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Jack Coan>>>Graham Mertz

savvyandsassier

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Dec 16, 2013
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Did that thought not occur to you as a fan over and over again on Saturday? I meant to make a post about this earlier, but is that not correct? I'm halfway wondering if Coan is thinking all this week somewhere in the corner of his mind if he should have stayed at Wisconsin. I don't really mean that literally, but after the game it was extremely easy for me to imagine at least, a scenario where Coan sat tight, stayed at Wisky, and then totally winning the job back before the season even started. That's how underwhelming the great Graham Mertz looks to be. Just because your coaches say they're gonna stick with somebody doesn't mean they're actually gonna stick with him, it just means that's the tentative plan.

In any case we definitely got the better of the two. We recruited Mertz pretty hard and he snubbed us, and after last weekend I don't mind that he did. Love me some Jack Coan, and I'll take Drew Pyne as well, who also looked better than Mertz on Saturday.... Though now that I think of it, Mertz was in Brendan Clark's year, but the point still stands....
 
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I don't think it's any news breaking thing to say that Coan is better, but it's not like he's some superstar in his own right or anything. Basically when you have to have these conversations about QB's, then you don't really have one regardless. Coan is fine and all but if he was the QB he needs to be get ND to that promised land of actually making it look like they have a chance to win a playoff game, he wouldn't now seemingly always be looking over his shoulder at the backup. He also seems to be injury prone and maybe that had an impact on WI wanting to move on too.
 
I don't think it's any news breaking thing to say that Coan is better, but it's not like he's some superstar in his own right or anything. Basically when you have to have these conversations about QB's, then you don't really have one regardless. Coan is fine and all but if he was the QB he needs to be get ND to that promised land of actually making it look like they have a chance to win a playoff game, he wouldn't now seemingly always be looking over his shoulder at the backup. He also seems to be injury prone and maybe that had an impact on WI wanting to move on too.
You'd be injury prone as well playing behind our offensive line. Injury prone? What a stupid comment
 
I don't think it's any news breaking thing to say that Coan is better, but it's not like he's some superstar in his own right or anything. Basically when you have to have these conversations about QB's, then you don't really have one regardless. Coan is fine and all but if he was the QB he needs to be get ND to that promised land of actually making it look like they have a chance to win a playoff game, he wouldn't now seemingly always be looking over his shoulder at the backup. He also seems to be injury prone and maybe that had an impact on WI wanting to move on too.
Sorry to disagree, but I think the stupidest platitude I've ever heard in any sport ever, is the one in football where if you have two QBs then you actually have none. Never made any sense to me, on almost any level at all. More like some schmo made it up, some hack sportswriter, and it stuck and it's been with us ever since, lowering the quality of debate and discussion of football right into the present day. To this day I really don't know what is supposed to meant by that obscure bit of purported wisdom.

In any case, we got Jack Coan, and I think Wisc really screwed up on that one. They're kicking themselves!
 
I don't think it's any news breaking thing to say that Coan is better, but it's not like he's some superstar in his own right or anything. Basically when you have to have these conversations about QB's, then you don't really have one regardless. Coan is fine and all but if he was the QB he needs to be get ND to that promised land of actually making it look like they have a chance to win a playoff game, he wouldn't now seemingly always be looking over his shoulder at the backup. He also seems to be injury prone and maybe that had an impact on WI wanting to move on too.
What a pile of garbage.
 
No problems, I certainly don't post anything here caring about whether the majority agrees with me or not. Based on the "intelligence" levels that tend to be on display around here, I'd actually prefer seeing people disagree with me.
 
No problems, I certainly don't post anything here caring about whether the majority agrees with me or not. Based on the "intelligence" levels that tend to be on display around here, I'd actually prefer seeing people disagree with me.
Well you're in luck then! That's probably what you're going to get a steady diet of....

I do want to add one more note regarding Mertz. He was just plain old shitty and lame. Regardless of Coan, Mertz was a little bitch this Saturday, and I wouldn't be too cool with the guy stinking it up in such a big game if I was a Wiscy fan. His body language sucked all game, he threw shitty interceptions, and he just was not impressive at all. I think our defense is kicking ass, but Graham Mertz didn't do his part on Saturday. It could be he was a bit rattled having to face his old rival, actually playing for another team. And that shit fazed him!

