Dude. Get a life. You won't see me on a Buckeye Board arguing with opposing fans.
Did Savvy Jack Just Signal ND to the BUG 10?
- Thread starter tbonesays
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Arguments didn't start until you showed up and spewed your same bull crap. I'm looking for productive conversations, not trash talk. Not going to reply to you anymore.
^ says the guy that sucks the sweat off of Urbie’s ass.
Your opinion is not fact. Your cherry picked Google searches fool no one. You have contradicted yourself over and over
your spin cycle has run its course.
Last year's ND 3:30pm games drew larger audiences in several regions, including the NE. Also, within advertising the demographics attracted are key to pricing the commercial time. Bottom line: All viewers are not created equal and Madison Avenue knows the difference.
Just remember my post so when the next ND game is announced
Do you think it could be because the other networks have ten games to choose from in each slot?
It's not your typing speed but the points it looked like you DIDN'T CONNECT.
As for the 3:30 time slot, ESPN can play HARD BALL, TOO. What's ND going to do? Walk away from AWAY GAME COVERAGE?
Negotiations are a TWO-WAY STREET.
Maybe ND gets its number. Or maybe not.
That's an excellent point.
Many don't realize HOW MANY MORE VIEWERS THERE WERE FOR, SAY, OSU GAMES last year. I listened to a podcast on just that subject, and the DIFFERENTIAL was significant.
I'd had NO IDEA.
https://www.sportsmediawatch.com/college-football-tv-ratings/
Regarding the link you find 'telling'. I find it telling as well, but probably from a different perspective.
It also should not be earth-shattering to anyone that exciting teams and players are fun to watch. OSU is FUN to watch on offense. Same for Bama. They have explosive play after explosive play. Notre Dame's offense last year? Not so fun. Methodical = boring for the casual fan.
Bowl Games/ CFP:
Notre Dame game is ranked #1 of games that also had other games being played at the same time. (UK/IA) (PSU/ARK). They pulled a 4.2, at 1p with two other games going that kicked off at the same time or just slightly before. Ranked #6 overall in all Bowl / CFP games, 3 of the games that beat them were the National Championship and two CFP games. The other 2 games were primetime with no opposing games. Not to shabby on ND's part.
Conference Champ game:
This is where ND is leaving money on the table, and, perhaps more importantly, they aren't giving the players an extra game against superior competition to prepare for the game speed and intensity of the playoffs to come. When USC is good, ok, that's a good way to finish the season. But finishing vs Stanford, Georgia Tech, Navy and Virginia is NOT the competition ND needs to be facing leading up to the CFP. Notre Dame had their best appearance in the CFP playing Bama just after the loss to Clemson in the ACCCG. The week lay-off for Navy/Army and then the Conference Champs is TOO long and a disadvantage. Those other teams in CFP had a full game two weeks AFTER Notre Dame play their last. Not good.
Week 13
ND vs Stanford at 8pm, only other game worth watching during the time slot was Ok/OKst. ND finishes the 8th most watched game that day. The two biggest games of the regular season OSU/MI (15 million - wow - at noon) and AU/AL had been played early in the day. Only the most ravenous of college football fans will watch football from 12noon to 10p. Stanford is boring and blows. Kansas St vs Texas had more views at noon.
Week 12
ND finishes 10th playing Georgia Tech at 230. Wake/Clemson finished just ahead of them in 9th with a 12p kick off. Concerning.
Week 11
ND plays Virginia and finishes 6th in Primetime. Finishing 5th just above ND was A&M vs Ole Miss also in primetime. Both games scored 1.8. One of ND's worst matchups scores EVENLY with the SEC's best 2nd game in primetime.
Week 10
ND plays Navy and finishes 9th playing at 330. MSU/Purdue finished 3rd, Wake/UNC finished 7th, UGA/Missouri finished 8th. Concerning.
Week 9
UNC/ND finishes 8th in primetime. PSU/OSU and Miss/Aub were the other primetime games. PSU/OSU picked up 3.7 crushing the other two prime games. But again, ND finishes (1.3) EVENLY with the SEC's 2nd best game (1.4).
Week 8
Maybe the most telling of all, and not in my hoped-for direction. ND finishes 7th, in primetime, against their rival USC. Not good. Illinois/Penn St (3rd), OSU/IU (4th) and Northwestern/MI (5th) all finished ahead of ND game. Ouch.
Week 7
No ND football. Somehow college football survived.
Week 6
ND not listed again
Week 5
ND vs Cincy lands at 5 with a 2.2. Number 1 was Bama vs Miss with a 2.7 in the SEC 330 slot. Two Big 10 games scored better, slightly. Mich vs Wisc at noon and Penn St/Indiana in primetime.
Week 4
ND vs Wisc lands at #1 with a 12 noon kickoff. 3.1 score. 2.5 is next closest in a primetime night game.
