Introducing the 2017 Irish Defensive line !!! They will gain your respect !!

[Bodizephax]

1. Jerry Tillery 6'7" 308 LBS --DT 10. Darnell Ewell 6'4" 295 LBS----DT.

2. Daelin Hayes 6'4" 255 LBS--DE 11. Adetokunbo Ogundji 6'4" 251 LBS---DE

3.Julian Okwara 6'4" 235 LBS---DE 12. Elijah Taylor 6'3" 280 LBS----DT.

4. Daniel Cage 6'1" 326 LBS---NT 13. Mountain Dew Treadway 6'4" 299 LBS--DT

5. Khalid Kareem 6'4" 267 LBS---DE 14. Brandon Tiassum 6'4" 304 LBS---NT.

6. Jay Hayes 6'4" 281 LBS----DL 15.MyronTagouailoa Mosa 6'4"270LBS-DE

7. Andrew Trumbetti 6'4" 252 LBS---DE 16. Kurt Hinish 6'2" 283 LBS---DT.

8. Jonathon Bonner 6'4" 284 LBS---DT. 17. Kofi Wardlow 6'3.5" 230 LBS---DE

9. Jonathon MacCollister 6'4"238 LBS---DE 18. Pete Mokwuah 6'3" 326 LBS---DT.

*** And 19. Jamir Jones 6'3" 243 LBS who I think will be moved from ILB to DE !!

**** Lots of experience and talented youth !! I believe we have more depth than the 2012 team. They need to get their bodys by Ballis and coached up by Elston and Elko !!! DISCUSS !!

 

[Irish2684]

The amount of bodies and measurables seem to be there. My question is can they get it done between the lines on Saturdays? I'm done predicting how these kids are going to play during the year in the offseason and will wait to actually see if they can produce during the season.

It's like we think a guy is all of a sudden going to be a great player because he's been on the team for a few years. Show up work hard and get the job done on Saturdays.

 

[Kelso86]

Agree with Irish2684 -- enough with the projections of who is going to be great -- measurables are fine for show, but mean absolutely nothing come Saturday.

What I am looking out of this group is that they play with passion, aggression, be fundamentally sound -- and for God's sake, can tackle. All of these have been missing from ND football for a long time (save for 2012 for the most part)..

 

[Ara64]

The thing that's got me pumped now is the S&C program. The last couple seasons the lads looked soft IMHO. They look motivated and aggressive this year from top to bottom. It's nice having a hungry DC again. I think the lads will play hard for him.

 

[ivan brunetti]

2016 rushing defense: 70th
2016 passing defense (pass rush influenced): 20th

 

[Telx1]

So much depends on things like Tillery showing dedication and consistency; Bonner finally producing at the level envisioned when he surprised in Spring training as a freshman; Taylor and Cage totally recovered and playing injury free; Trumbetti playing consistently good; D Hayes showing that the B&G game was a preview of what to expect. All possible, but not likely to hit 100%. I think they'll have a hard time keeping Ewell totally off the field as a true freshman, and I won't be surprised if Amosa steals some reps as well. Anxious to see if Khalid has developed to start pushing Trumbetti and J Hayes for playing time. Too many question marks to be cocky, but enough potential to be cautiously optimistic.

 

[IRISHJD98]

That's a lot of guys.

 

[IrishInOntario]

All comes down to health, Balis and Elston. Mike Elston was maligned in his previous stint as the DL coach, yet when he was running the show at that position ND had its best defensive lines in a long time. That said, he also had Stephon Tuitt, Louis Nix and for a short time, Aaron Lynch... He did a nice job of development with Kapron Louis-Moore, Prince Shembo, Kona Schwenke and Sheldon Day, who weren't 5 star prospects.

It comes down to this. If Hayes and Okwara continue to work their guts out in the weight room this spring / summer, Tillery decides he wants to be an NFL'er and ND gets healthy seasons out of Cage and Jay Hayes, they'll be fine... The development of Kareem, Bonner, Ogundeji, and Ewell will be important as well.

A year ago I said the DL would be fine and I was flat wrong. A lot of that had to do with their terrible DC (They played much better once Elston took over) but again, I was wrong.

Things are encouraging this spring. The guys are getting into much better shape and I like that they have an ass kicker as their position coach in Elston. Guys like Tillery need the push from their coach, IMO. I'm also very high on Mike Elko's ability to create pressure with Nyles Morgan and Drue Tranquill, giving the DL more 1 v 1 opportunities. That SHOULD help the pass rush... Again though. That Drop End spot is vital. Hayes and Okwara are still going to be sophomores, but they need to be massively better than a year ago. They need 3 more good months with Balis and Elston needs to be terribly hard on them both in terms of teaching and discipline this fall.

