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Stop Hyping up the Michigan defense!!!

Zorich 88

I've posted how many times?
Dec 7, 2006
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I am tired of all the Michigan fans posting and bragging about how great their defense is. The Detroit Freepress even did an article going as far as saying this Michigan defense is a championship caliber defense. WHAT? My first question to that crazy remark is who did they beat last season???
Florida 4-7
Cinci 4-8
Air Force 5-7
Purdue 7-6
Indiana 5-7
Rutgers 4-8
Minnesota 5-7
Maryland 4-8

Come on! You wanna call this a championship defense when the team did not beat ONE team with a winning record?
Okay, blame the offense. But real teams like PSU and Wisky had zero problems with the Michigan defense.

ND will win this game. Unfortently, this game will not seem as big at the end of the season. Michigan will have 4-5 loses and will be talking about firing Jim.
 
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I am tired of all the Michigan fans posting and bragging about how great their defense is. The Detroit Freepress even did an article going as far as saying this Michigan defense is a championship caliber defense. WHAT? My first question to that crazy remark is who did they beat last season???
Florida 4-7
Cinci 4-8
Air Force 5-7
Purdue 7-6
Indiana 5-7
Rutgers 4-8
Minnesota 5-7
Maryland 4-8

Come on! You wanna call this a championship defense when the team did not beat ONE team with a winning record?
Okay, blame the offense. But real teams like PSU and Wisky had zero problems with the Michigan defense.

ND will win this game. Unfortently, this game will not seem as big at the end of the season. Michigan will have 4-5 loses and will be talking about firing Jim.

Love it. This post will be archived.
 
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I am tired of all the Michigan fans posting and bragging about how great their defense is. The Detroit Freepress even did an article going as far as saying this Michigan defense is a championship caliber defense. WHAT? My first question to that crazy remark is who did they beat last season???
Florida 4-7
Cinci 4-8
Air Force 5-7
Purdue 7-6
Indiana 5-7
Rutgers 4-8
Minnesota 5-7
Maryland 4-8

Come on! You wanna call this a championship defense when the team did not beat ONE team with a winning record?
Okay, blame the offense. But real teams like PSU and Wisky had zero problems with the Michigan defense.

ND will win this game. Unfortently, this game will not seem as big at the end of the season. Michigan will have 4-5 loses and will be talking about firing Jim.
There was a reason why ND stopped scheduling Purdue. ;)
 
I am tired of all the Michigan fans posting and bragging about how great their defense is. The Detroit Freepress even did an article going as far as saying this Michigan defense is a championship caliber defense. WHAT? My first question to that crazy remark is who did they beat last season???
Florida 4-7
Cinci 4-8
Air Force 5-7
Purdue 7-6
Indiana 5-7
Rutgers 4-8
Minnesota 5-7
Maryland 4-8

Come on! You wanna call this a championship defense when the team did not beat ONE team with a winning record?
Okay, blame the offense. But real teams like PSU and Wisky had zero problems with the Michigan defense.

ND will win this game. Unfortently, this game will not seem as big at the end of the season. Michigan will have 4-5 loses and will be talking about firing Jim.
Here is another way to look at the UM defense. No doubt they got bushwacked in Happy Valley. But if UM repeated their performance every game against MSU, SC, WISC, and OSU they would have had the 1st, 9th, 16th, and 33rd best defense in college football presuming that total yardage was the only metric. ND's average allowed was 369 yards which was tied for 46th.

UM did not lose games last year because their defense was poor. Despite having arguably the least experienced team in college football they were able to hold their own against some very good offenses.

They lost games because they were unable to replicate the ball possession and field position offense that worked so well in 2016. If Shea Patterson is as good as 2016 Wilton Speight I think that with suitable rest and now a year of experience they can be very good.

I will reiterate my opinion that an incredibly inexperienced team was good enough to be top 5 in a lot of defensive metrics. With a year of experience and additional depth the flaws that were exploited last year will be much harder to exploit. If the offense gives the defense any respite by staying on the field, I think it has the makings of a top 5 defense. Just going by the All American lists there are 5 individuals from UM on Athelon's preseason All American list. Athelon thinks the 3rd and 4th best DE's play for one team. So it is not just the Detroit Free Press that thinks UM D could be pretty good. Of course the games have to be played and we will find out. To the victor go the trolls :)
 
They have a good defense. There shouldn't be an argument about that. To be a playoff caliber team you need to be strong up front on both sides and they're not.
 
Rashan Gary
Chase Winnovich
Khaleke Hudson
Devin Bush
Lavert Hill
David Long

Are all really good football players, coached by an excellent DC. It's not type. They play good football. You can hate a team and still respect them.
 
