ADVERTISEMENT

Taking a look at the DEFENSE and Mike Elko's refreshing changes......

Duo

ND Expert
Jul 23, 2006
1,431
203
63
Mike Elko: "Scheme is irrelevant. We'll use whatever creates the best matches. Our approach will be matchup oriented."

That means on any given day the ND D could line up in a 4-3, 3-4 or 4-2-5. It all depends on the strengths and weaknesses of the opponent in any given game.

Elko thinks it is most important to be aggressive and to be able to come off blocks.

When asked about the season Elko said, "We've got to continue to develop because you can't reach your ceiling in 6 months. It's just not possible."

In addition to being the OC at Wake, Elko was also the safeties coach. He has coached some all american safeties in his career. That will be something for ND fans to watch for (look for Drue Tranquill).

What are your thoughts on the new defensive coordinator Mike Elko from Wake Forest and the possibilities for the ND defence this year?
 
  • Like
Reactions: JWh2340 and rgc7
Mike Elko: "Scheme is irrelevant. We'll use whatever creates the best matches. Our approach will be matchup oriented."

That means on any given day the ND D could line up in a 4-3, 3-4 or 4-2-5. It all depends on the strengths and weaknesses of the opponent in any given game.

Elko thinks it is most important to be aggressive and to be able to come off blocks.

When asked about the season Elko said, "We've got to continue to develop because you can't reach your ceiling in 6 months. It's just not possible."

In addition to being the OC at Wake, Elko was also the safeties coach. He has coached some all american safeties in his career. That will be something for ND fans to watch for (look for Drue Tranquill).

What are your thoughts on the new defensive coordinator Mike Elko from Wake Forest and the possibilities for the ND defence this year?

From what I have read, I like the fact that he went back to the fundamentals in the spring -- face it, ND had TERRIBLE tackling fundamentals under BVG. I like the fact that he continues to teach and coach, and it appears that he is just telling his players to simply play -- under BVG, these guys were thinking way too much.

We'll see in the fall, but, if he can get the guys to play like he got them to play at Wake Forest -- should be an interesting year!
 
  • Like
Reactions: rgc7
]
Mike Elko: "Scheme is irrelevant. We'll use whatever creates the best matches. Our approach will be matchup oriented."

That means on any given day the ND D could line up in a 4-3, 3-4 or 4-2-5. It all depends on the strengths and weaknesses of the opponent in any given game.

Elko thinks it is most important to be aggressive and to be able to come off blocks.

When asked about the season Elko said, "We've got to continue to develop because you can't reach your ceiling in 6 months. It's just not possible."

In addition to being the OC at Wake, Elko was also the safeties coach. He has coached some all american safeties in his career. That will be something for ND fans to watch for (look for Drue Tranquill).

What are your thoughts on the new defensive coordinator Mike Elko from Wake Forest and the possibilities for the ND defence this year?

A refreshing change would be progress on the field during the season.
 
Can't win a war without the troops. Are the boys good enough? It's that simple. Recent history isn't promising. But then, who knows?
 
  • Like
Reactions: tkirish
Virtually all of the teams on ND's schedule will be getting progressively better as the season progresses. (Barring injuries of course)

Sounds like the Irish have their work cut out for him then especially the DC
 
Sounds like the Irish have their work cut out for him then especially the DC

Dead...........

Yeah. But the same is true for everybody. That is why I am hoping that whoever loses the FSU/Bama opening game goes undefeated for the remainder of the season and they meet again in the playoffs. Just more great CFB!
 
Dead...........

Yeah. But the same is true for everybody. That is why I am hoping that whoever loses the FSU/Bama opening game goes undefeated for the remainder of the season and they meet again in the playoffs. Just more great CFB!
Is getting closer and I'm getting excited
go Irish
 
if ND can end up playing in a Bowl game........especially one of the more significant Bowls.........that would be a great achievement and speak volumes for the new coaches. I am expecting to see trickery by both the offence and the defence.
 
Major emphasis on fundamentals, employing an attacking at the line focus versus hit and hold, and major improvement in strength and conditioning are all at play here, and I expect we'll see a much improved product on the field.
 
Hit and hold? Thats called 2 gapping and it is a perfectly fine defensive technique. It is actually better than 1 gapping and flying up the field and getting screened, drawed, booted and reversed to death. Just let ND play defense and add up the PPG, Yards, 1st Downs, and make your analysis. Forget about scheme and technique here. Nobody knows anything about it.
 
listened to xm radio and Clemson coach said Wake foret defense wbest they faced all year... interesting considering who they played in the Championship. That is a good sign . Elko might get these guys rolling. There is enough talent .
 
Some thoughts on things I expect to improve defensively.