 

[perseverare]

The defense will benefit from a less than usual challenging schedule. UGA and USC are the only opponents having a proven elite QB. In both those cases the inexperienced ND defense will be facing somewhat inexperienced, however talented, OL's. DLvsOL will be a key matchup in those pivotal games. Eason and Darnold must face some sort of pass rush and be made uncomfortable, or both offenses will score at will.

So, can Hayes or Okwara do what no ND front liners have been able to do? that is rush the passer?
Most of the other names are pretty well known in that capacity and counting on Fr. is just a stretch.

Defensively, Hayes and Morgan must stay healthy; they are to the D what Wimbush is to the offense.

 

[OneillIrish]

The defense will benefit from a less than usual challenging schedule. UGA and USC are the only opponents having a proven elite QB. In both those cases the inexperienced ND defense will be facing somewhat inexperienced, however talented, OL's. DLvsOL will be a key matchup in those pivotal games. Eason and Darnold must face some sort of pass rush and be made uncomfortable, or both offenses will score at will.

So, can Hayes or Okwara do what no ND front liners have been able to do? that is rush the passer?
Most of the other names are pretty well known in that capacity and counting on Fr. is just a stretch.

Defensively, Hayes and Morgan must stay healthy; they are to the D what Wimbush is to the offense.

Where are you getting the idea that Eason is a "proven elite" QB?

Please tell me you're not basing "proven elite" on recruiting ranks for 2-3 years ago.

You're certainly not basing it on his CFB performance though, which would be better termed "significantly below average"

Nor could you be basing it on his spring game performance, which would be termed "down-right concerning"

Are you basing it on the widely held belief that a new True Frosh QB (Fromm) is already pushing Eason for the starting job Ann's has an actual chance to unseat him?

Just want to make sure I understand the factual underpinnings of your post...

 

[Bodizephax]

So much depends on things like Tillery showing dedication and consistency; Bonner finally producing at the level envisioned when he surprised in Spring training as a freshman; Taylor and Cage totally recovered and playing injury free; Trumbetti playing consistently good; D Hayes showing that the B&G game was a preview of what to expect. All possible, but not likely to hit 100%. I think they'll have a hard time keeping Ewell totally off the field as a true freshman, and I won't be surprised if Amosa steals some reps as well. Anxious to see if Khalid has developed to start pushing Trumbetti and J Hayes for playing time. Too many question marks to be cocky, but enough potential to be cautiously optimistic.

I have kind of given up on Trumbetti and Bonner (I hope I am wrong !). My hope lies in Dealin Hayes, Kahleed Kareem,Okwara, Ogundji, and the rest of the Young guns ! Remember the Sophmores--- the best dline class the Irish have had since the 2011 class !

 

[perseverare]

yes, UGA and Kirby Smart will bench inarguably the best true freshman QB UGA has had for an untested inexperienced true freshman. Would Brian Kelly take an incombent QB and/or bench him or create a QB controversy ? Would MVG get the starting nod 3 spring gams ago because he was 'better' than Kizer? Really?

And that is about as sensible as this quote (following MSU loss)
"Brian Kelly on if he's confident in the scheme and Brian VanGorder: "Oh, absolutely. Without question."


backdrop:
The Irish were gashed in Saturday night’s 36-28 loss to Michigan State, two weeks after dropping a 50-47 double overtime shootout at Texas.

Through three games of this young campaign, Notre Dame ranks 102nd nationally in yards per play allowed, tied for 94th in scoring defense, 103rd in pass efficiency defense and 99th in rushing defense. Still, head coach Brian Kelly said Sunday he still has the right scheme and leader on defense.

 

[IRISHJD98]

yes, UGA and Kirby Smart will bench inarguably the best true freshman QB UGA has had for an untested inexperienced true freshman. Would Brian Kelly take an incombent QB and/or bench him or create a QB controversy ? Would MVG get the starting nod 3 spring gams ago because he was 'better' than Kizer? Really?

And that is about as sensible as this quote (following MSU loss)
"Brian Kelly on if he's confident in the scheme and Brian VanGorder: "Oh, absolutely. Without question."


backdrop:
The Irish were gashed in Saturday night’s 36-28 loss to Michigan State, two weeks after dropping a 50-47 double overtime shootout at Texas.

Through three games of this young campaign, Notre Dame ranks 102nd nationally in yards per play allowed, tied for 94th in scoring defense, 103rd in pass efficiency defense and 99th in rushing defense. Still, head coach Brian Kelly said Sunday he still has the right scheme and leader on defense.

Not sure what any of that stuff about Kelly has to do with whether Eason proved himself to be an elite quarterback last year.

