Marcus Freeman, year 1 disappointment by the numbers

[chaseball]

ND finished #9 in F+ last year (2021) and had the #7 recruiting class (2022) under Brian Kelly

In steps Marcus Freeman, and ND finishes #29 in F+ (2022), and #10 in recruiting (2023) this past season.

Marcus Freeman was supposed to make up for being a lesser experienced coach with an ability to recruit better talent, but that isnt happening right now.

I'm having a hard time seeing where there's any improvement from the BK led version of the program. If these numbers don't improve noticeably next season, it's time for a white-hot seat in 2024.

The only thing going for Marcus Freeman after year 1 is that he's so green that his outlook is still very uncertain.

 

[Granite45]

ND finished #9 in F+ last year (2021) and had the #7 recruiting class (2022) under Brian Kelly

In steps Marcus Freeman, and ND finishes #29 in F+ (2022), and #10 in recruiting (2023) this past season.

Marcus Freeman was supposed to make up for being a lesser experienced coach with an ability to recruit better talent, but that isnt happening right now.

I'm having a hard time seeing where there's any improvement from the BK led version of the program (in fact, it's the opposite). If these numbers don't improve noticeably next season, it's time for a white-hot seat in 2024.

Then a great time for you to shift to a different team to follow.

 

[Notre Dame du Lac]

ND finished #9 in F+ last year (2021) and had the #7 recruiting class (2022) under Brian Kelly

In steps Marcus Freeman, and ND finishes #29 in F+ (2022), and #10 in recruiting (2023) this past season.

Marcus Freeman was supposed to make up for being a lesser experienced coach with an ability to recruit better talent, but that isnt happening right now.

I'm having a hard time seeing where there's any improvement from the BK led version of the program. If these numbers don't improve noticeably next season, it's time for a white-hot seat in 2024.

The only thing going for Marcus Freeman after year 1 is that he's so green that his outlook is still very uncertain.

Rees felt it was bs too. Nobody can say with a straight face that Freeman was qualified or earned that job. All we can do now is get behind him and hope for the best. The competition has a way of throwing it back in your face so if he does not stop losing to Marshall he’ll be gone soon. It’s particularly interesting he was hired as he’s also a defensive coach. Sometimes young guys like Riley get jobs since they’re so good with QBs. Let’s hope he figures it out.

 

[BGI User 756]

Now we just need nasty and TP for the rest of the circle jerk

 

[NDSMC78]

Then a great time for you to shift to a different team to follow.

I've been saying this for a long time. ND is not able to live up to chaseball's lofty expectations. He needs to go pull for Bama, UGA, or some other school.

 

[francade]

I agree w/ the thread’s sentiment about rooting for another team but I’m more on the ‘who gives a shit what this cyber metric geek thinks’ train.

 

[echowaker]

Rees felt it was bs too. Nobody can say with a straight face that Freeman was qualified or earned that job. All we can do now is get behind him and hope for the best. The competition has a way of throwing it back in your face so if he does not stop losing to Marshall he’ll be gone soon. It’s particularly interesting he was hired as he’s also a defensive coach. Sometimes young guys like Riley get jobs since they’re so good with QBs. Let’s hope he figures it out.

Sure seemed like he figured it out after the Marshall game. 9-2 with a back up QB is pretty good. The Stanford game was a real stinker but if you didn't see progress you weren't looking.

 

[Tru2Irish]

ND finished #9 in F+ last year (2021) and had the #7 recruiting class (2022) under Brian Kelly

In steps Marcus Freeman, and ND finishes #29 in F+ (2022), and #10 in recruiting (2023) this past season.

Marcus Freeman was supposed to make up for being a lesser experienced coach with an ability to recruit better talent, but that isnt happening right now.

I'm having a hard time seeing where there's any improvement from the BK led version of the program. If these numbers don't improve noticeably next season, it's time for a white-hot seat in 2024.

The only thing going for Marcus Freeman after year 1 is that he's so green that his outlook is still very uncertain.