Anyway, to repeat Coan>>>Mertz....
 
Sorry to disagree, but I think the stupidest platitude I've ever heard in any sport ever, is the one in football where if you have two QBs then you actually have none. Never made any sense to me, on almost any level at all. More like some schmo made it up, some hack sportswriter, and it stuck and it's been with us ever since, lowering the quality of debate and discussion of football right into the present day. To this day I really don't know what is supposed to meant by that obscure bit of purported wisdom.

In any case, we got Jack Coan, and I think Wisc really screwed up on that one. They're kicking themselves!
Look it doesn't take a genius to know that every organization thrives when it has two leaders.

Go ahead, name a country that doesn't have two presidents. A boat that sets sail without two captains. Where would Catholicism be, without the popes?
 
Look it doesn't take a genius to know that every organization thrives when it has two leaders.

Go ahead, name a country that doesn't have two presidents. A boat that sets sail without two captains. Where would Catholicism be, without the popes?
I guess there are situations when a coach can't come to a decision, he keeps going back and forth and it can screw things up for his team. And I guess if you only have one player at that position, then the decision is made for you.

However I just think that if I were a coach that I could handle that responsibility and thus I wouldn't mind having as many good options as I could get, and I wouldn't prefer to only have one... I do believe that expression is at least overused, if not completely stupid. I bet you Wiscy would rather have Jack Coan right now, on tap and available to go rather than not....
 
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Well you're in luck then! That's probably what you're going to get a steady diet of....

I do want to add one more note regarding Mertz. He was just plain old shitty and lame. Regardless of Coan, Mertz was a little bitch this Saturday, and I wouldn't be too cool with the guy stinking it up in such a big game if I was a Wiscy fan. His body language sucked all game, he threw shitty interceptions, and he just was not impressive at all. I think our defense is kicking ass, but Graham Mertz didn't do his part on Saturday. It could be he was a bit rattled having to face his old rival, actually playing for another team. And that shit fazed him!

Anyway, to repeat Coan>>>Mertz....
I gotta say that I find this post to be quite ironic.

This guy is always screaming civility and yelling “tOxIc” and “TrOLl” but then posts an extremely childish comment about Mertz, calling him names and attacking his character.

Do you know him personally to be able to judge him in this manner?

I’m not a Mertz or Wisconsin fan but how would you respond if a Badger fan said such things about a ND player?

I’m sure you’re a former NFL All Pro QB and all but your assessment of him seems lowbrow.
 
Did that thought not occur to you as a fan over and over again on Saturday? I meant to make a post about this earlier, but is that not correct? I'm halfway wondering if Coan is thinking all this week somewhere in the corner of his mind if he should have stayed at Wisconsin. I don't really mean that literally, but after the game it was extremely easy for me to imagine at least, a scenario where Coan sat tight, stayed at Wisky, and then totally winning the job back before the season even started. That's how underwhelming the great Graham Mertz looks to be. Just because your coaches say they're gonna stick with somebody doesn't mean they're actually gonna stick with him, it just means that's the tentative plan.

In any case we definitely got the better of the two. We recruited Mertz pretty hard and he snubbed us, and after last weekend I don't mind that he did. Love me some Jack Coan, and I'll take Drew Pyne as well, who also looked better than Mertz on Saturday.... Though now that I think of it, Mertz was in Brendan Clark's year, but the point still stands....
Here's some speculation on that situation. Pure speculation.

Is it possible that Coan never fully recovered from his injury and got (Wally) Pipped, as Goolsby likes to say, because he was somewhat damaged goods? And that ND took a chance on him anyway, judging the effects of his injury to be something less than disqualifying?

If you look at Coan's Wisconsin highlight reel, he's a much more mobile QB than he is today. And you don't get a lacrosse scholarship to ND -- as both an attacker and midfielder -- if you're not mobile. Lacrosse is NON-STOP RUNNING. Plus, there's body checking galore, and it doesn't work out too well for you if you go down as easily as Coan has at times when pressured this season.