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They have a good defense. There shouldn't be an argument about that. To be a playoff caliber team you need to be strong up front on both sides and they're not.
That I agree with you. I do not project UM as a serious BCS contender because even though there is potential there are too many question marks. I don't think you can be a serious BCS contender with the question marks at tackle. Shea Patterson would have to be the 2nd coming of Baker Mayfield.
 
Rashan Gary
Chase Winnovich
Khaleke Hudson
Devin Bush
Lavert Hill
David Long

Are all really good football players, coached by an excellent DC. It's not type. They play good football. You can hate a team and still respect them.
I never said they were not "good" football players. I said no way based off of SOS last season would I call them a championship caliber defense. I do question why there D.C. Is considered excellent???
 
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I never said they were not "good" football players. I said no way based off of SOS last season would I call them a championship caliber defense. I do question why there D.C. Is considered excellent???
Because of what he did in the past. Look at Don Browns record. He is a great Dcoordinator. It is always possible that teams might catch up to his run blitz tricks. I always viewed him as a college version of Dick LeBeau. Blitz and blitz some more.
 
They do have 10 returning starters and they are coming into South Bend mad as hell. It worries me especially with what was lost on the line. Don’t be shocked if it takes a while to break through. They are very good and athletic.
 
That I agree with you. I do not project UM as a serious BCS contender because even though there is potential there are too many question marks. I don't think you can be a serious BCS contender with the question marks at tackle. Shea Patterson would have to be the 2nd coming of Baker Mayfield.
You have too much common sense to be posting here ;)
That kind of comprehensive talk with a holistic view of a program is not tolerated.

All kidding aside, please stop referencing the BCS. That ship sailed with the new "playoff" format.
 
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Just for the sake of argument...Michigan 2017 schedule.....Total Offense rankings.....Fla 109th, Cincy 101st, OSU 7th, MSU 91st, PSU 19th, AF 49th, Purdue 61st, Indiana 70th, Rutgers 128th, South Carolina 108th, Minny 122nd, Maryland 119th, Wisc 51st.
Offense Scoring....Fla 108th, Cincy 110th, OSU 6th, MSU 96th, PSU 7th, AF 44th, Purdue 91st, Indiana 78th, Rutgers 120th, South Carolina 99th, Maryland 100th, and Wisc 28th. From the three opponents that had any type of offense to speak of...OSU scored 31, Wisc scored 24 and PSU scored 42 against the Michigan defense. Lot of numbers here but numbers can tell some of the story. 2018 is a new season.
 
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You have too much common sense to be posting here ;)
That kind of comprehensive talk with a holistic view of a program is not tolerated.

All kidding aside, please stop referencing the BCS. That ship sailed with the new "playoff" format.
that ship sailed a while ago.
 
Just for the sake of argument...Michigan 2017 schedule.....Total Offense rankings.....Fla 109th, Cincy 101st, OSU 7th, MSU 91st, PSU 19th, AF 49th, Purdue 61st, Indiana 70th, Rutgers 128th, South Carolina 108th, Minny 122nd, Maryland 119th, Wisc 51st.
Offense Scoring....Fla 108th, Cincy 110th, OSU 6th, MSU 96th, PSU 7th, AF 44th, Purdue 91st, Indiana 78th, Rutgers 120th, South Carolina 99th, Maryland 100th, and Wisc 28th. From the three opponents that had any type of offense to speak of...OSU scored 31, Wisc scored 24 and PSU scored 42 against the Michigan defense. Lot of numbers here but numbers can tell some of the story. 2018 is a new season.

When you can hold OSU to under 350 total yards, and Wisconsin under 300 total yards, you are dealing with a really good Defense. The points against had more to do with Michigan’s inept offense, but make no mistake, OSU and Wisky struggled to move the ball.

And that was against a D with 10 new starters. This year they have experience...
 
Just for the sake of argument...Michigan 2017 schedule.....Total Offense rankings.....Fla 109th, Cincy 101st, OSU 7th, MSU 91st, PSU 19th, AF 49th, Purdue 61st, Indiana 70th, Rutgers 128th, South Carolina 108th, Minny 122nd, Maryland 119th, Wisc 51st.
Offense Scoring....Fla 108th, Cincy 110th, OSU 6th, MSU 96th, PSU 7th, AF 44th, Purdue 91st, Indiana 78th, Rutgers 120th, South Carolina 99th, Maryland 100th, and Wisc 28th. From the three opponents that had any type of offense to speak of...OSU scored 31, Wisc scored 24 and PSU scored 42 against the Michigan defense. Lot of numbers here but numbers can tell some of the story. 2018 is a new season.
I think your better point would be to look at yards per play. There is no doubt UM attempted to shorten games with ball control. The big difference between 2016 and 2017 is with some exceptions Speight was at least decent at keeping the offense moving. Maybe they did not always score but they got a 1st down or two to force teams to go the length of the field.