He's had barely over a year of coaching as head of ND. Geez and you want to put down any accomplishments. How many years was BK head coach? How many connections did he have with HS coaching staff and schools? Freeman is just getting started. Let's talk reality. If not for this free agent,NIL stuff- he would have kKeeley,Moore and maybe Bowen[flake kid]. That's 3 five stars that might have drawn in a few others. Is it his fault NIL money isn't as good at ND as Bama,A&M,USC,LSU and some other places? He had to hang onto 22' class while recruiting 23' class. I think he has done fairly well. Kelly failed many times to pull in some top talent and lost some games he shouldn't have too. So 9-4 is not failure. Freeman is just beginning. Will he have hiccups along the way? Sure. I for one am glad to see BK gone. He could never get the team up for big games. Oh.maybe one Clemson game over how many years. I'm not about to put Kelly on a pedestal while demeaning Freeman. I sincerely hope and believe Freeman is gonna make you eat crow!!!

 

[TheSodFather]

ND finished #9 in F+ last year (2021) and had the #7 recruiting class (2022) under Brian Kelly

In steps Marcus Freeman, and ND finishes #29 in F+ (2022), and #10 in recruiting (2023) this past season.

Marcus Freeman was supposed to make up for being a lesser experienced coach with an ability to recruit better talent, but that isnt happening right now.

I'm having a hard time seeing where there's any improvement from the BK led version of the program. If these numbers don't improve noticeably next season, it's time for a white-hot seat in 2024.

The only thing going for Marcus Freeman after year 1 is that he's so green that his outlook is still very uncertain.

 

[Notre Dame du Lac]

He's had barely over a year of coaching as head of ND. Geez and you want to put down any accomplishments. How many years was BK head coach? How many connections did he have with HS coaching staff and schools? Freeman is just getting started. Let's talk reality. If not for this free agent,NIL stuff- he would have kKeeley,Moore and maybe Bowen[flake kid]. That's 3 five stars that might have drawn in a few others. Is it his fault NIL money isn't as good at ND as Bama,A&M,USC,LSU and some other places? He had to hang onto 22' class while recruiting 23' class. I think he has done fairly well. Kelly failed many times to pull in some top talent and lost some games he shouldn't have too. So 9-4 is not failure. Freeman is just beginning. Will he have hiccups along the way? Sure. I for one am glad to see BK gone. He could never get the team up for big games. Oh.maybe one Clemson game over how many years. I'm not about to put Kelly on a pedestal while demeaning Freeman. I sincerely hope and believe Freeman is gonna make you eat crow!!!

BK cut his teeth at a D2 school and is a self made man. While I may not like everything about BK, the man did it on his own and earned every bit it. He deserves to be at LSU. He spent 20 years moving up before ND even bothered considering him. Not comparable. We can root for Freeman while understanding the privilege afforded to him as well.

 

[echowaker]

BK cut his teeth at a D2 school and is a self made man. While I may not like everything about BK, the man did it on his own and earned every bit it. He deserves to be at LSU. He spent 20 years moving up before ND even bothered considering him. Not comparable. We can root for Freeman while understanding the privilege afforded to him as well.

" privilege " ? He was offered a job and took it. We all know why you have hated the hire from the get go. I doubt you are rooting for him at all.

 

[Notre Dame du Lac]

" privilege " ? He was offered a job and took it. We all know why you have hated the hire from the get go. I doubt you are rooting for him at all.

Typical excuse from your type. We all get your virtue signaling. I’m all in for Freeman’s success. I also like him personally, unlike BK. He’s a Catholic man that has values and presents a good image for the school. I hope he is the best coach in ND history. That doesn’t change that he’s the least experienced coach in ND history. Facts don’t lie. The odds are sometimes great and sometimes small. But Notre Dame will win over all. His odds go up tremendously if he makes good hires. So far he’s done a helluva job in hiring, with the exception of Al Washington. Ludwig would make his odd go up.

