, one of your other handles will still be here anyway.

Bill
there is 8-4 and there is 8-4

by that I mean a team can play well coached, well disciplined, dedicated, tough, excellent football but just get beat by better teams and that kind of 8-4 from a fan perspective should be something of pride.

 

[deadirishpoet]

The next 10 years kelly went 9-3, 8-3, 6-3-2, 8-4, 8-3, 8-3, 9-2, 9-3, 5-5, 7-4….

After 10 years he broke through with 13-1, 14-0, and 14-1 records….

He finished with a WP of .76923 2 NCs

Chuck Martin took the reins from kelly and went 10-3, 13-0, 15-0, 12-1, 11-1, 13-2

He finished with a WP of .91358 2 NCs[/QUOTE]


It is true but coach Kell set him up pretty good. All Martin needed to do was not change the syatem.

Bill
there is 8-4 and there is 8-4

by that I mean a team can play well coached, well disciplined, dedicated, tough, excellent football but just get beat by better teams and that kind of 8-4 from a fan perspective should be something of pride.

Next season's schedule is a minimum 9/10 win season with this talent.

 

[jameskroner3]

From 2014.... http://www.wsj.com/news/interactive/COUNT0820

I'll give ya shaw, Saban, Meyer and stoops. Not much else there....harbaugh isn't listed but don't had 3 bad years at Stanford, and 1 average year at Michigan. Curious to see your next five in.

What Harbaugh did at Stanford was a miracle. You list he had three bad years. Do you remember what he had to work with during that time? In one year he has turned around the culture of the Michigan program. It's obvious he will have Michigan playing for a NC in the next 3 years.

 

[NDSMC78]

What Harbaugh did at Stanford was a miracle. You list he had three bad years. Do you remember what he had to work with during that time? In one year he has turned around the culture of the Michigan program. It's obvious he will have Michigan playing for a NC in the next 3 years.

That's not obvious at all. He has a long way to go.