I simply don't see the same player. And that's why he may never have gotten his job back at Wisconsin. They'd seen both the BEFORE and AFTER.

Which leads me to his recent ankle injury. Is it the same foot? Does anyone know? I've felt from the get-go that he might be heading towards another injury this season given ND's line. And I worry that even if he comes back from his recent injury with no ill effects, he's likely to get injured again.

Again, this is theory. Pure speculation. But my eyes aren't seeing the same guy in a blue jersey I watched in a red one.
 
I gotta say that I find this post to be quite ironic.

This guy is always screaming civility and yelling “tOxIc” and “TrOLl” but then posts an extremely childish comment about Mertz, calling him names and attacking his character.

Do you know him personally to be able to judge him in this manner?

I’m not a Mertz or Wisconsin fan but how would you respond if a Badger fan said such things about a ND player?

I’m sure you’re a former NFL All Pro QB and all but your assessment of him seems lowbrow.
That's what a decent ND fan does, is this even a serious post?? Or any fan of any team, and I would expect nothing less of a Wiscy fan, and would be disappointed if they didn't have some shit to throw our way. Not that they would have much to say to us after we stomped them. Barbs, loose talk, and other assorted insults are to be directed at one's opponents....

I hope you're trolling with this post and just being a punk. You can't really be that stupid, can you?
 
I guess there are situations when a coach can't come to a decision, he keeps going back and forth and it can screw things up for his team. And I guess if you only have one player at that position, then the decision is made for you.

However I just think that if I were a coach that I could handle that responsibility and thus I wouldn't mind having as many good options as I could get, and I wouldn't prefer to only have one... I do believe that expression is at least overused, if not completely stupid. I bet you Wiscy would rather have Jack Coan right now, on tap and available to go rather than not....
I agree with you for the most part. Just thought it was a perfect time for me to quote one of my favorite shows, lol (The Office).
 
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Here's some speculation on that situation. Pure speculation.

Is it possible that Coan never fully recovered from his injury and got (Wally) Pipped, as Goolsby likes to say, because he was somewhat damaged goods? And that ND took a chance on him anyway, judging the effects of his injury to be something less than disqualifying?

If you look at Coan's Wisconsin highlight reel, he's a much more mobile QB than he is today. And you don't get a lacrosse scholarship to ND -- as both an attacker and midfielder -- if you're not mobile. Lacrosse is NON-STOP RUNNING. Plus, there's body checking galore, and it doesn't work out too well for you if you go down as easily as Coan has at times when pressured this season.

I simply don't see the same player. And that's why he may never have gotten his job back at Wisconsin. They'd seen both the BEFORE and AFTER.

Which leads me to his recent ankle injury. Is it the same foot? Does anyone know? I've felt from the get-go that he might be heading towards another injury this season given ND's line. And I worry that even if he comes back from his recent injury with no ill effects, he's likely to get injured again.

Again, this is theory. Pure speculation. But my eyes aren't seeing the same guy in a blue jersey I watched in a red one.
That's what happened.... He got Wally Pipped. The same way Kizer Wally Pipped Malik Zaire, only BK wouldn't accept it. And it almost cost BK his job at ND, which is a reasonable commentary to make on the occasion of BK becoming the all-time winning coach at ND.

I agree that Coan's slow-footedness is confusing, given his lacrosse background and just his youtube highlights from Wiscy where he's moving around pretty good. In all seriousness, I think it's highly possible if Coan had stayed put, that he'd be starting right now. Wiscy is 1-2... and Mertz sucked! He's got more upside than Jack Coan, but he's off to a lousy start this year....

I'm just gonna say it, I'm kind of expecting to see Drew Pyne. I'll be surprised if we don't, possibly as early as this weekend vs UC. Which is fine by me, I was impressed as heck with what we saw in the 4th quarter, and I think that little guy can do it! He's not going to be too small.... But I'm not playing favorites, I like 'em both, just hoping we can cut down on the sacks....
 
That's what happened.... He got Wally Pipped. The same way Kizer Wally Pipped Malik Zaire, only BK wouldn't accept it. And it almost cost BK his job at ND, which is a reasonable commentary to make on the occasion of BK becoming the all-time winning coach at ND.