1. Schematic soundness. What bothered me most about BVG was that he would send overload blitzes that were telegraphed and leave the defense with obvious, major holes, and would ask players to rotate into difficult coverages that they did not possess the athleticism to execute. BVG likes to send pressure with his two ILB's, his Rover, both safeties and his boundary corner, but rarely does he send more than 5 or 6 and he plays responsible coverages behind them. I'm looking for weed to a defense that his not automatically giving up a 40 yard play simply because a blitz didn't get home.

2. Physicality. This will also have a lot to do with Matt Balis but I expect the ND defense to be more physical and tenacious. It's simply Mike Elko's personality to teach fundamentals of a downhill, physical defense predicated on sound tackling and individual matchups. This may not come to full fruition until 2018, after an entire year-and-a-half with Balis, but expect to see significant signs of a much more physical defense from nose guard to field corner.

3. Flexibility. How many times did Notre Dame get hamstrung by BVG's insatiable hunger to implement more scheme, effectively rendering almost all but the starting personnel useless and forcing them to play wayyyyuu too many snaps? I really like the flexibility of players such as Tranquill, Bilal and Crawford (nickel) at the Rover spot. Each brings a different skill set to the table and allows ND to matchup better week-to week.

4. Tackles for loss and batted / deflected balls. You'll see a lot more run blitzes and negative / zero gain types of plays. Elko really likes to activate his linebackers and get them into the backfield to disrupt the timing in the run game. Looking forward to some negative plays, even if we do get gashed a little more than I like.

5. Pass rushers. Daelin Hayes looks like he's for real and hopefully Okwara, Tranquill and Morgan can also be disruptive. I think Mike Elston did a good job when he was allowed to do his job under Bob Disco, and while he certainly benefited from having a Stephon Tuitt type defensive end, people are quick to forget that Shembo and Lewis-Moore, who were also productive pass rushers, we're low ranked 4 stars that Elston developed. I think we'll see some guys start to emerge, but I expect the pressures to be spread out.

I'm sticking to my prediction of a defense ranked somewhere in the low 30's this season in PPG. Earth shattering? No. I don't think ND has the personnel for that, especially in the first year of the scheme. ND'S defense did play a lot better and showed signs of improvement each week after BVG was fired. Had Elston been in charge the entire year my guess is the unit would have ranked somewhere in the 40's. I don't think it's overly ridiculous to think that ND will shave 2-3 PPG in year one under Elko.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Kelso86 and rgc7
Some thoughts on things I expect to improve defensively.

1. Schematic soundness. What bothered me most about BVG was that he would send overload blitzes that were telegraphed and leave the defense with obvious, major holes, and would ask players to rotate into difficult coverages that they did not possess the athleticism to execute. BVG likes to send pressure with his two ILB's, his Rover, both safeties and his boundary corner, but rarely does he send more than 5 or 6 and he plays responsible coverages behind them. I'm looking for weed to a defense that his not automatically giving up a 40 yard play simply because a blitz didn't get home.

2. Physicality. This will also have a lot to do with Matt Balis but I expect the ND defense to be more physical and tenacious. It's simply Mike Elko's personality to teach fundamentals of a downhill, physical defense predicated on sound tackling and individual matchups. This may not come to full fruition until 2018, after an entire year-and-a-half with Balis, but expect to see significant signs of a much more physical defense from nose guard to field corner.

3. Flexibility. How many times did Notre Dame get hamstrung by BVG's insatiable hunger to implement more scheme, effectively rendering almost all but the starting personnel useless and forcing them to play wayyyyuu too many snaps? I really like the flexibility of players such as Tranquill, Bilal and Crawford (nickel) at the Rover spot. Each brings a different skill set to the table and allows ND to matchup better week-to week.

4. Tackles for loss and batted / deflected balls. You'll see a lot more run blitzes and negative / zero gain types of plays. Elko really likes to activate his linebackers and get them into the backfield to disrupt the timing in the run game. Looking forward to some negative plays, even if we do get gashed a little more than I like.

5. Pass rushers. Daelin Hayes looks like he's for real and hopefully Okwara, Tranquill and Morgan can also be disruptive. I think Mike Elston did a good job when he was allowed to do his job under Bob Disco, and while he certainly benefited from having a Stephon Tuitt type defensive end, people are quick to forget that Shembo and Lewis-Moore, who were also productive pass rushers, we're low ranked 4 stars that Elston developed. I think we'll see some guys start to emerge, but I expect the pressures to be spread out.

I'm sticking to my prediction of a defense ranked somewhere in the low 30's this season in PPG. Earth shattering? No. I don't think ND has the personnel for that, especially in the first year of the scheme. ND'S defense did play a lot better and showed signs of improvement each week after BVG was fired. Had Elston been in charge the entire year my guess is the unit would have ranked somewhere in the 40's. I don't think it's overly ridiculous to think that ND will shave 2-3 PPG in year one under Elko.