 

[d1042]

ND finished #9 in F+ last year (2021) and had the #7 recruiting class (2022) under Brian Kelly

In steps Marcus Freeman, and ND finishes #29 in F+ (2022), and #10 in recruiting (2023) this past season.

Marcus Freeman was supposed to make up for being a lesser experienced coach with an ability to recruit better talent, but that isnt happening right now.

I'm having a hard time seeing where there's any improvement from the BK led version of the program. If these numbers don't improve noticeably next season, it's time for a white-hot seat in 2024.

The only thing going for Marcus Freeman after year 1 is that he's so green that his outlook is still very uncertain.

MF did very well, Season 1. Metric measurements do not tell a full story, frequently can be misleading.
You seem to have a permanent wedgie re MF.

 

[3daughters]

Biggest MF’s disappointment…he’s not a douche like Bk and the OP.

 

[Get Nasty]

Then a great time for you to shift to a different team to follow.

So every time you don’t like the head coach of your team you should root for another team? Historically dumb comment… I don’t love freeman yet but nd has a good chance to be really good in 2023… if nd does freeman and nd could take off, If nd doesn’t have a great year it will really be clear why not

Pretty telling you get bothered with facts and stats

 

[sjb75]

I literally stopped reading at F+.

 

[Get Nasty]

I wanted Kelly gone after 2016 but he made massive changes and righted the program, I thought freeman should have been on the hot seat after the marshal disaster and cal almost disaster. Hard to learn in season as a head coach so 2023 to me will be very telling … there’s flat out no excuse to be worse than 10-2 this year

 

[NDSMC78]

So every time you don’t like the head coach of your team you should root for another team? Historically dumb comment… I don’t love freeman yet but nd has a good chance to be really good in 2023… if nd does freeman and nd could take off, If nd doesn’t have a great year it will really be clear why not

Pretty telling you get bothered with facts and stats

The OP complained for years about Brian Kelly. Many times he stated that ND needed to make a coaching change and that, no matter who ND hired, that person would be better than Brian Kelly. Now we have Marcus Freeman as our coach for one year, and already the OP is ready to run him off.
Additionally, the OP routinely disparages the ND administration. He thinks that ND should lighten up its admissions requirements so that it would be easier for some high school payers to be admitted to ND. In short, he views ND solely as a football team which, according to him is not winning enough football games on the field. He is unconcerned with anything else at ND.

 

[baron100]

I’m not going to fault someone for being ambitious but was he the most qualified candidate available— not even close. No O experience and still growing as a dc with under a year in the nd program—-he was a recruiter. Based on Jack’s speech there was going to be a thorough search and players could weigh -in but not determine who the new coach was going to be. Jack did just the opposite, he got hi jacked by current players and recruits like sneed who said they would leave. So we got who we got, a real nice guy who a bunch of young kids like. is he involved on the sidelines like saban is? Sure doesn’t look that way. But it’s our model for now, HC is head recruiter and DC/OC run their groups. So like it or not this is a growth model and everyone has to expect a few embarrassing speed bumps—Marshall, Stanford. Blame it on swarbrick for a lazy search but don’t blame it on freeman for being ambitious. And now we have to give him a few years no matter what happens. maybe it ends up working if you bring in top 2 classes year after year. I thought this year he would bring in a class like that and with Keeley , Bowen, Moore(s), edwards, he probably would have been top 3. Freeman to his credit has not used nil or academics as a hurdle, he’s actually said nil is not a hurdle. And for academics, we offered 63 of top 100 last year ( virtually same as sc and far more then most teams on our schedule) vs Bama at 72. Frankly freeman just whiffed on the big targets maybe he learned something and this year will go better. Again part of the 3-5 year learning process. He’s got everything he needs here, ( money, prestige, history, facilities, nd Rolodex, media backing), let’s see if he grows into it. no point in criticizing him at this point because he’s going nowhere for a few years. Support him and hope for the best

 

[Get Nasty]

The OP complained for years about Brian Kelly. Many times he stated that ND needed to make a coaching change and that, no matter who ND hired, that person would be better than Brian Kelly. Now we have Marcus Freeman as our coach for one year, and already the OP is ready to run him off.
Additionally, the OP routinely disparages the ND administration. He thinks that ND should lighten up its admissions requirements so that it would be easier for some high school payers to be admitted to ND. In short, he views ND solely as a football team which, according to him is not winning enough football games on the field. He is unconcerned with anything else at ND.