I agree that Coan's slow-footedness is confusing, given his lacrosse background and just his youtube highlights from Wiscy where he's moving around pretty good. In all seriousness, I think it's highly possible if Coan had stayed put, that he'd be starting right now. Wiscy is 1-2... and Mertz sucked! He's got more upside than Jack Coan, but he's off to a lousy start this year....

I'm just gonna say it, I'm kind of expecting to see Drew Pyne. I'll be surprised if we don't, possibly as early as this weekend vs UC. Which is fine by me, I was impressed as heck with what we saw in the 4th quarter, and I think that little guy can do it! He's not going to be too small.... But I'm not playing favorites, I like 'em both, just hoping we can cut down on the sacks....
Unless we mix up the oline, roll the pocket, do something with that oline, no QB will have sustained success. Our oline, as it is now, is flat awful. We can't run the ball, and some receivers can't get off the line. A recipe for injury to the QB
 
Unless we mix up the oline, roll the pocket, do something with that oline, no QB will have sustained success. Our oline, as it is now, is flat awful. We can't run the ball, and some receivers can't get off the line. A recipe for injury to the QB
It's true, it's really bad. And that's one of the reasons we might see Drew Pyne! He's quicker of foot, and it was visibly noticeable when he was in there, and he didn't look as troubled by the collapsing pocket as Coan has this season. In addition to Coan's injury which supposedly is not an issue, but we'll see how that plays out....

And so we'll see. I'm down with Drew Pyne if he gets the call. Hopefully we see both, Pyne-Coan, baby!
 
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That's what a decent ND fan does, is this even a serious post?? Or any fan of any team, and I would expect nothing less of a Wiscy fan, and would be disappointed if they didn't have some shit to throw our way. Not that they would have much to say to us after we stomped them. Barbs, loose talk, and other assorted insults are to be directed at one's opponents....

I hope you're trolling with this post and just being a punk. You can't really be that stupid, can you?
Dude, you are total garbage. You are a walking contradiction, you scream wokeness and then slander a 19/20 yr old young man, calling him names and questioning his character.

I’ve talked trash to other fans but for being the “tRoLl” you claim me to be, I’ve never called an opposing teams players pieces of shit ot little bitches before.

I’m no expert but you were clearly bullied as a kid, you’re victim hood oozes out in every response. You scream “tOxICiTy” but then attack players and fellow posters constantly.

I’m not a particularly violent man but I wouldn’t mind putting a few of your teeth in a jar.
 
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Dude, you are total garbage. You are a walking contradiction, you scream wokeness and then slander a 19/20 yr old young man, calling him names and questioning his character.

I’ve talked trash to other fans but for being the “tRoLl” you claim me to be, I’ve never called an opposing teams players pieces of shit ot little bitches before.

I’m no expert but you were clearly bullied as a kid, you’re victim hood oozes out in every response. You scream “tOxICiTy” but then attack players and fellow posters constantly.

I’m not a particularly violent man but I wouldn’t mind putting a few of your teeth in a jar.
Geez, I thought you were going to come around. Apparently not. I'm all high and shit, and here you are stomping around and fuming and making a scene. I'm not up for all this, I'll tell you that.

So I gotta go, but I'll leave with this. When soldiers are at war and whatnot, which is a common metaphor for football so I'm going to go ahead and use it... They point their guns at the enemy.... You get it?

But you're so desperate to get the upper hand that here you are condemning me for talking some shit about the team we just ass-whupped...

Anyway, you're tripping, and I'm out of here....
 
Geez, I thought you were going to come around. Apparently not. I'm all high and shit, and here you are stomping around and fuming and making a scene. I'm not up for all this, I'll tell you that.

So I gotta go, but I'll leave with this. When soldiers are at war and whatnot, which is a common metaphor for football so I'm going to go ahead and use it... They point their guns at the enemy.... You get it?

But you're so desperate to get the upper hand that here you are condemning me for talking some shit about the team we just ass-whupped...

Anyway, you're tripping, and I'm out of here....
You’re a twat, and saying a 19/20 year old young man is a bitch or a POS isn’t trash talking, it’s just being a douche. If it’s not something you’d say to his face, then it makes you nothing more than a coward IMO. That’s why I’m comfortable calling you a twat or a douche.