The thing I don't get is you hear some coaches talk about being a physical defense?

Aren't all defenses taught to be physical? Lol.
I mean, isn't that the bedrock of any defense at all levels? To be physical?
 
Here's hoping after bama & fsu play in the opener, they both lose every game they play, forever. Not likely, but a man can dream.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Islero
Some thoughts on things I expect to improve defensively.

1. Schematic soundness. What bothered me most about BVG was that he would send overload blitzes that were telegraphed and leave the defense with obvious, major holes, and would ask players to rotate into difficult coverages that they did not possess the athleticism to execute. BVG likes to send pressure with his two ILB's, his Rover, both safeties and his boundary corner, but rarely does he send more than 5 or 6 and he plays responsible coverages behind them. I'm looking for weed to a defense that his not automatically giving up a 40 yard play simply because a blitz didn't get home.

2. Physicality. This will also have a lot to do with Matt Balis but I expect the ND defense to be more physical and tenacious. It's simply Mike Elko's personality to teach fundamentals of a downhill, physical defense predicated on sound tackling and individual matchups. This may not come to full fruition until 2018, after an entire year-and-a-half with Balis, but expect to see significant signs of a much more physical defense from nose guard to field corner.

3. Flexibility. How many times did Notre Dame get hamstrung by BVG's insatiable hunger to implement more scheme, effectively rendering almost all but the starting personnel useless and forcing them to play wayyyyuu too many snaps? I really like the flexibility of players such as Tranquill, Bilal and Crawford (nickel) at the Rover spot. Each brings a different skill set to the table and allows ND to matchup better week-to week.

4. Tackles for loss and batted / deflected balls. You'll see a lot more run blitzes and negative / zero gain types of plays. Elko really likes to activate his linebackers and get them into the backfield to disrupt the timing in the run game. Looking forward to some negative plays, even if we do get gashed a little more than I like.

5. Pass rushers. Daelin Hayes looks like he's for real and hopefully Okwara, Tranquill and Morgan can also be disruptive. I think Mike Elston did a good job when he was allowed to do his job under Bob Disco, and while he certainly benefited from having a Stephon Tuitt type defensive end, people are quick to forget that Shembo and Lewis-Moore, who were also productive pass rushers, we're low ranked 4 stars that Elston developed. I think we'll see some guys start to emerge, but I expect the pressures to be spread out.

I'm sticking to my prediction of a defense ranked somewhere in the low 30's this season in PPG. Earth shattering? No. I don't think ND has the personnel for that, especially in the first year of the scheme. ND'S defense did play a lot better and showed signs of improvement each week after BVG was fired. Had Elston been in charge the entire year my guess is the unit would have ranked somewhere in the 40's. I don't think it's overly ridiculous to think that ND will shave 2-3 PPG in year one under Elko.

Ontario........

Excellent post! Well thought out and featuring specifics on what you think the future looks like for the D.

Question: Re: "may not come to full fruition until 2018, after an entire year-and-a-half with Balis"

Can you expand on that a little? That said, what are you expecting for 2017? Feel free to comment in the game by game predictions thread if you like.
 
There are some excellent post on this board explaining a good sound analysis of the finer points of defensive
Football. I won't even attempt to do such an analysis because if I did, I would be in way over my head.
But here is what I like about what I get from both Elko's comments and what other posters have posted.
Have a team grounded in sound fundamentals and scheme is irrelevant. Every team has weaknesses
Someplace. Scout that team, find those weak spots, and then scheme to exploit those weaknesses on game day.
No matter the scheme , football is a game where your line and blockers have to beat the guy on the other side of the line. I remember Lou saying before a big game with Michigan: " You are not going to
Beat the U of M by outsmarting them, you are going to beat them by outblocking them and out tackling
Them. " in shot, Toughness, discipline, and sound fundamentals.
ND should be fun to watch next year ?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Telx1
Ontario........

Excellent post! Well thought out and featuring specifics on what you think the future looks like for the D.

Question: Re: "may not come to full fruition until 2018, after an entire year-and-a-half with Balis"

Can you expand on that a little? That said, what are you expecting for 2017? Feel free to comment in the game by game predictions thread if you like.

What I was getting at is that ND's strength program really fell off in the past couple years under the previous strength staff. Physicality is part mental. You have to be tough minded and have the will to be physical. Secondly, it is part knowledge based. You have to have confidence in your ability to perform the tasks being asked of you without the hesitancy associated with thinking. We often simplify this by saying "you have to play fast". Lastly, physicality requires the physicals tools to implement your will. Not all guys are born with ideal body frames, but through a high volume of work, over an extensive period of time, they can build their body to be an elite, physical, machine. That means the strength to overwhelm your opponent and the stamina to do so repeatedly over a period of time.

