The Rich Get Richer: When Will Notre Dame Land a Gamebreaking Top 5 Overall Recruit? (#1 overall composite QB Jared Curtis to Georgia)
- Thread starter chaseball
- Start date
I've only ever posted on this site with this username. I think all the people on the "chaseball alt" conspiracy theories are exposing themselves. I just laugh at the accusations and get disappointed any time people scare off new posters but the people who think that im secretly creating alt accounts to talk to myself and like my own posts are exposing their own behavior because it's something they would personally do if they haven't done so already/aren't presently doing it already.
Unfortunately, new people will join this site, and then be extremely confused when there are random weirdos accusing them of being you.....lol
I think the only pieces we hadn't been hitting on to win a title are stud WR and DL. DL looks to finally be trending up at a level we can have a quality 2 deep. Our 2 deep got exposed by PSU and Ohio State on the DL.
Our Edge health (botelho & Traore) and Interior DL will be the most likely reason for ND to not go undefeated. Rubio, Onye, Dawson can be a solid front 3, but need someone to step up as the 4th. I don't see it with hinish. For every 1 good play he makes he gets devoured 10 plays. We need to keep the other teams OL off our LBs.
WR, I think we're close, just need to land 1 or 2 studs. Fields should be big this year.
Our Edge health (botelho & Traore) and Interior DL will be the most likely reason for ND to not go undefeated. Rubio, Onye, Dawson can be a solid front 3, but need someone to step up as the 4th. I don't see it with hinish. For every 1 good play he makes he gets devoured 10 plays. We need to keep the other teams OL off our LBs.
WR, I think we're close, just need to land 1 or 2 studs. Fields should be big this year.
Hinish is a good player. He will be in the rotation. He's a disruptor on passing downs
You don't think there is HARD EVIDENCE that ND has a more restrictive academic standard than, say, OSU? You ARE aware of Heisburgh's deempahsis of football in 1952 and Monk Molloy's clamp down on Holtz-era recruiting. Or no? Because the results of those shifts were STUNNINGLY CLEAR in both Terry Brennan's classes and the immediate dropoff in recruiting during the Davie/Willingham era.
I will grant you that there have been periods of ebb and flow short of the post-Leahy and post-Holtz periods, but ND has NEVER otherwise had the kind of consistent bumper crops of recruits that the FOOTBALL FACTORIES now experience regularly. Again, ND can sell its BUTT OFF, but its field of BUYERS is limited. They DON'T WANT the ND experience. And the PROOF of this is that, by and large, THEY DON'T SIGN UP.
AS for the university's position, "rectifying" this state of affairs is NOT ENOUGH OF A PRIORITY for it to ditch its overall ACADEMICS- FIRST IDENTITY.
Besides, for ND'S Admin, what's an NC in football get it that it doesn't already have? I'm sure it would be a THRILL to win one, but I'm betting that making the playoffs, let alone playing in the NC game -- which the team just did -- would amount to proof enough that it's more than HOLDING ITS OWN.
I anticipate ZERO changes in ND's overall philosophy going forward.
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I dont know if you do or dont have alt accounts. Dont care to be honest. What Ive observed and have concluded is that you are here to troll & are not a real ND fan. Its a sad way to spend time but judging by your "internet" personality I can see you struggle in real life and this is a form of communication and attention your crave in the real world.
The evidence-or lack thereof-that I’m referring to is the actual impact Notre Dame’s academic standards have on its football program. You believe Notre Dame’s academic mission limits their recruiting, and while I agree it might be a factor in some specific cases, I think the bigger obstacle is the football program itself. Issues like the lack of elite talent already on the roster (poor social proof), underwhelming results at the highest level, relatively poor program culture, an uninspiring recruiting pitch, lack of investment in recruiters & recruiting department, lack of NIL, and, ultimately, a lack of creativity and vision from the administration all play a much larger role. The good news is that as long as the gravy train keeps rolling in these problems are very fixable.
