And the 3-stars keep on coming. Kelly's only redeeming quality has been recruiting (except DL). He is a terrible game day coach with poor player development. Without great recruiting, he needs to go. If he blows games with ridiculous play calling when the team has better recruiting (blows at least 2 games a year with his inane decisions), how will he fair with a roster full of 3-stars. 8-5 with good talent. I guess we are a 6-6 team when he recruits like he is at Grand Valley.
How many more 3-star
- Thread starter Izo
- Start date
What should be of more concern - just because of the metrics the staff uses to identify talent some will move to 4 * - is how 4 & 5* either dismiss or no longer consider ND very seriously. The program is in a critical stage. The real world that evaluates Kelly and his program have concerns about him and his ability to take this program somewhere. That, to me, is one concern and the suspicion that recruits sense that Kelly is shallow as a man and do not believe he can deliver what he says his program will deliver. As I have said, Kelly has taken this as far as he can....next man in.
Nobody ever has an answer to that question. Or at least a realistic answer, i.e., no, Jon Gruden is NOT coming to coach ND.
I'm guessing that the posters have Saban or Meyer, neither of whom will ever coach ND, in mind.
Howard Hall 74 is our resident Indiana alum masquerading as an ND fan, Brian Davidson.
Bodizephax
I've posted how many times?
It's a good thing CJ Prosise was a 5 star out of HS. It looks like we are going to need him. Folston was a 4 star and he is very good. Bryant must have been a 3 star. I can't remember. Obviously I'm being sarcastic. Jaylon was a 5 star and is a star. Hey, the stars ARE indicators, nobody is arguing that. But there are a lot of teams that don't load up on all 4&5 star talent and they are very good. For example, TCU's recruiting would have a lot of people on this board ready to panic. They have committed In 2015 10 three stars and a two star so far this year. In 2015 they had a miserable recruiting season - 18 three stars and 2 two stars. In 2014 it was worse, they signed 12 three stars, 10 (TEN!) 2 stars, and 2 players NR (not rated). According to the recruiting gods, they should probably not have winning seasons ever, but we know different. Just saying...
you don't see posts like that on the Bama board or UGA or tOSU or....
BTW: CJP whereever he starts' will be a 1st year starter. Hold off on the College Hall of Fame induction till he plays a few games.
Before denegrating the rating system or trying to create a bogus success idea; first at least examine the past 10 years and (1) who were the best teams and how did they recruit? (2) ND recruiting at this level has been how successful?
BTW: CJP whereever he starts' will be a 1st year starter. Hold off on the College Hall of Fame induction till he plays a few games.
Before denegrating the rating system or trying to create a bogus success idea; first at least examine the past 10 years and (1) who were the best teams and how did they recruit? (2) ND recruiting at this level has been how successful?
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57- TCU is a byproduct of Texas talent. Guys who are two stars in Texas could in some instances be 3 stars if they had more exposure or stood out more. Same with some 3 stars. Also Gary Patterson is a top 5 coach. Finally TCU'S schedule is not NDs.
3.1 with 10 committments
As long as I been following recruiting on Rivals - this is the lowest rating by far at this stage.
Many of the regulars will recall beachcardinal and my discussions of the threshhold rating to put yourself in national contention. 3.66 was the minimum considered to get you in the national picture.
We are pretty sure 6-7 of these guys will get very meaningful bumps, and there will still be 6-8 additions to also "up" the average. But at this stage of the recruiting session in comparison to past sessions: way behind.
As long as I been following recruiting on Rivals - this is the lowest rating by far at this stage.
Many of the regulars will recall beachcardinal and my discussions of the threshhold rating to put yourself in national contention. 3.66 was the minimum considered to get you in the national picture.
We are pretty sure 6-7 of these guys will get very meaningful bumps, and there will still be 6-8 additions to also "up" the average. But at this stage of the recruiting session in comparison to past sessions: way behind.
Then I guess what you're saying is the rating system is currently wrong on 6-7 guys? Good. Then if the rating system bumps the 3 stars to 4 stars, the players are instantly better. I like that.
Let's be even more candid, this is the worst ranking, at this stage, in the last 15 years. You hope we get a bump - I see maybe 2-3 guys (which is typical because of the metrics applied in recruiting methodology by this staff), but beyond that...? Currently, we are somewhere between 30 - 40 in most recruiting sites. Do the recruits see something, sense something we don't? People should be asking, why aren't we closing? Is it the school and their standards? The staff and how they approach a recruit? Or, do the recruits sense Kelly is not someone they could feel comfortable with - both as a coach and a man? (ask Golson)
They have 20 of 22 starters back, the so called talent, "athleticism, swagger" etc...well, they better win, because if they can't, with this so called great group, they will really have trouble recruiting in the years to come.
actually 6 of the 3 stars are legit candidates to go 4. That would change the profile of the class.