Personally speaking, I'm in good shape. I played college football, have been an athlete my entire life and now work in the military, where I am constantly performing physical tasks. I run roughly 40km per week on my own time (on top of work) and I lift between 3-4 days per week on top of that... With that said, I'm no longer interested in being really big and strong. I no longer take supplements and my work in the gym is primarily maintenance, rather than building at this point... If I were to change my mind and wanted to get really strong again, I would have a great base to do so but nevertheless, it would take time. There was a time that I was 5'11, 210lbs and really strong. Today I stand at the same 5'11, but am a much leaner 185lbs. So how does this relate to what I'm talking about with ND'S strength program?

The point that I'm getting at is that by all reports and we've seen definite physical progress in players to corroborate this statement, Balis is cranking up the ND strength program and the players are making serious physical gains. Those physical gains will also help change the mental attitude of the players as well, but that's another discussion. Let's face it, however, Balis will have had about 7 months of work with these kids by time fall camp comes around. Anybody who has ever lifted extensively on their own or participated in a high end strength program will tell you that you can make substantial gains in 7 months. I can and will attest to that. I've seen substantial gains in 3 month periods. I've seen mind-boggling transformations in 6-8 month periods, but if I'm also being honest, I can tell you that "desired results" almost never occur in under a year. It's a multi year process. Even with the greatest conditioning program in the world, the best strength coaches imaginable and the most borderline legal supplements to aid you along the way, paired with a perfect diet and ideal sleep, time under tension is still the primary factor and to be honest, ND'S players under Longo weren't spending enough time under tension, nor were they lifting heavy enough or in the most ideal ways (from everything I've been told). In simplistic terms, their workouts were not hard enough to really stress the body into getting stronger and more explosive and they weren't varied enough to cause the type of muscle stimulation that causes maximum growth and leads to advanced output... You can't outrun a bad diet and you can't replace a lack of effort in the gym. It's an integral part of modern football.

Under the most ideal conditions a high end athlete can add maybe 1-2lbs of lean muscle mass every month. The rest is going to be fat and water weight. ND had a lot of kids that were "heavy" and their measurables seemed right to be competitive in major college football, but when you saw them in person, it was obvious that the weight they had added wasn't always what you had hoped to see. Balis is changing that. The guys are starting to look like the guys you see in the NFL and at other top tier programs. That isn't by accident. He's working these kids exceptionally hard... But if you really want to see the fruits of their hard work, you're probably going to have to wait until 2018 to get the full effect because it simply takes that long to get the kind of results you are looking for. That is especially true given the fact that many of ND's best players are underclassmen, who had less of a base for Balis to work with than players that had already spent 3-4 years in a college (albeit an average one) weight program.

Hope that answers your question.
 
Last edited:
listened to xm radio and Clemson coach said Wake foret defense wbest they faced all year... interesting considering who they played in the Championship. That is a good sign . Elko might get these guys rolling. There is enough talent .

Exactly. Coaching can make a huge difference on a defense. We may not have the talent level of a Bama or Ohio State, but we've got a lot more talent on paper than Wake Forest. And Elko had WF's defense playing really well last year. They ranked 38th in the country in total defense, and 20th in ppg.

I'm looking forward to seeing what Elko can do with our D this year.
 
What I was getting at is that ND's strength program really fell off in the past couple years under the previous strength staff. Physicality is part mental. You have to be tough minded and have the will to be physical. Secondly, it is part knowledge based. You have to have confidence in your ability to perform the tasks being asked of you without the hesitancy associated with thinking. We often simplify this by saying "you have to play fast". Lastly, physicality requires the physicals tools to implement your will. Not all guys are born with ideal body frames, but through a high volume of work, over an extensive period of time, they can build their body to be an elite, physical, machine. That means the strength to overwhelm your opponent and the stamina to do so repeatedly over a period of time.

Personally speaking, I'm in good shape. I played college football, have been an athlete my entire life and now work in the military, where I am constantly performing physical tasks. I run roughly 40km per week on my own time (on top of work) and I lift between 3-4 days per week on top of that... With that said, I'm no longer interested in being really big and strong. I no longer take supplements and my work in the gym is primarily maintenance, rather than building at this point... If I were to change my mind and wanted to get really strong again, I would have a great base to do so but nevertheless, it would take time. There was a time that I was 5'11, 210lbs and really strong. Today I stand at the same 5'11, but am a much leaner 185lbs. So how does this relate to what I'm talking about with ND'S strength program?

