new poster on Coach Kelly

[roeck83]

I've been reading the boards for about a week. Tracking the tension over the Kelly comments. Is he a good coach? Yes. Has he rehabilitated the ND program talent-wise? Yes. But….Can he motivate his teams to fire up and resolve for big games? Aside from Oklahoma in 2012 I'd say no. We came out flat against Clemson. We came out terribly flat against Ohio State. It's a problem. Urban Meyer is a schmuck. Going for first down from his own 30 in the first quarter on fourth down, is low class, and insulting. It was an attempt to snap the Irish will. Come out looking dazed and you are going to get that kind of treatment. never going to beat a first tier team with simple offensive fire power. My feelings obviously mixed on Kelly.

ANother thing that bothers me is how quickly he sells out the run. The first three series against OSU we ran the ball maybe twice. And not in good situations.

If Kelly should go to the Giants, by some remote chance (and I thought it was in terrible taste to again promote himself for the NFL during Fiesta bowl week- he did the same thing in '12 flirting with the Eagles), I actually don't think it would be best for ND to go out and get a name coach. I would look for a young, determined, committed, high quality assistant coach looking for a chance. I know this is not easy to do, but ND possesses the personnel resources to locate such folks.

 

[Classic Irish]

I've been reading the boards for about a week. Tracking the tension over the Kelly comments. Is he a good coach? Yes. Has he rehabilitated the ND program talent-wise? Yes. But….Can he motivate his teams to fire up and resolve for big games? Aside from Oklahoma in 2012 I'd say no. We came out flat against Clemson. We came out terribly flat against Ohio State. It's a problem. Urban Meyer is a schmuck. Going for first down from his own 30 in the first quarter on fourth down, is low class, and insulting. It was an attempt to snap the Irish will. Come out looking dazed and you are going to get that kind of treatment. never going to beat a first tier team with simple offensive fire power. My feelings obviously mixed on Kelly.

ANother thing that bothers me is how quickly he sells out the run. The first three series against OSU we ran the ball maybe twice. And not in good situations.

If Kelly should go to the Giants, by some remote chance (and I thought it was in terrible taste to again promote himself for the NFL during Fiesta bowl week- he did the same thing in '12 flirting with the Eagles), I actually don't think it would be best for ND to go out and get a name coach. I would look for a young, determined, committed, high quality assistant coach looking for a chance. I know this is not easy to do, but ND possesses the personnel resources to locate such folks.

You make some valid points. But I think we've learned our lesson hiring assistant coaches with no head coaching experience: e. g. Bob Davie and Charlie Weis.

 

[roeck83]

Agreed that those were bad decisions. Weiss evidently can't coach his way out of a paper bag based on what he did at Kansas. Just not a leader. If not an assistant coach, then a head coach with a relatively low profile, who has all the tools, and will, and who wants to make a name for himself at ND. At least this should be considered an option, something worth looking at, if Kelly decides to jump.

 

[romulator]

I've been reading the boards for about a week. Tracking the tension over the Kelly comments. Is he a good coach? Yes. Has he rehabilitated the ND program talent-wise? Yes. But….Can he motivate his teams to fire up and resolve for big games? Aside from Oklahoma in 2012 I'd say no. We came out flat against Clemson. We came out terribly flat against Ohio State. It's a problem. Urban Meyer is a schmuck. Going for first down from his own 30 in the first quarter on fourth down, is low class, and insulting. It was an attempt to snap the Irish will. Come out looking dazed and you are going to get that kind of treatment. never going to beat a first tier team with simple offensive fire power. My feelings obviously mixed on Kelly.

ANother thing that bothers me is how quickly he sells out the run. The first three series against OSU we ran the ball maybe twice. And not in good situations.

If Kelly should go to the Giants, by some remote chance (and I thought it was in terrible taste to again promote himself for the NFL during Fiesta bowl week- he did the same thing in '12 flirting with the Eagles), I actually don't think it would be best for ND to go out and get a name coach. I would look for a young, determined, committed, high quality assistant coach looking for a chance. I know this is not easy to do, but ND possesses the personnel resources to locate such folks.

huh? Isn't it the job of the coach to "snap the will" of the opponent? That's what Meyer is supposed to do. If it's so insulting, then perhaps you should stop them. I'm no Meyer fan but that is not "low class" but rather it's showing confidence and demonstrating a superior OL as compared to ND's DL.

 

[Duo]

Low class for going for it on 4th down? ???
If Kelly did it you'd say it was bravado!
This is Big Time CFB not ladies paddy cake. Grow a pair!

 

[perseverare]

experience does not matter - if it is "bad" experience!

 

[SALittleGiant513]

Of all thing things to call Meyer a schmuck for... what a weird one to pick.

 

[perseverare]

contemplate that Urb is an assistant on the current staff and he is passed over because he lacks prior HC experience; so he goes elsewhere to gain that experience. And then...

