All big games are NOT equal

[88ND]

There appears to be quite a split crowd on pointing at these games as big game wins, ordinary wins, big game losses, etc....

So I will clarify my opinion of the big game. There are few tpes of big games. A big game that is mid season...a big game that is home...and or both.If you want to call them big games that is fine but they should come with an asterisk because it's not as hard as it gets due to mid season and being at home, etc. Examples of these
Home against NC State
Home against USC
Wins against Michigan at home
On the road against MSU. I put MSU in this category because East Lansing and the time of year that game is played is NEVER on the same level as the ones in the much more difficult group.
Oklahoma on the road in 12

A big game on the road in a hostile environment, a big game with much at stake later in the year with that chaotic environment. The biggest of all stages so to speak. Examples of these would be..
@Clemson in 15
@ Stanford in 15
@ FSU in 14
@Miami in 17
@Oklahoma in 12
*Note OU is on both lists because honestly that game could be looked at as either.
Any major bowl game.
NC title game against Bama
Kelly has proven he can win the first kind.

All the above is irrelevant when Kelly is having a bad year.

It only matters when he has a good team.

As you can see it's pretty damn black and white. When BK has a big game with a cushion like listed in the first group he does ok.

When we need that something extra from the coaching staff, whether it's through scheme or a mental rise to the us against the world mentality this is where the problem lies. Those seond group of games you just can't go on like business as usual. Those games require something extra.

Once you win one, the next will be easier because you've acutally now done it.

But god damn it in eight years that one big game with huge stakes win just keeps eluding us.

 

[nemeth#5]

You literally just took all the 'bigger games' and divided up the ones we won with the ones we lost just so you could cry more about how much you dislike BK......

Get over it dude.

 

[Toby Smart]

Big games in 2017......MSU, USC, NCST. Any of these games were considered elimination games and were played against good teams. They were previewed as much throughout the media. The Miami game was just another one of those games. Here lies the problem. Do you treat the Miami game as just another elimination game and risk complacency, only to find out the the Canes are treating it like a national title game or do you hype the game all week at practice and possibly give your team the heebee geebees? You know, that stunned deer in the headlight look once they enter the stadium? We all get the point about unprepared for the defining "big game". That was actually asked in a BK presser recently. I think Eric Hanson asked the question.

 

[nemeth#5]

If we get that 2 point conversion against Clemson in '15 and go on to beat them.... they don't go to the NC.... and 88nd is saying that 'isn't a real big game' as it was in October and Clemson wasn't even that good!

 

[88ND]

If we get that 2 point conversion against Clemson in '15 and go on to beat them.... they don't go to the NC.... and 88nd is saying that 'isn't a real big game' as it was in October and Clemson wasn't even that good!

Two things O' great lover of mediocre performance

#1....88 WOULD include that as a big win. Do not speak for me ever thank you very much.

#2....woulda coulda shoiulda...you can piss and moan if we get the two, if we get this , if if if if if
you can "if" all day long becasue the IF was cemented with DIDN'T

 

[justified1]

In hindsight, Some games, especially early season, were big games in that they eventually had an effect on national developments.
Some games are big games to the respective fan basis, but really are not viewed as national interest nor impact games.

But like Sat. some games are hyped in the days leading up as having clear national implications.
Also NC contests, BCS bowl games (in past seasons) and NY6 bowl games or other post sesson games where it is a game with a nationally prominant team or coach.

Other games fans view in considering a ‘big time’ coach are records vs higher ranked teams or Teams ranked in the Top 10; or upsetting a team significantly ranked higher which carries over to public perceptions and recruiting.

General rule, if you don’t know it is or was a big game, then it was not. You cannot debate a past game into the belief it was a big game.

 

[nemeth#5]

I must be crazy for thinking the SC and Michigan St game were 'big games'........

Either way, it is a silly irrelevant argument. Some people some people are passionate about firing BK (with no plan to replace him) and there is nothing that can be said to change their mind.

 

[twalsh]

General rule, if you don’t know it is or was a big game, then it was not. You cannot debate a past game into the belief it was a big game.

True, but winning the game, and hence giving the opponent another loss, does not reduce a "big" game to being just another game. But we seem to have many many fans who think that way. You have to measure the "bigness" of the game based upon the importance associated with the game in the week leading up to the game, and ONLY then. It doesn't change, either way, retroactively.

