Recruiting Crashing

Get Nasty

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I talked about this before the season. If we find out that Freeman and Rees are bad coaches (WE FOUND THAT OUT) then our record will be worse than 10-2 and recruiting will fall depending on how bad it is. Obviously the D hasn't looked great and the offense has been absolutely awful.

Trending right now to end up with a Brian Kelly type class but with a coaching staff far far far worse.

Not good

Paige probably going to USC, love trending away, lyons not a lock, no plan or good option for keeley backup, no qb, bowen probably gone (it would make us losing our top 3 commits), and in 24 our top DE looking at UM now secretively. That's what we know right now and it's not getting better. Complete disaster on the field. THanks OHIO STATE GRAD.

If Freeman can't recruit lights out, this will send ND backwards more than TY and bob davie did.
 

IrishBeer

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I talked about this before the season. If we find out that Freeman and Rees are bad coaches (WE FOUND THAT OUT) then our record will be worse than 10-2 and recruiting will fall depending on how bad it is. Obviously the D hasn't looked great and the offense has been absolutely awful.

Trending right now to end up with a Brian Kelly type class but with a coaching staff far far far worse.

Not good

Paige probably going to USC, love trending away, lyons not a lock, no plan or good option for keeley backup, no qb, bowen probably gone (it would make us losing our top 3 commits), and in 24 our top DE looking at UM now secretively. That's what we know right now and it's not getting better. Complete disaster on the field. THanks OHIO STATE GRAD.

If Freeman can't recruit lights out, this will send ND backwards more than TY and bob davie did.
Agree. If we don't make a bowl game, Jack needs to take it on the chin and get the train back on the tracks before it derails so far off the tracks there's no getting it back on. One only needs to look at other programs that made huge coaching mistakes to see how long it takes to rebound. Some never did. At a place like ND (admissions and requirements) and in this era (not playing big NIL), hiring the wrong guy could be a death sentence (i.e., Nebraska). Pull the plug and hire a home run coach while the culture is still mediocre and the recruiting isn't in shambles. Likely we take the path of least resistance here, which is to give Freeman 3-5 years regardless of how he's doing. That could do irreparable damage. Not making a bowl game with the talent level on this current team to me is as bad or worse than 3 losing seasons.
 
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Get Nasty

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Agree. If we don't make a bowl game, Jack needs to take it on the chin and get the train back on the tracks before it derails so far off the tracks there's no getting it back on. One only needs to look at other programs that made huge coaching mistakes to see how long it takes to rebound. Some never did. At a place like ND (admissions and requirements) and in this era (not playing big NIL), hiring the wrong guy could be a death sentence (i.e., Nebraska). Pull the plug and hire a home run coach while the culture is still mediocre and the recruiting isn't in shambles. Likely we take the path of least resistance here, which is to give Freeman 3-5 years regardless of how he's doing. That could do irreparable damage. Not making a bowl game with the talent level on this current team to me is as bad or worse than 3 losing seasons.
If jack isn't right now talking with and seeing what the market looks like for HC he is an idiot. I'm not talking about offers or anything that extreme yet, but it's clear Freeman and staff have major coaching issues, the question is can they fix them. 8-4 and freeman probably should get 1 more year, anything worse he should be canned on the spot. A good coach has this team 10-2 this year at worst.
 
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IrishBeer

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Freeman was hired because he is a good recruiter. I wouldn't be surprised if he's less successful at recruiting than BK by the time signing day rolls around. Nobody wants to play for a bum coach. The Marshall loss was a dagger. Only way Freeman survives is if ND starts looking like Georgia in the next few weeks and gets back in the rankings. That loss to Marshall means we need to win even bigger and he needs to look even better. At that point the Marshall loss simply becomes an oops. Beat Clemson and things are very very different. I highly doubt Freeman is our coach by 2024 season unless Jack is too worried about legalities to fire him. Unfortunately, even if he losses every single game from here on out, ND won't have the guts to fire him and he'll be back next season. Fickell will get picked up by some school that cares about winning. If Lincoln Riley or Brian Kelly lost every game from here on out, they would not be treated the same.
 
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IrishBeer

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Sayin is very interested in LSU. If Saying picks LSU, Georgia will take a harder swing at Jayden Davis. If Jayden Davis goes to Georgia, Michigan will press harder for CJ Carr. ND fires Rees, keep pressuring Carr for '24, and Freeman keeps losing to Marshall's and CJ is bye bye to Michigan. I like Michigan's odds to make the playoffs again this season.
 

tbonesays

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Sayin is very interested in LSU. If Saying picks LSU, Georgia will take a harder swing at Jayden Davis. If Jayden Davis goes to Georgia, Michigan will press harder for CJ Carr. ND fires Rees, keep pressuring Carr for '24, and Freeman keeps losing to Marshall's and CJ is bye bye to Michigan. I like Michigan's odds to make the playoffs again this season.
You think CJ Carr's commitment to ND is contingent on us winning X games in Freeman's first year?
 

