Portal QB’s

[FightingIrish44]

So ND should be 11-1 to finish. They obviously had the talent to win against NIU to get to 12-0.

That’s why you bring in Riley Leonard. What if Angeli or another QB was playing? Does ND beat Louisville and A&M? Georgia Tech even? Who knows. They obviously lost to NIU even with Leonard. Miami lost to GT with Cam Ward.

I’ll never give up the idea of winning the title anyway, but imagine if ND wasn’t hit with these injuries. You’d feel pretty good about ND’s chances in the playoffs. I still feel okay about it.

I always want to play for this season rather than next. There’s no guarantee the QB you invested in will even be around. Go 9-3 this year and your program looks stagnant.

Same goes for Hartman and Coan and the transfer that wasn’t brought in for 2022. Hopefully ND has enough at QB next year.

 

[Pennick4]

So ND should be 11-1 to finish. They obviously had the talent to win against NIU to get to 12-0.

That’s why you bring in Riley Leonard. What if Angeli or another QB was playing? Does ND beat Louisville and A&M? Georgia Tech even? Who knows. They obviously lost to NIU even with Leonard. Miami lost to GT with Cam Ward.

I’ll never give up the idea of winning the title anyway, but imagine if ND wasn’t hit with these injuries. You’d feel pretty good about ND’s chances in the playoffs. I still feel okay about it.

I always want to play for this season rather than next. There’s no guarantee the QB you invested in will even be around. Go 9-3 this year and your program looks stagnant.

Same goes for Hartman and Coan and the transfer that wasn’t brought in for 2022. Hopefully ND has enough at QB next year.

There will be no portal qb for the next few years!

 

[sjb75]

There will be no portal qb for the next few years!

No one knows this for certain.

 

[SubwaydomerDFW]

This team could(would) be undefeated with Angeli, no doubt.

Leonard has masked some of the offensive line growing pains, but there have been so many completions missed. Leonard's legs have helped receivers get single coverage.

Leonard is more accurate of a passer and I truly feel like the transition to Denbrock's scheme would have been better since RL missed out on the spring and Gino had zero familiarity with Leonard.

 

[savvyandsassier]

I feel like a jerk for even doubting RL at this point. And while we may need to wean ourselves from the portal at QB at some point, it's always worth a look. But this off season is gonna be tense. It's reasonable to think that every scholarship QB could feel they have good enough reason to hit the portal themselves if we go back to the well again. But there's guaranteed going to be some tempting options.

Having a real dual threat QB who can really run is a treat though. And maybe that's what Denbrock prefers. And other than maybe Minchey, sort of, we don't have any of those on the roster. The new guy, the Clemson decommit definitely is.

 

[FightingIrish44]

This team could(would) be undefeated with Angeli, no doubt.

Leonard has masked some of the offensive line growing pains, but there have been so many completions missed. Leonard's legs have helped receivers get single coverage.

Leonard is more accurate of a passer and I truly feel like the transition to Denbrock's scheme would have been better since RL missed out on the spring and Gino had zero familiarity with Leonard.

No doubt that he would get to 12-0? It’s totally unprovable that Angeli would get ND to 12-0. Even the best QB in college could have an off game and be the main reason a team lost.

I think with Angeli that ND probably beats NIU (only because of the turnovers but there’s no guarantee that Angeli wouldn’t have throw three or more picks) but loses to A&M. I’d guess they would have lost to Louisville as well but that’s more of a 50/50 proposition.

That’s a good point about the system. Maybe Angeli would have been more prepared for Texas A&M but I think Leonard’s mobility was a help in winning that game. The OL got eaten up at times.

At any rate, I’m not worried about the effects of next year because ND went to the portal for 2024. It was worth it. Next year ND will have to figure out again how to manufacture points. Hopefully the OL stays loaded.

 

[FightingIrish44]

I feel like a jerk for even doubting RL at this point.

It happens. Lots of people didn’t watch him at Duke and just formed their opinions off of a couple games with ND…with a struggling/new OL.

Now watch him throw 9 picks to end the season and I become a board pariah. I do have to say, despite the awful NIU and GT picks, he’s only turned it over 4 times which is pretty darn good.

 

[4-4-3]

So ND should be 11-1 to finish. They obviously had the talent to win against NIU to get to 12-0.

That’s why you bring in Riley Leonard. What if Angeli or another QB was playing? Does ND beat Louisville and A&M? Georgia Tech even? Who knows. They obviously lost to NIU even with Leonard. Miami lost to GT with Cam Ward.

I’ll never give up the idea of winning the title anyway, but imagine if ND wasn’t hit with these injuries. You’d feel pretty good about ND’s chances in the playoffs. I still feel okay about it.