USC in 2017 was a big fork in the road game for ND. Finish the first half 5-1 and still be relevant down the stretch this season, finish 4-2 and be out of the discussion in the middle of October, with several toss up games still to play. It was a big game, a highly anticipated game, with high stakes involved. That doesn't change.

This is a very tired debate.

 

[88ND]

I must be crazy for thinking the SC and Michigan St game were 'big games'........

Either way, it is a silly irrelevant argument. Some people some people are passionate about firing BK (with no plan to replace him) and there is nothing that can be said to change their mind.

Are you saying the games in East lansing are on the same level with the big games I listed. It's not even close. The atmosphere, the stakes at the time because it's always played so early.

One question and one constant theme with the games i listed.
Why do the Irish players look like deer in headlights in the listed gamesI noted. Not one of them mind you..but all of them. Every single one.

You know the best game I think BK ever coached was on the rad against FSU. He was absolutley spot on with the play calling all game long. We didn't get the W but if we would perform like that in all the big games we'd actually win some of those.

 

[nemeth#5]

Are you saying the games in East lansing are on the same level with the big games I listed. It's not even close. The atmosphere, the stakes at the time because it's always played so early.

One question and one constant theme with the games i listed.
Why do the Irish players look like deer in headlights in the listed gamesI noted. Not one of them mind you..but all of them. Every single one.

You know the best game I think BK ever coached was on the rad against FSU. He was absolutley spot on with the play calling all game long. We didn't get the W but if we would perform like that in all the big games we'd actually win some of those.

I don't think they looked like deer in the headlights against Clemson, FSU, or Oklahoma when they won.... hell, even against Stanford they played decent and the prevent defense in the last 30 seconds prevented them from making the playoffs lol.....

 

[88ND]

I don't think they looked like deer in the headlights against Clemson, FSU, or Oklahoma when they won.... hell, even against Stanford they played decent and the prevent defense in the last 30 seconds prevented them from making the playoffs lol.....

We watched two different teams then. Clemson game we very much were in awe of the atmosphere until the middle of the second quarter. You can't spot teams points and time in these games. As I said the Oklahoma game could be considered a big game or bigger type game. I personally feel that was the most one dimensional OU team since Switzer.

It seems you are perfectly happy with the program and the performance over the last eight years.

I prefer to reach a little higher than just getting close. That speaks not only for the big game but the season as a whole.

 

[nemeth#5]

We watched two different teams then. Clemson game we very much were in awe of the atmosphere until the middle of the second quarter. You can't spot teams points and time in these games. As I said the Oklahoma game could be considered a big game or bigger type game. I personally feel that was the most one dimensional OU team since Switzer.

It seems you are perfectly happy with the program and the performance over the last eight years.

I prefer to reach a little higher than just getting close. That speaks not only for the big game but the season as a whole.

I am just not into bitching about things without providing a solution. We will agree to disagree.

 

[tkirish]

I think the main thing is this. At some point if you are Brian Kelly you have to win games on the road against very good teams. Miami. Clemson , FSU , Stanford , Alabama and Ohio state ( bowl games). I give him credit for Oklahoma in '12 and USC in '12. Most of the time they haven't faired to well on the road in big games. All this back and forth doesn't change the fact that in 8 years, ND is still an average program. 2012 was a good year and this year may end up being good depending on the last 3 games. The jury is still out. We can debate " big wins" all we want. The facts speak for themselves. Simply look at the record each year since Kelly has been here and draw your own conclusion. Mine is simple. Kelly is a good coach who looks like he has peaked as coach of the Irish.

 

[tbonesays]

I'm afraid our middle tier common opponents like Sparty and NCST are just not going to reach "big game" status no matter how well they perform.

Part of the term refers to whether the game is circled before the season and how much hoopala the talking heads give.

Also it's early in the season, so no one really knows if its has juuuge playoff implications (now that the regular season is devalued). If we got to play Sparty last like 1966 then it would be different but it's not.

 

[NyyorkerND]

There appears to be quite a split crowd on pointing at these games as big game wins, ordinary wins, big game losses, etc....

