ND Ranked No. 5 in The Athletic's Post-Spring Rankings

[Drinking The Green Koolaid]

Not sure how many subscribers there are here to The Athletic. One of their CFB writers, Ari Wasserman, has ND ranked at #5 in his post-spring practice top 25. Here are his top 10:

1. Ohio State
2. UGA
3. Oregon
4. Texas
5. ND
6. Ole Miss
7. Bama
8. Missouri
9. UM
10. Miami

I realize these kinds of rankings are just fodder for the fans, but some of his picks are interesting.

What amused me the most were the comments following the story. ND's position in the rankings was by far the most controversial, with one poster after another claiming ND was overranked (again), they need to be in a conference, and that they are irrelevant as a CFB program. Given the dozens of haters who decided they just had to comment, the "irrelevant" tag was especially comical.

Aside from wanting to see ND win another Natty before I shuffle off into the big locker room in the sky, I will especially take delight in seeing all the haters go apoplectic. What a glorious day that will be.

 

[mbd11]

Number 5 isn't outrageous for us IMO. We have most of our top 5 defense coming back, and added a talented transfer QB in Leonard.

The one that's more out of place IMO is Miami at #10. They went 7-6 last year, and haven't shown much improvement yet under Cristobol.

 

[IrishMike409]

Marcus Freeman has done a helluva job. We'll be pre-season Top-10, recruiting is awesome and keeps getting better, the QB room is loaded and keeps ascending, big time athletes from both coasts are coming (KVA, Golden, etc....), this team is primed to go on a run in 24.

Freeman is the guy. He's got things right on schedule. Can't wait for A&M.

 

[sjb75]

Marcus Freeman has done a helluva job. We'll be pre-season Top-10, recruiting is awesome and keeps getting better, the QB room is loaded and keeps ascending, big time athletes from both coasts are coming (KVA, Golden, etc....), this team is primed to go on a run in 24.

Freeman is the guy. He's got things right on schedule. Can't wait for A&M.

I like Marcus Freeman. That said, 8-4 and 9-3 in the first two regular seasons is not on schedule.

 

[IrishMike409]

I like Marcus Freeman. That said, 8-4 and 9-3 in the first two regular seasons is not on schedule.

Simple, yet effective post/point.

Some bad losses, no doubt about it. But I think he's learned some tough lessons and has this program primed to make a jump.

I was a BK fan, but with BK, the program was always gonna be Too-15, maybe Top-10.

Freeman has us in the hunt to be a Top-5 program. I think he can do it.

 

[chaseball]

Most impressive thing about the Marcus Freeman era so far is that he finished in the top 10 in F+ in year 2. This suggests that at the bare minimum he looks like he can hold his own at the highest level. And since he's still so raw/green as a head coach (only 2 years experience) this also means there might be some more upside as he continues to learn on the job.

Another plus so far under MF is the player development last off-season. There were quite a few players that developed into contributors/star players/overachieved-in-general last offseason (seemingly out of nowhere) which is always a sign of good player development.

• Jordan Fiason
• Xavier Watts and the rest of the secondary for that matter.
• Steve Angeli
• All of the recruited RBs
• The development of Howard Cross at DT and the rest of the dline for that matter as well

come to mind

The performance of the new offensive line in the bowl game last season was also quite impressive.

Having really good player development is really fun to watch. Every fall camp is like christmas and when camp starts it's like opening up your christmas gifts and seeing what the coaching staff delivered to its fans this year. e.g. are we going to get a star player at RB? WR? at DE? maybe all 3 this year ? who knows but i'm looking forward to finding out

In contrast, I remember during the Charlie Weis era, the only players that improved from one season to the next were the guys who were going to be great regardless (the extraordinary high 4-star and 5-star Chads) but there was literally no development anywhere else on the roster

 

[sjb75]

Simple, yet effective post/point.

Some bad losses, no doubt about it. But I think he's learned some tough lessons and has this program primed to make a jump.

I was a BK fan, but with BK, the program was always gonna be Too-15, maybe Top-10.