Week 3
ND vs Purdue finishes 5th at 1.5. Alabama vs UF and Aub/Penn St in primetime crush everyone. 3rd is Neb/OK, 4th is Michigan St vs Miami. Those are 4 solid game match-ups ahead of ND/Purdue.
Week 2
ND vs Toledo on Peacock. I see no ratings.
Week 1
ND vs FSU is the 2nd most watched game. Played alone in primetime on Sunday. #1 in primetime on Saturday was UGA/Clemson.
In conclusion, Notre Dame can carry it's own water. They are not as valuable as an entire conference, but they are arguably the MOST VALUABLE TEAM in all of college football. In any given year the teams or teams favored to win the National Title and/or have Heisman type players will secure higher ratings than ND on average and especially in marquee matchups. When ND has marquee matchups - without the heisman players and likelihood of a national title - they score at the top or very near the top in ratings.
It is also very clear that the Big 10 is much closer to the SEC in football fandom. They are CLEARLY the two best conferences. I believe the ACC serves ND well in recruiting and east coast footprint. If/when FSU and Miami could get their shit together, along with Clemson, you have formidable competition and excellent ratings.
IMO, we haven’t truly been independent since we agreed with the ACC to play 5 ACC games. Aren’t you guys tired of the Wake Forest, Duke, Syracuse, Virginia, UNC, NC St type games? I certainly am. What makes me nervous is if the SEC & BIG move to 10 conference games per year, it will make scheduling quality games difficult. We’ll be stuck scheduling ACC and left out PAC 12 & Big 12 teams. I’d much rather play Nebraska, MSU, Purdue, Penn St and UCLA as mid level teams. Add on the big boys, Michigan, USC and Ohio State and then we really have a great schedule. I’m from the Midwest so maybe that’s why my mindset is this way. I loved ND being independent growing up, but we’re currently about 60% independent. I dont think we’ll ever be left out of the playoff and I agree we have enough money, but our ability to schedule top teams will change with the new mega conference shift.
Kind of like Illinois, Iowa, Northwestern, Purdue and Minnesota games, if you ask me. You seem to have left out Clemson, Miami and Florida St.
At least those opponents are regional. Would you really rather watch your team play Clemson and Miami? Or Michigan, Ohio State, Michigan State, Penn State, Wisconsin, Iowa, USC, UCLA. The list goes on. You can't tell me with a straight face playing the ACC (part time) is more attractive.
We can play those teams, play teams from the south, play teams from the west. We can play teams from anywhere.
Why would we want to play those teams over and over all the time
And you seem to have missed that nothing would change that by joining the BUG. We would still be 4th fiddle to anOSU. No one mentioned:
OSU / RUT BTN N/A
All the conference schools have weeks where their least interesting game is buried on a conference network.
The rest of the micro analysis of the 2021 season, remember our rival SC played the season with a lame duck or interim coach, the schedule was historically weak, we knocked ourselves back into the race by losing the buy game, and ND still was #1 in the Wiscy week and usually in the top 10.
No.
About half of the ACC has football history with us going back a generation or more. The other half are basketball schools that can benefit ND on the court.
You are beyond tiresome. For reasons unknown to me, you are here on a regular basis, pointing out reasons why ND should join the Big 10. While there are exceptions, most ND fans and alums do not want to join the Big 10. The Big 10 has existed without ND for the past century, even before it was known as the Big 10. Ohio St. has Michigan. You have Penn St. and Michigan St. Go have fun with those schools and the new members. ND would not be a good fit in the Big 10. Really, the time has come for you to stop with the campaign. You are not going to persuade us.
You see those numbers as MAKING THE CASE that ND "can carry its own water"? That's not how I read them. It's "getting by" on them now, but are they grounds, in the current climate, for TV revenues of $75 million+ as a standalone independent? Not if I'm dispensing the money. And NOT AT THIS TIME.
I see ND as a LEGACY PROGRAM in the early stages of its ND 2.0 iteration which began under Kelly. No NC, Heisman winner, prominent media darling or signature win in over a GENERATION. You can't just rely on PURE BRAND. At some point, that brand must be FORTIFIED.
Unless Freeman brings back the GOOD OLD DAYS, ND could DEPRECIATE to the degree other programs either emerge or remain dominant. And for Freeman to return ND -- ACTUALLY -- to Leahy-Ara-Holtz levels -- given a) the current environment and b) the unforeseen ways THE SPORT HAS EVOLVED -- looks to me like a VERY TALL ORDER.
Perhaps I'm wrong, but that's how I see it.
Same regurgitated Garbage.
Why don’t you put on one of your Scarlet Gray replica jerseys and go hang out with your own kind.
We have done the Mich, MSU, PSU, USC thing for decades. We have played UCLA and Wisky.
sorry, but no, Iowa doesn’t move the needle
Regarding your response to me, IT'S NOT THAT SIMPLE.