So I will clarify my opinion of the big game. There are few tpes of big games. A big game that is mid season...a big game that is home...and or both.If you want to call them big games that is fine but they should come with an asterisk because it's not as hard as it gets due to mid season and being at home, etc. Examples of these
Home against NC State
Home against USC
Wins against Michigan at home
On the road against MSU. I put MSU in this category because East Lansing and the time of year that game is played is NEVER on the same level as the ones in the much more difficult group.
Oklahoma on the road in 12

A big game on the road in a hostile environment, a big game with much at stake later in the year with that chaotic environment. The biggest of all stages so to speak. Examples of these would be..
@Clemson in 15
@ Stanford in 15
@ FSU in 14
@Miami in 17
@Oklahoma in 12
*Note OU is on both lists because honestly that game could be looked at as either.
Any major bowl game.
NC title game against Bama
Kelly has proven he can win the first kind.

All the above is irrelevant when Kelly is having a bad year.

It only matters when he has a good team.

As you can see it's pretty damn black and white. When BK has a big game with a cushion like listed in the first group he does ok.

When we need that something extra from the coaching staff, whether it's through scheme or a mental rise to the us against the world mentality this is where the problem lies. Those seond group of games you just can't go on like business as usual. Those games require something extra.

Once you win one, the next will be easier because you've acutally now done it.

But god damn it in eight years that one big game with huge stakes win just keeps eluding us.

Dude in college football you only play 12 games if you're not in a conference. All 12 are big games. It's just silly to debate otherwise. The only truly biggest game was Alabama in the natty and we lost to the BETTER TEAM, case closed.

 

[bizzybecknd]

Are you saying the games in East lansing are on the same level with the big games I listed. It's not even close. The atmosphere, the stakes at the time because it's always played so early.

One question and one constant theme with the games i listed.
Why do the Irish players look like deer in headlights in the listed gamesI noted. Not one of them mind you..but all of them. Every single one.

You know the best game I think BK ever coached was on the rad against FSU. He was absolutley spot on with the play calling all game long. We didn't get the W but if we would perform like that in all the big games we'd actually win some of those.

The fact is- Miami was only a Big game because of other big games won prior- USC, MSU, NC State. ND was only in a position to be in this big game because they beat #12 by 35, #14, and MSU whose been as high as #13.

 

[HRC08]

You literally just took all the 'bigger games' and divided up the ones we won with the ones we lost just so you could cry more about how much you dislike BK......

Get over it dude.

And he believes only road games against ranked teams are true big games. I wonder if ranked teams playing at NDS consider those games, “big”? Example: did USC, Georgia and NC State label their games at NDS any differently then the home Irish? Doubtful.

 

[88ND]

Dude in college football you only play 12 games if you're not in a conference. All 12 are big games. It's just silly to debate otherwise. The only truly biggest game was Alabama in the natty and we lost to the BETTER TEAM, case closed.

So all games are of equal value then? Oooook

Thank you for writing.

 

[theskibro]

The fact is- Miami was only a Big game because of other big games won prior- USC, MSU, NC State. ND was only in a position to be in this big game because they beat #12 by 35, #14, and MSU whose been as high as #13.

The OP makes a strong point

Bottom line and no one can argue against if even those sniffing Kelly’s crouch —. He flat out sux in big games. You cannot count sc n ncs 2017 as big games. Each team had at least one loss and ranked in teens

Miami 2017 was undefeated and #7. Oklahoma 2012 was the only big win Kelly has achieved

 

[NyyorkerND]

So all games are of equal value then? Oooook

Thank you for writing.

So then let's lose all the games and win your "big game" it's an absurd discussion. Just cut the bs and say if we don't win a national championship I don't care if we win.

 

[88ND]

And he believes only road games against ranked teams are true big games. I wonder if ranked teams playing at NDS consider those games, “big”? Example: did USC, Georgia and NC State label their games at NDS any differently then the home Irish? Doubtful.

You seemingly find a way to defend mediocre...

I prefer to reach just a little higher.

8 years and counting of...........
Tulsa losses, injury blame, thud..it's called thud, 4-8 seasons, turnovers, shopping from a different aisle.

Seriously we've heard them all yet you defend that. Defend excuses. I'm looking for results.

Thanks.