I always want to play for this season rather than next. There’s no guarantee the QB you invested in will even be around. Go 9-3 this year and your program looks stagnant.

Same goes for Hartman and Coan and the transfer that wasn’t brought in for 2022. Hopefully ND has enough at QB next year.

You do whatever YOU CAN to make the team better.

Sometimes, it's the PORTAL. Sometimes, it's IN-HOUSE. Sometimes, it winds up BEING BOTH.

No one who wishes to improve their organization willfully CHUCKS OPTIONS on some doctrinnaire basis or because some tradition or other is being "disrespected." CFB talent is now TOTALLY FLUID. It's a market of BUYERS AND SELLERS. And now, in addition to the traditional RECRUITMENT MARKET, there's also this MORE DYNAMIC PORTAL MARKET.

And your point about WINNING NOW is well taken. Why invest long-term when a LIKELY MORE IMMEDIATE return is knocking on your door? Talent is SO PLENTIFUL that it's literally a FUNGIBLE COMMODITY. At Indiana, 31 players transferred in and 36 transferred out.

The moment is NOW.

Look at what the Yankees did with what may prove to be no more than a ONE-YEAR RENTAL of Juan Soto. He helped get them to the World Series.

IT'S A COMMERCIAL WORLD, AND LIFE IS TOO SHORT.

 

[echowaker]

This team could(would) be undefeated with Angeli, no doubt.

Leonard has masked some of the offensive line growing pains, but there have been so many completions missed. Leonard's legs have helped receivers get single coverage.

Leonard is more accurate of a passer and I truly feel like the transition to Denbrock's scheme would have been better since RL missed out on the spring and Gino had zero familiarity with Leonard.

No doubt ? The staple of the offense is read option. You lose that with Angeli. Yes he's a more accurate passer but he's also a statue back there and the inconsistency up front most of the season would have been problematic. Hardly no doubt. Maybe they don't lose to NIU but I doubt they beat A&M without Leonard's running ability.

 

[FightingIrish44]

I must say that I do think Leonard needs to pull the trigger on some of these throws. There was one play in the first half where he could have thrown the ball to Collins instead he somewhat blindly threw it into tighter coverage. I feel like he was a better passer at Duke aside from the OL issues.

Still a good performance vs FSU and happy as heck ND got him.

 

[graceh90]

Leonard is simultaneously the team MVP and biggest liability. Almost always true of your starting QB

 

[4-4-3]

Leonard is simultaneously the team MVP and biggest liability. Almost always true of your starting QB

HIGH RISK, HIGH RETURN.

 

[hoopsstar12]

I am not a Leonard fan. It's been a soft schedule. If we make it to the playoffs that will shed some light when accuracy and consistency will matter most.

 

[IrishMike409]

I am not a Leonard fan. It's been a soft schedule. If we make it to the playoffs that will shed some light when accuracy and consistency will matter most.

Our run game is a machine right now. The D is elite.

If the D and run game are cookin, then we'll be a tough playoff out, even if the passing game is sub-par.

 

[savvyandsassier]

BC's QB just hit the portal. Major dual threat, and a pretty intriguing player. Only 5-9, but rushed for a 1000 yards a year ago. And passed for over 2000. And apparently didn't jibe well enough with Bill O'Brien, and is hitting the portal. One year left. Strikingly similar career resume and general profile to RL before coming to ND.

 

[NDinNJ]

BC's QB just hit the portal. Major dual threat, and a pretty intriguing player. Only 5-9, but rushed for a 1000 yards a year ago. And passed for over 2000. And apparently didn't jibe well enough with Bill O'Brien, and is hitting the portal. One year left. Strikingly similar career resume and general profile to RL before coming to ND.

No

 

[Pennick4]

BC's QB just hit the portal. Major dual threat, and a pretty intriguing player. Only 5-9, but rushed for a 1000 yards a year ago. And passed for over 2000. And apparently didn't jibe well enough with Bill O'Brien, and is hitting the portal. One year left. Strikingly similar career resume and general profile to RL before coming to ND.

No way...he has played like crap the last several games. Plus he just quit on his team because he got benched. Wouldn't touch him with a telephone pole.

 

[sjb75]

No

x2.

 

[FightingIrish44]

Quitting because you lost your starting position is garbage.

 

[savvyandsassier]

Quitting because you lost your starting position is garbage.

I think he's quitting because he's going into the portal. And he wouldn't have quit otherwise. It's pretty standard practice. That's just what everyone does. I guess it's late in the season, he could stay, they might need him. It doesn't affect his eligibility in this case. But for the most part they all leave whenever in the middle of the season.