Freeman has us in the hunt to be a Top-5 program. I think he can do it.

Agree with you. Question. If Marcus Freeman goes 9-3 in 2024 and misses the CFB playoff, what will the ND fan base say?

 

[BGI User 1596]

Agree with you. Question. If Marcus Freeman goes 9-3 in 2024 and misses the CFB playoff, what will the ND fan base say?

Players didn’t execute! Classes too hard. Weather issues. Refs screwed them.

 

[1Redrum]

Agree with you. Question. If Marcus Freeman goes 9-3 in 2024 and misses the CFB playoff, what will the ND fan base say?

That Marcus Freeman should be a director of recruiting and not a head football coach?

 

[Irishjohn68]

If Kelly couldn’t get it done by year 3 can Freeman?

 

[Golson5]

If Kelly couldn’t get it done by year 3 can Freeman?

Kelly was given 12 years.

 

[NDblitz]

Number 5 isn't outrageous for us IMO. We have most of our top 5 defense coming back, and added a talented transfer QB in Leonard.

The one that's more out of place IMO is Miami at #10. They went 7-6 last year, and haven't shown much improvement yet under Cristobol.

Agree. If anything that should be FSU. Lost a lot but were 13-0.

 

[sjb75]

If Kelly couldn’t get it done by year 3 can Freeman?

Depends on your definition of "...getting it done..."

I have no expectations that Marcus Freeman needs to win a title in year 3.

Simply make the 12-team playoff.

If that does not happen, it's fair to criticize.

 

[HDK]

Depends on your definition of "...getting it done..."

I have no expectations that Marcus Freeman needs to win a title in year 3.

Simply make the 12-team playoff.

If that does not happen, it's fair to criticize.

I agree. It's a great coincidence that Notre Dame coaches win titles in their third years. I would love to see a championship, of course, but I don't care if it's year 3, 4, 5 or whatever.

 

[IrishMike409]

Agree with you. Question. If Marcus Freeman goes 9-3 in 2024 and misses the CFB playoff, what will the ND fan base say?

9-3, no playoffs......I think we'd have a frustrated (and rightfully so) fanbase.

Then the heat is really on for 25.......and a scenario is created where he coaching for his job, and a playoff birth is the minimum expectation.

 

[Drinking The Green Koolaid]

9-3, no playoffs......I think we'd have a frustrated (and rightfully so) fanbase.

Then the heat is really on for 25.......and a scenario is created where he coaching for his job, and a playoff birth is the minimum expectation.

I am a huge Marcus Freeman fan and have made that clear many times on this board. While a 9-3 season would not be a disaster, it would certainly be a disappointment. But based upon what I have witnessed about the trajectory of the football program under MF, I am confident that will not happen.

Pete Sampson made a couple of interesting observations about MF learning on the job versus what happened with BK. BK had his 10 men on the field moments just as MF did against OSU, but the difference was that for Kelly those things happened at Grand Valley State and Central Michigan. Freeman's learning curve is happening on a very public stage, and when he make mistakes they are magnified.

When asked why there is such a stark difference between how Kelly and Freeman are perceived by alumni, donors, former players and the school administration, I thought Sampson made another interesting point. As he explained, the football program was broken when Kelly took the job. To his credit, Kelly pushed hard for changes to be made to the program, but in the end it wasn't in his DNA to get things done like the new Shields Hall project, because that would have required suppressing his ego. Freeman is more accommodating and approachable in that regard. Here is how Sampson explains the difference:

"The distinction here is Kelly took Notre Dame as far as he could take it, which was pretty damn far considering where the football program was when he arrived. But to fully get everybody on board, you need a head coach willing to recruit donors, administrators and deans. Kelly didn’t want to do that. It’s not hard to understand why considering the progress he forced on this place. Being Notre Dame’s all-time wins leader is a heck of an ego boost. Freeman is the opposite. His default setting is an embrace. He’s wired to say yes. And he gets to align with a version of Notre Dame that’s aligned with winning in a different way."