 

[88ND]

So then let's lose all the games and win your "big game" it's an absurd discussion. Just cut the bs and say if we don't win a national championship I don't care if we win.

Titles will take care of themselves. I never said its title or bust. Never ever once. Assume somewhere else. Thanks.

Your response right there that they're all big games...

Holy Jesus then
....so far this year Kelly has eight excruciatingly huge wins then...right?

You reckon he deserves a raise now?

GMAFB

 

[NyyorkerND]

Titles will take care of themselves. I never said its title or bust. Never ever once. Assume somewhere else. Thanks.

Your response right there that they're all big games...

Holy Jesus then
....so far this year Kelly has eight excruciatingly huge wins then...right?

You reckon he deserves a raise now?

GMAFB

Dude you're like every delusional ND fan that thinks we're still special.

If you don't understand that no game is more important than the other especially in college football then I can't help you.

Your approach to preparing for games should never change, if your approach is every game is a "big game" ask any successful coach/player in general and they would tell you that.

He deserves credit for turning a program around from a 4 an 8 season. I came into the year hoping we would have a 8 win season and it looks like we'll finish better than that so he's exceeded my expectations.

 

[88ND]

Dude you're like every delusional ND fan that thinks we're still special.

If you don't understand that no game is more important than the other especially in college football then I can't help you.

Your approach to preparing for games should never change, if your approach is every game is a "big game" ask any successful coach/player in general and they would tell you that.

He deserves credit for turning a program around from a 4 an 8 season. I came into the year hoping we would have a 8 win season and it looks like we'll finish better than that so he's exceeded my expectations.

First of all your repeated use of the word dude is pretty telling.
It's no longer trendy nor was ever mature.

Secondly I don't need help from anyone that strives for mediocrity. I'll tell you something to help you though.....
What you're saying is the preparation needs to be same each and every week no matter the opponent.

Tell you what smart guy, BK breaks your rule of thumb all the time yet you're a supporter of his? Makes so much sense.

How about I will correct your statement to be just a little more accurate.

Every college football game is IMPORTANT.
Some are certainly bigger than others.

There you go. That's much better. You're welcome.

 

[NyyorkerND]

First of all your repeated use of the word dude is pretty telling.
It's no longer trendy nor was ever mature.

Secondly I don't need help from anyone that strives for mediocrity. I'll tell you something to help you though.....
What you're saying is the preparation needs to be same each and every week no matter the opponent.

Tell you what smart guy, BK breaks your rule of thumb all the time yet you're a supporter of his? Makes so much sense.

How about I will correct your statement to be just a little more accurate.

Every college football game is IMPORTANT.
Some are certainly bigger than others.

There you go. That's much better. You're welcome.

I don't need help correcting my statement, I made it. I don't know you, so the usage of the word "dude" is a figure of speech and since the convo is going no where I'm done, since you only seem to want to argue an idiotic point bc you're mad we lost.

 

[88ND]

I don't need help correcting my statement, I made it. I don't know you, so the usage of the word "dude" is a figure of speech and since the convo is going no where I'm done, since you only seem to want to argue an idiotic point bc you're mad we lost.

Whoa...finally sonething a little accurate. Just not the whole story.

You're right and unlike yourself I was pissed about Saturday night.

You will have to tell me sometime your secret in celebrating losses.

The part you fail to mention because you're assuming again is you want to act like I'm just pissy ONLY because of Saturday. WRONG.

I'm pissed because I'm tired of BK's excuses for failure. Taking ND into hostile territory and looking like we just started playing football.
The tease of getting close, just not close enough.

You'd think that even by accident he'd win a couple of these big games over the years. Hell just winning a couple of them would do such wonders for the program.

 

[tbonesays]

Dude in college football you only play 12 games if you're not in a conference. All 12 are big games. It's just silly to debate otherwise. The only truly biggest game was Alabama in the natty and we lost to the BETTER TEAM, case closed.

Odd example as Bama has 3 big games at most this year until January.

 

[Pennick44]

There appears to be quite a split crowd on pointing at these games as big game wins, ordinary wins, big game losses, etc....