I don't think ND's going after a portal QB anyway. But he is pretty intriguing though.

 

[FightingIrish44]

I think he's quitting because he's going into the portal. And he wouldn't have quit otherwise. It's pretty standard practice. That's just what everyone does. I guess it's late in the season, he could stay, they might need him. It doesn't affect his eligibility in this case. But for the most part they all leave whenever in the middle of the season.

I don't think ND's going after a portal QB anyway. But he is pretty intriguing though.

And he’s going to the portal almost certainly because he lost his starting spot. It’s not that hard to just finish the season, at least the regular season. You owe that to your school, teammates, and coaches, etc.

 

[savvyandsassier]

And he’s going to the portal almost certainly because he lost his starting spot. It’s not that hard to just finish the season, at least the regular season. You owe that to your school, teammates, and coaches, etc.

Yes, of course. He was replaced as the starter. I thought that was understood. Now that would be bad. If he was still the starter, and his coach loved him, and was like, 'You're the man, I wish you could start forever.' And then he just quit. But he got benched, and may not have a future with a new coach on board who's going in a different direction, which I think is the situation. Hence the quitting and the portal announcement. Even though I suppose he could stay and finish out the season 2nd string. And then quit.

Anyway, he looks like a pretty sweet dual threat QB, but I don't think we're going to even be shopping for one.

 

[FightingIrish44]

Yes, of course. He was replaced as the starter. I thought that was understood. Now that would be bad. If he was still the starter, and his coach loved him, and was like, 'You're the man, I wish you could start forever.' And then he just quit. But he got benched, and may not have a future with a new coach on board who's going in a different direction, which I think is the situation. Hence the quitting and the portal announcement. Even though I suppose he could stay and finish out the season 2nd string. And then quit.

Anyway, he looks like a pretty sweet dual threat QB, but I don't think we're going to even be shopping for one.

I’m not sure if we’re on the same page. You seem to think this is okay because he lost his starting position. I definitely do not. His job as a scholarship player is to do his best to help the team. Now his team just lost their #2 QB for no respectable reason.

“Even though I suppose he could stay and finish out the season 2nd string. And then quit.” Yes. Absolutely. Anything less than this is garbage IMO.

 

[NDinNJ]

I think he's quitting because he's going into the portal. And he wouldn't have quit otherwise. It's pretty standard practice. That's just what everyone does. I guess it's late in the season, he could stay, they might need him. It doesn't affect his eligibility in this case. But for the most part they all leave whenever in the middle of the season.

I don't think ND's going after a portal QB anyway. But he is pretty intriguing though.

He's a smaller and less talented version of Pyne.

 

[Golson5]

Hes smaller than Pyne but he's way more talented

Either way, we don't want him or need him

Our 25 starting QB is on the roster already

 

[NDinNJ]

Hes smaller than Pyne but he's way more talented

Either way, we don't want him or need him

Our 25 starting QB is on the roster already

Who? Carr, Minchey, or Angeli?

 

[savvyandsassier]

I’m not sure if we’re on the page. You seem to think this is okay because he lost his starting position. I definitely do not. His job as a scholarship player is to do his best to help the team. Now his team just lost their #2 QB for no respectable reason.

“Even though I suppose he could stay and finish out the season 2nd string. And then quit.” Yes. Absolutely. Anything less than this is garbage IMO.

Yeah, I know what you think. That was unsubtly clear. Apparently my original phrasing didn't suit you, and so you had to re-emphasize how unacceptable it is for a player to do this, even though I was aware of that the first time. Which I suppose is debatable. We had a player quit on the team this past season, but I believe that was so he could preserve eligibility, and thus he had an excuse. Jaden Mickey! But this guy's eligibility would be unaffected I'm assuming. And so why not just finish it off. I don't know, maybe he's all excited about finding his new team, he feels he got short shrift from the new coach, Bill O'Brien, and the portal will be opening up in just a few weeks, and so he's getting a head start, which will be a pretty crucial time for him once the portal madness for this cycle ensues, especially as a QB where you can make real money, and he'll probably garner some real interest. Perhaps that doesn't morally justify it by some standard, but that's nevertheless the circumstances.

So I think we understand each other. And I have no inclination to unduly condemn or harshly judge him on account of these actions.

 

[Golson5]

Who? Carr, Minchey, or Angeli?