IrishBeer

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You think CJ Carr's commitment to ND is contingent on us winning X games in Freeman's first year?
And Rees's firing, and recruiting falling off, and Michigan's success, and Michigan's potential opening for '24 QB, and pressuring him to '24, and Freeman's future with the program, and lack of OL development.

Do I think he bails? Not too worried as things stand now. Lose another 4-5 games and a bunch of recruits and I will certainly start worrying. Right now I expect Freeman will lose at least 4-5 more games, so I am worrying in advance.
 

IrishMike409

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If jack isn't right now talking with and seeing what the market looks like for HC he is an idiot. I'm not talking about offers or anything that extreme yet, but it's clear Freeman and staff have major coaching issues, the question is can they fix them. 8-4 and freeman probably should get 1 more year, anything worse he should be canned on the spot. A good coach has this team 10-2 this year at worst.
Every leader has a bench or succession plan, ready at all times.

That being said, it isn’t even close to time to start talking about firing Freeman. Not close. Even if we’re 4-8 (won’t happen), he’ll be back next season.

Jack played his hand. Coulda had Campbell or Fickell, but he chose Freeman. This has to play out. Freeman deserves at least 2 seasons.
 

IrishBeer

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Every leader has a bench or succession plan, ready at all times.

That being said, it isn’t even close to time to start talking about firing Freeman. Not close. Even if we’re 4-8 (won’t happen), he’ll be back next season.

Jack played his hand. Coulda had Campbell or Fickell, but he chose Freeman. This has to play out. Freeman deserves at least 2 seasons.
Agree besides "deserving" anything. He doesn't deserve a thing. He has one of the most prestigious jobs in all of college sports and he's in way over his head. The student athletes at ND and the fans deserve better.
 
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Get Nasty

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Every leader has a bench or succession plan, ready at all times.

That being said, it isn’t even close to time to start talking about firing Freeman. Not close. Even if we’re 4-8 (won’t happen), he’ll be back next season.

Jack played his hand. Coulda had Campbell or Fickell, but he chose Freeman. This has to play out. Freeman deserves at least 2 seasons.
Except Jack when BK left, and possibly not now despite it being very clear Freeman is wayyyy in over is head. Maybe freeman turns it around, I sure hope so because I believe he can recruit at a level much higher than BK. But if you don't win 8 games with our talent, bye bye bye
 

beachcardinal

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Lots of talk at USC that Elijah Paige may flip to us. But that may change if we lose to Oregon State which I think is a 50/50 game for us at best.
 

IrishMike409

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Except Jack when BK left, and possibly not now despite it being very clear Freeman is wayyyy in over is head. Maybe freeman turns it around, I sure hope so because I believe he can recruit at a level much higher than BK. But if you don't win 8 games with our talent, bye bye bye
He’s 3 games in. Can’t yet say he’s in over his head.

So 8 is the watermark? Based on what? Win 7 and he’s fired. Win 8 and he’s safe?

Starting QB is out for the year.
 

NIN Irish

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Agree besides "deserving" anything. He doesn't deserve a thing. He has one of the most prestigious jobs in all of college sports and he's in way over his head. The student athletes at ND and the fans deserve better.
"Deserves got nothing to do with it." William Munny
 

buckey

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Agree. If we don't make a bowl game, Jack needs to take it on the chin and get the train back on the tracks before it derails so far off the tracks there's no getting it back on. One only needs to look at other programs that made huge coaching mistakes to see how long it takes to rebound. Some never did. At a place like ND (admissions and requirements) and in this era (not playing big NIL), hiring the wrong guy could be a death sentence (i.e., Nebraska). Pull the plug and hire a home run coach while the culture is still mediocre and the recruiting isn't in shambles. Likely we take the path of least resistance here, which is to give Freeman 3-5 years regardless of how he's doing. That could do irreparable damage. Not making a bowl game with the talent level on this current team to me is as bad or worse than 3 losing seasons.
No way freeman gets canned
 
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DieHard_Irish

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A lot of nonsense here. Not surprised by the 2 stirring it up
Exactly, you'd think these idiots would just go find another team. Coach Freeman and coach Rees aren't going anywhere. With our youth at the skill positions on offense, anyone who thought we were a playoff team knows nothing at all about football; kinda like the two who continually stir it up; know nothing, idiots
 

echowaker

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Every leader has a bench or succession plan, ready at all times.

