Anthony Sacca CB’ed to ND

[BGI User 756]

I hadn't taken the time to actually look up the exact numbers in a while which is why I used the squigly line as to say "around 15th" ~15th.

The reason I didn't look up the exact numbers is because the specific numbers are inconsequential to the point of the post. The point of the post was about NDs status quo ad nauseum tier 2 and tier 3 results as a football program over the last 10 years.

But here's how it actually breaks down (below are the average ranking over the last 10 years (2015-2024) using the 247 COMPOSITE):

Last 10 years average:

• Recruiting Class Ranking: 12th
• 85-man roster Talent Ranking: 10th
• Final F+ Ranking: 14th
• Top 50 overall recruits secured per cycle: 0.8 (less than 1 per class)

recruiting class ranking is how well your program is recruiting in general
85-man roster talent ranking is a consolidation of all of the talent on your 85 man roster at the start of the season
final f+ ranking is a measure of how well your team performed on the football field for the season with an adjustment made for opponent quality and for luck
top 50 overall recruits signed is how effectively your program is recruiting the best/most elite/rarest prospects in the country .. the 40+ offer kids who can go anywhere

You take this data (Notre Dame's data) and compare it to the teams that are winning national titles over the last 20+ years, and there's a gap the size of a football stadium between what ND is producing and what a national title winning program is producing. And ND has done very little to materially improve their position in any of these critical metrics over the last 5, 10, 15+ years

These aren't the metrics of a program destined to win a national title, these are the metrics of a team destined to finish somewhere in the area of 10-15th. And in this 2025 cycle, it's more of the same. NDs 2025 class is nearly full and they have 1 commit in the top 50 in the 247 composite (Ivan Taylor).

At this rate, we'll be dead before ND puts together a roster/a program that is good enough to win a national title.

Lol

A pivot then another swing and a miss

 

[Get Nasty]

Yours. The coaches have been fair about Mickey. Hes a good player. And he will be a high quality player for the next 2 years.

We wont need the 25 wr class to be immediate impact players

Greathouse
Thomas
Faison
Smith
Williams
Gilbert
Saldate
Colzie
Any transfers

Let them develop. If they arent good enough while they are here, they will be processed out and transfer.

Coaches thought he was good enough and ready to play at ohio state but his busted coverage was the back breaker in the game.

 

[sjb75]

Coaches thought he was good enough and ready to play at ohio state but his busted coverage was the back breaker in the game.

Hey Mel, stick to your day job.

 

[Golson5]

Coaches thought he was good enough and ready to play at ohio state but his busted coverage was the back breaker in the game.

No. They thought he was the best option at the time.

 

[BGI User 756]

Coaches thought he was good enough and ready to play at ohio state but his busted coverage was the back breaker in the game.

It was.

However there were a few other ‘back breakers’ that game

 

[chaseball]

We had a statistically very good team last year, that happened to lose 3 games. Our defense was ranked 5th in the nation, and we return a lot. So this team has a lot of potential this year, with a talented transfer QB coming in.

Yes we had a really good defense last year (#7 in DF+) that lead ND to a #8 final F+ ranking (one of the best finishes on record in the last 15 years) and not a ton of attrition on that side of the ball and we've recruited defense well in the last several years so we have the material/depth to possibly keep it going.

Unfortunately the offense wasn't as good (#15 in OF+), and lost key players at key positions, and that side of the ball hasn't been recruited well under MF. We have a lot of low-upside incoming transfers (tweener guys) at key positions at QB and WR to patch up the roster on offense. The OL and TE personnel have fallen off in terms of level of prospects there, so after losing two NFL players on the o-line there's massive question marks (likely regression coming) on the offensive line as well.

ND has been spoiled by a consistently elite OL under Brian Kelly that has been quietly diminishing in quality since BKs departure (both in terms of productivity and the level of prospects being recruited there).

to summarize: defense good and will likely remain good. offense not good enough and likely to regress.

When all is said and done, it looks like it will be another 10-15th finish in F+ in 2024 to match NDs final result in F+ year after year after year after year after year ad nauseum for going on about 15 seasons now.

A 10-15th F+ finish is about 2-3 tiers away from having a team that is good enough to win a national title. That's the rub.