There will be interesting days ahead.

 

[Irish_Mutt]

I'm excited for the year. There has been a lot of positive momentum under freeman. My only concern is how well can his team play on the road. Last season, they just seemed flat in a couple of road games. Hoping it improves this season.

 

[sjb75]

9-3, no playoffs......I think we'd have a frustrated (and rightfully so) fanbase.

Then the heat is really on for 25.......and a scenario is created where he coaching for his job, and a playoff birth is the minimum expectation.

…berth.

 

[d1042]

If Kelly couldn’t get it done by year 3 can Freeman?

I think we need to reevaluate our expectations in the era of the professional college player. ND still considers its players students - that’s a real handicap to competing.

 

[Golson5]

I think we need to reevaluate our expectations in the era of the professional college player. ND still considers its players students - that’s a real handicap to competing.

Excuse maker

 

[sjb75]

I think we need to reevaluate our expectations in the era of the professional college player. ND still considers its players students - that’s a real handicap to competing.

“We ain’t come here to play school…” Cardale Jones—Ohio St.

 

[burmafrd1943]

The three year thing is pretty ridiculous and anyone emphasizing it is just trolling.

Knute Rockne did not win a NC in his third year I do believe so If You are not going to hold HIM to that standard then what right do you do it to anyone else?

 

[Irishjohn68]

Kelly was given 12 years.

The measuring stick for ND coaches is year #3. Historically they win NC in there 3rd year. Try and keep up.

 

[Irishjohn68]

The three year thing is pretty ridiculous and anyone emphasizing it is just trolling.

Knute Rockne did not win a NC in his third year I do believe so If You are not going to hold HIM to that standard then what right do you do it to anyone else?

BS! I don’t care if he wins in year 3 or 4. Just get it done.
Year 3 is a telling year for any coach at any school. By then you can tell usually where that coach is heading.

 

[Golson5]

The measuring stick for ND coaches is year #3. Historically they win NC in there 3rd year. Try and keep up.

Who cares. So if he goes 11 and 1 and doesn't win it this year, should we fire him?

What happened over 40 years and l9nger ago is irrelevant to the situation now

 

[mva5580]

I love how like damn near every single thread on this board is the same 5-10 people just yelling back and forth at each other.

 

[sjb75]

BS! I don’t care if he wins in year 3 or 4. Just get it done.
Year 3 is a telling year for any coach at any school. By then you can tell usually where that coach is heading.

What does "...get it done..." mean? If it means make the 12 team playoff, we agree.

That's my only expectation for Marcus Freeman in year 3.

 

[Irishjohn68]

Get it done, win a natty.

 

[Irishjohn68]

I love how like damn near every single thread on this board is the same 5-10 people just yelling back and forth at each other.

I make a comment and I get attack from the know it alls who really know nothing.

 

[sjb75]

Get it done, win a natty.

That's an unrealistic expectation, IMO.

 

[mbd11]

That's an unrealistic expectation, IMO.

Not really. We have a good enough team to compete for the title this year IMO, if Leonard plays well. Do Georgia and Ohio State have more talent overall? Probably. But last year, Michigan probably wasn't the most talented team in the country, and they managed to win it all.

 

[sjb75]

Not really. We have a good enough team to compete for the title this year IMO, if Leonard plays well. Do Georgia and Ohio State have more talent overall? Probably. But last year, Michigan probably wasn't the most talented team in the country, and they managed to win it all.

It’s unrealistic to expect Marcus Freeman to win a title in 2024. Spin that any way you wish.

 

[burmafrd1943]

To expect him to win it all is unrealistic, expect him to compete for one is not.

 

[mbd11]

It’s unrealistic to expect Marcus Freeman to win a title in 2024. Spin that any way you wish.

I didn't say I expected us to win the title, just that we should be a contender, along with about 10 other teams.

 

[IrishMike409]

…berth.

My bad....

You refuse to give me an inch out here!!

 

[IrishMike409]

I love how like damn near every single thread on this board is the same 5-10 people just yelling back and forth at each other.