As a vet and career LEO, I’m certain a metaphor is as close as you’ll ever get to the fray there Meth head.
 
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You’re a twat, and saying a 19/20 year old young man is a bitch or a POS isn’t trash talking, it’s just being a douche. If it’s not something you’d say to his face, then it makes you nothing more than a coward IMO. That’s why I’m comfortable calling you a twat or a douche.

As a vet and career LEO, I’m certain a metaphor is as close as you’ll ever get to the fray there Meth head.
Yeah, you're definitely right about that. I forgot about the possibility that I could be talking to a military dude. My mistake....

In any case, I'll go ahead and put you on ignore.
 
That's what happened.... He got Wally Pipped. The same way Kizer Wally Pipped Malik Zaire, only BK wouldn't accept it. And it almost cost BK his job at ND, which is a reasonable commentary to make on the occasion of BK becoming the all-time winning coach at ND.

I agree that Coan's slow-footedness is confusing, given his lacrosse background and just his youtube highlights from Wiscy where he's moving around pretty good. In all seriousness, I think it's highly possible if Coan had stayed put, that he'd be starting right now. Wiscy is 1-2... and Mertz sucked! He's got more upside than Jack Coan, but he's off to a lousy start this year....

I'm just gonna say it, I'm kind of expecting to see Drew Pyne. I'll be surprised if we don't, possibly as early as this weekend vs UC. Which is fine by me, I was impressed as heck with what we saw in the 4th quarter, and I think that little guy can do it! He's not going to be too small.... But I'm not playing favorites, I like 'em both, just hoping we can cut down on the sacks....
Yes, he might have started at Wisconsin, yet the staff there bet against it, and he bolted. Whereas ND took the other side of the trade -- Coan's side.

So far, it's worked out better for a) Coan at ND and b) ND than c) Mertz at Wisconsin and d) Wisconsin. But we're only one-third through the season.

As for Pyne, if it comes down to his playing, so be it. Whatever it takes.

I look at major league pitching staffs. When is any team's projected 5-man rotation ever healthy at once? One guy is usually coming off Tommy John surgery as another goes under the knife.

Attrition is REAL in college football. Injuries, transfers, early graduations.

It's all now part of the game.
 
Geez, I thought you were going to come around. Apparently not. I'm all high and shit, and here you are stomping around and fuming and making a scene. I'm not up for all this, I'll tell you that.

So I gotta go, but I'll leave with this. When soldiers are at war and whatnot, which is a common metaphor for football so I'm going to go ahead and use it... They point their guns at the enemy.... You get it?

But you're so desperate to get the upper hand that here you are condemning me for talking some shit about the team we just ass-whupped...

Anyway, you're tripping, and I'm out of here....
Please leave forever
 
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Dude, you are total garbage. You are a walking contradiction, you scream wokeness and then slander a 19/20 yr old young man, calling him names and questioning his character.

I’ve talked trash to other fans but for being the “tRoLl” you claim me to be, I’ve never called an opposing teams players pieces of shit ot little bitches before.

I’m no expert but you were clearly bullied as a kid, you’re victim hood oozes out in every response. You scream “tOxICiTy” but then attack players and fellow posters constantly.

I’m not a particularly violent man but I wouldn’t mind putting a few of your teeth in a jar.
Nice!!!
 
Sorry to disagree, but I think the stupidest platitude I've ever heard in any sport ever, is the one in football where if you have two QBs then you actually have none. Never made any sense to me, on almost any level at all. More like some schmo made it up, some hack sportswriter, and it stuck and it's been with us ever since, lowering the quality of debate and discussion of football right into the present day. To this day I really don't know what is supposed to meant by that obscure bit of purported wisdom.

In any case, we got Jack Coan, and I think Wisc really screwed up on that one. They're kicking themselves!
When has a D-1 college team or NFL team won a championship with QB’s sharing the snaps?
 
Yes, he might have started at Wisconsin, yet the staff there bet against it, and he bolted. Whereas ND took the other side of the trade -- Coan's side.