1) As part of the Big Ten, there could be more negotiating leverage and comparatively more money over time.
2) ND's viewership could increase as a DIRECT RESULT of BIG TEN RIVALRIES based on ones that already exist with UM, MSU and Purdue. From there, others would develop.
3) There would be an ASSURED ROUTE TO THE PLAYOFFS rather than the one that requires ND to whip out its CRAFTSMAN TOOL BOX every few years so as to build its ELIGIBILITY case.
You start with cells, move to organs, proceed to systems and wind up with ORGANISMS. College football is on its way to becoming a COHERENT ORGANISM. There's no real FUTURE in ND insisting on its own SINGLE-CELL-ECOSYSTEM.
We're now in a world of NETWORKS and BLOCKCHAINS where everything is measured, synchronized and standardized.
And ND's answer to this should be to STAND ALONE on the basis of some HISTORICAL CONCEIT rooted in a snub by a long dead religious bigot from Michigan?
Seems a bit PRECIOUSLY EXCEPTIONAL to me.
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That’s fair, I realize there will always be “filler” type games. Personally I would rather play the top, middle and bottom, Big 10 teams than the top, middle, bottom ACC teams (especially if Clemson & Miami head to the SEC).
Jack recognizes the power of the new conferences. I’ve never heard him compliment a conference like he has recently. This is proven by NBC quickly hopping on the prime time slot for BIG, which essentially pushes our top game (currently 730pm games) back down to 3:30, (unless we have to deal with Peacock again, nightmare). Also gives us a B-Level announcer as Torico would take the night game for BIG. Not having a prime time home game is tough. Recruits love those games, hell, we all love those games.
Times are changing very quickly. College football has not had the money poured into it like we’ll see these next few years. CBS contract for the SEC was $55M. It’s now going to be $350M for the BIG. With these new mega TV contracts, conferences likely going to 10 conference games, i see the top teams in the big conferences only scheduling home games for their non-conference games. Which would not be ideal for us being independent.
I would love to stay independent if it is possible to continue scheduling top teams in top conferences for home & homes. The new mega conferences worry me a bit in that regard. But I guess we’ll find out soon enough. Appreciate the banter here.
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Solid, insightful post.
But you seemed to stop just short of the water your logic took you to. What you wrote would suggest, in my opinion, grounds for more angst re ND's ability to remain independent than simply the view that the "new mega conferences worry me a bit."
Is your concern merely that MILD or did you not just IMPLICITLY make some reasonable points as to why ND should join a conference?
At some point, the price of admission to the CFP -- WIN GAMES OR NOT -- is likely to be CONFERENCE MEMBERSHIP.
Some conference, group of schools or dominant school will either insist on an EQUAL PLAYING FIELD or ND may realize that CONFERENCE MEMBERSHIP is in its best interests. Or both.
That time may not be now, but if the game keeps advancing in the direction it's going, systemization of the process by which an NC is chosen will be TOTAL.
ND will either be on board by then or not. And if it's not, CFB WON'T CEASE.
Absolutely fair criticism. I didn’t fully commit to where my mindset currently lies. In short, I have always loved our independence. I know that the majority of the board also loves this and hopes to remain independent. I currently wonder if the new landscape of college football makes sense for us to remain this way. If the 2 conferences get bigger, I simply don’t know if we can build a great independent schedule, which is where my worry lies. I am nervous 3 years down the road our schedule is mid level ACC Teams (because Clemson/Miami jump ship to SEC) and then we’re left to schedule Big 12 and Pac 12 teams. I don’t want a schedule of Boston College, Virginia Tech, Washington and Oklahoma St. In particular with the majority of our rivals now joining the Big 10. Add in the money aspect of joining the Big 10, It starts to make sense to join. I’m obviously speculating because I don’t know if what we’ll be able to schedule in the future. I hope this makes a little more sense.
Go Irish!
In a new situation we can strike a new deal. Our doubt that our ACC contract says that we have to work with any association of schools that calls themselves the ACC.
Personally I hope we continue our strategery of associating with the powerful football schools in the south.
It does make sense, but so did your first post.
My view is that ND will NOT go down that second-tier road. That both the MONEY and the DESIRE TO COMPETE AT THE HIGHEST LEVEL will force its hand to JOIN A CONFERENCE.
And that once it's done, IT WON'T BE A PARTICULARLY BIG DEAL.
If you told the average ND fan in 1962 that in 60 years ND would be COMPELLED to play 5 or so ACC games a year, they would have told you you were drunk.
TIMES CHANGE.
As I see it, there's an almost INEXORABLE LOGIC at work here. ND may be one of the sport's biggest fish, but IT DOESN'T CONTROL IT. And there's simply no point beyond TRADITION FOR ITS OWN SAKE in its attempting to exist in its own private ECOSYSTEM along with some boring, second-tier PILOT FISH.
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