So I will clarify my opinion of the big game. There are few tpes of big games. A big game that is mid season...a big game that is home...and or both.If you want to call them big games that is fine but they should come with an asterisk because it's not as hard as it gets due to mid season and being at home, etc. Examples of these
Home against NC State
Home against USC
Wins against Michigan at home
On the road against MSU. I put MSU in this category because East Lansing and the time of year that game is played is NEVER on the same level as the ones in the much more difficult group.
Oklahoma on the road in 12

A big game on the road in a hostile environment, a big game with much at stake later in the year with that chaotic environment. The biggest of all stages so to speak. Examples of these would be..
@Clemson in 15
@ Stanford in 15
@ FSU in 14
@Miami in 17
@Oklahoma in 12
*Note OU is on both lists because honestly that game could be looked at as either.
Any major bowl game.
NC title game against Bama
Kelly has proven he can win the first kind.

All the above is irrelevant when Kelly is having a bad year.

It only matters when he has a good team.

As you can see it's pretty damn black and white. When BK has a big game with a cushion like listed in the first group he does ok.

When we need that something extra from the coaching staff, whether it's through scheme or a mental rise to the us against the world mentality this is where the problem lies. Those seond group of games you just can't go on like business as usual. Those games require something extra.

Once you win one, the next will be easier because you've acutally now done it.

But god damn it in eight years that one big game with huge stakes win just keeps eluding us.

More blather from the board nitwit.
#courtesyflush

 

[hvillebill]

You seemingly find a way to defend mediocre...

I prefer to reach just a little higher.

8 years and counting of...........
Tulsa losses, injury blame, thud..it's called thud, 4-8 seasons, turnovers, shopping from a different aisle.

Seriously we've heard them all yet you defend that. Defend excuses. I'm looking for results.

Thanks.

88 - We all want better. We want consistency and yes we want to be competitive in all the big games and never get embarrassed.

With that said, I have to ask you: since you want BK gone now, what coach do you feel we can get that is willing to go to South Bend? And please answer the question because it's legitimate. I've asked other posters in the past only to get the tired response of "It's not my job".

 

[Crabwalkers]

88 - We all want better. We want consistency and yes we want to be competitive in all the big games and never get embarrassed.

With that said, I have to ask you: since you want BK gone now, what coach do you feel we can get that is willing to go to South Bend? And please answer the question because it's legitimate. I've asked other posters in the past only to get the tired response of "It's not my job".

Gee, where can we get a coach that does not get pissy with the media, does not make a fool of himself on the sidelines, does not throw his players under the bus, does not make excuses, does not fingerpoint, does not make ridiculous plays calls, does not interview for NFL gigs right before a NC game, does not consistently lose big games, does not speak as if inventing a new version of ebonics, does not game plan exactly the same for every team, and does not go 8-5 every year.

Yeah, real tough. I see your point. Lets just stick with this clown. LOL. Same tired argument.

HOW ABOUT ANYONE ELSE!!!!

 

[hvillebill]

Gee, where can we get a coach that does not get pissy with the media, does not make a fool of himself on the sidelines, does not throw his players under the bus, does not make excuses, does not fingerpoint, does not make ridiculous plays calls, does not interview for NFL gigs right before a NC game, does not consistently lose big games, does not speak as if inventing a new version of ebonics, does not game plan exactly the same for every team, and does not go 8-5 every year.

Yeah, real tough. I see your point. Lets just stick with this clown. LOL. Same tired argument.

HOW ABOUT ANYONE ELSE!!!!

So, we just put ANYBODY in there because you don't like BK. And what does that get us? While we're looking, why don't we just get the guy coaching at Kansas, or UTEP, or Rice, or Charlotte. At least we don't have BK anymore, right? Let's just go 1-11 so we can please you.

I realize you've probably never been in a management position with your job at 7-11, so I can't expect you to understand this sort of thing. Where I work, we don't make changes unless we feel we can do better. But that's just us.

 

[echowaker]

Gee, where can we get a coach that does not get pissy with the media, does not make a fool of himself on the sidelines, does not throw his players under the bus, does not make excuses, does not fingerpoint, does not make ridiculous plays calls, does not interview for NFL gigs right before a NC game, does not consistently lose big games, does not speak as if inventing a new version of ebonics, does not game plan exactly the same for every team, and does not go 8-5 every year.

Yeah, real tough. I see your point. Lets just stick with this clown. LOL. Same tired argument.