Yeah I hardly ever agree with op, but agree with him that we took a step back last year with game prep and coaching, that can’t happen in 23 with how good of a team we could have

We should all know how important coaching is due to 2015 and 2016…. We could have been undefeated with a competent DC in 2015 … we were super talented

 

[Golson5]

I wanted Kelly gone after 2016 but he made massive changes and righted the program, I thought freeman should have been on the hot seat after the marshal disaster and cal almost disaster. Hard to learn in season as a head coach so 2023 to me will be very telling … there’s flat out no excuse to be worse than 10-2 this year

Sure there is.

You can easily make a case that OSU, USC and Clemson are better teams than we are

And theres some other opponenets who could be dangerous

 

[sjb75]

Man In The Arena. "It's not the critic who counts..........."

Roosevelt was correct then, and spot on today.

 

[Notre Dame du Lac]

Man In The Arena. "It's not the critic who counts..........."

Roosevelt was correct then, and spot on today.

Jack is a critic. So are the people that buy tickets. Maybe the critic doesn’t count to you but it’s handed its fare share of men in the arena a pink slip whether it fits your faux historical narrative or not.

 

[sjb75]

Jack is a critic. So are the people that buy tickets. Maybe the critic doesn’t count to you but it’s handed it’s fare share of men in the arena a pink slip whether it fits your faux historical narrative or not.

Couch critics.

 

[Notre Dame du Lac]

Couch critics.

$$

 

[Patrirish]

The OP complained for years about Brian Kelly. Many times he stated that ND needed to make a coaching change and that, no matter who ND hired, that person would be better than Brian Kelly. Now we have Marcus Freeman as our coach for one year, and already the OP is ready to run him off.
Additionally, the OP routinely disparages the ND administration. He thinks that ND should lighten up its admissions requirements so that it would be easier for some high school payers to be admitted to ND. In short, he views ND solely as a football team which, according to him is not winning enough football games on the field. He is unconcerned with anything else at ND.

👍

 

[Patrirish]

I’m not going to fault someone for being ambitious but was he the most qualified candidate available— not even close. No O experience and still growing as a dc with under a year in the nd program—-he was a recruiter. Based on Jack’s speech there was going to be a thorough search and players could weigh -in but not determine who the new coach was going to be. Jack did just the opposite, he got hi jacked by current players and recruits like sneed who said they would leave. So we got who we got, a real nice guy who a bunch of young kids like. is he involved on the sidelines like saban is? Sure doesn’t look that way. But it’s our model for now, HC is head recruiter and DC/OC run their groups. So like it or not this is a growth model and everyone has to expect a few embarrassing speed bumps—Marshall, Stanford. Blame it on swarbrick for a lazy search but don’t blame it on freeman for being ambitious. And now we have to give him a few years no matter what happens. maybe it ends up working if you bring in top 2 classes year after year. I thought this year he would bring in a class like that and with Keeley , Bowen, Moore(s), edwards, he probably would have been top 3. Freeman to his credit has not used nil or academics as a hurdle, he’s actually said nil is not a hurdle. And for academics, we offered 63 of top 100 last year ( virtually same as sc and far more then most teams on our schedule) vs Bama at 72. Frankly freeman just whiffed on the big targets maybe he learned something and this year will go better. Again part of the 3-5 year learning process. He’s got everything he needs here, ( money, prestige, history, facilities, nd Rolodex, media backing), let’s see if he grows into it. no point in criticizing him at this point because he’s going nowhere for a few years. Support him and hope for the best

👍

 

[stu4don]

Yeah, bring back Charlie!