Good fans and good people here. I appreciate all the regulars.

 

[Patrirish]

Not sure how many subscribers there are here to The Athletic. One of their CFB writers, Ari Wasserman, has ND ranked at #5 in his post-spring practice top 25. Here are his top 10:

1. Ohio State
2. UGA
3. Oregon
4. Texas
5. ND
6. Ole Miss
7. Bama
8. Missouri
9. UM
10. Miami

I realize these kinds of rankings are just fodder for the fans, but some of his picks are interesting.

What amused me the most were the comments following the story. ND's position in the rankings was by far the most controversial, with one poster after another claiming ND was overranked (again), they need to be in a conference, and that they are irrelevant as a CFB program. Given the dozens of haters who decided they just had to comment, the "irrelevant" tag was especially comical.

Aside from wanting to see ND win another Natty before I shuffle off into the big locker room in the sky, I will especially take delight in seeing all the haters go apoplectic. What a glorious day that will be.

👍

 

[Patrirish]

Depends on your definition of "...getting it done..."

I have no expectations that Marcus Freeman needs to win a title in year 3.

Simply make the 12-team playoff.

If that does not happen, it's fair to criticize.

That sounds reasonable

 

[stu4don]

Most impressive thing about the Marcus Freeman era so far is that he finished in the top 10 in F+ in year 2. This suggests that at the bare minimum he looks like he can hold his own at the highest level. And since he's still so raw/green as a head coach (only 2 years experience) this also means there might be some more upside as he continues to learn on the job.

Another plus so far under MF is the player development last off-season. There were quite a few players that developed into contributors/star players/overachieved-in-general last offseason (seemingly out of nowhere) which is always a sign of good player development.

• Jordan Fiason
• Xavier Watts and the rest of the secondary for that matter.
• Steve Angeli
• All of the recruited RBs
• The development of Howard Cross at DT and the rest of the dline for that matter as well

come to mind

The performance of the new offensive line in the bowl game last season was also quite impressive.

Having really good player development is really fun to watch. Every fall camp is like christmas and when camp starts it's like opening up your christmas gifts and seeing what the coaching staff delivered to its fans this year. e.g. are we going to get a star player at RB? WR? at DE? maybe all 3 this year ? who knows but i'm looking forward to finding out

In contrast, I remember during the Charlie Weis era, the only players that improved from one season to the next were the guys who were going to be great regardless (the extraordinary high 4-star and 5-star Chads) but there was literally no development anywhere else on the roster

You are being optimistic! I'm so glad you are back on your m

Most impressive thing about the Marcus Freeman era so far is that he finished in the top 10 in F+ in year 2. This suggests that at the bare minimum he looks like he can hold his own at the highest level. And since he's still so raw/green as a head coach (only 2 years experience) this also means there might be some more upside as he continues to learn on the job.

Another plus so far under MF is the player development last off-season. There were quite a few players that developed into contributors/star players/overachieved-in-general last offseason (seemingly out of nowhere) which is always a sign of good player development.

• Jordan Fiason
• Xavier Watts and the rest of the secondary for that matter.
• Steve Angeli
• All of the recruited RBs
• The development of Howard Cross at DT and the rest of the dline for that matter as well

come to mind

The performance of the new offensive line in the bowl game last season was also quite impressive.

Having really good player development is really fun to watch. Every fall camp is like christmas and when camp starts it's like opening up your christmas gifts and seeing what the coaching staff delivered to its fans this year. e.g. are we going to get a star player at RB? WR? at DE? maybe all 3 this year ? who knows but i'm looking forward to finding out

In contrast, I remember during the Charlie Weis era, the only players that improved from one season to the next were the guys who were going to be great regardless (the extraordinary high 4-star and 5-star Chads) but there was literally no development anywhere else on the roster

 

[d1042]

Bidding wars are now part of recruiting and it is going to make some universities just back off trying to win championships and return to providing a sport for students and fans. Outside interests (alumni and agents) have taken control of the college games.