I also believe the ongoing power struggle between athletes and institutions is significantly affecting Notre Dame’s recruiting. The university has been very public about its conservative, traditional stances on things like player compensation, the transfer portal, and other progressive policies that empower athletes. Notre Dame has even lobbied Congress to try to revert college football to its old model. These traditional views are not helping Notre Dame’s public image with recruits-especially when other schools are fully embracing player empowerment, not just in words but in action, by constantly raising the bar for NIL deals and player compensation.
In short, I think these internal program issues and resistance to the changing landscape of college football are impeding Notre Dame’s recruiting efforts far more than their academic standards are
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I was going to say that you’re clueless, but instead, I’ll just say that you’re misinformed and incorrect
I can assure you that you’re not onto something.
Your dismissal of “academics” betrays your ignorance
"I agree it might be a factor in some specific cases." Well, those specific cases are usually the 5* guys who you so covet who think they are NFL bound and have no interest in attending classes, etc.; for them the next three years are semi-pro (make some $$) and then the draft and the real $$$. Those guys just aren't usually interested in ND. And I'm good with that. Marcus proved we can go all the way with the right mix of ND guys and targeted transfers. Plus, I am more inclined to trust our coaches in evaluating and developing talent for example just in 2024 you would have bitched about us accepting: Leonard Moore, Anthonie Knapp and Aneyas Williams (none of them nationally ranked and only Aneyas was under top 25 in his position.) Moore is a pre-season all-American, Knapp was named true-freshman All-American team and started every game, and Aneyas delivered big time in big games (finding real pt behind two NFL-2026 picks) as a freshman.
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Your list of claims about ND's football program are something I wouldn't venture to comment on AS I SIMPLY DON'T KNOW WHAT GOES ON. And since you're not presenting any SPECIFIC EVIDENCE other than what you SURMISE based on your own comparison of ND's program to others programs, there can't be any FACT-BASED discussion of this.
BUT LET'S SAY -- HYPOTHETICALLY -- THAT EVERYTHING YOU CLAIM IS THE CASE. AND THAT THE PROBLEM IS NOT JUST ACADEMICS BUT THE PROGRAM ITSELF.
In which case, what would all of that mean?
It would mean -- AS IT ACTUALLY DOES -- that the football program ISN'T IN CHARGE. Which leads me to ask: DO YOU NOT REALIZE THAT? THAT THE FOOTBALL PROGRAM DOESN'T ACTUALLY CALL THE SHOTS? Because it doesn't. It's relationship to ND's Admin is like that of a subsidiary to a HOLDING COMPANY.
And the effect on RECRUITING is just a NATURAL CONSEQUENCE of the HOLDING COMPANY being ACADEMICALLY DRIVEN which then limits the pool of recruits A) who can seriously be expected to come and B) the number of recruits who ACTUALLY DO COME.
So, yes, ND's recruiting is SELF-LIMITING. But that's the choice the ADMIN has made by INSISTING ON REMAINING an ACADEMICS-FIRST institution. So, the distinction you've made between less than optimal recruiting on one hand and the deficiencies of the football program on the other is A FALSE ONE. It's all a CONSEQUENCE of the same ACADEMICS-FIRST PHILOSOPHY.
And what the HOLDING COMPANY says the guidelines are is WHAT THEY ARE.
Now, if Freeman wants to attempt to OVERREACH his mission and start going about things the way that KELLY NOW CAN AT LSU, he will be out the door just like Kelly and Holtz before him. Holtz got his way for a while, but Kelly never did. Holtz was eased out, and Kelly finally GAVE UP when an offer HE COULDN'T REFUSE came his way.
Thing is, you're LOBBYING for a PALACE COUP that will NEVER HAPPEN, short of ND RENOUNCING everything it has STOOD FOR regarding football and academics and the relationship between the two for the past 70 YEARS.
But you're right about one thing. The way the game is evolving will make it INCREASINGLY DIFFICULT for ND to thread an EVER-NARROWING NEEDLE.
And, frankly, I HAVE NO IDEA what that will lead to.