So far, it's worked out better for a) Coan at ND and b) ND than c) Mertz at Wisconsin and d) Wisconsin. But we're only one-third through the season.

As for Pyne, if it comes down to his playing, so be it. Whatever it takes.

I look at major league pitching staffs. When is any team's projected 5-man rotation ever healthy at once? One guy is usually coming off Tommy John surgery as another goes under the knife.

Attrition is REAL in college football. Injuries, transfers, early graduations.

It's all now part of the game.
Right, this is all true. That's why ND is going to have to come to terms with accepting transfers. Not just grad transfers like Coan, but undergrad transfers. Apparently Clemson is not big on taking undergrad transfers either, not so much because of academics, or credits or whatnot, just culturally, and their football culture, which I suppose is if not insular, probably pretty strong and dedicated, and that's why Clemson is as dominant as they are.

And quite possibly they're already slipping... on account of the free transfers racking their program going out, and yet no one coming in... which is a possible future ND is staring into the face as well. That's at least what a pair of pundits were speculating, as a possible explanation as to why Clemson is so off this year. Transfers...
 
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Right, this is all true. That's why ND is going to have to come to terms with accepting transfers. Not just grad transfers like Coan, but undergrad transfers. Apparently Clemson is not big on taking undergrad transfers either, not so much because of academics, or credits or whatnot, just culturally, and their football culture, which I suppose is if not insular, probably pretty strong and dedicated, and that's why Clemson is as dominant as they are.

And quite possibly they're already slipping... on account of the free transfers racking their program going out, and yet no one coming in... which is a possible future ND is staring into the face as well. That's at least what a pair of pundits were speculating, as a possible explanation as to why Clemson is so off this year. Transfers...
The transfer option has already changed the game and will continue to redistribute talent. Fewer good players will “wait their turn” or risk never seeing it but, instead, head for greener pastures. Simply because it’s now much easier.

As for ND, what do you mean by “coming to terms with” undergraduate transfers? Admissions are admissions, right? Anyone seeking to transfer to ND will still have to qualify. Meaning ND will still be looking at the same restricted pool it deals with as per annual recruiting.

But then, maybe I’m missing your point.

Do you mean the very idea of accepting undergraduate transfers? There have always been some. Pat Eilers, the starting “blocking” receiver on Holtz’s NC team, was a Yale transfer, while Alohi Gilman came from the Naval Academy.

So, in theory, there shouldn’t be a problem per se for qualified applicants from good schools. But if you mean throwing open the doors to would-be -- but as yet non-starting – “phenoms” from a host of lesser schools, I don’t see ND “coming to terms with” that.

The Clemson situation points to something interesting: the competing interests of necessary manpower vs. preserving one’s culture or even identity. Unless Clemson wishes to move more towards being just a competitive brand, rather than an ACTUAL year-in and year-out NC competitor, it will surely have to replace the number of transfers-out with transfers-in. Otherwise, its performance will suffer.

Assuming that the transfer issue indeed becomes unbalanced for them. "One swallow does not a summer make."

What ND will find out is how many of its carefully selected recruits – whose qualifications by definition must also include at least "some" academic competence – will prize their ND education over the chance to start at another high-profile and/or championship caliber school.

My guess is that many could take the opportunity to play elsewhere as almost all of them wish to become pros. And whereas a school like Clemson can bend things more easily so as to equalize the number of transfers in vs. out, ND may find it much harder.

In fact, what ND may have to “come to terms with” is operating in a TRANSFER PORTAL DEFICIT. And while there would still be plenty of openings for talented recruits out of HS – if for no other reason, the potential number of upperclassmen transferring out – it could become increasingly more difficult for ND to AMASS DEPTH.

If, as a rule, players start moving more -- simply because they’re sitting -- yet there’s less movement in a given team’s direction, THAT CAN REALLY MESS THINGS UP. In ND’s case it could lead to more WILLINGHAM-TYPE ROSTERS – where having more than ONE PLAYABLE QB at a time was a CHALLENGE.

I wanted to talk additionally about the difference between a COMPETITIVE BRAND and an ANNUAL NC COMPETITOR, but I’ll save that for another post.
 
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