But one has to recognize that the current propects considered the top part of the class are not resonating with whatever this staff is putting out as a message.
Red Flag time.
But one has to recognize that the current propects considered the top part of the class are not resonating with whatever this staff is putting out as a message.
Red Flag time.
Kelly does not care about the future or he would not be stocking up on 3 stars instead of letting the season play out. Not to intelligent. If we go 12-0, we could attract more elite recruits but by then the class will be filled with 2, 3 and a couple of 4 star recruits. It is obvious he is looking to bolt soon and just going through the motions. Welcome to The University of Notre Dame at Cincinnati.
The movement of the kids from 3 stars to 4 stars doesn't change the profile of the class it changes the perception of the class.
but there are currently commits that are soo obviously undervalued that few fans would object to them as commits;
the real problem is not the current list it, is that the list does not have any ready or ready in a year upper tier prospect to provide DL help. This is year 3 of this problem. If ND lands 2 such prospects the criticism drops off dramatically.
Kelly inherited similar issues along the OL and he took a few years to remedy that. It appears his successor will inherit DL problems.
the real problem is not the current list it, is that the list does not have any ready or ready in a year upper tier prospect to provide DL help. This is year 3 of this problem. If ND lands 2 such prospects the criticism drops off dramatically.
Kelly inherited similar issues along the OL and he took a few years to remedy that. It appears his successor will inherit DL problems.
That profile is the same though whether the undervalued kids get bumps or not. There is only a handful of fans complaining about the recruiting right now
outstanding prospect; but his position (G) - ND ought pass on him and go Defense. OL (G) is not a need.
It is the same old group of guys. I like to call them the "star gazers".
ND should not pass on Parker. If it was a zero sum issue and Parker meant they had to shut out a DL then maybe but as it stands now you take him and close out the OL for the cycle hoping you can hold on to the class. DE is a big need that will have to be addressed but ND's plan was to take 3 OL this year since they only took 2 last year after Tillery moved to the DL.
Sal, correct for reasons stated. Perse, DE is a problem area thus far, but forgoing the likes of Parker does nothing to solve this.
actually ND is doing 4 OL and the next has to be a T - DL looks like it may be a whiff.
My comment on PB was based entirely off position and no way questioned his abilities. Everyone is reporting he is a very good G prospect. But of all the positions to recruit G is probably the easiest to recruit.
ND may have gone 4 deep this cycle at OL if they had grabbed Bredeson. Not sure they are going to take a 4th now. You may be right but right now with the numbers I believe ND is done at OL.
I like this kid more than BB; because he is a definite G; but BB was iffy as to actual OL fit.
And, they want a T; if they find one they will take him; but not unless he is elite.
They still have Claypool on the must get list; another DB, 1 LB and 2 DL these are the obvious priorities; and then ND will take a RB and another WR. That's 7 ...so the Inn is about full.
No TE and no QB.
And, they want a T; if they find one they will take him; but not unless he is elite.
They still have Claypool on the must get list; another DB, 1 LB and 2 DL these are the obvious priorities; and then ND will take a RB and another WR. That's 7 ...so the Inn is about full.
No TE and no QB.
Bodizephax
I've posted how many times?
Offensively, stars aside, this might end as a very good offensive class.
Defensively, the DB group will be very good, if just a tier below the 'elite'
The problen is as it has been for 3 seasons: DL. Recruiting is such that just 2 key commits could change everything!
Defensively, the DB group will be very good, if just a tier below the 'elite'
The problen is as it has been for 3 seasons: DL. Recruiting is such that just 2 key commits could change everything!
Bodizephax
I've posted how many times?
Why would I wait, Brian? I know nothing about recruiting college football players. I leave that job to Brian Kelly and staff.
You can 't build a perennial power with 3-star athletes.But you can be 8-4 teams that Kelly has year after year . That 12-0 season was just luck .It happens .
TCU and Baylor have wide open offenses ,but I don't know if they are true championship type teams .
TCU and Baylor have wide open offenses ,but I don't know if they are true championship type teams .
After posting this Saturday morning , I went to the Rivals recruiting for 2016.I can't remember a time when Rivals listed only 1 ND commit (T.Kraemer) on the top 250 high- school list. Maybe during Willingham ,Davies years ? Usually we have 5-7 in the top 250 . Also of the remaining non- committed ,we are not high on their lists . Frustrating. I'll say it again ,"I hope we have a great season ."