Any of the 3 will be the starter over a transfer QB

But if I had to handicap it

I would say

1. Carr
2. Minchey
3. Angeli although could easily be 2 because of experience

 

[FightingIrish44]

Yeah, I know what you think. That was unsubtly clear. Apparently my original phrasing didn't suit you, and so you had to re-emphasize how unacceptable it is for a player to do this, even though I was aware of that the first time. Which I suppose is debatable. We had a player quit on the team this past season, but I believe that was so he could preserve eligibility, and thus he had an excuse. Jaden Mickey! But this guy's eligibility would be unaffected I'm assuming. And so why not just finish it off. I don't know, maybe he's all excited about finding his new team, he feels he got short shrift from the new coach, Bill O'Brien, and the portal will be opening up in just a few weeks, and so he's getting a head start, which will be a pretty crucial time for him once the portal madness for this cycle ensues, especially as a QB where you can make real money, and he'll probably garner some real interest. Perhaps that doesn't morally justify it by some standard, but that's nevertheless the circumstances.

So I think we understand each other. And I have no inclination to unduly condemn or harshly judge him on account of these actions.

Your first and second responses to me were kind of confusing for me. Not just unsuitable. It was difficult for me to follow.

 

[Pennick4]

And he’s going to the portal almost certainly because he lost his starting spot. It’s not that hard to just finish the season, at least the regular season. You owe that to your school, teammates, and coaches, etc.

Bravo

 

[savvyandsassier]

Your first and second responses to me were kind of confusing for me. Not just unsuitable. It was difficult for me to follow.

I'm not sure why they would be, or why they were. I suppose because I was not emphatically crystal clear, as far as the moral aspect, and whether these are blameworthy actions or not. And I don't really have much of an opinion. To each his own on that one. To me something like that would be very minor on the 'Am I going to hate this guy' list of transgressions that he could have committed. And certainly doesn't cross the threshold.

It bears repeating, that it would be worse if he was the starter and still quit, so he could transfer and make more money. Now that really would be quitting on your teammates. Like if RL quit tomorrow to enter the portal again. Rather than if Angeli did, which would be more of an annoyance.

 

[FightingIrish44]

I'm not sure why they would be, or why they were. I suppose because I was not emphatically crystal clear, as far as the moral aspect, and whether these are blameworthy actions or not.

I couldn’t tell if you were agreeing or disagreeing with me or what your overarching point was. Perhaps you were harmlessly fleshing out what the potential scenarios are, but it left me slightly confused. Not a big deal and maybe it’s just my lack of comprehension.

 

[savvyandsassier]

I couldn’t tell if you were agreeing or disagreeing with me or what your overarching point was. Perhaps you were harmlessly fleshing out what the potential scenarios are, but it left me slightly confused. Not a big deal and maybe it’s just my lack of comprehension.

My overarching point? I was just mentioning this dude was available, he looks pretty good, and a couple of you guys were outraged at him leaving the team the way he did, and so I blathered out some comments about it. What do you mean, overarching point?

In any case, I don't figure we're going to go after a portal QB anyway, but he is a pretty sweet looking dual threat guy. Notwithstanding what an unreliable teammate he is. And having a dual threat offense when it's humming pretty good does rock.

 

[ZibbyQuinn]

Any of the 3 will be the starter over a transfer QB

But if I had to handicap it

I would say

1. Carr
2. Minchey
3. Angeli although could easily be 2 because of experience

Would say
1/Carr or Angeli (could see this going either way) Freeman has shown a propensity for experience at the position.
2/ Minchey

 

[sjb75]

Would say
1/Carr or Angeli (could see this going either way) Freeman has shown a propensity for experience at the position.
2/ Minchey

Steve Angeli has a good shot to win the starting job at ND next Spring, IMO.

 

[Golson5]

Would say
1/Carr or Angeli (could see this going either way) Freeman has shown a propensity for experience at the position.
2/ Minchey

I would be pretty surprised if it was Angeli but it's possible

 

[SubwaydomerDFW]

No doubt ? The staple of the offense is read option. You lose that with Angeli. Yes he's a more accurate passer but he's also a statue back there and the inconsistency up front most of the season would have been problematic. Hardly no doubt. Maybe they don't lose to NIU but I doubt they beat A&M without Leonard's running ability.

I meant to say Angeli is more accurate; you're right. I was going 90 miles a minute on my iphone.

I don't think they beat A&M in week 1 with Angeli but I believe they could now that this O Line has greatly improved.

I just think ND wasted half this season getting a newby ready in a new scheme and if they could get some more cohesiveness think of how much better they'd be by halfway through the season..

 

[Pennick4]

Steve Angeli has a good shot to win the starting job at ND next Spring, IMO.

I think that Minchey or Carr will be the starter next year after having the season to get familiar with the Denbrock offense.