HOW ABOUT ANYONE ELSE!!!!

such a well thought out, educated response.

 

[88ND]

88 - We all want better. We want consistency and yes we want to be competitive in all the big games and never get embarrassed.

With that said, I have to ask you: since you want BK gone now, what coach do you feel we can get that is willing to go to South Bend? And please answer the question because it's legitimate. I've asked other posters in the past only to get the tired response of "It's not my job".

You're asking me the answer...i can certainly tell you a whole reset button needs pressed.

What I mean with that is when looking for a candidate it needs done with absolutely zero nostalgia in mind.
A new nostalgia needs to be built. Once a championship or two happens then we can reference the past along with it.

But the hiring needs done without thinking its a huge honor to be coaching here. While ultimately it is an honor but I echo again that all arrogance and nostalgia needs removed from any talk and thinking.

We need to be prepared to open the check book as well. If we want to set the bar in college football again then we need to understand we get what we pay for.
If we can afford four million per year now you better believe we can afford 8-10. The revenue our football program generates is nearly second to none. Maybe that's the number. 8-10. We certainly need to be prepared to pay that though.

I believe right now ND has a reputation that you can't win with its restrictions, etc.

So we have to make it extremely attractive and give some extra incentive to draw a big name.

You want a list of names which I will not address at this time. Once word gets out that we are stepping up to the plate now plus some extra, we'll get a real good idea how much interest is out there.

So I would dismiss BK and begin by doing the above. It won't take long for word to get out that Notre Dame is looking for a top coach and is willing to pay for it plus some.

As far as you making fun of someone and saying they're not a manager of something....

Well on the same note I can say with your thinking you've NEVER been in business or you own a business that is stagnant and stale.

There are risks all the time. There are no guarantees. If we stand idle though that only guarantees our program stays idle.

If you do business afraid of failure you'll never reach lofty goals.

You must ask yourself if you're satisfied with the success Brian Kelly brings to the table then no change needed. You won't be an elite team and maybe you're OK with that.

If you want to reach a little higher though and get ND back where it belongs it's going to take a little risk, a lot of money, and a mindset of not stopping until we are elite.

We have the money...you have the courage to take the risk? I do.

 

[South Bender]

BK is a good coach. Winning at UND requires a great coach.

We were on the cusp of greatness in '15 and '17, but just can't seem to finish it out. BK got us up the hill, but can't get us over the hill. We are so, so close though.

 

[ndfi65]

I must be crazy for thinking the SC and Michigan St game were 'big games'........

Either way, it is a silly irrelevant argument. Some people some people are passionate about firing BK (with no plan to replace him) and there is nothing that can be said to change their mind.

And some people no matter how many 8 win seasons or mediocre performances by bk, still think hes the greatest. All we need to do is give him more time.....like 8 more fricking years!

 

[justified1]

And some people no matter how many 8 win seasons or mediocre performances by bk, still think hes the greatest. All we need to do is give him more time.....like 8 more fricking years!

I am standing neutral on the matter, but whenever a question is put out why is Kelly ‘Top 5’ the question is ignored. When a poster posts stats or reasons why the think it is time for change, the replys are not in form of reasons why they think he is ‘great’, but instead the replies are just to attack the opposing poster or other sarcasms.

 

[ndfi65]

I am standing neutral on the matter, but whenever a question is put out why is Kelly ‘Top 5’ the question is ignored. When a poster posts stats or reasons why the think it is time for change, the replys are not in form of reasons why they think he is ‘great’, but instead the replies are just to attack the opposing poster or other sarcasms.

67-32 with no major bowl wins in eight years at ND is mediocre in my book

 

[HRC08]

You seemingly find a way to defend mediocre...

I prefer to reach just a little higher.

8 years and counting of...........
Tulsa losses, injury blame, thud..it's called thud, 4-8 seasons, turnovers, shopping from a different aisle.

Seriously we've heard them all yet you defend that. Defend excuses. I'm looking for results.

Thanks.

Yeah and so are all of us. We just chose to post about it in a different way.

Some of you wanted Kelly gone after last season and refuse to acknowledge any improvements made this season because of two loses to teams of equal talent.