That being said, it isn’t even close to time to start talking about firing Freeman. Not close. Even if we’re 4-8 (won’t happen), he’ll be back next season.

Jack played his hand. Coulda had Campbell or Fickell, but he chose Freeman. This has to play out. Freeman deserves at least 2 seasons.
No he could not of had Fickell. Luke was not interested. Not sure why that false narrative is still floating around.
 
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Pennick4

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I talked about this before the season. If we find out that Freeman and Rees are bad coaches (WE FOUND THAT OUT) then our record will be worse than 10-2 and recruiting will fall depending on how bad it is. Obviously the D hasn't looked great and the offense has been absolutely awful.

Trending right now to end up with a Brian Kelly type class but with a coaching staff far far far worse.

Not good

Paige probably going to USC, love trending away, lyons not a lock, no plan or good option for keeley backup, no qb, bowen probably gone (it would make us losing our top 3 commits), and in 24 our top DE looking at UM now secretively. That's what we know right now and it's not getting better. Complete disaster on the field. THanks OHIO STATE GRAD.

If Freeman can't recruit lights out, this will send ND backwards more than TY and bob davie did.
I am not going to be able to sleep tonight. 🤣
 

GDFan

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Paige gone. Keep winning and we will be ok. Rees needs to call some plays where Pyne stretches the field.
 

4-4-3

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Agree. If we don't make a bowl game, Jack needs to take it on the chin and get the train back on the tracks before it derails so far off the tracks there's no getting it back on. One only needs to look at other programs that made huge coaching mistakes to see how long it takes to rebound. Some never did. At a place like ND (admissions and requirements) and in this era (not playing big NIL), hiring the wrong guy could be a death sentence (i.e., Nebraska). Pull the plug and hire a home run coach while the culture is still mediocre and the recruiting isn't in shambles. Likely we take the path of least resistance here, which is to give Freeman 3-5 years regardless of how he's doing. That could do irreparable damage. Not making a bowl game with the talent level on this current team to me is as bad or worse than 3 losing seasons.
Extremely well put.

And, yes, my biggest fear as well is that if Freeman's results make a strong case for his NOT being the right guy, he still gets 3 to 5 years to "figure it out."

ND is TRULY at a crossroads. NIL, the portal and, potentially, REVENUE SHARING DO NOT PLAY TO ND'S STRENGTHS. In fact, for most PREMIER PLAYERS, THEY RENDER THEM IRRELEVANT. Or even MEANINGLESS.

The best CFB players are attending GLADIATOR SCHOOL, and they only want to go to one that will get them to the ARENA, these days, known as the LEAGUE.

ND has to be ALL-IN. Half a loaf WON'T DO IT. Or even three-quarters.
 

tkirish

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Well if NBC somehow dropped them that would be the biggest catalyst for change
 

4-4-3

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Every leader has a bench or succession plan, ready at all times.

That being said, it isn’t even close to time to start talking about firing Freeman. Not close. Even if we’re 4-8 (won’t happen), he’ll be back next season.

Jack played his hand. Coulda had Campbell or Fickell, but he chose Freeman. This has to play out. Freeman deserves at least 2 seasons.
He'll get the Mulligan. But if there's no improvement, there shouldn't BE a YEAR 3.
 
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tbonesays

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Exactly, you'd think these idiots would just go find another team. Coach Freeman and coach Rees aren't going anywhere. With our youth at the skill positions on offense, anyone who thought we were a playoff team knows nothing at all about football; kinda like the two who continually stir it up; know nothing, idiots
I will be pleasantly surprised if Rees is OC in 2023, because that will have meant that 2022 ended with an amazing scoring turnaround.
 
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sjb75

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Extremely well put.

And, yes, my biggest fear as well is that if Freeman's results make a strong case for his NOT being the right guy, he still gets 3 to 5 years to "figure it out."

ND is TRULY at a crossroads. NIL, the portal and, potentially, REVENUE SHARING DO NOT PLAY TO ND'S STRENGTHS. In fact, for most PREMIER PLAYERS, THEY RENDER THEM IRRELEVANT. Or even MEANINGLESS.

The best CFB players are attending GLADIATOR SCHOOL, and they only want to go to one that will get them to the ARENA, these days, known as the LEAGUE.

ND has to be ALL-IN. Half a loaf WON'T DO IT. Or even three-quarters.
Poor Irish Beer. Anytime this clown agrees with me, I am out.