The point that I'm getting at is that by all reports and we've seen definite physical progress in players to corroborate this statement, Balis is cranking up the ND strength program and the players are making serious physical gains. Those physical gains will also help change the mental attitude of the players as well, but that's another discussion. Let's face it, however, Balis will have had about 7 months of work with these kids by time fall camp comes around. Anybody who has ever lifted extensively on their own or participated in a high end strength program will tell you that you can make substantial gains in 7 months. I can and will attest to that. I've seen substantial gains in 3 month periods. I've seen mind-boggling transformations in 6-8 month periods, but if I'm also being honest, I can tell you that "desired results" almost never occur in under a year. It's a multi year process. Even with the greatest conditioning program in the world, the best strength coaches imaginable and the most borderline legal supplements to aid you along the way, paired with a perfect diet and ideal sleep, time under tension is still the primary factor and to be honest, ND'S players under Longo weren't spending enough time under tension, nor were they lifting heavy enough or in the most ideal ways (from everything I've been told). In simplistic terms, their workouts were not hard enough to really stress the body into getting stronger and more explosive and they weren't varied enough to cause the type of muscle stimulation that causes maximum growth and leads to advanced output... You can't outrun a bad diet and you can't replace a lack of effort in the gym. It's an integral part of modern football.

Under the most ideal conditions a high end athlete can add maybe 1-2lbs of lean muscle mass every month. The rest is going to be fat and water weight. ND had a lot of kids that were "heavy" and their measurables seemed right to be competitive in major college football, but when you saw them in person, it was obvious that the weight they had added wasn't always what you had hoped to see. Balis is changing that. The guys are starting to look like the guys you see in the NFL and at other top tier programs. That isn't by accident. He's working these kids exceptionally hard... But if you really want to see the fruits of their hard work, you're probably going to have to wait until 2018 to get the full effect because it simply takes that long to get the kind of results you are looking for. That is especially true given the fact that many of ND's best players are underclassmen, who had less of a base for Balis to work with than players that had already spent 3-4 years in a college (albeit an average one) weight program.

Hope that answers your question.

Ontario.........

Great explanation, enjoyed the read. I used to be a gym rat weight lifter myself and set the example for my 2 sons when they were in HS. They turn 28 this month, are in business for themselves and no longer play sports. But, they are much bigger and stronger than I ever was and now I am winding down.......doing lots of stretching and cardio and different kinds of work.

I do have a question though:

Re: "time under tension is still the primary factor and to be honest, ND'S players under Longo weren't spending enough time under tension"

I'm not familiar with the phrase "time under tension"? Do you mean the amount of time spent weight lifting? Or, the size of the weights? Or, super exhausting 4th quarter drills? Please explain.

PS. One summer my sons played American football in Central America near the equator where it was scorching hot and super humid. When they reported for football in the fall back in their home state of Colorado they ran circles around the other players. They were super strong, fit and had amazing stamina. Guess you might say their "time under tension" really paid off. Thoughts?
 
From what I have read, the thing that intrigues me about Elko's defense is that he plays a lot of players. ND's players may not have been in the best physical condition last year, but much of the fall off in the fourth quarter may also be attributed to less player rotation. I don't know if this is true or not. If it is, it could make a significant impact on player performance. I believe it was Vince Lombardi that stated "Exhaustion makes cowards of us all". I am looking forward to this season where ND will play a great schedule. Georgia will be the most physical team they play. Stanford will be the most disciplined team and USC will be the most talented overall. Given the disparity in talent, if ND doesn't beat Navy this year, then to quote Otis Redding, "a change is gonna come".
 
  • Like
Reactions: irishalice
I thought we had some real recruiting success on the DL this past season, especially in light of our record and staff makeover. Among these, Ewell looked to be the one that looked college strong and ready to compete for some reps. Now I read that Cage had minor knee surgery and hernia surgery, but that he will be ready to play by the Fall. This has to put his strength and conditioning on hold, and present an opportunity for Ewell to become a major player in the two deep. I want Cage healthy and in condition, but I am also anxious to see Ewell contribute, as I think he has the potential to be our best interior DL in many years.
 
I thought we had some real recruiting success on the DL this past season, especially in light of our record and staff makeover. Among these, Ewell looked to be the one that looked college strong and ready to compete for some reps. Now I read that Cage had minor knee surgery and hernia surgery, but that he will be ready to play by the Fall. This has to put his strength and conditioning on hold, and present an opportunity for Ewell to become a major player in the two deep. I want Cage healthy and in condition, but I am also anxious to see Ewell contribute, as I think he has the potential to be our best interior DL in many years.

The knee surgery Cage had in combination with his weight is a troubling proposition to be ready by fall. Conditioning is always a factor with him anyways, now he won't have offseason conditioning & is rehabbing.

I think he is a non-factor the first half of the season & probably still limited the second half.