Some of the same group (like myself) that wished we replaced Kelly have watched all of the games and choose (rightly or wrongly) to accept the results because we see an improvement on the field and from the sideline. I mean it’s our right, right? Or can reasonable people not see the same things and disagree about the path forward?

You would do what exactly? Go back into the future or cast some sort of Spell removing Brian Kelly from his position and replay all of the games? Or are you just planting a seed of the position of wanting a new coach next season? Do you honestly think that will happen after going 4-8, replacing half of his staff and he keeping his job?

The AD’s job is to take everything into account. So... ND currently has a Rivals top 10 recruiting class, is 8-2 and will be favored this weekend. So for the sake of looking forward, let’s say they win this weekend and lose at Stanford and in the bowl game. That’s a 9-4 season with a first year Qb, Offensive Coordinator and a Defensive Coordinator in his first season with the Irish. Remember that they’ll likely rebound from a disastrous end to last season’s recruiting cycle to land a consensus 10th-15th ranked class.

And that’s the glass half empty scenario. What if they win this weekend and find a way to beat Stanford? Even if they were to lose the bowl game that would be a 10-3 year with all 3 loses being at the hands of top 10 teams. God forbid they find a way to beat all of their remaining opponents, right? 11-2. They could do it but I’ll concede that that is highly unlikely given how lethargic the offense has been in the two loses. Of course I say that not knowing what Stanford’s and the yet to be determined bowl opponent’s run defenses are like. That’s the rub right? Defenses that can stop the running attack are likely to throttle the Irish offense given the inexperience (some have said lack of talent but again I chose to see improvement from a vastly inexperienced passer in Wimbush. In HS I doubt he had to worry much about reading defenses and trying to beat players with more athletic abilities then him) of the Irish passing game. Remember it’s not just Wimbush that’s green but also his receivers. None of which have had to be counted on to be the #1 target much less having the luxury of possessing skills that we’ve seen from past ND great like Will Fuller, Michael Floyd or to a lesser degree, Jeff Samardzija. And that not evening factoring in the Tight Ends ND has had in recent years.

Sorry for being so wordy and admittingly probably being all of the map but I sure you can sense my passion and will give me a pass. Listen, sir... we all read your words and sympathize with you because at the end of the day (game) we all want the game things that you want. We all want a title or at the very least to see the Irish get over these (your words) Big Game hiccups and be competitive. As recently as 2014 and 2015, ND went in hostile ACC territory and was one or two plays from pulling off the type of performance you are longing for. Remember that please and consider how differently you’d feel about Brian Kelly if his teams had won at Florida State and Clemson.

I honestly think that the Irish are on the right track. I won’t kid myself or insult you by claiming that they are “almost” there because Idk if they are. Again I watch the games and certainly see areas of huge concern or at the least areas that need improvement before any of of can say they are on the brink.

Anyway I don’t want to come off as being completely dismissive of your post and apologize it I’ve given that impression. Truthfully i remember you saying (or atleast I think it was you) that you would admit that keeping Brian Kelly was the right move only after a victory at Miami. While wins against USC and NC State were enough for me to say I was glad I didn’t get my way when JS decided against firing Kelly after last season. You set the bar higher then I did and much higher then other posters. Again reasonable people sometimes disagree. We’ll see how the rest of the season plays out.

 

[HRC08]

Dude you're like every delusional ND fan that thinks we're still special.

If you don't understand that no game is more important than the other especially in college football then I can't help you.

Your approach to preparing for games should never change, if your approach is every game is a "big game" ask any successful coach/player in general and they would tell you that.

He deserves credit for turning a program around from a 4 an 8 season. I came into the year hoping we would have a 8 win season and it looks like we'll finish better than that so he's exceeded my expectations.

I disagree. ND’s coaching staff might agree with you and perhaps that’s why they sometimes get off to less then fast starts. Similar to a golfer that’s looking to avoid highs and lows, I understand trying to keep your emotions in check. That’s all fine and good unless your opponent is playing on a high. You can’t always wait that out or else you risk losing the game in the first quarter. I believe that passion and demand for perfection begins in practice. Practicing as if every game is the same isn’t practical because the players will see thru that. Some games are just bigger then others.

 

[88ND]

Yeah and so are all of us. We just chose to post about it in a different way.

Some of you wanted Kelly gone after last season and refuse to acknowledge any improvements made this season because of two loses to teams of equal talent.