 

[perseverare]

Not sure what any of that stuff about Kelly has to do with whether Eason proved himself to be an elite quarterback last year.

would it make you feel better if the statement was that it appears that only 2, thought to be outstanding, but yet unproven, returning starters are on the ND schedule?

That would mean that ND should breeze through the '17 schedule with ease. No excuses.

 

[IRISHJD98]

would it make you feel better if the statement was that it appears that only 2, thought to be outstanding, but yet unproven, returning starters are on the ND schedule?

That would mean that ND should breeze through the '17 schedule with ease. No excuses.

Why not just admit that you were wrong about Eason being a proven quarterback?

 

[perseverare]

but As to the ND schedule, heading into the season, Darnold and Eason are the obviously elite QB's. They are both considered among the pre season top 20 and are the 2 highest ranking QB's on the ND schedule in '17

Eason has had a full season, having started as a true Fr. And he has 2 experienced elite RB's behind him.
There is nothing to categorically say Eason is not as billed as when he arrived at UGA. He remains among the elite prospects at the QB position. Are you stating that you do not believe Eason to be among the top QB's heading into the '17 season? I think your real gripe is that he is not Irish.

Do you consider Wimbush among the top QB's for '17?

 

[IRISHJD98]

but As to the ND schedule, heading into the season, Darnold and Eason are the obviously elite QB's.

Eason has had a full season, having started as a true Fr. And he has 2 experienced elite RB's behind him.
There is nothing to categorically say Eason is not as billed as when he arrived at UGA.

Certainly possible that he becomes elite, but that's not the same as being proven. Personally, I think the point is silly. It seems like I've seen plenty of unproven quarterbacks of varying degrees talent slice up our defenses in recent years.

I think the better point you had, bringing this back on topic, is that that defensive line play will be very important in the Georgia game. With Georgia potentially starting a redshirt freshman and two big and talented true freshmen on the OL, having experienced depth on the defensive line that allows for a healthy rotation could be a significant benefit.

With Georgia, I'm more concerned about consistently controlling the run (especially in the fourth quarter) because I think the early impact of the freshmen linemen (assuming they start) will benefit their running game first.

 

[IRISHJD98]

Are you stating that you do not believe Eason to be among the top QB's heading into the '17 season? I think your real gripe is that he is not Irish.

Do you consider Wimbush among the top QB's for '17?

I missed this part of your post earlier, it must have been the edit.

As far as Eason goes, there were two other true freshmen quarterbacks in the SEC last year who performed better than Eason. Eason was getting the ball out late and missing open receivers. One of the few criticisms of his game as a recruit was that he appeared to be slow making decisions. Another part of his problem was that his receivers couldn't hold onto the ball and his offensive line didn't let him get comfortable. I think it will take time for his new starting OL and WR's to settle in. I think Kizer's performance early last year was (loosely) based on similar issues with the OL and WR's settling in.

Eason had flashes that showed he can be very good. But quarterbacks have to be good every game and they need an offensive line and receivers. Based solely on last year's performance, he wouldn't be on my top 10 list of QB's for 2017.

And no. I don't consider Wimbush a top QB for 2017 either. He's completely unproven.

 

[perseverare]

I don 't disagree with much of what you say.
Eason played in the tough SEC and he is considered a key player for the 2017 fortunes. (Eason's '16 OL was a team weakness; watch them, they run blocked well but poor at pass blocking)
But the original point was that, pre-season, it appears that the two top QB's, on the ND schedule, the ones that stand out at you, are Darnold and Eason. None of the other QB's on the schedule are known quantities of experienced vs the kind of competition of those two. At season end, this may all be different.

BTW: Wimbush better prove to be elite. A lot is made of arm strength, and his throwing a 70yd pass, but the thing that makes Wim special is his understanding of the position; Golson as talented as he was, never was a 'QB'.

 

[Telx1]

I have kind of given up on Trumbetti and Bonner (I hope I am wrong !). My hope lies in Dealin Hayes, Kahleed Kareem,Okwara, Ogundji, and the rest of the Young guns ! Remember the Sophmores--- the best dline class the Irish have had since the 2011 class !

Bodi...I hear you re Bonner and Trumbetti. BUT, both appeared to have strong Springs and make positive impressions with the new staff, and both have skills that benefit from Elko's scheme. Surprisingly, I think both might start if the game was today. Don't know if that speaks well for their development, or the lack of same for the three young studs you referenced. That said, a whole lot of change can take place between now and the first game, and Bilas will have had eight months to mould and condition these guys, and it will be interesting to see if any of these young guys emerge as a starter.

 

[perseverare]

JD98
check this kid out

Elite? possibly the No.1 pick in '18.

 

[IRISHJD98]

JD98
check this kid out

Elite? possibly the No.1 pick in '18.