But to your point of the Dline.
Franklin is tearing it up at the opening, even having a top Olineman say he was the hardest player to block.
Ewell is a stud. Same with Hayes.
Add in Jayson & Justin.
Then it looks like we will still get another DE in this class.

The Dline will go from weakness to strength in next two years.
 
The knee surgery Cage had in combination with his weight is a troubling proposition to be ready by fall. Conditioning is always a factor with him anyways, now he won't have offseason conditioning & is rehabbing.

I think he is a non-factor the first half of the season & probably still limited the second half.

But to your point of the Dline.
Franklin is tearing it up at the opening, even having a top Olineman say he was the hardest player to block.
Ewell is a stud. Same with Hayes.
Add in Jayson & Justin.
Then it looks like we will still get another DE in this class.

The Dline will go from weakness to strength in next two years.
Hope like hell that yet to be known DE will turn out to be Oweh. Add him to the mix and a very good two year haul on the DL potentially will be a great two year haul. Still hoping Kareem becomes a major contributor in his Sophomore season.
 
The DL is improving through much better recruiting, but it's going to be thin (particularly on the interior) this year because of the combination of Cage's injury and vast inexperience due to a blend of lack of talent and youth. I'm not a fan of Tiassum or Taylor and lisfranc injuries are a bastards to come back from in one year. Dew-Treadway has upside, but he's done absolutely nothing at this point and has been banged up.

I think Darnell Ewell was a great get and will prove to be a damn good defensive lineman in time and I suspect he's already making gains to his advanced body under Balis but to expect him to be dominant as a freshman is a tough ask. Really, we're left with Tillery, Bonner, whatever you can get out of Cage and Jay Hayes who will swing inside at times. Ewell and Dew-Treadway will be in a complimentary role. Suddenly, I'm much more confident in defensive end depth than I am DT / NG depth. Crazy how that works, isn't it?

That said, the future is bright. Ewell, Tagovailoa-Amosa, Franklin and Ademilola is an outstanding two year haul and ND is a major player for some big time 2019 guys as well.

As for defensive end, I still want Thomas Booker in a bad way. Would be a shame if he chooses Stanford and ND has to play against him for 4 years. That's going interesting. At the drop end position I really want Jayson Oweh but I have a feeling he ends up at Ohio State, unless they fill up in the meantime. The other drop end that would be a great pull is Joseph Ossai, but it's obvious Texas A&M leads. An ND visit could shake that up though and who knows, if Summit gets fired, that could open the door for ND late in the process.

Still a long way to go until February and if ND can start the season with a couple big wins and show that they've put last year behind them, there is no telling what kind of momentum they could gain on the recruiting front.

Let's get 4 of Booker, Austin, Simon, Lamb, McGrone, Tremble and Johnson before the end of August, have 16-17 guys secured before official visit season and try to finish strong with guys like Oweh, Ossai, Griffith, Cook, Salyer, Craig, Petit-Frere, St. Brown, Porter etc, etc... Just have to steal one ir two of those studs and you have an awesome, well rounded class in the making.
 
  • Like
Reactions: IrishDave1
The DL is improving through much better recruiting, but it's going to be thin (particularly on the interior) this year because of the combination of Cage's injury and vast inexperience due to a blend of lack of talent and youth. I'm not a fan of Tiassum or Taylor and lisfranc injuries are a bastards to come back from in one year. Dew-Treadway has upside, but he's done absolutely nothing at this point and has been banged up.

I think Darnell Ewell was a great get and will prove to be a damn good defensive lineman in time and I suspect he's already making gains to his advanced body under Balis but to expect him to be dominant as a freshman is a tough ask. Really, we're left with Tillery, Bonner, whatever you can get out of Cage and Jay Hayes who will swing inside at times. Ewell and Dew-Treadway will be in a complimentary role. Suddenly, I'm much more confident in defensive end depth than I am DT / NG depth. Crazy how that works, isn't it?

That said, the future is bright. Ewell, Tagovailoa-Amosa, Franklin and Ademilola is an outstanding two year haul and ND is a major player for some big time 2019 guys as well.

As for defensive end, I still want Thomas Booker in a bad way. Would be a shame if he chooses Stanford and ND has to play against him for 4 years. That's going interesting. At the drop end position I really want Jayson Oweh but I have a feeling he ends up at Ohio State, unless they fill up in the meantime. The other drop end that would be a great pull is Joseph Ossai, but it's obvious Texas A&M leads. An ND visit could shake that up though and who knows, if Summit gets fired, that could open the door for ND late in the process.

Still a long way to go until February and if ND can start the season with a couple big wins and show that they've put last year behind them, there is no telling what kind of momentum they could gain on the recruiting front.