Get it? Once warned, twice burned!

 

[BGI User 1596]

Low class for going for it on 4th down? ???
If Kelly did it you'd say it was bravado!
This is Big Time CFB not ladies paddy cake. Grow a pair!

Exactly - well said.

 

[SALittleGiant513]

Perse we get it man you like Sanford... we get it.

 

[roeck83]

So let me get this straight. You gentlemen think, that going for it on fourth down, from one's own thirty, in the first quarter, is, shrewd? Gutsy? Admirable? 'Ballsy'? It's a gesture of contempt. Now Kelly, I suppose in response, later in the quarter went for 4th down from our own 40. I thought it was necessary, because of Meyer's move. Whatever else Meyer's move was, it was no thing of beauty.

 

[perseverare]

Perse we get it man you like Sanford... we get it.

Sal

if that is what you took from it, YOU DID NOT get it.

 

[romulator]

So let me get this straight. You gentlemen think, that going for it on fourth down, from one's own thirty, in the first quarter, is, shrewd? Gutsy? Admirable? 'Ballsy'? It's a gesture of contempt. Now Kelly, I suppose in response, later in the quarter went for 4th down from our own 40. I thought it was necessary, because of Meyer's move. Whatever else Meyer's move was, it was no thing of beauty.

you are complaining about a coach going for it on 4th down in the FIRST QUARTER on his own side of the field? Really? I would hope and pray that the opposing coach would go for it on 4th down on his own side of the field early in the game every single time. It's not a gesture of contempt. it's called trying to WIN. I can't believe this is a point you're trying to make. Absurd.

 

[SALittleGiant513]

Who the hell cares what the intent of the gesture is? Football is not a gentleman's game, this isn't tennis or golf, its nut-up or shut-up football. Kelly had to go for it later in the quarter because ND needed some type of momentum. Wanting to go for the kill in the first quarter against a team that can put up point in a hurry is a bad thing?

Also, he went for it there b/c his kicker is a sub 60% kicker.

Mike Tomlin went for 2 pt conversions and 4th downs more then almost any coach in the league combined this year at all times in the game but I am not sure about anyone who thinks he is a schmuck... he says analytics tell him its the smart play.

 

[twalsh]

So let me get this straight. You gentlemen think, that going for it on fourth down, from one's own thirty, in the first quarter, is, shrewd? Gutsy? Admirable? 'Ballsy'? It's a gesture of contempt. Now Kelly, I suppose in response, later in the quarter went for 4th down from our own 40. I thought it was necessary, because of Meyer's move. Whatever else Meyer's move was, it was no thing of beauty.

It's his way of saying that he doesn't think we can beat him. And if he makes it he may get our guys to think the same thing, which is a big psyche win for him. No problem with it at all, but you'd better make it.

 

[roeck83]

I really would not think highly of a ND coach who went for 4th down from his own thirty in the first quarter.
I admit it, I don't admire Meyer's call. But I think what I originally claimed was that it was unpardonable for us to come out flat. Incidentally I don't play golf.

 

[kellys heroes 35]

I've been reading the boards for about a week. Tracking the tension over the Kelly comments. Is he a good coach? Yes. Has he rehabilitated the ND program talent-wise? Yes. But….Can he motivate his teams to fire up and resolve for big games? Aside from Oklahoma in 2012 I'd say no. We came out flat against Clemson. We came out terribly flat against Ohio State. It's a problem. Urban Meyer is a schmuck. Going for first down from his own 30 in the first quarter on fourth down, is low class, and insulting. It was an attempt to snap the Irish will. Come out looking dazed and you are going to get that kind of treatment. never going to beat a first tier team with simple offensive fire power. My feelings obviously mixed on Kelly.

ANother thing that bothers me is how quickly he sells out the run. The first three series against OSU we ran the ball maybe twice. And not in good situations.

If Kelly should go to the Giants, by some remote chance (and I thought it was in terrible taste to again promote himself for the NFL during Fiesta bowl week- he did the same thing in '12 flirting with the Eagles), I actually don't think it would be best for ND to go out and get a name coach. I would look for a young, determined, committed, high quality assistant coach looking for a chance. I know this is not easy to do, but ND possesses the personnel resources to locate such folks.

10-2 losses to Clemson and Stanford on the road by a total of 4 pts is competing at the highest level of college football - there is no higher level -- if there is please do share .

" winning the big game " is more on players than the coach

Big game -- handing Mich St their only loss two or three years ago -- is that a " big win "

Beating USC @ USC to go undefeated to play in teh national championship - big win ? mini win ?

There's a jerk off mentality among those who have no real feel for competition at this level -- that mentality is this

If a coach doesn't go undefeated or win the national championship there is " something wrong " and someone else can do better . I live in Philadelphia and chuckled at douche bags thinking the Eagles could " do better " than Andy Reid . Five NFC Championship games and overweight beer guzzling slugs thought that was hoo hum .