 

[stu4don]

Seriously? Let's dig in:

1. Beat top ten team, improvement.
2. Won bowl game, improvement.
3. Highest average recruit rating ('23) in ten years at 3.79 (during that time 3.59 was the highest), improvement.
4. Brought in #1 transfer recruit, a 6* QB, improvement.
5. Currently has the #2 ranked recruiting class for 2024, big improvement.
6. Including a (soon to be) 5* recruit at QB, improvement.

And... Coach Freeman did alls this with...

1. A brand new staff including six new coaches,,,
2. A starting QB who had never started a game, AND that QB was injured in game #2! (how may teams shined with that variable?)
3. Toughest schedule in the last five years.

Yes, he lost two games he never should have lost but he won a couple Kelly would not have won, (given the injury to his starting QB.) All in all a solid start for a very young coach in his first year at the helm.

I'm buying ND with Marcus as HC.

 

[Notre Dame du Lac]

Seriously? Let's dig in:

1. Beat top ten team, improvement.
2. Won bowl game, improvement.
3. Highest average recruit rating ('23) in ten years at 3.79 (during that time 3.59 was the highest), improvement.
4. Brought in #1 transfer recruit, a 6* QB, improvement.
5. Currently has the #2 ranked recruiting class for 2024, big improvement.
6. Including a (soon to be) 5* recruit at QB, improvement.

And... Coach Freeman did alls this with...

1. A brand new staff including six new coaches,,,
2. A starting QB who had never started a game, AND that QB was injured in game #2! (how may teams shined with that variable?)
3. Toughest schedule in the last five years.

Yes, he lost two games he never should have lost but he won a couple Kelly would not have won, (given the injury to his starting QB.) All in all a solid start for a very young coach in his first year at the helm.

I'm buying ND with Marcus as HC.

Improvement over what? A NC game? A Heisman finalist? 2 playoff games? Multiple 11-1 seasons? Multiple 12-0 seasons? Wins over multiple top 10 teams? Top 3 recruiting class? Multiple 5 star recruits? Enough demand to get bought out by an SEC team? Grooming an OC that Saban wants? Hiring the next ND head coach? Shall I go on? Winning multiple D2 national titles? Turning two programs around and making Cincy a relevant program it never would be? Fixing ND from 2 decades of disaster and rebuilding the program Freeman inherited? You’re allowed to like Freeman more. That’s your prerogative. Saying he’s an improvement based on stats is a lie. Hopefully Freeman can do all that. He’s our guy.

 

[echowaker]

Typical excuse from your type. We all get your virtue signaling. I’m all in for Freeman’s success. I also like him personally, unlike BK. He’s a Catholic man that has values and presents a good image for the school. I hope he is the best coach in ND history. That doesn’t change that he’s the least experienced coach in ND history. Facts don’t lie. The odds are sometimes great and sometimes small. But Notre Dame will win over all. His odds go up tremendously if he makes good hires. So far he’s done a helluva job in hiring, with the exception of Al Washington. Ludwig would make his odd go up.

Please, you showed your true " colors" here when he was being rumored for the job. Go back and read your old posts from that time. For the record Bob Stoops, Kirby Smart, Dabo and others have all won National Championships in their very first Head coaching stints since ND has won one. The whole narrative that a guy must have experience is dumb. The right guy is the right guy.

 

[Notre Dame du Lac]

Please, you showed your true " colors" here when he was being rumored for the job. Go back and read your old posts from that time. For the record Bob Stoops, Kirby Smart, Dabo and others have all won National Championships in their very first Head coaching stints since ND has won one. The whole narrative that a guy must have experience is dumb. The right guy is the right guy.

Right. Bc they did it means they all will. Experience is overrated. 😂

 

[Patrirish]

High ranking recruiting classes are irrelevant if they don’t translate into and produce highly successful W/L records.

In the words of the great American philosopher, Vince Lombardi, “Winning isn’t everything, it’s the ONLY thing !’

Crowing about recruiting classes is useless if you’re not winning almost all or all of your games on Saturday.