What really hurt UM in 2017 is the offense generated a lot of 3 and outs wearing out the defense, they generated a lot more TO's forcing the defense on a short field, but also regressing in the punt game. Unnoticed is Jabril Peppers was really good at catching every punt. UM was probably gaining 50-75 yards of field position per game by Peppers never letting a punt bounce. In a tight game where you may only have 300-350 yards of offense preventing a few bouncing punts is huge. Last year there was a true freshman trying to do that.

All of those will improve in 2018. I for one hope that Brian Kelly thinks the UM defense is overrated as much as this board.
 
Not sure too many Irish fans think the Michigan defense is over rated. Just sick of hearing about it. As a fan who plays no part in the outcome, I give due respect to the Michigan program as I will do the same to Ball State the very next week. We can break down last season all kinds of different ways and always come up with the same conclusion. That was then, this is now.
 
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I think your better point would be to look at yards per play. There is no doubt UM attempted to shorten games with ball control. The big difference between 2016 and 2017 is with some exceptions Speight was at least decent at keeping the offense moving. Maybe they did not always score but they got a 1st down or two to force teams to go the length of the field.

What really hurt UM in 2017 is the offense generated a lot of 3 and outs wearing out the defense, they generated a lot more TO's forcing the defense on a short field, but also regressing in the punt game. Unnoticed is Jabril Peppers was really good at catching every punt. UM was probably gaining 50-75 yards of field position per game by Peppers never letting a punt bounce. In a tight game where you may only have 300-350 yards of offense preventing a few bouncing punts is huge. Last year there was a true freshman trying to do that.

All of those will improve in 2018. I for one hope that Brian Kelly thinks the UM defense is overrated as much as this board.
So all five games Michigan lost was because of the offense?

Also, still don't see greatness in the DC. Where was he great at?
BC? 3 years nothing special.
UConn? 1 year Nothing
Maryland? 1 year Nothing
Where exactly did this GREAT DC thing happen???
 
So all five games Michigan lost was because of the offense?

Also, still don't see greatness in the DC. Where was he great at?
BC? 3 years nothing special.
UConn? 1 year Nothing
Maryland? 1 year Nothing
Where exactly did this GREAT DC thing happen???
And they say Defense wins Championships! Lols
 
So all five games Michigan lost was because of the offense?

Also, still don't see greatness in the DC. Where was he great at?
BC? 3 years nothing special.
UConn? 1 year Nothing
Maryland? 1 year Nothing
Where exactly did this GREAT DC thing happen???
Don't know what to say. Where Don Brown has gone he has not only built defenses but he has left a legacy where there is success after he left. The best example is BC where they were 11th in 2015 but 1st in 2016 and still 9th in 2017. The same thing happened at Maryland and UCONN despite short stays. Is Don Brown a deity? No! But he is a fine coach who does have a track record. Regardless of how good or bad he is I prefer the aggressive style of attempting to make defensive plays verses being passive and hoping the offense does not make plays.
 
Don't know what to say. Where Don Brown has gone he has not only built defenses but he has left a legacy where there is success after he left. The best example is BC where they were 11th in 2015 but 1st in 2016 and still 9th in 2017. The same thing happened at Maryland and UCONN despite short stays. Is Don Brown a deity? No! But he is a fine coach who does have a track record. Regardless of how good or bad he is I prefer the aggressive style of attempting to make defensive plays verses being passive and hoping the offense does not make plays.
left a legacy ? i think he is a very good coach but you're making him out to be buddy ryan.
 
left a legacy ? i think he is a very good coach but you're making him out to be buddy ryan.
As good as a coordinator can. The year he left UCONN they were 9th in ypg and at BC they were 1st. I can't dig up any good stats on Maryland. Any college coach is limited by turnover especially a coordinator. The proof will be in the pudding this year because UM has a very difficult schedule. Depending on the ratings agencies they have to play 5 top 15 teams. So how about we let the schedule play out and make our observation at the end?
 
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As good as a coordinator can. The year he left UCONN they were 9th in ypg and at BC they were 1st. I can't dig up any good stats on Maryland. Any college coach is limited by turnover especially a coordinator. The proof will be in the pudding this year because UM has a very difficult schedule. Depending on the ratings agencies they have to play 5 top 15 teams. So how about we let the schedule play out and make our observation at the end?
Great hire by Hardballs ..... Brown has saved face for Mr. Khaki Pants so far.
 
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