ND maxed out this yr from a " level " standpoint . Did I hope they would win the NC ? Definitely--but I don't see that as a problem , I look at the fact they were in the conversation up to the last week of the season . Mission accomplished really .

 

[Duo]

So let me get this straight. You gentlemen think, that going for it on fourth down, from one's own thirty, in the first quarter, is, shrewd? Gutsy? Admirable? 'Ballsy'? It's a gesture of contempt. Now Kelly, I suppose in response, later in the quarter went for 4th down from our own 40. I thought it was necessary, because of Meyer's move. Whatever else Meyer's move was, it was no thing of beauty.

Roeck.....

Re: "Whatever else Meyer's move was, it was no thing of beauty."

You are only saying that because:

A.) It was the other team's coach and your team got beat! If your coach did it you would say it was a brilliant move.

B.) Sour grapes. You didn't think of it so it can't be a good idea!

C.) It worked! And it's called winning. Winners go out and win while "good sports" get their azz handed to them!

Maybe you should develop an interest in a different sport where sportsmanship and etiquette take precedence over mere winning. Let us know when you find a sport like that.

Pin the tail on the donkey anyone?.............bwahahahah!

“Show me a good loser, and I'll show you a loser.”
Vince Lombardi

 

[cgvr]

Of all thing things to call Meyer a schmuck for... what a weird one to pick.

He gave us a chance to out physical them and turn the momentum.

It was a huge opening/opportunity that we unfortunately failed to seize.

That could have been an adrenaline shot for the ages....

 

[SALittleGiant513]

Sure but does that make him a Schmuck or a gambler?

 

[cgvr]

Sure but does that make him a Schmuck or a gambler?

I don't think he felt he was jeopardizing anything. I'm guessing that if he felt the odds of making it were even he may have punted. The post game transcript is below. It doesn't look like anyone asked him about it.

imo He scouted us, knew what he was going to do in that situation and successfully fired an "unconventional" one across our bow.

http://www.asapsports.com/show_interview.php?id=115672

 

[SALittleGiant513]

We are on the same page. The OP is the one suggesting his decision was unbecoming, kinda just reeks of butt hurt though.

 

[cgvr]

We are on the same page. The OP is the one suggesting his decision was unbecoming, kinda just reeks of butt hurt though.

It's unfortunate and emblematic.

 

[allaboutthecash]

Meyer going for it on 4th was a sign he had no respect for ND football or Brian Kelly, that is the truth. He knew he was going to win that game before kick off, I am sure it was closer than he even thought it would be. Meyer is a great coach who wins big time games, he knows what he is doing. Brian Kelly should be taking notes as he despite all the NFL talent can not compete at the highest level.

 

[Duo]

FWIW, I do think BK has watched some other coaches and taken notes (Saban, Meyer, Fisher, etc.). He has changed his game (albeit to some extent) since arriving at ND. He needs to watch, learn and emulate some of the coaches that show up in the Big Time games. That wouldn't guarantee anything but it would certainly help!

 

[twalsh]

Meyer going for it on 4th was a sign he had no respect for ND football or Brian Kelly, that is the truth. He knew he was going to win that game before kick off, I am sure it was closer than he even thought it would be. Meyer is a great coach who wins big time games, he knows what he is doing. Brian Kelly should be taking notes as he despite all the NFL talent can not compete at the highest level.

Wow, like that wasn't predictable.

 

[FLballcoach1]

Meyer going for it on 4th was a sign he had no respect for ND football or Brian Kelly, that is the truth. He knew he was going to win that game before kick off, I am sure it was closer than he even thought it would be. Meyer is a great coach who wins big time games, he knows what he is doing. Brian Kelly should be taking notes as he despite all the NFL talent can not compete at the highest level.

Moron

 

[perseverare]

curious?

do the above comments re the OP come from the notion that
1. he is a flammer
2. you genuinely think his comments are outlandishly wrong
3. you don't think his comments are outlandishly wrong but you object that he points them out?

 

[roeck83]

curious?

do the above comments re the OP come from the notion that
1. he is a flammer
2. you genuinely think his comments are outlandishly wrong
3. you don't think his comments are outlandishly wrong but you object that he points them out?

I don't know what a flammer is, I admit. Let's go back to the point that got so many folks exercised. Was Meyer a schmuck going for it on fourth down, in a scoreless ballgame, from his own thirty? was it unbecoming? It is certainly not against the rules, so enough said. What one has to ask oneself, is why a very smart coach like Meyer would take a chance churning up the mojo of his opponent. I mean, most college coaches go ballistic against their players for talking trash before a game, etc. al. Because, they don't want to give their opponent any cause to rally around. Meyer knew all this, and did it anyway. He knew that Kelly's defense would wilt, rather than rally. For Kelly's Heroes, I get the Kelly's part, but what is the 'heroes' part?