Let's get 4 of Booker, Austin, Simon, Lamb, McGrone, Tremble and Johnson before the end of August, have 16-17 guys secured before official visit season and try to finish strong with guys like Oweh, Ossai, Griffith, Cook, Salyer, Craig, Petit-Frere, St. Brown, Porter etc, etc... Just have to steal one ir two of those studs and you have an awesome, well rounded class in the making.

A few weeks ago a few of those guys I thought were locks.
But now I'm pretty sure McGrone has lost interest in ND & seems to be in love with UM & some of the other schools giving him recent love.
Simon sounds like ND, but then he has a lot of comments about UM also?
Austin has to be ND or I will be completely shocked?
Tremble is a wildcard. He likes ND but we might have to steal him away?
St. Brown isn't coming in my opinion. He just doesn't seem excited about ND?
Griffith is another WTF happened guy? He was all ND then all of the sudden is all FSU?
I think Ossai wants to stay in Texas. He is smart to choose ND as an alternative choice for his top 3 just in case.
Oweh & Booker would both be a steal.
Lamb is interesting because everyone thought he is 100% west coast but he loved his visit to ND & maybe we can sway him away from UCLA this season?

So I am not as optimistic as I was ever since Griffith & McGrone seemed to flip?
But I'm hoping we get a few shockers/steals to end the class.
 
Hate to be a downer. Not too excited. Power run game will eat us alive

Well, if we get Sophomore Tillery instead of Freshman Tillery than yes it will.
But I think Morgan & Tranquill in run support could help a little. Maybe Ewell puts forth a freshman year like Day did?
Or our Offense puts up so many points teams are forced to abandon the run?
 
Navy, AF, smaller sized teams, etc... find ways to compete up front. On offense they run options, but on D they still figure ways out.

If ND is weaker up front they need to find ways to cover for it like the Academies do.
 
  • Like
Reactions: rgc7
Well, if we get Sophomore Tillery instead of Freshman Tillery than yes it will.
But I think Morgan & Tranquill in run support could help a little. Maybe Ewell puts forth a freshman year like Day did?
Or our Offense puts up so many points teams are forced to abandon the run?
It's not talent I'm worried about but scheme. Elko D has a huge power run game hole
 
The DL is improving through much better recruiting, but it's going to be thin (particularly on the interior) this year because of the combination of Cage's injury and vast inexperience due to a blend of lack of talent and youth. I'm not a fan of Tiassum or Taylor and lisfranc injuries are a bastards to come back from in one year. Dew-Treadway has upside, but he's done absolutely nothing at this point and has been banged up.

I think Darnell Ewell was a great get and will prove to be a damn good defensive lineman in time and I suspect he's already making gains to his advanced body under Balis but to expect him to be dominant as a freshman is a tough ask. Really, we're left with Tillery, Bonner, whatever you can get out of Cage and Jay Hayes who will swing inside at times. Ewell and Dew-Treadway will be in a complimentary role. Suddenly, I'm much more confident in defensive end depth than I am DT / NG depth. Crazy how that works, isn't it?

That said, the future is bright. Ewell, Tagovailoa-Amosa, Franklin and Ademilola is an outstanding two year haul and ND is a major player for some big time 2019 guys as well.

As for defensive end, I still want Thomas Booker in a bad way. Would be a shame if he chooses Stanford and ND has to play against him for 4 years. That's going interesting. At the drop end position I really want Jayson Oweh but I have a feeling he ends up at Ohio State, unless they fill up in the meantime. The other drop end that would be a great pull is Joseph Ossai, but it's obvious Texas A&M leads. An ND visit could shake that up though and who knows, if Summit gets fired, that could open the door for ND late in the process.

Still a long way to go until February and if ND can start the season with a couple big wins and show that they've put last year behind them, there is no telling what kind of momentum they could gain on the recruiting front.

Let's get 4 of Booker, Austin, Simon, Lamb, McGrone, Tremble and Johnson before the end of August, have 16-17 guys secured before official visit season and try to finish strong with guys like Oweh, Ossai, Griffith, Cook, Salyer, Craig, Petit-Frere, St. Brown, Porter etc, etc... Just have to steal one ir two of those studs and you have an awesome, well rounded class in the making.

P.S.
I sent you a message with the service info we discussed.
 
It's not talent I'm worried about but scheme. Elko D has a huge power run game hole

I don't know that any real quality defensive coordinator (which I believe Elko is) necessarily has a defense that is intrinsically flawed again a power running game. I think more than anything, he had really average and even below average defensive lineman at Wake Forest. At times he had really solid individual guys but as a group they weren't a great unit. He relied on a lot of linebacker run blitzes and safeties flowing down into the box as extra hats, not by choice, but out of need. I think you'll see a little bit of that at ND as well, but overall, he has much better personnel. Is ND'S defensive line 2012 good? Not even close, but look at the unit and toy see Daelin Hayes who is on track to be highly coveted in the NFL. Jerry Tillery who is a surefire NFL'er as well. Jay Hayes, needs to put it together but is not lacking talent. Khalid Kareem, who was once committed to Alabama. Darnell Ewell, who was more highly ranked and coveted (offers) than all of them... Elko has a lot better pieces to work with to stop the run at Notre Dame. Unlike pass rush, which man be schemed and manufactured, defending the requires the bodies to do so.

