Three Different Eras

[Kcndmis97]

I don't really disagree with anything here other than the fact that you're leaving out a lot of star seniors/upperclassman from 2012 (that Charlie Weis was responsible for recruiting/signing).

Also those classes from 2006 through 2008 came out to 4th or 5th on aggregate using 247 composite ratings. Brian Kelly has never been close to recruiting at thatlevel over a three-year period at any point during his tenure at Notre Dame.

Regardless, neither coach has gotten it done. and the only way to find a coach that has all of those qualities--or at least a better combination of all of them--is to take more chances on the coaching carousel.

BK does seem like he has maxed out at ND so when his contract is up, it might be wise for a mutual parting. He has done a lot to move this program forward where the next coach will be setup nicely. Regardless, we still need some luck in recruiting in having more elite players in ND friendly regions.

Look at Weis’ top players, most of them were still from the Midwest/East or California. Floyd, Rudolph, Riddick, Aldridge, a few guys from the Chicago area, Jonas Gray (Michigan), etc. I know I keep harping on this but it is true and the facts prove it....we’ve landed very few elite players from the south, even Weis. That’s why it is hard because just go look at the Rivals 5 star players the last few years, the vast majority are from the south, with some sprinkled in from California. I think our best bet is for USC to stay down and hit California harder. We’ve clearly given up on recruiting Florida due to the issues we’ve had with character.

This cycle is a good example, there happened to be two 5 star stud WRs from the East/Midwest. Fleming and J Johnson. We got one of them, OSU got the other. It would be nice if OSU hit a lull too so we can pull more of the Ohio recruits, they usually are pretty good but when OSU is rolling, they all go there.

 

[Kelso86]

Weis did bring in top 10 classes for 3 straight years but most of the players never materialized at ND or in the NFL. We’ll never know if hey were overrated or Weis had really poor S&C/player development. These guys were highly rated: Aldridge, Sam Young, Demetrius Jones, Darrin Walls, Armando Allen, Matt Romine, Gary Gray, Robert Hughes, Mike Ragone, Dwayne Crist, Steve Filer.

Again, we will never know why these guys were never real impact players, maybe the recruiting services got it wrong or Weis did a poor job coaching them up. Regardless, this is why recruiting rankings don’t tell the whole story. You need need good coaching, S&C, player development, retention, winning culture. FSU and USC are prime examples of top 5 in talent but not top 5 in actual team performance.

So, even if the next coach is a better recruiter than BK, there’s no guarantee he will develop them properly or put them in the best position to succeed. You need a great recruiter AND a great talent developer. Weis might have been a better recruiter than BK but his player development and overall program development was a C- at best. BK maybe only a “B” as a recruiter but he is an “A-“ at player/program developer.

"We’ll never know if hey were overrated or Weis had really poor S&C/player development. These guys were highly rated: Aldridge, Sam Young, Demetrius Jones, Darrin Walls, Armando Allen, Matt Romine, Gary Gray, Robert Hughes, Mike Ragone, Dwayne Crist, Steve Filer."

My "guess" is that he was not a good S&C and player development guy -- look at how him teams fell apart physically at year end (outside of his 1st 2 years). They seem to just be worn out --

 

[TDIrish27]

Weis classes are what led to Notre Dame's 2010 to 2012 run which is the best stretch of performance on record during the Brian Kelly era.

I don't know what you mean by his classes were built on the ratings of the recruiting services... There isn't a program in college football that doesn't use the rating services to get a general neutral opinion about different prospects that they might be interested in. Brian Kelly included.

Weis' classes werent perfect but they were far better than the classes Brian Kelly is bringing in at Notre Dame.

That's ridiculous-----and basically says it all about what you know.