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"I agree it might be a factor in some specific cases." Well, those specific cases are usually the 5* guys who you so covet who think they are NFL bound and have no interest in attending classes, etc.; for them the next three years are semi-pro (make some $$) and then the draft and the real $$$. Those guys just aren't usually interested in ND.
BULLSEYE.
Riley Leonard says it well at this Rookie camp:
"I think going to Duke and Notre Dame, the days are just crazy," Leonard said. "I know people think that, oh, college football, you're an athlete only. They're paying you to be an athlete. Well, apparently their schools haven't picked up on that yet because, guys, we're going to every class.
"We're going to every class, and that's a good thing. Recruits might not want to hear that, but parents, alright, send your kids to those two schools, you'll be just fine. But yeah, we're going to class every day, study hall, all that good stuff.
"I think you see throughout the draft process, these coaches know who the Notre Dame and Duke guys are. There's a different type of person that goes to those schools and a character that kind of stands out to everybody, which is nice."
"I think going to Duke and Notre Dame, the days are just crazy," Leonard said. "I know people think that, oh, college football, you're an athlete only. They're paying you to be an athlete. Well, apparently their schools haven't picked up on that yet because, guys, we're going to every class.
"We're going to every class, and that's a good thing. Recruits might not want to hear that, but parents, alright, send your kids to those two schools, you'll be just fine. But yeah, we're going to class every day, study hall, all that good stuff.
"I think you see throughout the draft process, these coaches know who the Notre Dame and Duke guys are. There's a different type of person that goes to those schools and a character that kind of stands out to everybody, which is nice."
There will always be people who value a quality education. There will always be people who don't. Those that do will end up at schools like ND.
And every interview I've heard of an ND kid IN THE LAST TWENTY YEARS has confirmed that.
ND'S players, by and large, ARE A CUT ABOVE as PEOPLE.
And that's both the GOAL and the FORMULA.
Not to mention the BASIS OF THE SCHOOL'S IDENTITY.
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I wouldn't say it if I didn't think that it's TRUE.
And it's not to say that there aren't outstanding kids at other places. But I've yet to see an ND player come off sounding POORLY in an interview.
They've all carried themselves EXTREMELY WELL.
And I don't think that that's just a COINCIDENCE.
And I think it is THIS that impressed Freeman when he was hired. And it's something he wishes to PERPETUATE.
I think your analogy of the Palace Coup is spot on, as is your conclusion that it will never happen
Except the Notre Dame has a higher profile when it comes to excelling in football, and is therefore more attractive
Glad you agree, but since I know our views on this are CONGRUENT, I'm not surprised.
Chase is pursuing a kind of UTOPIAN FANTASY that requires ND to do something COMPLETELY OUT OF CHARACTER. Why he can't see the contradiction inherent in this I DON'T KNOW. My only guess is WILLFUL BLINDNESS.
And, chase, if you're reading this, maybe you should put together an ACTION PLAN in the form of an OPEN LETTER to ND'S President and AD. LAY OUT FOR THEM what you think they should do to GET ON THE SAME PLANE as OSU & CO. Get into MSM print, hit all the ND podcasters, start campaigning for ND to CHANGE ITS STRIPES.
See what kind of response you get.
Who knows? Someone might even ENGAGE WITH YOU. I mean, if ND's President or AD were to make the same argument any number of us here have been making, WOULD THAT SUFFICE for you? Or would you still keep CAMPAIGNING?
You've taken it this far.
Why not go ALL . . . THE . . . WAY.
Seems like the Irish are getting richer, Chase! Just took a RB away from Alabama (Saban was recruiting him), Georgia and OSU (are they tier 1 or...?)
Pretty impressive class!
Pretty impressive class!
The answer to your question is simple …… rankings are on paper, but the real proof is the results on the field.
ND beat USC, Indiana, Georgia and Penn State in consecutive games
how many times do I have to remind you that the high academic standards limit the size and depth of the pool of potential recruits.
For whatever the reason you refuse to acknowledge the impact of higher academic standards on recruiting