I'll reserve my judgement until Elko has a couple years of shutting down the run with the huge upgrade in talent he has at ND vs at Wake Forest.
 
There are some objective reasons to believe the defense will be better next season.

1. Balis. We were not a well conditioned team so we lost the 4th quarter on offense and defense. That should be remedied as shown in Body by Balis posts.

2. We were a step slow in BVG's defense. Although ND hatas will say we still will be with essentially the same players, BVG's schemes neither created TOs nor sacks. The players never really looked like they knew what they were doing. Players who know their roles will be a step faster and that will result in sacks, TOs, TFLs, and Passes Deflected

3. Next year we should have:
a. Crawford, Tranquil, Watkins, Love and other players who strike me as better than 2016.
b. A year improved DL guys. We really only lose JJ who played beneath himself and Rochell who distinguished himself. I think personnel is better but we already have injuries and that hurts the competition we needed. Guys like JHayes and DHayes should be factors
c. 4 LBs who have basically been starting games for 2 years and are now in a friendlier scheme per opponent.

Still, it is all just talk until we see it. Right now they are a 4-8 defense an then realize it. I like that.
 
Summarizing posts and opinions of fans that obviously have watched ND over, at least recent years, the comments always center around: poor fundamentals, poor conditioning, a lack of discipline, certain position groups lacking depth/talent. Then during seasons there are complaints about game plans, poor in game decisions, inability to make halftime adjustments, a lack of team leadership by both staff and players, all while compiling disappointing season records; all under a "CEO" in the eighth year of his employment.
How could one not be optimistic?
 
Summarizing posts and opinions of fans that obviously have watched ND over, at least recent years, the comments always center around: poor fundamentals, poor conditioning, a lack of discipline, certain position groups lacking depth/talent. Then during seasons there are complaints about game plans, poor in game decisions, inability to make halftime adjustments, a lack of team leadership by both staff and players, all while compiling disappointing season records; all under a "CEO" in the eighth year of his employment.
How could one not be optimistic?

That is summarizing the comments of some fans, not all. And a funny thing about comments, in all things in life, not just football, the majority of comments are negative because negative people complain a lot more than positive people.
You can go to a 3 Michelin Star restaurant's site & you will see a more negative comments than positive.

All the times the "CEO" does something well nobody remembers it or posts about it. It's selection/reporting bias.

Everyone should take 5 minutes & read Lou Somogyi's inside take on ND hiring since the early '80s. He breaks down all the decisions & how/why they were made & gives facts (not thread banter) on all the coaches people clammer for on ND sites & why the aren't coming to ND or have turned ND down. Even goes into CBK in 2009 & how he was literally the hottest coach on the market & had the best resume of any option ND had. And currently there really are no options out there that come even close to meeting what people want.
 
Last edited:
A lot of what is mentioned is not just opinion, but based upon past events and history.
Criticism is often based upon generally recognized benchmarks.
You sure are 'negative' towards people in general.

can you figure out why I post this clip?

 
Last edited:
Summarizing posts and opinions of fans that obviously have watched ND over, at least recent years, the comments always center around: poor fundamentals, poor conditioning, a lack of discipline, certain position groups lacking depth/talent. Then during seasons there are complaints about game plans, poor in game decisions, inability to make halftime adjustments, a lack of team leadership by both staff and players, all while compiling disappointing season records; all under a "CEO" in the eighth year of his employment.
How could one not be optimistic?
Dead horse alert !
 
A lot of what is mentioned is not just opinion, but based upon past events and history.
Criticism is often based upon generally recognized benchmarks.
You sure are 'negative' towards people in general.

can you figure out why I post this clip?


lol, I'm negative?

I'm the one who defends ND's players, coaches, University, team...

I don't like complainers, whiners, blamers & people who offer nothing but criticism without solutions.

I won't be watching your clip because I lived that life & that movie is silly.

I'm going to add you to ignore, not because I dislike you, or am mad at you, or any type of disrespect. It's just because I already know what you are going to post before you do it, so no reason for me to read it. No matter what is ever posted, I will just chalk up your response as negative towards Brian Kelly, to save us both time.

If it's possible, enjoy the season.
(Which must be hard because if ND wins you will be upset as well?)

Godspeed.
 
ADVERTISEMENT
ADVERTISEMENT