 

[Golson5]

Yes we had a really good defense last year (#7 in DF+) that lead ND to a #8 final F+ ranking (one of the best finishes on record in the last 15 years) and not a ton of attrition on that side of the ball and we've recruited defense well in the last several years so we have the material/depth to possibly keep it going.

Unfortunately the offense wasn't as good (#15 in OF+), and lost key players at key positions, and that side of the ball hasn't been recruited well under MF. We have a lot of low-upside incoming transfers (tweener guys) at key positions at QB and WR to patch up the roster on offense. The OL and TE personnel have fallen off in terms of level of prospects there, so after losing two NFL players on the o-line there's massive question marks (likely regression coming) on the offensive line as well.

ND has been spoiled by a consistently elite OL under Brian Kelly that has been quietly diminishing in quality since BKs departure (both in terms of productivity and the level of prospects being recruited there).

to summarize: defense good and will likely remain good. offense not good enough and likely to regress.

When all is said and done, it looks like it will be another 10-15th finish in F+ in 2024 to match NDs final result in F+ year after year after year after year after year ad nauseum for going on about 15 seasons now.

A 10-15th F+ finish is about 2-3 tiers away from having a team that is good enough to win a national title. That's the rub.

Clueless.

Leonard is more talented than Hartman

Love and Price are studs so I don't see a drop off.

Wr room is much better

OC is better

What are you talking about

You dont follow ND football much, do you?

 

[mbd11]

Yes we had a really good defense last year (#7 in DF+) that lead ND to a #8 final F+ ranking (one of the best finishes on record in the last 15 years) and not a ton of attrition on that side of the ball and we've recruited defense well in the last several years so we have the material/depth to possibly keep it going.

Unfortunately the offense wasn't as good (#15 in OF+), and lost key players at key positions, and that side of the ball hasn't been recruited well under MF. We have a lot of low-upside incoming transfers (tweener guys) at key positions at QB and WR to patch up the roster on offense. The OL and TE personnel have fallen off in terms of level of prospects there, so after losing two NFL players on the o-line there's massive question marks (likely regression coming) on the offensive line as well.

ND has been spoiled by a consistently elite OL under Brian Kelly that has been quietly diminishing in quality since BKs departure (both in terms of productivity and the level of prospects being recruited there).

to summarize: defense good and will likely remain good. offense not good enough and likely to regress.

When all is said and done, it looks like it will be another 10-15th finish in F+ in 2024 to match NDs final result in F+ year after year after year after year after year ad nauseum for going on about 15 seasons now.

A 10-15th F+ finish is about 2-3 tiers away from having a team that is good enough to win a national title. That's the rub.

We already got a preview of our new OL in the Sun Bowl, and the results were very good. We ran for 236 yds and threw for 232 in the 40-8 win. And while Oregon State was depleted, they did have a good defense last year during the season.

So I think, if all goes well, we'll be better than last year - better offense (due to a better QB and receivers) and roughly equivalent defense.

Because Leonard's more talented than Hartman, and the receiver group (our weakest area last year) should be improved overall, with our young receivers getting older, and the transfers coming in.

 

[FightingIrish44]

Coaches thought he was good enough and ready to play at ohio state but his busted coverage was the back breaker in the game.

Which play was that? He wasn’t on the field for that slant pass that was completed to the slot receiver.

That said, while he made big strides last year, I haven’t seen enough evidence to put him in the ‘good’ category yet. It’s definitely possible he becomes that player this year. It seems like he had more confidence last year.

 

[Get Nasty]

Clueless.

Leonard is more talented than Hartman

Love and Price are studs so I don't see a drop off.

Wr room is much better

OC is better

What are you talking about

You dont follow ND football much, do you?

Tackles are critical and I have hope with jagusah but absolutely none with baker.

 

[Telx1]

Tackles are critical and I have hope with jagusah but absolutely none with baker.

Baker played better in the Sun Bowl than I expected, but I have major reservations about him against better competition. But to his credit, he has reportedly worked hard and improved his craft each of the last two seasons. Still hoping Wagner or Lambert or Absher wins the job outright.

 

[NDinNJ]

Agreed. I use the services, offers from coaching staffs and my own film judgement

There is no perfect system to judge this

Thanks Mel.