View embedded media

Given that Wyoming is not on the schedule, I'm thinking none of the young men Bodi was discussing need to worry about chasing him to prevent Wyoming from scoring at will. But I do think most of his line is returning.

I discussed Eason because Georgia is on the schedule and you seemed to paint them as capable of "scoring at will". Georgia has a number of issues to address, particularly with their offensive line, before their offensive prowess is proven. That's why I thought it was relevant to the thread.

Maybe we can save the discussion of other talented quarterbacks not on the schedule for another thread.

 

[stu4don]

JD98
check this kid out

Elite? possibly the No.1 pick in '18.

View embedded media

Wanna bet? We all know who the #1 pick will be...unless he gets hurt. It is SD. Kid has it all.

 

[OneillIrish]

but As to the ND schedule, heading into the season, Darnold and Eason are the obviously elite QB's. They are both considered among the pre season top 20 and are the 2 highest ranking QB's on the ND schedule in '17

Eason has had a full season, having started as a true Fr. And he has 2 experienced elite RB's behind him.
There is nothing to categorically say Eason is not as billed as when he arrived at UGA. He remains among the elite prospects at the QB position. Are you stating that you do not believe Eason to be among the top QB's heading into the '17 season? I think your real gripe is that he is not Irish.

Do you consider Wimbush among the top QB's for '17?

So what are you basing Eason being an elite QB on?

Back to recruiting rankings again?
Still ignoring CFB play?

Just admit you have no idea what your talking about, and sit quietly.

 

[OneillIrish]

I don 't disagree with much of what you say.
Eason played in the tough SEC and he is considered a key player for the 2017 fortunes. (Eason's '16 OL was a team weakness; watch them, they run blocked well but poor at pass blocking)
But the original point was that, pre-season, it appears that the two top QB's, on the ND schedule, the ones that stand out at you, are Darnold and Eason. None of the other QB's on the schedule are known quantities of experienced vs the kind of competition of those two. At season end, this may all be different.

BTW: Wimbush better prove to be elite. A lot is made of arm strength, and his throwing a 70yd pass, but the thing that makes Wim special is his understanding of the position; Golson as talented as he was, never was a 'QB'.

You realize that this comment completely invalidates your praise of Eason as "proven" or "elite"...right?

Or are you really so dense as to miss that basic fact?

 

[Bodizephax]

Bodi...I hear you re Bonner and Trumbetti. BUT, both appeared to have strong Springs and make positive impressions with the new staff, and both have skills that benefit from Elko's scheme. Surprisingly, I think both might start if the game was today. Don't know if that speaks well for their development, or the lack of same for the three young studs you referenced. That said, a whole lot of change can take place between now and the first game, and Bilas will have had eight months to mould and condition these guys, and it will be interesting to see if any of these young guys emerge as a starter.

What do you think about Jay Hayes? I actually liked that he complained about not playing as a frosh and that he has a big mouth some times. Defensive lineman should be irritable and angry. I personally think that he will shine now that he is an upperclassman and play well with SWAG !;

 

[Telx1]

I like Jay Hayes a lot, but like several of our DL, he confounds me with his inconsistency. Actually expected him to beat out Trumbetti for starting SDE, but he'll get a lot of reps regardless. I think he was hampered by BVG's scheme that required him to hold his position and occupy large space eating offensive linemen to create tackling opportunities for the Back seven, and I think Elko's system where he has him attacking and playing downhill will play to his strengths much better. Frankly, I find myself thinking damn near the same with respect to all our defensive linemen. The lack of consistency is usually a combination of lack of effort and discipline and conditioning. I'm hoping the cultural change we've all read about largely eliminates inconsistent play and guys like Hayes bring it with attitude every down.

 

[Pennick44]

Why not just admit that you were wrong about Eason being a proven quarterback?

He still hasn't gotten over G. Kiel leaving ND. He ended up 3rd string at Powerhouse Cincinnati.

 

[Pennick44]

I have kind of given up on Trumbetti and Bonner (I hope I am wrong !). My hope lies in Dealin Hayes, Kahleed Kareem,Okwara, Ogundji, and the rest of the Young guns ! Remember the Sophmores--- the best dline class the Irish have had since the 2011 class !

Bonner is playing inside but is much undersized. He might be able to help in pass rush situations.

 

[Telx1]

Bonner is playing inside but is much undersized. He might be able to help in pass rush situations.

I've been wrong about Bonner every season. Thought he was going to be a better than average SDE with his quickness off the ball; and yet last year he looked like an overweight slow below average interior lineman that lacked the size to hold his position and eat up space. Hoping the combination of Bilas conditioning and Elko's scheme will finally reveal an impactful player.