Call me crazy, but I’m a RESULTS ORIENTED fan !

 

[Notre Dame du Lac]

High ranking recruiting classes are irrelevant if they don’t translate into and produce highly successful W/L records.

In the words of the great American philosopher, Vince Lombardi, “Winning isn’t everything, it’s the ONLY thing !’

Crowing about recruiting classes is useless if you’re not winning almost all or all of your games on Saturday.

Call me crazy, but I’m a RESULTS ORIENTED fan !

You’re crazy. Give me blue chippers and 6-6 records like OU all day baby.

 

[Patrirish]

Please, you showed your true " colors" here when he was being rumored for the job. Go back and read your old posts from that time. For the record Bob Stoops, Kirby Smart, Dabo and others have all won National Championships in their very first Head coaching stints since ND has won one. The whole narrative that a guy must have experience is dumb. The right guy is the right guy.

How do you know if you chose “the right guy” ?

 

[Golson5]

Improvement over what? A NC game? A Heisman finalist? 2 playoff games? Multiple 11-1 seasons? Multiple 12-0 seasons? Wins over multiple top 10 teams? Top 3 recruiting class? Multiple 5 star recruits? Enough demand to get bought out by an SEC team? Grooming an OC that Saban wants? Hiring the next ND head coach? Shall I go on? Winning multiple D2 national titles? Turning two programs around and making Cincy a relevant program it never would be? Fixing ND from 2 decades of disaster and rebuilding the program Freeman inherited? You’re allowed to like Freeman more. That’s your prerogative. Saying he’s an improvement based on stats is a lie. Hopefully Freeman can do all that. He’s our guy.

I see you're comparing 1 year to 12 years. Thats smart of you lol

Yikes

 

[Golson5]

Right. Bc they did it means they all will. Experience is overrated. 😂

It is overrated

 

[Golson5]

High ranking recruiting classes are irrelevant if they don’t translate into and produce highly successful W/L records.

In the words of the great American philosopher, Vince Lombardi, “Winning isn’t everything, it’s the ONLY thing !’

Crowing about recruiting classes is useless if you’re not winning almost all or all of your games on Saturday.

Call me crazy, but I’m a RESULTS ORIENTED fan !

This is nonsense. Recruiting rankings matter. Georgia Bama OHio st dominate in recruiting and it translates to the field

 

[sjb75]

Seriously? Let's dig in:

1. Beat top ten team, improvement.
2. Won bowl game, improvement.
3. Highest average recruit rating ('23) in ten years at 3.79 (during that time 3.59 was the highest), improvement.
4. Brought in #1 transfer recruit, a 6* QB, improvement.
5. Currently has the #2 ranked recruiting class for 2024, big improvement.
6. Including a (soon to be) 5* recruit at QB, improvement.

And... Coach Freeman did alls this with...

1. A brand new staff including six new coaches,,,
2. A starting QB who had never started a game, AND that QB was injured in game #2! (how may teams shined with that variable?)
3. Toughest schedule in the last five years.

Yes, he lost two games he never should have lost but he won a couple Kelly would not have won, (given the injury to his starting QB.) All in all a solid start for a very young coach in his first year at the helm.

I'm buying ND with Marcus as HC.

When you lose to Stanford at home en route to a 9-4 record, and the previous 4 seasons under Brian Kelly the program went 44-6 with two CFB playoff berths, expect some criticism from fans.

I won't point fingers...I will allow MF to grow into the job; however, many others will.

 

[NDinNJ]

BK cut his teeth at a D2 school and is a self made man. While I may not like everything about BK, the man did it on his own and earned every bit it. He deserves to be at LSU. He spent 20 years moving up before ND even bothered considering him. Not comparable. We can root for Freeman while understanding the privilege afforded to him as well.

BK also went 4-8 in year 7 at ND. Previous head coaches were fired for such debacles well into their tenure. Outside of 2012, BK's first 7 years were mediocre at best. There is a reason he holds the record for most losses as an ND head coach.