Some of the same group (like myself) that wished we replaced Kelly have watched all of the games and choose (rightly or wrongly) to accept the results because we see an improvement on the field and from the sideline. I mean it’s our right, right? Or can reasonable people not see the same things and disagree about the path forward?

You would do what exactly? Go back into the future or cast some sort of Spell removing Brian Kelly from his position and replay all of the games? Or are you just planting a seed of the position of wanting a new coach next season? Do you honestly think that will happen after going 4-8, replacing half of his staff and he keeping his job?

The AD’s job is to take everything into account. So... ND currently has a Rivals top 10 recruiting class, is 8-2 and will be favored this weekend. So for the sake of looking forward, let’s say they win this weekend and lose at Stanford and in the bowl game. That’s a 9-4 season with a first year Qb, Offensive Coordinator and a Defensive Coordinator in his first season with the Irish. Remember that they’ll likely rebound from a disastrous end to last season’s recruiting cycle to land a consensus 10th-15th ranked class.

And that’s the glass half empty scenario. What if they win this weekend and find a way to beat Stanford? Even if they were to lose the bowl game that would be a 10-3 year with all 3 loses being at the hands of top 10 teams. God forbid they find a way to beat all of their remaining opponents, right? 11-2. They could do it but I’ll concede that that is highly unlikely given how lethargic the offense has been in the two loses. Of course I say that not knowing what Stanford’s and the yet to be determined bowl opponent’s run defenses are like. That’s the rub right? Defenses that can stop the running attack are likely to throttle the Irish offense given the inexperience (some have said lack of talent but again I chose to see improvement from a vastly inexperienced passer in Wimbush. In HS I doubt he had to worry much about reading defenses and trying to beat players with more athletic abilities then him) of the Irish passing game. Remember it’s not just Wimbush that’s green but also his receivers. None of which have had to be counted on to be the #1 target much less having the luxury of possessing skills that we’ve seen from past ND great like Will Fuller, Michael Floyd or to a lesser degree, Jeff Samardzija. And that not evening factoring in the Tight Ends ND has had in recent years.

Sorry for being so wordy and admittingly probably being all of the map but I sure you can sense my passion and will give me a pass. Listen, sir... we all read your words and sympathize with you because at the end of the day (game) we all want the game things that you want. We all want a title or at the very least to see the Irish get over these (your words) Big Game hiccups and be competitive. As recently as 2014 and 2015, ND went in hostile ACC territory and was one or two plays from pulling off the type of performance you are longing for. Remember that please and consider how differently you’d feel about Brian Kelly if his teams had won at Florida State and Clemson.

I honestly think that the Irish are on the right track. I won’t kid myself or insult you by claiming that they are “almost” there because Idk if they are. Again I watch the games and certainly see areas of huge concern or at the least areas that need improvement before any of of can say they are on the brink.

Anyway I don’t want to come off as being completely dismissive of your post and apologize it I’ve given that impression. Truthfully i remember you saying (or atleast I think it was you) that you would admit that keeping Brian Kelly was the right move only after a victory at Miami. While wins against USC and NC State were enough for me to say I was glad I didn’t get my way when JS decided against firing Kelly after last season. You set the bar higher then I did and much higher then other posters. Again reasonable people sometimes disagree. We’ll see how the rest of the season plays out.

If you want to call Miami the game ok...

But more accurately what I said when asked what it would take to get in the kiss ass line...

My answer had nothing to do with record. I wasn't sour about Georgia.

My make or break with him is the big road game. The huge stakes game. I want to see him pull an upset against an elite team...team or setting. Saturday was perfect scenario wjth jusy how different things would be now. He can say we run now. He can say we play better D now...i mean Kelly saying this...etc etc etc..but he has to actually win one of those games. Bilk Walsh couod be doing the offense and he could have the 70's steel curtain playing D.....he still has to actually win one of
"those" games.

Saturday was a great opportunity to show just how much he and his team has turned the corner and things being different now.

The result was more of the same. Even more laughable then sone previous big games. So not only did we show we're really no further along than before, one could say we took a gigantic leap back from our fifteen amd 12 team.

Eight years is long enough. He's shown with two compete full recruiting classes now... He's shown just how far he can go.